Am I the only one that feels like TDKR prevents Nolan's trilogy from being perfect?

[BatLobsterRises]

Originally Posted by Happy Jack

It's also a culmination of elements from the previous films as well. Unlike TDK which could *almost* be considered a standalone feature from Begins, Rises is dependent on the story that's come before it. The movie actually opens with a bit from Knight after all (unused, but still). I think that turned some off but for me it was appropriate in crafting a true unified ending.

Very true.

Also, I think it's pretty cool that they seem to have shot a whole speech for Gordon at Dent's funeral despite the fact that only the "Nothing less than a knight...shining" line was in the TDK script. I feel like they also probably shot an actual speech from Harvey for the bit where Bruce is watching him on the Bat-computer, if memory serves. Those would make cool bonus material for the Ultimate Edition, and technically they wouldn't be deleted scenes since they were never intended as actual scenes.

[Brain Damage]

Originally Posted by Happy Jack

It's also a culmination of elements from the previous films as well. Unlike TDK which could *almost* be considered a standalone feature from Begins, Rises is dependent on the story that's come before it. The movie actually opens with a bit from Knight after all (unused, but still). I think that turned some off but for me it was appropriate in crafting a true unified ending.

Was it unused footage or did they just set up the set again? I imagine it wouldn't have been that hard, considering it's only one static shot. All they would have really had to do is match Oldman's look to TDK.

[Fudgie]

Originally Posted by MAKAVELI25

For me its been the opposite. The more times I watch it the more disappointment I feel because it had all the makings to be amazing. For me though a lot of it feels too rushed and falls flat

Originally Posted by Shikamaru

That's exactly how I feel.

Count me in there too, gents.

[BatLobsterRises]

Originally Posted by Brain Damage

Was it unused footage or did they just set up the set again? I imagine it wouldn't have been that hard, considering it's only one static shot. All they would have really had to do is match Oldman's look to TDK.

I'm fairly certain it's unused footage. Oldman had clearly put on a few pounds for TDKR, in the opening shot everything is exact and his weight perfectly matches up TDK.

I think the way it works is, the props department, much like they fill an entire Gotham Times paper with actual articles that make sense, gave him an actual speech to read that way when he got to his "nothing less than a knight" line, it would have a believable flow to it.

[Anno_Domini]

Originally Posted by Deserana

Jeez that last shot really is so perfect.

Indeed. Perfect shot of Nolan's story of Bruce Wayne being finished and the slight hint of a new Batman.

[Ryan]

Originally Posted by Fudgie

Count me in there too, gents.

myself as well

[The Joker]

Originally Posted by Ryan

myself as well

I'll know next week if another viewing of the movie makes me appreciate it more or dislike it even more. I'm hoping it's the former.

[BatmanBeyond]

Originally Posted by BatLobsterRises

I will say this about the endings for Batman Begins, The Dark Knight and The Dark Knight Rises: they all give me the chills, but each for very different reasons.

Excellent point, same here. I think one of the trilogy's main strengths lies in the fact that the three movies are clearly different, and yet at the same time, they fit seamlessly within the same continuity. It also keeps things rather fresh considering that each one is over 2 hours long.

Originally Posted by The Joker

Seconded.

Not to put down the endings to other great superhero movies, but Nolan's are on a whole other level. Begins left me so excited for the Joker's forthcoming arrival. TDK's left me with a lump in my throat at Batman's amazing sacrifice. Rises' left me very happy Bruce settled down with Selina.

Agreed, my reactions were basically the same. I think it's interesting to note, once again, how both BB and TDK could work as standalone Batmovies considering their endings. Nolan and Co. could've basically left us with either the Joker card ending or the ending with Batman's sacrifice (despite the former being a cocktease, with the latter being rather dark, but also bittersweet). Both of them are so rich in content individually that I don't think I would've minded if they left at either one. I'm glad of course that they came back to do TDKR, because the trilogy as a whole is great and I've really been enthralled with this version of Batman/Bruce Wayne. On the other hand, I think one of the reasons TDKR doesn't work as well as the others as a standalone is because of the degree to which it depends on both of them.

[MAKAVELI25]

Originally Posted by The Joker

I'll know next week if another viewing of the movie makes me appreciate it more or dislike it even more. I'm hoping it's the former.

I really tried to love the movie, I wanted to. Nolan had yet to dissapoint me before TDKR, I walked out of BB feeling like it was the best superhero film I had ever seen and I loved TDK even more. I just didn't feel the same when I walked out of TDKR

[pr0xyt0xin]

while amazing, I agree with OP. TDKR leaves the trilogy merely near-perfect.
(BB - 9, TDK - 10, TDKR - 8)

For many reasons. Specifically?

Batman's retirement
Bane's death
Talia's death
army o' cops
omission of Joker's whereabouts

[Anno_Domini]

^ We have the same rating numbers, but for different films, lol.

[Anno_Domini]

Originally Posted by The Joker

I'll know next week if another viewing of the movie makes me appreciate it more or dislike it even more. I'm hoping it's the former.

I'm hoping it's the former as well, haha. I definitely appreciate your rating system for most of the films that's been mentioned on here and the Spider-Man section

[Ryan]

Originally Posted by The Joker

I'll know next week if another viewing of the movie makes me appreciate it more or dislike it even more. I'm hoping it's the former.

I think I went and saw the movie about 4 times in theatres. I can't say I ever got to like it more, but maybe I got more 'used to it" if that makes sense. It was what it was.

[The Joker]

Originally Posted by BatmanBeyond

Agreed, my reactions were basically the same. I think it's interesting to note, once again, how both BB and TDK could work as standalone Batmovies considering their endings. Nolan and Co. could've basically left us with either the Joker card ending or the ending with Batman's sacrifice (despite the former being a cocktease, with the latter being rather dark, but also bittersweet). Both of them are so rich in content individually that I don't think I would've minded if they left at either one.

