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Old 10-20-2012, 01:29 AM   #1
bat89
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Default Does Race Really Matter?

Nick Fury's apperance was changed in the comics and now is widely accepted in favor over the original(mostly thanks to the movies). However could characters like Batman(Bruce Wayne) or Wonder Woman(Diana) have a "race change" and it be accepted like Fury's? Would it really matter or take away from the character if in a movie/tv show Bruce, Diana, or any other major DC player was portrayed by a minority actor or actress?

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Old 10-20-2012, 02:24 AM   #2
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

It could be done but Im pretty sure it wont be accepted by the vast majority of comic fans.

I think the general audience might not care as much if Bruce Wayne were a black guy or whatever change in race you can think of.

Personally I wouldnt care as long as they get the characterization right and the movie/tv show is good.

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Old 10-20-2012, 02:29 AM   #3
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Can of worms.

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Old 10-20-2012, 02:43 AM   #4
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

It does.

More for some characters than others, really. But black Nick Fury isn't really Nick Fury. He's Samuel L. Jackson.

Bruce Wayne comes from old money. He's as WASPy as you can get, really. I guess you could change all that, but why?

Wonder Woman is an odd example, since the character makes no sense from the get go (her creator either didn't care, or didn't do much research on Amazons).

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Old 10-20-2012, 03:46 AM   #5
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

it does matter to some.

as far as I'm concerned, not to sound like some faux enlighted douchbag but i'd dig a black bruce wayne(looking at idris). i think wondy could be ethinically ambigous looking enough that she could be played but someone white, latina, or black.

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Old 10-20-2012, 03:51 AM   #6
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

I guess it all depends on how invested I am with the character, a black Nick Fury doesn't bother me but that doesn't mean I would accept an Asian Superman. And it isn't an issue of race it's just how I view what Superman should look like.

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Old 10-20-2012, 05:53 AM   #7
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

It shouldn't in most cases but don't tell it to this board. I remember people's heads exploding when there was that brief rumor a black actor (donald glover) was campaigning to be the new spider-man.

Some people's true colors certainly came out.

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Old 10-20-2012, 11:01 AM   #8
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

It really depends on the character. Some characters it doesn't matter at all, some characters it really does. Changing Batman's race, for instance, wouldn't really work, given the Wayne family's status as the long time kings of Gotham. OTOH, changing the race of J'onn J'onnz's human cover identity is basically trivial. Most characters are somewhere in between.

However, a good rule of thumb is that, the more iconic and known-by-the-GA the character is? The worse an idea it is to change their race.

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Old 10-20-2012, 11:11 AM   #9
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

With Obama in the White House, you can easily change the Wayne's from white to black

I was all for thinking of Rihanna as Wonder Woman, because I felt her moody look and bad girl attitude were right up WW's street. Bear in mind, my mind frame was thinking of Miller's interp...which was wrong lol

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Old 10-20-2012, 03:06 PM   #10
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

I think it matters, i can never see an Asian Superman or a Black Batman. mainly because their characters would never work if they were Black or Asian.

Americans trusted Superman because he blend in from Day 1. he looked like an avarage american. he represented the avarage american who wanted to be super, to do good but couldnt really and he also was the illegal alien who wasnt the problem of the country he immigrated in he was the solution to already existing problems.

Similar thing with Bruce Wayne.

Also Black and Asian characters are written this way in order to bring coltural diversity and to take the xenophobia away from the everyday man. black panther could never be white. he was made to saw people that black guys can be heroes, something the everyday man couldnt realise and still cant which is tragic if you think about it.

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Old 10-20-2012, 03:26 PM   #11
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mace Dolex View Post
I guess it all depends on how invested I am with the character, a black Nick Fury doesn't bother me but that doesn't mean I would accept an Asian Superman. And it isn't an issue of race it's just how I view what Superman should look like.
This.

I'd be just as pissed if Superman was made blonde. But that's because i'm really attached to his look.

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Old 10-20-2012, 04:34 PM   #12
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Well I saw this thing that talked about how some actors who played superheroes were Hispanic or something like that. Dean Cane, Linda Carter, etc. So I guess as long as they look like the character in the comic people wont really care. I don't know. It wouldn't bother me if they did that.
Billy D. Williams almost played Two-Face, and he did play Harvey Dent in Batman 1 by Tim Burton. I was upset when I heard that Laurence Fishburne was going to play Doc Ock in Spider-Man, but not because of his race really but because he wasn't this older heavy German (because of the cartoon I thought Ock had a thick German accent) man. But if he had put on the weight and started using a thick German accent I think I would have been fine with that. I would have been fine if Donald Glover actually was going to play Spider-Man/Peter Parker because he could portray Peter as the silly nerdy guy he is. I didn't care that Kingpin was played by Michael Clark Duncan in the DD movie and when I heard Cuba Gooding Jr wanted to play Murdock I thought that might have been really cool.

