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Old 10-22-2012, 01:05 PM   #76
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

I think you should avoid changing the race of major characters if necessary. Nick Fury just worked because he was based of Sam L Jackson from the getgo and lets face it....the change in race and persona made him a much more interesting, cool character.

However changing the race of a major character (although its not the biggest deal to me) is just bringing controversy when it can be avoided. But tbh most comic book characters are raceless. I mean, does Superman have to be white? No not really. He isn't even human for goodness sake. Spider-man? Not really. But people are already USED to those characters and changing them for no reason is pretty pointless.

The only major character I can see them changing in the near future is Magneto. He is the victim of genocide and the generation of jews that survived the holocaust are now passing away. I can see marvel making him of african decent since the next biggest and well known genocide is the Rwandan genocide. So a race change to a character like Magneto would be for a REASON and not just done spontaneuosly (which is where I think most of the gripe comes from...if youre going to change a characters race make it for a damn good reason)

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Old 10-22-2012, 01:32 PM   #77
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The only major character I can see them changing in the near future is Magneto. He is the victim of genocide and the generation of jews that survived the holocaust are now passing away. I can see marvel making him of african decent since the next biggest and well known genocide is the Rwandan genocide. So a race change to a character like Magneto would be for a REASON and not just done spontaneuosly (which is where I think most of the gripe comes from...if youre going to change a characters race make it for a damn good reason)
I wouldn't mind the above being tested out in an 'alternate reality' story, but this is a suggestion that makes sense. Obviously time doesn't seem to pass in the comic books at the same rate as it does in real life, but there will come a time when Magneto and Professor X will either need to be killed off for good or be 're-imagined'. And as his people being the victims of genocide is integral to his character, Magneto being Rwandan instead of a Holocaust survivor could work - whereas the 'old money' WASP-y Bruce Wayne suddenly becoming an African-American, or Asian-American, wouldn't make as much sense.

I remember there was talk of Colin Salmon wanting to portray James Bond prior to Daniel Craig being cast, and a lot of folk dismissed it with "but James Bond is white!" As with the example above, changing Bond's race wouldn't be as much of an issue now as it would have been in the 60s. In the UK in this day and age it isn't implausible to have such a black secret service agent, so why not? The stories are no longer set in the original time frame, and they're more loosely based on the original writings now anyway.

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Old 10-22-2012, 01:34 PM   #78
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Unfortunately there are still a few genocides in Europe to choose from.

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Old 10-22-2012, 01:37 PM   #79
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Unfortunately there are still a few genocides in Europe to choose from.
Indeed. Magneto being Bosnian, for example, would probably sit better with some than him becoming Rwandan, but either would be possibilities for any 'reboot' of the character.

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Right. So if you're opposed to changing the look of a character, which is a defining characteristic of a character in a visual medium like comics, then you're a racist. Oh please. I also recall people on this board complaining about Keanu being cast as John Constantine due to the fact that he's neither blonde nor British. So is that indicative of a deep-seated racism on the part of this board against dark-haired white American men?
I hated that Constantine film, and I didn't like the blonde-haired Scouser suddenly being an American in LA (portrayed by a Canadian) at all.

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Old 10-22-2012, 01:40 PM   #80
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

I would actually do what the X-Men cartoon did and just make it an unspecified one. That way you retain a certain timelessness. And looking at the state of East / Southern Europe, that won't be dated any time soon.

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Old 10-22-2012, 01:43 PM   #81
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Does race matter?

Well, does hair color matter? Would it have mattered if Black Widow and Jean Grey weren't redheads in their movies?

Would it matter if Superman was blond?

Normally, people want the movie character to look like the comic character. That's the reason why people don't like changes.

But then again, some changes worked. Michael Clarke Duncan as Kingpin worked for me. He was great.

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Old 10-22-2012, 01:51 PM   #82
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

You can't compare hair color to race.

Race has a huge role defining a character.

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Old 10-22-2012, 02:04 PM   #83
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You can't compare hair color to race.

Race has a huge role defining a character.
I believe you misunderstood me.

I think hair color and race have a huge role defining a character. A blond Superman wouldn't work. A black haired Black Widow wouldn't work.

However, for some characters, it works. And I don't know why. Black Kingpin worked for me.

Tall and handsome Wolverine (= Jackman) works for me, although I'd like to see a version which is closer to the original.

For Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver, however, ethnicitiy is important. You can't change that IMO.

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Old 10-22-2012, 02:08 PM   #84
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Originally Posted by Sentinel X View Post
I think you should avoid changing the race of major characters if necessary. Nick Fury just worked because he was based of Sam L Jackson from the getgo and lets face it....the change in race and persona made him a much more interesting, cool character.

However changing the race of a major character (although its not the biggest deal to me) is just bringing controversy when it can be avoided. But tbh most comic book characters are raceless. I mean, does Superman have to be white? No not really. He isn't even human for goodness sake. Spider-man? Not really. But people are already USED to those characters and changing them for no reason is pretty pointless.