Yes, I think they could have been left as stand alones, and I know Nolan said his intention at the end of Batman Begins was never a sequel set up. But I'll be damned if he didn't leave everyone thirsting to see him tackle The Joker in a sequel.

Originally Posted by MAKAVELI25

I really tried to love the movie, I wanted to. Nolan had yet to dissapoint me before TDKR, I walked out of BB feeling like it was the best superhero film I had ever seen and I loved TDK even more. I just didn't feel the same when I walked out of TDKR

I was the exact same. I don't know how much you like TDKR compared to me. I enjoyed it a lot, I think it certainly broke the superhero threequel curse, but I just find to be very flawed and a big step down from BB and TDK.

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

I'm hoping it's the former as well, haha. I definitely appreciate your rating system for most of the films that's been mentioned on here and the Spider-Man section

Spider-Man 2 is still the best

Originally Posted by Ryan

I think I went and saw the movie about 4 times in theatres. I can't say I ever got to like it more, but maybe I got more 'used to it" if that makes sense. It was what it was.

Yes, that makes sense. But sometimes you can see a movie a couple of times in theaters and it doesn't shift your opinion on it. Then several months later it comes out on DVD and you suddenly like it more than you did when you saw it in the theater.

That's happened to me before. I see it happening all the time on here. There was an influx of that happening in The Amazing Spider-Man section when it came out a couple of weeks ago. Lots of people were loving it a lot more than they had before it came out on DVD. So I am hopeful something similar happens for me with TDKR. We'll see.

Can I ask how many times you saw Batman Begins and The Dark Knight in theater? Mine goes like this;

BB - 5 times
TDK - 10 times
TDKR - 4 times

[Deserana]

I've never seen BB in the theatres Saw TDK 6 times and TDKR 4 times.

[Deserana]

Originally Posted by pr0xyt0xin

omission of Joker's whereabouts

We know where he is they just didn't feel the need to say it. Practically the reason Bruce is the way he is in TDKR is down to The Joker. This isn't aimed at you but I find it funnt how Nolan is sometimes accused of handholding an audience but some seem to not see that it was The Joker's fault mainly for his retirement.

[Mr. Wooden Alligator]

Yes. The Joker basically shut Bruce off from a normal life...by Bruce's train of thought. Plus the however long he spent whittling away the mob probably took a physical toll on him.

[The Joker]

I do love that out of all of the villains in the trilogy the Joker had the worst and most long lasting effect on Bruce. 8 long years of misery.

[Robin91939]

Not to short-change the effect the Joker had on Bruce -- because I do feel that he retired due to that night...

I believe that he operated as Batman for at least a little bit after that night. Yes, the night he "killed" Dent is the "last reported sighting of the Batman," but that doesn't mean that he didn't operate for a while unseen.

Think about it --

The Batcave was not yet rebuilt during The Dark Knight...

Why would Bruce had rebuilt the Batcave if he weren't going to use it? It makes me think that he used the Batcave for at least a little while AFTER the events of The Dark Knight. Also, Alfred says in The Dark Knight Rises when Bruce is in the Batcave searching Selina Kyle on the Batcomputer, "You haven't been down here in a long time." Suggesting that he's been in the newly renovated Batcave -- meaning he would have had to been down there after the events of The Dark Knight...

He probably retired a short time after the night he took the wrap for Dent's murder.

-R

[The Joker]

The Batcave was never destroyed though. He never had to rebuild it. Just Wayne Manor. He said at the end of Begins that they were going to make improvements on the Batcave. After seeing TDKR, I didn't notice any radical improvements.

[Ryan]

Originally Posted by The Joker

I do love that out of all of the villains in the trilogy the Joker had the worst and most long lasting effect on Bruce. 8 long years of misery.

Good point. I never thought of that.

[BatLobsterRises]

The rising platforms, the walkway, a brand new Bat-computer. I'd say cave definitely got a solid upgrade.

Also, joint injuries can worsen do to inactivity. The doc saying he had no cartilage left in his knee seems like a nod to arthritis. I highly doubt Bruce has been hobbling on a cane for 8 years.

I think the movie just wanted to present a very general impression on the audience that Batman has been gone a long time. It's romanticized. The most easy way to interpret that is that he's been retired the whole 8 years, not 7 years and 3 months or whatever...but nothing in the film would contradict that idea.

[Deserana]

Originally Posted by The Joker

The Batcave was never destroyed though. He never had to rebuild it. Just Wayne Manor. He said at the end of Begins that they were going to make improvements on the Batcave. After seeing TDKR, I didn't notice any radical improvements.

It had no elevating platforms in BB. The suit was in some kind of wardrobe in BB whereas in TDKR it came outta the ground.

[Robin91939]

Originally Posted by The Joker

The Batcave was never destroyed though. He never had to rebuild it. Just Wayne Manor. He said at the end of Begins that they were going to make improvements on the Batcave. After seeing TDKR, I didn't notice any radical improvements.

Yeah -- the cave had a pretty complete overhaul. And Alfred's line about being down there -- as in the "new batcave," seems like Bruce has operated from this revamped cave. Which means he would have had to move from the Batbunker in The Dark Knight and into this revamped cave. Which means he would have had to have continued as Batman for at least a little while AFTER the night Dent was killed.

-R

[The Joker]

Originally Posted by Deserana

It had no elevating platforms in BB. The suit was in some kind of wardrobe in BB whereas in TDKR it came outta the ground.

I don't call a rising platform and a new wardrobe radical new improvements lol. As for the Bat-Computer, it looks like the same one he had in the Bat-Bunker in TDK. I'd say he just transferred it to there.