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View Poll Results: Which villain
Mr. Freeze 39 16.25%
Joker 5 2.08%
Riddler 70 29.17%
Penguin 10 4.17%
Clayface 16 6.67%
Mad Hatter 4 1.67%
Hugo Strange 34 14.17%
Poison Ivy 8 3.33%
Two Face 6 2.50%
Killer Croc 15 6.25%
The League Of Assasins 1 0.42%
The Court Of Owls 19 7.92%
Dollmaker 0 0%
Catwoman 1 0.42%
Other 12 5.00%
Voters: 240. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-26-2013, 10:40 PM   #501
gwynplaine
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Default Re: Next Batman Villain?

Jean Dujardin as Black Mask.

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Old 11-27-2013, 07:44 AM   #502
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Default Re: Next Batman Villain?

That could work !!!

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Old 11-28-2013, 06:46 AM   #503
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Originally Posted by shauner111 View Post
Freeze actually has a great character arc. There's a tragic story to tell. Poison Ivy in my opinion is a very shallow, one-dimensional character. You can say the same about Black Mask. To some people he may seem darker (he is) and more threatening, but he's not more important than Ivy. Like you said.

I just dont think she's important to the history of Batman or how she relates to Batman/Bruce Wayne. I would argue that she's more important than say..Mad Hatter. But i can name a dozen villains that hold more importance to the mythology.
She isn't shallow or unidimensional, but very bad developed (at least in the stories I've read of her). She's the one important female Batman villain independant and non linked with a male character (also Catwoman, but nowadays is difficult consider her as a villain) and she represents something very interesting and dangerous to the ideology of Batman/Bruce Wayne: the revolution of the nature and the revolution of the woman, both things deeply related. The problem is the writers, which are generally men, doesn't know how to carry her, and she always finishes doing little more than committing crimes with plants, which is something shallow, but she has an incredible potential.

What villains would you say are more important than Ivy in the Batman mythos?

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Old 11-28-2013, 08:38 PM   #504
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Default Re: Next Batman Villain?

I was thinking tonight, Enrico Colantoni or Toby Jones would be good picks for The Ventriloquist:




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Old 11-28-2013, 09:17 PM   #505
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Default Re: Next Batman Villain?

This should be the inspiration for the Ventriloquist. Not a Puppet that looks like an old gangster with a speech impediment.

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Old 11-28-2013, 09:19 PM   #506
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Default Re: Next Batman Villain?

What do you think about that new Ventriloquist? The even creepier chick.

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Old 11-28-2013, 09:19 PM   #507
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She isn't shallow or unidimensional, but very bad developed (at least in the stories I've read of her). She's the one important female Batman villain independant and non linked with a male character (also Catwoman, but nowadays is difficult consider her as a villain) and she represents something very interesting and dangerous to the ideology of Batman/Bruce Wayne: the revolution of the nature and the revolution of the woman, both things deeply related. The problem is the writers, which are generally men, doesn't know how to carry her, and she always finishes doing little more than committing crimes with plants, which is something shallow, but she has an incredible potential.

What villains would you say are more important than Ivy in the Batman mythos?
There's potential there to do something a little deeper when you get into nature, women, etc. But it's still nothing interesting in my eyes. You say that relates to something that could be very dangerous/interesting to Bruce or Batman, but i dont see how that's the case. The revolution of woman and nature...specifically with "woman"...what does that have to do with Batman? Nature and earth or plants over what? Technology? Im sure Batmans answer to that would be so what? i can strip myself down of gadgets and still kick your ass and make you think a giant bat is coming for your ass cuz im the goddamn batman!

Ive never seen her portrayed well enough for me to say "yeaaah she's definitely an important character of the mythos." Nope.

More important than Pamela Isley? Catwoman is miles ahead but yes you're right, she's not really a villain, nor should she be portrayed as such. Like how Tim Burton used her in film.

Id say Penguin, Freeze, Joker, Riddler, Bane, Hush, Scarecrow, Hugo Strange, Ra's Al Ghul, Talia most definitely. My personal preferences are not included because i would rather see Black Mask or Ventriloquist than Ivy but they're no more important. I also dont care for Hush that much but he was a part of something new for audiences 10 years ago, by a popular writer/artist dynamic. And his story actually relates to Bruce Wayne.

