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Old 12-11-2012, 05:38 PM   #26
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

Mace wasn't a wonderful character to begin with.

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Old 12-11-2012, 07:12 PM   #27
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

I'll admit Samuel L. Jackson wasn't really "emotional" that's just how he is and once you see him enough it begins to get old especially in star wars because his dialog just came off as forced and bland. The things that needed emotion didn't have any and there was never a sense of real urgency. Also how could he come back, didn't he get propelled off of a building thousands of feet in the air?

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Old 12-11-2012, 07:19 PM   #28
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

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I'll admit Samuel L. Jackson wasn't really "emotional" that's just how he is and once you see him enough it begins to get old especially in star wars because his dialog just came off as forced and bland. The things that needed emotion didn't have any and there was never a sense of real urgency. Also how could he come back, didn't he get propelled off of a building thousands of feet in the air?
I would chalk that up to script problems more than Jackson's acting, and yes he was slung through the air like a frisbee, but he is Samuel L. Mother****in Jackson and a jedi so who knows.

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Old 12-11-2012, 08:00 PM   #29
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

Force Ghost Mace would be alright, I guess.

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Old 12-11-2012, 09:02 PM   #30
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

Any excuse they could make for him surviving AND being in the background the whole time during the rule of the Empire would be a heinous contrivance.

It'd be the "shatterpoint" of my suspension of disbelief.

And as far as being a Force ghost: Mace was Dark Side-curious, experimenting on being almost dark side, but not quite. He had yet to come out of the closet, I mean 'garbage compactor'. Force ghosts are for those who had embraced the light side fully.


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Old 12-11-2012, 09:48 PM   #31
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

How about Tyler Perry in drag as Mace's daughter?

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Old 12-11-2012, 10:36 PM   #32
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

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How about Tyler Perry in drag as Mace's daughter?
And then she could fall in love with Jar Jar's son.

Has there ever been an cross-species relationship in Star Wars? It would be different.

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Old 12-11-2012, 11:53 PM   #33
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

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Any excuse they could make for him surviving AND being in the background the whole time during the rule of the Empire would be a heinous contrivance.

It'd be the "shatterpoint" of my suspension of disbelief.

And as far as being a Force ghost: Mace was Dark Side-curious, experimenting on being almost dark side, but not quite. He had yet to come out of the closet, I mean 'garbage compactor'. Force ghosts are for those who had embraced the light side fully.
Quigon didnt learn to fully embrace the light side and become one with the force until after he was dead so the same is possible for Mace. And Mace in the films was not dark side curious. His vapaad fighting style isnt mentioned in the films.

Let me be clear, im playing devil's advocate. Im neither condoning nor condemning Mace's possible return. Im just making a point that so far I have not seen one argument against it that couldnt be rebutted with logic. Because we only saw him thrown out a window we cant rule out that he survived. We have seen jedi survive falls from great heights and we have seen jedi survive the emporer's electroshock and we have seen jedi lose limbs. Not saying it will happen but if they do bring him back it wouldnt take some big retcon to make it happen. The possibility is already present. All the things that happened to Mace a jedi CAN survive and we have witnessed jedi surviving these things in the saga. His return also wouldnt contradict anything because no where in ROTS does any character make mention of his death so there is that on top of everything else. It would be incredibly easy to bring the character back and break no logic doing it.

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Last edited by Marvolo; 12-12-2012 at 12:01 AM.
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Old 12-11-2012, 11:54 PM   #34
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

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Any excuse they could make for him surviving AND being in the background the whole time during the rule of the Empire would be a heinous contrivance.

It'd be the "shatterpoint" of my suspension of disbelief.

.
I could swallow a thin retcon just to have Mace back on screen, but there's no doubt logic would take a hit. When Yoda tells Luke, "when gone am I, the last of the Jedi will you be", it's nearly impossible for me to think of a way that Yoda wouldn't have sensed another Jedi Council member alive.

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And then she could fall in love with Jar Jar's son.

Has there ever been an cross-species relationship in Star Wars? It would be different.
Kit Fisto and Aayla Secura, although only explored in the EU.

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Old 12-12-2012, 12:38 AM   #35
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Kit Fisto and Aayla Secura, although only explored in the EU.
Ugh! just thinking about them being intimate make me want to vomit blue milk.

