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Old 12-11-2012, 08:37 PM   #251
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

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The image of Mr. Wink did't display.

Hellboy is a virtual full-body prosthetic. All of the muscles are fake; as well as the stone hand (which is especially relevant to the Darkseid debate). Hellboy didn't involve CGI in the character's portrayal (except one ****y looking scene in the first film where they couldn't afford the animatronic hand to crush a coke can so they animated it with computers). I assume you meant, "unlike Hellboy."

Nobody has yet to explain exactly why CGI is needed for Darkseid-- you guys just want CGI; like gaudy spinners on a car.
You sure? Let's remember that Hellboy's tail was CGI. Mr. Wink's image did come up in that other comment, and I replied that he was obviously animations and while he was a great character, looked fake.

I'd prefer a mixture of prosthetics and CGI for Darkseid because I think that will yield better results than going full-on prosthetics or CGI.

That's all I'll say on the subject because I feel like I'm repeating myself.

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Old 12-11-2012, 09:21 PM   #252
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

Also, despite being animatronic, Wink wasn't always 100% animatronic for his scenes. At 0:29 of this scene, you'll notice that his mouth was touched up with CGI for the roaring part. And because of the animatronics and Wink's size, his movements had a stiffness to them that made him look even more fake.

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Old 12-12-2012, 03:03 PM   #253
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

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Yeah, I don't see why it has to be one or the other either when both could work together and achieve even greater results.
Exactly. I'd love to see them exhaust every possible avenue vs. turning my nose up at one method or the other. Different shots might require different combinations. Tailoring their approach for each scenario is imperative.


Without getting into a debate over whether or not it was a good movie, look how Captain America handled skinny Steve, and how they filmed each scene 6 times, just to get the right look for each shot.

Darkseid could benefit from that attention to detail, but in reverse. You could use a big 6'8"-6'10" guy in prosthetics as a double reference for the main actor, having them mimmick the actors performance, and overlay the two performances digitally to give the actor the right size.

If said "big" stuntman and the actual actor were identical prosthetics, the overlay could theoretically work. This is an arm chair view of the process, but that's my take. Then you could do enhancements (eyes, texture of the rock) in post.

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Old 12-12-2012, 03:52 PM   #254
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

Yeah so 100% animatronics/prosthetics is a no go. No one will take Darkseid seriously if we moves like a guy in a Chuck E. Cheese suit. Action scenes will definitely need to be mostly CG if not all by the way I see it.

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Old 12-12-2012, 04:00 PM   #255
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

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Yeah so 100% animatronics/prosthetics is a no go. No one will take Darkseid seriously if we moves like a guy in a Chuck E. Cheese suit. Action scenes will definitely need to be mostly CG if not all by the way I see it.

They need to figure out that balance that gives Darkseid texture and a real sense of existing in a space, which pure CGI often lacks. You don't want him to look like a giant grey ball of goop.

On the flip side, and as much as I love Guillermo Del Torro, I was always distracted by the animatronics in his Helboy films. Were the cool? Yes. But never once did I mistake them for real creatures.

That's why I'm arguing a melding of the two methods, and maybe some other methods, would help bring Darkseid to life.

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Old 12-12-2012, 07:11 PM   #256
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

I think the over-animated mouth of Mr. Wink is the only thing wrong with the character's appearance there. It's the CGI that looks fake.

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Yeah so 100% animatronics/prosthetics is a no go. No one will take Darkseid seriously if we moves like a guy in a Chuck E. Cheese suit. Action scenes will definitely need to be mostly CG if not all by the way I see it.
Why would he move clunky if he is wearing prosthetics relative to the character of Hellboy; and not some massive suit? If you build something huge; it's going to move like something huge.

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Old 12-12-2012, 07:21 PM   #257
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

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Yeah so 100% animatronics/prosthetics is a no go. No one will take Darkseid seriously if we moves like a guy in a Chuck E. Cheese suit. Action scenes will definitely need to be mostly CG if not all by the way I see it.
I say just replace him with Chuck E Cheese. That dude freaks me out!

Side note, I took the kids to Chuck E Cheese one day. The guy in the costume was walking around while the animatronics robot band was playing their songs on stage. Two Chuck E's in the room at the same time... totally ruined the vibe and illusion for the kids. Very sad.

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Old 12-12-2012, 07:54 PM   #258
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

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Yeah so 100% animatronics/prosthetics is a no go. No one will take Darkseid seriously if we moves like a guy in a Chuck E. Cheese suit. Action scenes will definitely need to be mostly CG if not all by the way I see it.
If you want him to be a 9 foot tall giant, of course. But if you only make him a little taller than Superman and apply prosthetics like Hellboy or the Frost Giants in Thor, the actor will move just fine.