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Old 11-28-2013, 09:27 PM   #508
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Quote:
Originally Posted by terry78 View Post
What do you think about that new Ventriloquist? The even creepier chick.
I don't know if you are asking me, but I'll answer, I'm not familiar with her, but it sounds cool lol.

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Old 11-28-2013, 09:35 PM   #509
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Default Re: Next Batman Villain?

The one that's in New 52. She's a metahuman and can actually bring her puppets to life.

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Old 11-28-2013, 09:37 PM   #510
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Cool, I'll check it out, thanks

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Old 11-28-2013, 09:57 PM   #511
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I always liked the Ventriloquist. Very sad villain. There is a story by Paul Dini and Bruce Timm where Wesker adopts a different personality or a "friend" and gets a new frog puppet. Damn it made my cry, very sad.

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Old 11-28-2013, 09:59 PM   #512
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Yeah, done right, The Ventriloquist could probably be a great villain.

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Old 11-28-2013, 10:00 PM   #513
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Old 11-28-2013, 10:48 PM   #514
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Default Re: Next Batman Villain?

------Phase 1--------

2015 Man of Steel: The Caped Crusader
(Jason has recently died, and Dick has yet to take the Nightwing name)

-Deathstroke & Metallo


-with Joker (offscreen) & Lex hinted at the end to be pulling the strings, though in opposite directions.


2017 Justice League
-Brainiac
-Ares


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Old 11-29-2013, 05:21 AM   #515
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------Phase 2---------

2018 Batman: Behind the Mask (Tim Drake's intro)

-Riddler (offscreen) and Hugo Strange


-Clayface (with a brief Jason Todd impression)

-Arkham inmate cameos


2020 Justice League: Tower of Babel
-
Atlantis/Starro to start (in medias res)
-then the Legion of Doom (with Doomsday and the Death of Superman)

------Phase 3---------

2021 Batman: Under the Hood

-Joker (with a Red Hood flashback to Ace chemicals and Joker's origin)

(With the Barbara storyline from The Killing Joke)

-Jason Todd's return as Red Hood (with a brief Lazarus Pit/Ra's scene)


-Black Mask & Penguin



2023 Justice League: The New Gods (death of Batfleck).


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Old 11-29-2013, 06:22 AM   #516
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------Phase 4-------------------------------------------------------

2024 Batman Legacy (Dick as Batman)

-Damian's intro


-Shiva and Cassandra


-James Gordon Jr.


2026 Justice League: Titans

------Phase 5---------

2027 Batman Reborn (return of Bruce Wayne, with a recast probably)
-Mr. Freeze (team up by the end)

-Court of Owls


2029 Justice League: Trinity

------Phase 6---------

2030 Batman Awakening

-Joker (Death of the Family)


-Talia and Ra's



2033 Justice League: Kingdom Come

------------------------

A man can dream, right?


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Old 11-29-2013, 10:10 AM   #517
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shauner111 View Post
There's potential there to do something a little deeper when you get into nature, women, etc. But it's still nothing interesting in my eyes. You say that relates to something that could be very dangerous/interesting to Bruce or Batman, but i dont see how that's the case. The revolution of woman and nature...specifically with "woman"...what does that have to do with Batman? Nature and earth or plants over what? Technology? Im sure Batmans answer to that would be so what? i can strip myself down of gadgets and still kick your ass and make you think a giant bat is coming for your ass cuz im the goddamn batman!

Ive never seen her portrayed well enough for me to say "yeaaah she's definitely an important character of the mythos." Nope.

More important than Pamela Isley? Catwoman is miles ahead but yes you're right, she's not really a villain, nor should she be portrayed as such. Like how Tim Burton used her in film.