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Old 12-12-2012, 01:52 AM   #36
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

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Ugh! just thinking about them being intimate make me want to vomit blue milk.
OK....Watto and Salacious Crumb. That never happened, but it should make you forget all about Aayla and Kit.

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Old 12-12-2012, 02:03 AM   #37
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

If Mace wasn't played by Jackson, would anyone even remember the character?

All he did was frown, until Episode III, when he got his ass handed to him by Palpatine.

Then again, most of the prequel characters were rather forgettable, but still.

Oh I just remembered he killed Jango. In my defense, I try to forget Attack of the Clones.


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Old 12-12-2012, 07:13 AM   #38
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Any excuse they could make for him surviving AND being in the background the whole time during the rule of the Empire would be a heinous contrivance.
Amnesia!

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Old 12-12-2012, 02:06 PM   #39
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

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If Mace wasn't played by Jackson, would anyone even remember the character?

All he did was frown, until Episode III, when he got his ass handed to him by Palpatine.

Then again, most of the prequel characters were rather forgettable, but still.

Oh I just remembered he killed Jango. In my defense, I try to forget Attack of the Clones.
He didn't get his ass handed to him by Palpatine. He had the advantage until Anakin sliced off his hand.

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Old 12-12-2012, 06:43 PM   #40
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

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And as far as being a Force ghost: Mace was Dark Side-curious, experimenting on being almost dark side, but not quite. He had yet to come out of the closet, I mean 'garbage compactor'. Force ghosts are for those who had embraced the light side fully.
Since they never said any of those things in the movies we could just ignore them and have Mace Windu as a force ghost.

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Old 12-13-2012, 01:45 AM   #41
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

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He didn't get his ass handed to him by Palpatine. He had the advantage until Anakin sliced off his hand.
That scene was just so perfect. We knew how the story ended, but we got to see that the Empire was a split second away from being ended before it began.

And also, "PO-WAA!! UN-LIM-E-TED PO-WAA!!!!!""

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Old 12-13-2012, 05:18 PM   #42
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Quigon didnt learn to fully embrace the light side and become one with the force until after he was dead so the same is possible for Mace. And Mace in the films was not dark side curious. His vapaad fighting style isnt mentioned in the films.
Even ignoring the EU, Mace never came across to me as a Jedi with the purity of Yoda or Obi-Wan from the OT. Before his demise, he's clearly about to kill the Emperor out of anger. I can buy Anakin coming back as a Force Ghost despite his time as a Sith, since he IS the Chosen One.

This said, Mace as a Ghost is more plausible than him appearing physically alive.

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Im just making a point that so far I have not seen one argument against it that couldnt be rebutted with logic.
Logic says he stays dead.

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Because we only saw him thrown out a window we cant rule out that he survived. We have seen jedi survive falls from great heights and we have seen jedi survive the emporer's electroshock and we have seen jedi lose limbs.
All at the same time?

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Not saying it will happen but if they do bring him back it wouldnt take some big retcon to make it happen.
Where was he in the OT? Why didn't Yoda mention him when Obi-Wan said Luke was their last hope? He said there was "another", but he was referring to Leia.

Mace is dead. Bringing him back in a soap opera-esque return would very much be a retcon.

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The possibility is already present. All the things that happened to Mace a jedi CAN survive and we have witnessed jedi surviving these things in the saga. His return also wouldnt contradict anything because no where in ROTS does any character make mention of his death so there is that on top of everything else. It would be incredibly easy to bring the character back and break no logic doing it.
It'd be easy to bring him back, yes. Dangle a pay check in front of Sam. But it breaks the story's internal logic, period.

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Old 12-13-2012, 06:12 PM   #43
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

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Also how could he come back, didn't he get propelled off of a building thousands of feet in the air?
If Maul could survive, I'm sure Mace could too.

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Old 12-13-2012, 06:57 PM   #44
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

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Where was he in the OT? Why didn't Yoda mention him when Obi-Wan said Luke was their last hope? He said there was "another", but he was referring to Leia.
That's one thing I hated how nothing in the prequels was mentioned in the OT (for obvious reasons, Lucas hadn't written the prequels).

- R2-D2 flew in AOTC why couldn't he fly in the OT? if I recall only C3P-O's mind was erased.
- Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan had some sort of superspeed, why didn't Luke have it?

