Actors from original trilogy on First Class sequel with Days of Future Past - Part 1

[EnDz0n3]

What was said about that in the audio commentary? Did they explain why it was so loose? Any comments from Fassbender? I imagine that would be something James and Michael privately laugh about.

[BMM]

Originally Posted by EnDz0n3

That's more subtle than "Mutant and Proud" (and "You didn't ask so I didn't tell") and didn't involve Mystique shouting across the beach to a Beast who did all he can do to not roll his eyes (along with the rest of the audience). Not like the make-up and prosthetics would've allowed him to roll his eyes to anyways!

And I think the majority agrees that scene at Bobby's house was a very powerful scene and one of the many highlights of X2.

I wouldn't be so sure about that.

[EnDz0n3]

Which part?

[psylockolussus]

Originally Posted by Angamb

is more appealing a new movie like Chronicle, with no comic book characters?

This is cinema. The movies can be funny and cool without the need to be an adaptation of a comic, novel or tv show.

It just deppends on how the director, writer and co. handle the characters.

Comic fans care about comic characters, general movie viewers care about cool stuff and a cool movie.

But I dont want to start another endless discussion about how X4 is a better option than a FC sequel with Banshee, Havok, Polaris and co.

Did you just compare X-Men to Chronicle?

You can say what you want to say about how great the First Class movies are gonna be but at the end of the day, it doesn't matter how good the movies are, if they aren't gonna sell that much.

Thats why in my opinion, if they have to bring in the most well-known characters in the X-Men universe (like Wolverine, Storm, Iceman, Rogue, etc.) instead of piling up B and C list characters that the casual viewers have no idea about.

[X-Maniac]

Originally Posted by Mrs Vimes

But being the mutant leaders (and in Charles' case, a teacher) is a very important part of who these two characters are. If there's no team for them to lead/teach in the movie, you lose that aspect and all the team interactions as well. Maybe less so for Erik because he doesn't really become a leader until the end when he fully comes into his powers, but definitely for Charles. Especially since Charles himself is not particularly action-oriented.

Charles' backstory is a lot more rich and interesting in the comic books than we saw on film. Check out the biography on his Wikipedia page - it's fascinating to read of his journey and those characters who crossed paths with him in those early years.

[Angamb]

yeah, since Im reading the 60's comics, they have shown that Charles have traveled many times around the world, and in one of them, he learnt about the origin of his stepbrother.

Of course FC didnt give us a tease about all those journeys and didnt even mention he has a stepbrother.

So its obvious that the writer is a pivotal role on what to tell from each character and what not, and if Charles has a bigger backstory or not.

And as we saw, Charles didnt get too much backstory as Eric. We all know Eric's origin is more powerfull and dramatic and leads to some revenge scenes here and there.

at the end of the day, FC was how it was, and we can just hope that in the sequels the writer and director give a little bit more info about Charles past so the audience will have much more info from him, taking into account all the movies to date.

[X-Maniac]

Originally Posted by josh8

Like I said before, when the movie was in production I always defended the filmmakers' decisions regarding the cast they chose. And I loved FC. It's only in retrospect that I've come to realize it was IMO probably a mistake. And just because I say one thing doesn't mean another. I can most definitely enjoy a movie without Logan, Scott, Jean, and Storm.

It's just a matter of the filmmakers being kind of wussy. They didn't have the balls to make a compelling movie that focused only on Xavier and Magneto. (They could've just made that, called it "X-men: Beginnings" or something, and put in mutant villains that inspired them to create the X-men).

They didn't have the energy to make a movie that introduced Xavier and Magneto AND Scott, Jean, and Storm.

Instead they chose to do a movie about Xavier and Magneto and sprinkle in a bunch of mutants that would "fill" up the movie.

And I repeat, I loved the movie, but it kind of left them stuck on where to go next.

Also, I didn't mean to say that Singer and Vaughn are not competent. Quite the opposite actually. They just didn't quite step up to the challenge.

I agree with most of this. I loved First Class but the more you think about, the more problematic it becomes, especially when trying to line it up with the existing films.

The opening should have been narrated by Xavier while it covered the period from 1944 to 1962. We could have seen Xavier first meeting Magneto (very briefly, before they met again later) at age 17, and more of the comic book biography should have been included. Moira would be a genetics expert, Banshee would be an Interpol agent (as in the comics) tracking the Hellfire Club (with a recast Sebastian Shaw and maybe not including Emma Frost, but opting for Sage or Selene as his first female associate).

