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View Poll Results: What is your favorite comic book film of all time?
Spider-Man (2002) 13 12.26%
Spider-Man 2 26 24.53%
The Amazing Spider-Man 20 18.87%
The Dark Knight 49 46.23%
The Dark Knight Rises 24 22.64%
Marvel's The Avengers 36 33.96%
Iron Man 20 18.87%
Captain America: The First Avenger 7 6.60%
Thor 11 10.38%
Superman 10 9.43%
Superman II 6 5.66%
V For Vendetta 5 4.72%
Watchmen 3 2.83%
X2: X-Men United 17 16.04%
X-Men: First Class 11 10.38%
Other 15 14.15%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 106. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-13-2012, 05:22 PM   #201
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Default Re: Rank every comic book film - where do the Spider-Man films fit in?

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Originally Posted by Picard Sisko View Post
Peter gave Dr. Connors the formula, therefore, he created him. I think you guys are really taking this too far, and overanalyzing it. He is a teenager, and he feels guilty for what has happened. That is normal.

As far as Electro goes, he will no doubt be connected to Oscorp. I doubt he will be personally connected to Peter's parents though. He is just some electrician.
Lol. Terrible reasoning. Peter gave Connors an equation that Peter did not create. Connors created the actual serum itself that Peter didn't create. Now we're just trying to put everything in its most simplest terms, when no, if you're going to really think about it, while Peter can be thought of as helping in creating this monster, Peter did not solely create the monster himself, which is what he told Gwen.

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Old 12-13-2012, 05:26 PM   #202
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Lol. Terrible reasoning. Peter gave Connors an equation that Peter did not create. Connors created the actual serum itself that Peter didn't create. Now we're just trying to put everything in its most simplest terms, when no, if you're going to really think about it, while Peter can be thought of as helping in creating this monster, Peter did not solely create the monster himself, which is what he told Gwen.
If it weren't for Peter, there would be no Lizard. End of story. He had to research his dad's notes, confront Connors, and hand over the formula to him.

EDIT: He set things in motion.

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Old 12-13-2012, 05:27 PM   #203
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Default Re: Rank every comic book film - where do the Spider-Man films fit in?


Some of these posts are better fit for "Which is better?" thread

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Old 12-13-2012, 05:35 PM   #204
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If it weren't for Peter, there would be no Lizard. End of story. He had to research his dad's notes, confront Connors, and hand over the formula to him.

EDIT: He set things in motion.
He HELPED create the monster. End of story. He didn't solely create him

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Some of these posts are better fit for "Which is better?" thread
The posters' ideas would probably be better.

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Old 12-13-2012, 05:40 PM   #205
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Peter says he gave Connors the equation that his dad was working on. It was his responsibility to stop him because it was a mess he made. And also, how do we know that Peter didn't add anything to the equation he found? Perhaps he changed something, too. Either way, he is responsible for the Lizard, and did "create" him.

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Old 12-13-2012, 05:41 PM   #206
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He HELPED create the monster. End of story. He didn't solely create him



The posters' ideas would probably be better.
Well, he didn't say he SOLELY created him. He gave credit to his father when he mentions he was working on the equation. So there. END OF STORY.

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Old 12-13-2012, 05:44 PM   #207
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Originally Posted by Picard Sisko View Post
Peter says he gave Connors the equation that his dad was working on. It was his responsibility to stop him because it was a mess he made. And also, how do we know that Peter didn't add anything to the equation he found? Perhaps he changed something, too. Either way, he is responsible for the Lizard, and did "create" him.
Then the film will simply show that Peter is smarter than Dr. Connors, an actual DOCTOR if Peter added something to the equation and Connors didn't seem to have anything positive going for him in that area.

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Well, he didn't say he SOLELY created him. He gave credit to his father when he mentions he was working on the equation. So there. END OF STORY.
Too bad he still said he created the monster, to which he wasn't the one who only created the monster that is the Lizard.