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Old 12-13-2012, 11:51 PM   #45
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

I would much rather Windu return in EP 7 than Vader. No one actually saw him die. He could have landed in a speeder that was flying by for all we know. Order 66 took effect right after Sidious blasted him from that window, so he would have went into hiding immediately....his survival is plausible.

The only issue would be a nitpick where Yoda tells Luke that after he dies (Yoda) "the last of the Jedi, he will be"

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Old 12-14-2012, 12:28 AM   #46
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I would much rather Windu return in EP 7 than Vader. No one actually saw him die. He could have landed in a speeder that was flying by for all we know. Order 66 took effect right after Sidious blasted him from that window, so he would have went into hiding immediately....his survival is plausible.

The only issue would be a nitpick where Yoda tells Luke that after he dies (Yoda) "the last of the Jedi, he will be"
A nitpick? That was one of the main points of Episode VI: Luke was the last of the Jedi.

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Old 12-16-2012, 03:34 PM   #47
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A Twin Brother that Mace never knew abour
And he ended up looking like James Earl Jones when he was older.

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Old 12-17-2012, 07:23 AM   #48
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

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That's one thing I hated how nothing in the prequels was mentioned in the OT (for obvious reasons, Lucas hadn't written the prequels).

- R2-D2 flew in AOTC why couldn't he fly in the OT? if I recall only C3P-O's mind was erased.
- Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan had some sort of superspeed, why didn't Luke have it?
Add to that,

- Leia describing her real mother to Luke in ROTJ [intimating that she at least grew up with her for some duration] yet Padme dies during childbirth in ROTS/

- Obi-Wan doesnt recognise R-2 or CP30 in ANH, despite the events that happened 'before' in the prequels.

Stuff like the above is the reason why I hate the idea that Lucas is some kind of genius who's worked from some 'grand plan' all these years - the glaring inconsistencies say different. In my mind, he's winged it all the way along and came up with stuff from here and there for the prequels, when a huge pile of $$$ was put in front of him to make more movies.

And [although this is different I need to get it off my chest] dont get me started on the fact that Obi-Wan basically lies to Luke (ANH) in order to get him in the game, yet then says that what he said was true 'from a certain point of view' later on in the series as a get out. I could get past it before the prequels came along but the lie was made all the more deceitful when you see the relationship between Obi-wan and Anakin in the prequels - Obi-Wan knew full well what happened between the two of them but just straight lies to Anakins son just so that he sides with him. WTF? How can anyone tell a son that someone killed his dad so they go avenge him, knowing full well that 'killer' is the dad?

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Old 12-17-2012, 07:28 AM   #49
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

The Leia thing is a cop-out, I agree.

But ObiWan, the way I see it, was faking not knowing them. He was a rascal in the OT, as you pointed out in the latter part of your post. I love Obi for that. Flawed to the end.

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Old 12-17-2012, 11:31 PM   #50
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Default Re: Samuel L. Jackson Wants to be in Star Wars: Episode VII

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Any excuse they could make for him surviving AND being in the background the whole time during the rule of the Empire would be a heinous contrivance.

It'd be the "shatterpoint" of my suspension of disbelief.

And as far as being a Force ghost: Mace was Dark Side-curious, experimenting on being almost dark side, but not quite. He had yet to come out of the closet, I mean 'garbage compactor'. Force ghosts are for those who had embraced the light side fully.
Did he swear to punish these turtles after getting out of the compactor?

Not to say I'm for Jackson coming back, but didn't EVERY other Jedi kinda do the same thing? Yoda litterally gave up in midfight and say he had to go hide! He wasn't even hurt or anything! If Windu hadn't died, who's to say he'd immediately run upstairs again for round 2? Maybe he was critically injured and hid. Maybe he ran off to tell others. Maybe he quit Jedidom altogether, making Luke the last one.

Oh, there's one for you Pro-comebacks. Maybe he went crazy with anger over losing his hand and being defenestrated and became a Sith! I mean, losing a hand and getting a replacement is sort of a symbol for it, at this point.

But I still insist he's probably too busy with Avengers 2 that year for anything more than a cameo. And in Sequel trilogy Mace'd be SUPERFRIGGINOLD if even alive.


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