Id say Penguin, Freeze, Joker, Riddler, Bane, Hush, Scarecrow, Hugo Strange, Ra's Al Ghul, Talia most definitely. My personal preferences are not included because i would rather see Black Mask or Ventriloquist than Ivy but they're no more important. I also dont care for Hush that much but he was a part of something new for audiences 10 years ago, by a popular writer/artist dynamic. And his story actually relates to Bruce Wayne.
But in certain way Pamela Isley is the contrary of Bruce Wayne: Batman is a masculine conservative force whose power is based on technology, while Ivy is a femenine revolutionary force whose power is based on nature. That's a very interesting antagonism and some great stories can be written with it.

I suppose the list of the most important villains is very subjective and it depends of each one, in my case I'd say the 10 most important villains in Batman mythos are: Joker, Two Faces, Scarecrown, Penguin, Catwoman, Riddler, Rha's Al Ghul, Bane, Harley Quinn and Poison Ivy.

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Old 11-29-2013, 10:25 AM   #518
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Nice (but unrealistic) layout FeedOnATreeFrog. And i see that you like my "Man Of Steel: Caped Crusader" suggestion

Quote:
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But in certain way Pamela Isley is the contrary of Bruce Wayne: Batman is a masculine conservative force whose power is based on technology, while Ivy is a femenine revolutionary force whose power is based on nature. That's a very interesting antagonism and some great stories can be written with it.

I suppose the list of the most important villains is very subjective and it depends of each one, in my case I'd say the 10 most important villains in Batman mythos are: Joker, Two Faces, Scarecrown, Penguin, Catwoman, Riddler, Rha's Al Ghul, Bane, Harley Quinn and Poison Ivy.
I guess when you put it that way it can be interesting. But i dont think it's that important especially since she hasn't been written with that much potential. In the grand scheme of things, within the source material and movies, she just hasn't left any mark. Plus i dont see WB going into that direction for a long time.

I totally forgot to mention Two-Face didnt i? he should be near the very top. I think Hugo Strange is probably on the level of Harley Quinn when you look at his history in the comics. He may be a bit above her. And yes i like Harley more. But there's no way she's more important to the mythology than Talia. I mean, sure, you can say she's more popular...especially in animation. But Harley is there because of Joker, she's like his Robin in a twisted way. Talia as a character directly relates to Bruce/Batman. She's even had his kid. That's more important to the history because of what ended up happening with Damien throughout the years. Which has lead us to where we are now in the comics. Talia has now been in a live-action movie which is more exposure than hardcore bat fans who love Harley elsewhere.


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Old 11-29-2013, 11:20 AM   #519
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I don't see Talia as a villain but a woman in Bruce Wayne life, I know she has been a proper antagonist but I can't see her in the villain way...


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Old 11-29-2013, 02:21 PM   #520
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Fair enough.

I find Penguin is a FAR more important villain than people give him credit for. I know Riddler challenges Batmans detective skills but there's way more parallels between Oswald and Bruce.

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Old 11-29-2013, 05:58 PM   #521
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Perhaps I'd change Harley Quinn for Victor Zsasz, the most hated criminal by Bruce (as said in Cacophony), and a very underrated character, cause his paralelisms with Bruce Wayne makes him, in some way, the darkest reflection of Batman.

In order of importance, I would list them this way:
1- Joker
2- Rha's Al Ghul
3- Two Faces
4- Catwoman (an ambiguous role, but she's always been a criminal and Batman is against them, so...)
5- Penguin
6- Scarecrown/Riddler
7- Riddler/Scarecrown
8- Bane
9- Zsasz
10- Poison Ivy

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Old 11-29-2013, 06:48 PM   #522
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If you want an Arkham style Penguin, you go to Jamie Foreman

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Old 11-30-2013, 02:38 AM   #523
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shauner111 View Post
Nice (but unrealistic) layout FeedOnATreeFrog. And i see that you like my "Man Of Steel: Caped Crusader" suggestion
Thanks, but I've always liked that title!

http://forums.superherohype.com/show...&postcount=392


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Old 12-01-2013, 03:24 AM   #524
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Court of Owls would make for a GREAT movie. It would be a great way to begin with an established "Bat-verse" while also adding new elements to it that wouldn't just be recycling the same, rundown origin story that we've seen so many times on the big screen.

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Old 12-16-2013, 10:49 PM   #525
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A horror movie type of version of Killer Croc would work to me.

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