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Old 12-13-2012, 05:52 PM   #208
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Then the film will simply show that Peter is smarter than Dr. Connors, an actual DOCTOR if Peter added something to the equation and Connors didn't seem to have anything positive going for him in that area.



Too bad he still said he created the monster, to which he wasn't the one who only created the monster that is the Lizard.
You are taking it way too literally. I'm done with this conversation. Seriously, its annoying at this point.

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Originally Posted by Peter Parker
"No matter how small I am--no matter how hopeless everything seems--I mustn't give up! My size doesn't matter! Even my life doesn't matter! No one can win--every battle, but--no man should fall-- without a struggle!"
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Old 12-13-2012, 05:56 PM   #209
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You're right, it is annoying in trying to understand why we can't take dialogue in a film literal.

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Old 12-13-2012, 05:58 PM   #210
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Originally Posted by Peter Parker
"No matter how small I am--no matter how hopeless everything seems--I mustn't give up! My size doesn't matter! Even my life doesn't matter! No one can win--every battle, but--no man should fall-- without a struggle!"
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Old 12-13-2012, 06:20 PM   #211
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He probably feels guilty for "creating" the Lizard the same way that he feels guilty for letting the thief go. Peter didn't actually shoot Uncle Ben. In fact, if you want to get really technical, Peter did nothing. Of course, that is taking things a little too far because that is the entire point, Peter feels guilty because he didn't do something to help when he could have, but you get my point.

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Old 12-14-2012, 03:39 AM   #212
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Default Re: Rank every comic book film - where do the Spider-Man films fit in?

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As incredible as that train scene is to watch, I will stick to criticizing how little sense it makes with Ock

Look back at the wrestling scene in Spider-Man 1, Bonesaw is trained to endure strong hits (even with the play in chair hits, they still need to train to swallow pain or roll with it), 8 kicks and a flip from Spider-Man and he falls unconscious

Train fight scene, Ock receives all these hits, 8 punches and 1 kick, even if one argues Spider-Man pulls those punches I'd say he pulls them against street thugs, look how fast they fall, and there is no way that kick to the chest is pulled

Octavius is a chubby middle aged man sticking long hours in a lab, he sometimes stays for days, there's no way someone like him could stand against so many hits when a guy as strong as Bonesaw fell and stayed down after less attacks
And in the warehouse fight he receives a few punches that make him dizzy, last punch is harder than the rest, and Ock gets up fast

His danger in comics is by not letting Spider-Man hit him in the face, every time he receives one hit from Spider-Man he faints, so if the comics did it better I'm sticking to my stance against Ock in SM2 the movie
This is actually very true!

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Peter gave Dr. Connors the formula, therefore, he created him. I think you guys are really taking this too far, and overanalyzing it. He is a teenager, and he feels guilty for what has happened. That is normal.

As far as Electro goes, he will no doubt be connected to Oscorp. I doubt he will be personally connected to Peter's parents though. He is just some electrician.
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I think people are going way too far with bashing every single detail in TASM. I could go over to Batman forums and point out the incredible number of flaws and plot holes in that movie. But its a waste of time.
Exactly!!

It seems some people don't seem to understand the human mind very well, especially not of younger people. ANYONE would feel guilt in Peter's situation. Maybe not Anno, but pretty much everyone else.

They're overanalysing and coming up with the most stupid excuses to call something bad because they want to. Simple as that.

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Old 12-14-2012, 03:42 AM   #213
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Default Re: Rank every comic book film - where do the Spider-Man films fit in?

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Too bad he still said he created the monster, to which he wasn't the one who only created the monster that is the Lizard.
Even you have to realise how stupid you are now.

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Old 12-14-2012, 04:21 AM   #214
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Default Re: Rank every comic book film - where do the Spider-Man films fit in?

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Originally Posted by Picard Sisko View Post
If it weren't for Peter, there would be no Lizard. End of story. He had to research his dad's notes, confront Connors, and hand over the formula to him.