The first X-Men is a tough decision - do you go for the Original Five of the comics, the Original Three of the films, do you include or ignore the backstory we have seen for Scott and Jean in the other films?

[X-Maniac]

Originally Posted by Lightning Strykez!

Well, I dunno know about that, unless I'm misunderstanding you here.

These are comic book films. Therefore we (fan community, comic readers, etc.,) are what provide the legs and positive word of mouth to hook the non-fans into the mix. We provide the repeat business weeks and weeks after the initial release and the general audience has moved on to other movies. It lives or dies with us first.

The producers of FC appealed to a very small percentage of X-Men fans by heavily pushing fairly less popular and/or less interesting characters. If they want the house filled, they need to bring the original big guns. It's just that simple. It's a formula. F*** with it, and it blows up in your face. LOL

The more hardcore fanboys all wanted the Original Five of the comics so that First Class the film was like First Class the comic. The mainstream (and most of the X-Men filmfans on here) wanted the Original Three of the films (Scott, Jean, Storm) as mentioned in X1.

The film could have opted for three of those five (Scott, Jean, Beast) or added Storm to make it line up with what was said in X1. Banshee could still have been added too.

[jaymes_e06]

Originally Posted by X-Maniac

The more hardcore fanboys all wanted the Original Five of the comics so that First Class the film was like First Class the comic. The mainstream (and most of the X-Men filmfans on here) wanted the Original Three of the films (Scott, Jean, Storm) as mentioned in X1.

The film could have opted for three of those five (Scott, Jean, Beast) or added Storm to make it line up with what was said in X1. Banshee could still have been added too.

That's what i wish had happened in hindsight it would have legitimized the name of the film a whole hell of a lot more too.

[psylockolussus]

Originally Posted by X-Maniac

The first X-Men is a tough decision - do you go for the Original Five of the comics, the Original Three of the films, do you include or ignore the backstory we have seen for Scott and Jean in the other films?

I would pick the original three of the films and I would have connected the backstory that we saw from Scott (XOW) and Jean (X3).

If Bryan Singer included those three in First Class then we wouldn't wonder anymore on how those three got to become a X-Man. But I do get why Bryan Singer didn't include Storm, Cyclops and Jean in the movie. He probably wanted to focus more on Charles and Erik and if he included Jean, Scott and Ororo, he probably wouldn't get that. Plus the age thing is another factor.

[spideyboy_1111]

Why do people also assume singer had such a massive hand in first class? He was a producer (they foot the bill) and vaughn directed and still had alot of control. And Im sure singer had more involvement than most producers, but everyone seems to want to credit singer for everything and that's not the case. FC was not "his" film

[spideyboy_1111]

Originally Posted by X-Maniac

The more hardcore fanboys all wanted the Original Five of the comics so that First Class the film was like First Class the comic. The mainstream (and most of the X-Men filmfans on here) wanted the Original Three of the films (Scott, Jean, Storm) as mentioned in X1.

The film could have opted for three of those five (Scott, Jean, Beast) or added Storm to make it line up with what was said in X1. Banshee could still have been added too.

Yeah prior to FC i always wanted it to very jean, Scott, hank, ororo, and Sean

[def28]

Originally Posted by spideyboy_1111

Why do people also assume singer had such a massive hand in first class? He was a producer (they foot the bill) and vaughn directed and still had alot of control. And Im sure singer had more involvement than most producers, but everyone seems to want to credit singer for everything and that's not the case. FC was not "his" film

Singer came up with the story and characters used, but when Vaughn was hired he rewrote the whole thing. So yeah, I think Singer let Vaughn do whatever he wanted to. Vaughn wouldnt have came on board otherwise. That guy doesnt seem interested in making other peoples visions.

[SpideyFan866]

Originally Posted by def28

Singer came up with the story and characters used, but when Vaughn was hired he rewrote the whole thing. So yeah, I think Singer let Vaughn do whatever he wanted to. Vaughn wouldnt have came on board otherwise. That guy doesnt seem interested in making other peoples visions.

This.

XM: FC was Vaughn's vision. It was a good film but the continuity hurt it in the end.

I think XM: DOFP will move back to the vision that Singer had for the series in the beginning, before it got derailed by the past 3 films (The Last Stand, Origins: Wolverine, First Class). For this reason, I am really happy to see Singer back as the director.