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Old 12-14-2012, 06:08 PM   #259
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

I love Darkseid of course and it will give them a true planetary threat to make them form together. However, I was really hoping for the Legion of Doom to be the threat for the first film because if JL is released after Avengers in 2015 then the GA will think that WB/DC are copying Disney/Marvel.

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Old 12-15-2012, 01:26 PM   #260
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

I think the movie's threat has to be a god or an alien. I don't see any other reason for why the JL members would have to team up. You have the world's greatest detective and most dangerous man (at least according to Darkseid and Superman), a "space cop" whose power is only limited by his imagination, an Godly Amazonian warrior, the fastest man alive, a being who can do almost anything and whose real name translates to God, and presumably the King of the Oceans who takes care of 74% of the planet and a telepath from Mars. Realistically speaking, you need a God or alien as the main villain in order to show the League's full potential but it might be a bit too early for Darkseid.

I think the White Martians would be a good choice. The only problem would be that they've been overused a lot in Justice League media in general. Almost every retelling of the origin did the White Martians or something very similar to them.

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Old 12-15-2012, 07:23 PM   #261
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

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If you want him to be a 9 foot tall giant, of course. But if you only make him a little taller than Superman and apply prosthetics like Hellboy or the Frost Giants in Thor, the actor will move just fine.
I was thinking 9 foot tall giant. I guess that won't be an option after all :/ Ah well it's no big deal at all. In fact, it might be better to leave Darkseid at a reasonable height so he doesn't come off as an utterly ridiculous character to the less comic oriented folks.

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Old 12-15-2012, 08:09 PM   #262
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League




Darkseid: AW YEAH!!! FEEL MA AWESOMENESS *****ES!!!


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Old 12-15-2012, 08:51 PM   #263
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

Prosthetics + CGI enchantments. Simple.

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Old 12-15-2012, 09:30 PM   #264
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

Whoa. That picture makes it look like Darkseid has radioactive farts.

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Old 12-15-2012, 09:32 PM   #265
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

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Whoa. That picture makes it look like Darkseid has radioactive farts.
Look like?

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Old 12-15-2012, 09:41 PM   #266
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

And then he proceeded to just lay waste to anyone and anything. I prefer my Darkseid a little more sophisticated.

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Old 12-15-2012, 11:17 PM   #267
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And then he proceeded to just lay waste to anyone and anything. I prefer my Darkseid a little more sophisticated.
I agree, that was probably my second biggest complaint about those first six or so issues of Justice League in the New 52. Darkseid became... just another bad guy. Show up, mess shiz up and for what? Well, we don't know do we? I didn't read past the sixth issue so I don't know if later it was revealed that it was part of a bigger plot than just to mess up Superman and take over the Earth. He was just one big brute - no more sophisticated than Juggernaut from X-Men. Part of Darkseid's appeal as well as his threat as a villain is how smart he is and his near immortality. Neither of these things became apparent unless if you did some serious reading between the lines. But thankfully it's looking like the New 52 won't have as big of an influence on the JL movie as we originally thought... well, we don't know this obviously, but it's looking like it's not.

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Old 12-15-2012, 11:20 PM   #268
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

He was looking for his daughter. They said that in the story. He also had people invade Earth-2. Since he never found her, it will play into something later.

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Old 12-15-2012, 11:39 PM   #269
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You know, even though I thought at first it'd be a nice way to bring all the single movies together, by having some multiverse level threat, I so hope they don't actually bring this concept into the Movies. Actually pisses me off regularly in the comics. I don't mind the multiverse concept itself, but I hate how always something goes down that forces different universes to merge and changes everything.

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Old 12-16-2012, 04:58 AM   #270
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

The only way I would want the multiverse brought in to a film universe would be if:

1) They base a story around JLA Earth-2

2)They base a story around Crisis On Infinite Earths

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Old 12-16-2012, 05:27 PM   #271
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Prosthetics + CGI enchantments. Simple.


That would be a good combo also.

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Old 12-18-2012, 11:07 AM   #272
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

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I was thinking 9 foot tall giant. I guess that won't be an option after all :/ Ah well it's no big deal at all. In fact, it might be better to leave Darkseid at a reasonable height so he doesn't come off as an utterly ridiculous character to the less comic oriented folks.

Wasn't Darkseid officially about 7'5" at one point? I think that would be a perfect height to make him both towering yet accessible.

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Old 12-18-2012, 11:57 AM   #273
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Something in the 7ft range would be ok, you could still get actors to fill a suit.


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Old 12-18-2012, 12:55 PM   #274
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Something in the 7ft range would be ok, you could still get actors to fill a suit.

I basically want Darkseid to be a head taller than any member of the Justice League.

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Old 12-18-2012, 01:11 PM   #275
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Default Re: Darkseid is the Villain in Justice League

Desaad maybe get a good role if the case is true.

Darkseid & Desaad?

Other villains I would like to see moviewise include , Eclipso, Vandal Savage & Despero.


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