EDIT: He set things in motion.
Not to mention the scene that Peter didn't simply give the equation, he also helped Connors in the lab with it to make it work


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Old 12-14-2012, 04:37 AM   #215
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Yeah he didn't literally create him, but he gave Connors the key that made it all possible,(and made sure that it would work), so in a poetic sense he created the Lizard

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Old 12-14-2012, 06:29 AM   #216
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He is a martial artist and a detective and a versatile genius like he is supposed to be. He is just not there on the same level as the well known mainstream Batman of the comics in terms of those skills. It makes sense too. BB and TDK were all about Batman in his very early career. BB takes place in Bruce's first year as Batman while TDK takes place in Bruce's second year as Batman and level of the skills he portrays in those films match the same level of the skills he portrays in his first and second year in the comics, specifically his skills in Year One and Long Halloween (BB's Batman is based on Year One's Batman and TDK's Batman is based on Long Halloween's Batman). The realism of those books is very similar to the realism of the Nolan films as well. Heck, Year One was even more realistic than any of the Nolan films. So it's really not a problem with me because BB and TDK are adaptations of a young not-fully-experienced Batman and they match the young not-fully experienced Batman of the early comics (early timeline-wise (not publication-wise) and once again, specifically the Batman from YO and TLH).
No matter how you justify it,he is not an accurate adaptation.Its his first year as Batman,but didnt he spend 7 years mastering the art? He cant learn martial arts in that period?
In BB he did speak a different language once and Ra's did reference different fighting styles he was trying,but after BB Nolan just went backwards on those things.
Its stupidity that after 7 years of trailer all he can do is be a thug on roids
Nolan wemt too much into the 'symbol' thingy,though it did suit the trilogy

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There is no problem with Rachel. Unlike Spider-Man and Superman, Batman doesn't have a consistent love interest. Every writer on Batman when they start writing him have the room to use any love interest from the past they want as minor as she may be and a lot of them even create a new love interest for him altogether (such as Nolan). So it's fine that he created a character. It works for Batman in any medium. It's not the same thing as creating a new love interest for Spider-Man or Superman when adapting them because they already have consistent ongoing love interests.
It beats me how creating a completely new love interest is Okay but changing an existing one's character a bit to suit the story is not(And MJ was fine in SM1 and SM2,she just wasnt written well in SM3)
Batman has plenty of female characters in the comics,anyone could have been modified to suit the needs instead of creating one from thin air

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Harvey's origin isn't an issue. The important thing when doing an adaptation is to get the basic and iconic aspects right. The only thing you need to stay true to when adapting to Two-Face is that he was originally a great district attorney who then got in a situation that got half of his face severely burned and then was corrupted/broken and turned into a villain. Those are really the only important aspects of Two-Face's origin.
And Raimi didnt get the basic and iconic aspect of Spider-man right? He did it better than Webb did

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I don't think I'm giving too much thought. Although you can definitely make a good Spider-Man movie that's not true to the comics, it would be such a huge waste of potential.
By that logic Nolan's trilogy is a waste of potential

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I think most of us can agree that the new franchise has far more potential than the old one because it set up everything better and portrayed the characters right from the start.
It has potential but definitely not more than SM2 or SM3 had before releasing


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Old 12-14-2012, 06:43 AM   #217
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Nolan's trilogy is a different animal. His action scenes were generally more stripped down and grounded, less fantastical.
There is nothing 'grounded' in half a dozen thugs having guns but preferring to wait their chance to get beat up and fight with their hands