The only major character I can see them changing in the near future is Magneto. He is the victim of genocide and the generation of jews that survived the holocaust are now passing away. I can see marvel making him of african decent since the next biggest and well known genocide is the Rwandan genocide. So a race change to a character like Magneto would be for a REASON and not just done spontaneuosly (which is where I think most of the gripe comes from...if youre going to change a characters race make it for a damn good reason)
Magneto has the convenience of being de-aged back in his canonical history. So, that story likely will rear it's ugly head when they finally need a explanation for his clearly advanced age.

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Old 10-22-2012, 02:12 PM   #85
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

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You can't compare hair color to race.

Race has a huge role defining a character.
Why should it?

Shouldn't race be meaningless in this day and age?

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Old 10-22-2012, 02:21 PM   #86
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Why should it?

Shouldn't race be meaningless in this day and age?
It depends on the character though. You would need to completely change Bruce Wayne's back story if he were African-American, as you'd find very few prominent 'old money' families such as the Waynes of African-American stock. And Superman would had to have landed somewhere other than Smallville.

I think there's a difference between not wanting to change the race of any character "just because" to there being certain instances where it doesn't make much sense to change it. I liked the casting of MCD in Daredevil as Kingpin, as the only other people I could think of for the role were Ving Rhames and James Gandolfini. But it depends on the character, and the reason you're changing it.

I don't see why an African-American Peter Parker couldn't work, for example.

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Old 10-22-2012, 02:56 PM   #87
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Peter Parker is the only major character that could work as a different race imo.

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Old 10-22-2012, 03:43 PM   #88
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

And they made sure to let it be known in no uncertain times with Miles Morales.

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Old 10-22-2012, 03:51 PM   #89
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

What do you guys think about Ben Kingsly being cast as the Mandarin in the new Iron Man Movie ? Should he be Asian ? or does it matter ?

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Old 10-22-2012, 03:52 PM   #90
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

I preferred he be Asian, but since Stark was holed up in a Middle Eastern country for his origin in this universe, it makes sense.

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Old 10-22-2012, 03:57 PM   #91
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Seems like when it comes to movie roles, Asians always get the short end of the stick.

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Old 10-22-2012, 04:52 PM   #92
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

It's messed up they made Goku (from DBZ) a skinny white boy but then again that entire project was FUBAR.

I don't think it be a big deal if they made Flash Asian. His race is pretty much a non-factor.

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Old 10-22-2012, 05:03 PM   #93
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

So we've established that race selectively matters, then?


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Old 10-22-2012, 05:15 PM   #94
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Race always matters. As for the actors being cast, their actual race doesn't matter, what matters is if they'd be able to pull off the race they'd be playing.

It's why Kingsley doesn't look good as Mandarin; I understand he is Asian, yes, but he's from a different part of Asia than the character he's intended for and it clearly shows.

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Old 10-22-2012, 07:30 PM   #95
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I think they should just go ahead and actually make some more worthwhile original black characters or increase the standing of ones they had in the past. Putting Cyborg in the Justice League is a good start. How about Vulcan or Mr. Terrific, too? (needs another female superhero, as well, so we get the number 9, which is like 7).

Miles Morales is a good example of doing it right, he's a great character first, and you're not just changing the race of a character, you're introducing a new one who is going to take over the same mantle.

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Old 10-22-2012, 09:03 PM   #96
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really i was more bothered by them making sue storm a latina with a bad dye job and expected audience to buy her and chris evans being brother and sister
If they wanted a latina Sue Storm they really should have cast a latino Johnny as well. It just looks silly otherwise.

Of course, Evans is the only actor in the entire movie that I actually think gives a good performance so the better answer would be to keep him and recast Sue.

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Old 10-23-2012, 12:18 AM   #97
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latinos can be ambiguous of race though. they aren't all olived skinned brown eyed brunettes. even alba's half danish/french canadian.


.
Families can be multi-ethnic through marriage or adoption. Sue and Johnny being different in that aspect could be easily explained.

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Old 10-23-2012, 03:37 PM   #98
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I guess it all depends on how invested I am with the character, a black Nick Fury doesn't bother me but that doesn't mean I would accept an Asian Superman. And it isn't an issue of race it's just how I view what Superman should look like.
Being a blue eyed white farm boy is a pretty big part who Superman is, changing his race would be pretty damn ambiguous.. Same goes for Batman, he's a rich kid from an old family..

Wonder Woman could easily (and realistically should) look Brazilian

Bruce Banner could be Asian, I guess

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Old 10-23-2012, 07:29 PM   #99
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Default Re: Does Race Really Matter?

Well,I'm a purist,so my hope is to always see the characters translate to the screen as close to the comics as they reasonably can.

I think the only time I felt a race change worked was Michael Clarke Duncan as Kingpin.He basically looked and sounded just like what I was expecting from the Kingpin,his race being the only real difference.

The thing about Samuel L. Jackson as Nick Fury that doesn't bother me too much- is that he's like a whole different character from the original.They're using the "ultimate" version Fury not the "616" version.So it doesn't feel like they changed anything to me.They're just using a "different" Nick Fury.

The biggest ojection I've had was Alicia in FF.It just felt to me like they went "Hey,we need a black actor in a prominent role....how about Alicia?"

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Old 10-23-2012, 07:40 PM   #100
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Fun factoid: the Kingpin was originally supposed to be a black guy. The editors made the writer change this, because they were afraid it would come off as racist.

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