I think its more like the comic fans get upset if the character, story, look, differ too much from the comic. People got upset that Spider-Man used organic web shooters, or that Joker didn't look like the comic when Ledger played him. I hope its just along that line of thinking and not reaction to their race.

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Old 10-20-2012, 04:47 PM   #13
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Artistsean View Post
Well I saw this thing that talked about how some actors who played superheroes were Hispanic or something like that. Dean Cane, Linda Carter, etc. So I guess as long as they look like the character in the comic people wont really care. I don't know. It wouldn't bother me if they did that.
Yeah I never had a problem with Dean Cain. He still looked enough like Superman to me for it not to matter one iota.

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I think back to my father. As a farmer, he had a natural understanding for the Earth. I remember him telling me this world is capable of providing for all its creatures. Even now, with so many more people, there exists enough food for everyone.

"The problem," Pa used to say, "is people. As far back as we go, we've always had problems with sharing. Seems everyone's too busy holding on to what they've got to care how their neighbors are doing."


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Old 10-20-2012, 06:44 PM   #14
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Superman is a weird case though isn't it? I mean he's not technically white is he? since he's not technically human.

Race is pretty much a social construct that we have here, so i doubt there would be much application to someone from another planet? Unless kryptonians are known for pale skin or whatever.

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Old 10-20-2012, 07:05 PM   #15
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Quote:
I think it matters, i can never see an Asian Superman or a Black Batman. mainly because their characters would never work if they were Black or Asian.
I take it that you hated Dean Cain then.

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Old 10-20-2012, 07:26 PM   #16
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hopefuldreamer
Yeah I never had a problem with Dean Cain. He still looked enough like Superman to me for it not to matter one iota.
I guess in Dean's case because he was mixed and didn't look so overtly Asian it didn't bother people.

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Old 10-20-2012, 07:49 PM   #17
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

I'm almost certain race does matter when it comes to casting the iconic heroes. Many fans would throw a fit if a Latino, Black, or Asian were cast as Superman, Batman or Wonder Woman. Not so much with lower tier characters like Hawkgirl (she's been Latina in the comics), or Martian Manhunter. Yes some actors can pass, such as Dean Cain or Lynda Carter, but that's because they were both mixed and didn't look overtly Asian or Latino. If you cast a good actor who resembled Jay Hernandez/Eva Longoria or Jet Li/Lucy Lui as Superman/Wonder Woman i'm sure a lot of fans would throw a fit even if the actor was talented enough to portray the character. So yes race does matter.

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Old 10-20-2012, 08:07 PM   #18
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

For most minor characters is doesn't matter at all.

Major characters is another story.

For major characters you need to:

A) Have a damn good reason to change the race (actor of another race fits better/the original was outdated)

B) Use another character to replace the original character's position (Miles Morales)

C) Wait until the character has been through many reboots then finally experiment with another race (black James Bond?)

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Old 10-20-2012, 08:23 PM   #19
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Miles Morales is an interesting example.

The character was apparently made just for this trope.

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Old 10-20-2012, 10:15 PM   #20
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Like (almost) everything: it depends on the person/situation.

Kingpin, Nick Fury: sure; Batman, Wonder Woman, Superman; I don't think so. Hell, even Will Smith was asked if he would like to play Superman, and even he said he shouldn't because Superman is suppose to be white and he's black.

It's one of those examples of things that shouldn't be changed.

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Old 10-20-2012, 10:24 PM   #21
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

I'm not against a black Wonder Woman.

But only after they've gave a white woman a shot at a WW movie first.

So a black woman for the eventual reboot if they can find someone black and suitable.

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Old 10-20-2012, 10:29 PM   #22
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

It's a shame debates like this are so one sided as well. I mean, it would equally suck for them to cast a caucasian actor as John Stewart/Cyborg/Bishop/War Machine/Storm etc.

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I think back to my father. As a farmer, he had a natural understanding for the Earth. I remember him telling me this world is capable of providing for all its creatures. Even now, with so many more people, there exists enough food for everyone.

"The problem," Pa used to say, "is people. As far back as we go, we've always had problems with sharing. Seems everyone's too busy holding on to what they've got to care how their neighbors are doing."


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Old 10-20-2012, 10:29 PM   #23
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

You'd think an Amazon would look like you know, an Amazon.

Then again DC's take on mythology is pretty hilariously inaccurate. But then they just didn't care.

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Old 10-20-2012, 10:34 PM   #24
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

I would think race matters if you want a faithful portrayal.

If you don't care about being faithful in adapting a character, race matters a lot less.

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Old 10-20-2012, 10:39 PM   #25
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

I like when they follow the comics. Let end it at that.

I don't want to sound racist but Dean Cain doesn't look Asian, he looks tan.

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