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I was hoping we'd get more of that in TASM. A little less fantastical (CGI-fest) and more up close and personal, brutal fight sequences. I realise you need CGI and spectacle, but based on the pre-production comments, I didn't think they'd use it so liberally.
I was watching a reel of the production on youtube and I couldnt believe how much practical stunts went in for the movie,a lot of sequences which I though was CGI were actually done in reality
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Honestly, if Sony came out tomorrow and said the next Spider-Man film has a budget of 140 m, I'd be VERY HAPPY. That would mean the filmmakers would have to strip down the action (not so much the amount of action) and be forced to be more inventive, more elemental. CGI just makes people lazy and is often a cop-out.
You dont get it,the reason why TASM had a high budget(220M) because they opted for Practical stunts rather than CGI
Plus when I meant better action sequences I didnt more CGI,I meant more creative sequences and that doesnt mean heavy CGI,Raimi made better action sequences with 140M movie than Webb did with a 220M movie
He created the perfect balance imo,not relying on too much practical stunts and bloating the budget yet the scenes wont look to impressive and niether did he go whole CGI bonanza to make it Transformer like
Thats what Webb needs to achieve

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I loved the Raimi action pieces and think the train sequence in SM2 has yet to be topped in any film. But we've been down that road and need something that feels different and new for this franchise.
Different in terms of Story and tone maybe but Action? No.Spidey should always have stylish action.I dont think anyone will disagree

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The SR concept was flawed in trying to build on 30 year old films. This Nolan & Snyder led film is something different entirely. It's riding the wave of a huge trilogy and aligning Superman more into the modern world. The positive reaction to the project and to the recent trailer(s) is something I never thought I'd see from a Superman film again. This is a reboot that most everyone wants to see.
Everyone in the domestic territory maybe

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The difference is in the Batman films it was usually a line of dialogue here or there, but in the Avengers (or Raimi's fims) actual sequences or scenes were built on it.
When you go with a fun tone,some things are bound to look cheesy to some people,its inevitable

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If you see the difference between BB's box office and TDK's box office, it was dramatic. The people who missed the boat for BB in the theaters caught up with DVD and rentals. It definitely built up it's audience for the sequel. The Joker had something to do with it, but the overall quality of the films are what carried the day.
People really overrate BB's DVD sales,SM1 for example,made almost triple the amount in DVD and VHS sales.
TDK made money because it was that good,plain and simple


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Old 12-14-2012, 06:48 AM   #218
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And look what Batman Begins did...so one can see what will happen with Man of Steel,Seriously, you're running in circles and making no sense on why Man of Steel wouldn't do great at the box office.
Those two statements contradict themselves,BB didnt do great at the box office

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Not at all. Seeing as how people having been waiting for a Superman film for a while now, I don't see it as expecting too much at all.
People were waiting in 2006 also,just saying

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One of those must be Bizarro you're talking about...
*Spider-man


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Old 12-14-2012, 06:52 AM   #219
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Lol, we sidetracked big time
Everyone, to the "Which version is better?" thread
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This is actually very true!
Thank You

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Old 12-14-2012, 07:06 AM   #220
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Thank You
You are missing a point,the inconsistency with powers has always been there.In the comics,cartoons,games everywhere

The Spider Sense varies in intensity and reliability throughout
His punch can supposedly kill a man in a single blow,yet he punches thugs plenty on times in the comics

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Old 12-14-2012, 07:29 AM   #221
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You are missing a point,the inconsistency with powers has always been there.In the comics,cartoons,games everywhere

The Spider Sense varies in intensity and reliability throughout
His punch can supposedly kill a man in a single blow,yet he punches thugs plenty on times in the comics
In comics he usually gives them what he can dub as "love tap"
Reading all these comics it's not hard to spot the inconsistency in powers, but still a lot of these comics did it better than a movie, and movies are better with consistency and making more sense, even to stuff requiring the suspense of disbelief the main ideas do

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Old 12-14-2012, 08:15 AM   #222
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You are missing a point,the inconsistency with powers has always been there.In the comics,cartoons,games everywhere

The Spider Sense varies in intensity and reliability throughout
His punch can supposedly kill a man in a single blow,yet he punches thugs plenty on times in the comics
So because comics can be inconsistent, that's a defense for a 2 hour movie being inconsistent as well? There's a huge difference between being inconsistent in comics there are thousands of and being inconsistent throughout one 2 hour movie.

Most of the time he punches thugs unconscious and web them up. Why would he hold back his punches more against a super villain such as Doc Ock? Why not just give him one successful hit to win like he does to many others? Aziz isn't missing any point there when it comes to the logic.

To not give the ASM haters any fun, yes ASM is inconsistent as well when it comes to the Spider Sense and that bothers me even more than the punches at Doc Ock (because I didn't even think of that before Aziz brought that up). Though it was pretty inconsistent in Raimi's trilogy as well.

I didn't like that his Spider Sense went off at the rooftop at Gwen's home. That was a bit extreme since the danger was so far away. It had been better if he'd just looked down, seen all the police cars rushing to the bridge and understanding that there's something going on there.

Also, when Lizard attacked Spider-Man in that underground water system thingy, the sound didn't come off. I've seen people say it did but I've seen the scene plenty of times and I think people mistake the music score sound at that moment as a Spider Sense sound. However, it is very clear that the Spider Sense do come off just by looking at Spidey's body language, but the sound is missing which makes it feel inconsistent.

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Old 12-14-2012, 09:28 AM   #223
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Not to mention the scene that Peter didn't simply give the equation, he also helped Connors in the lab with it to make it work
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He probably feels guilty for "creating" the Lizard the same way that he feels guilty for letting the thief go. Peter didn't actually shoot Uncle Ben. In fact, if you want to get really technical, Peter did nothing. Of course, that is taking things a little too far because that is the entire point, Peter feels guilty because he didn't do something to help when he could have, but you get my point.
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Exactly!!

It seems some people don't seem to understand the human mind very well, especially not of younger people. ANYONE would feel guilt in Peter's situation. Maybe not Anno, but pretty much everyone else.

They're overanalysing and coming up with the most stupid excuses to call something bad because they want to. Simple as that.
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Yeah he didn't literally create him, but he gave Connors the key that made it all possible,(and made sure that it would work), so in a poetic sense he created the Lizard

THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU!

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Also, when Lizard attacked Spider-Man in that underground water system thingy, the sound didn't come off. I've seen people say it did but I've seen the scene plenty of times and I think people mistake the music score sound at that moment as a Spider Sense sound. However, it is very clear that the Spider Sense do come off just by looking at Spidey's body language, but the sound is missing which makes it feel inconsistent.
I watched it again, and the spider sense sound DOES go off. Its not easy to point out, but its there.

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Old 12-14-2012, 11:11 AM   #224
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It definitely goes off in the sewers, because that was the point in the cinema my friend turned to me and said 'I love how his spider-sense makes that tingle sound in this'.

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Old 12-14-2012, 11:52 AM   #225
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Originally Posted by Oscorp View Post
This is actually very true!





Exactly!!

It seems some people don't seem to understand the human mind very well, especially not of younger people. ANYONE would feel guilt in Peter's situation. Maybe not Anno, but pretty much everyone else.

They're overanalysing and coming up with the most stupid excuses to call something bad because they want to. Simple as that.
And you say I sound stupid...

There's a difference than feeling guilt and what I bring up by Peter saying HE created the Lizard. If I'm being too literal on that dialogue, then excuse me for thinking something through. I will learn not to do this in TAS-M 2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oscorp View Post
Even you have to realise how stupid you are now.
Oh my, I guess I should ignore you now

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWallCrawler View Post
Yeah he didn't literally create him, but he gave Connors the key that made it all possible,(and made sure that it would work), so in a poetic sense he created the Lizard


Quote:
Originally Posted by Spiderdevil View Post
Those two statements contradict themselves,BB didnt do great at the box office
It did better than the last three Batman films by Schumacher and Burton domestically and WW with its new vision of Batman. That's a huge feat itself.

Quote:
People were waiting in 2006 also,just saying
Sadly we got a film that tried to tie itself with a series almost thirty years back. More were expecting a fresh take, not something that just jumped on that back of a series decades ago.

Quote:
*Spider-man

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