[Mrs Vimes]

Originally Posted by SpideyFan866

I think XM: DOFP will move back to the vision that Singer had for the series in the beginning, before it got derailed by the past 3 films (The Last Stand, Origins: Wolverine, First Class).

I would really, really, really hope not. FC felt so fresh and new, I think it would be a real pity to then just put it aside and go back for the sake of nostalgia or continuity or Singer wanting to do the X3 he never got to make.

[Mrs Vimes]

Originally Posted by X-Maniac

The more hardcore fanboys all wanted the Original Five of the comics so that First Class the film was like First Class the comic. The mainstream (and most of the X-Men filmfans on here) wanted the Original Three of the films (Scott, Jean, Storm) as mentioned in X1.

The film could have opted for three of those five (Scott, Jean, Beast) or added Storm to make it line up with what was said in X1. Banshee could still have been added too.

But if I remember right, in X1 Xavier says that Scott and Jean were his first students. Whereas in FC Banshee etc. were not really his students - they were there as CIA recruits and the school wasn't even started yet.

As for characters backstories, I think FC wanted to concentrate on the relationship between Erik and Charles rather than what each of them got up to separately over the years. We didn't see much of Erik's past life either apart from that one crucial event in the prologue.

[spideyboy_1111]

Xavier says Scott and Jean were "some of" his first students

[def28]

I think they went back too far. Should have went no further then the late70s/80s for the actual X Men team to come in. Its fine for Prof X and Magneto to be in the 60s but it doesnt line up so well for those main X Men Members in the previous films. JUmping into other decades so CYC and crew can be introduced now would also lend a few problems for the new team age wise. This film could potentially fix that I guess.

[X-Maniac]

Originally Posted by Mrs Vimes

I would really, really, really hope not. FC felt so fresh and new, I think it would be a real pity to then just put it aside and go back for the sake of nostalgia or continuity or Singer wanting to do the X3 he never got to make.

Singer is hardly likely to follow Vaughn's vision though. Bryan has his own ideas about the X-Men world on screen, and he is almost certain to revert to those because that's how he sees them. I can't see him suddenly switching to another approach altogether. I'll be listening to his promotional interviews with interest to see what he has in mind. It's about time we had some long-term planning for a start, now the studio seems invested in this as a Marvel-style narrative franchise and not a one-film-at-a-time cash cow.

[X-Maniac]

Originally Posted by Mrs Vimes

But if I remember right, in X1 Xavier says that Scott and Jean were his first students. Whereas in FC Banshee etc. were not really his students - they were there as CIA recruits and the school wasn't even started yet.

As for characters backstories, I think FC wanted to concentrate on the relationship between Erik and Charles rather than what each of them got up to separately over the years. We didn't see much of Erik's past life either apart from that one crucial event in the prologue.

He says Jean, Scott and Storm were 'some of my first students.'

But First Class very much leaves the impression - in my view at least - that Beast, Banshee and Havok become his first students. The real anomaly is that Havok is there before any mention of Cyclops; it's just very odd. And that a character called Angel was introduced who isn't the male Angel of the original five but a woman who ends up being one of the Brotherhood. Some very peculiar thinking, without much consideration for the source material.

[Mrs Vimes]

Sure, I don't expect DoFP to have the same approach as First Class - which I don't think would have been the case anyway even if Vaughn remained as a director. DoFP seems like a very different kind of story, I don't think that all the "60s James Bond" touches would have remained and it seems like a darker kind of story as well. But at the same time I hope it's not a complete throwback to Singer's own films, if only because both the 60s setting and the post-apocalyptic world are something different to the original films, and something that I would hope demand a different approach.

[SpideyFan866]

Originally Posted by Mrs Vimes

Sure, I don't expect DoFP to have the same approach as First Class - which I don't think would have been the case anyway even if Vaughn remained as a director. DoFP seems like a very different kind of story, I don't think that all the "60s James Bond" touches would have remained and it seems like a darker kind of story as well. But at the same time I hope it's not a complete throwback to Singer's own films, if only because both the 60s setting and the post-apocalyptic world are something different to the original films, and something that I would hope demand a different approach.

This.

[X-Maniac]

Originally Posted by Mrs Vimes

Sure, I don't expect DoFP to have the same approach as First Class - which I don't think would have been the case anyway even if Vaughn remained as a director. DoFP seems like a very different kind of story, I don't think that all the "60s James Bond" touches would have remained and it seems like a darker kind of story as well. But at the same time I hope it's not a complete throwback to Singer's own films, if only because both the 60s setting and the post-apocalyptic world are something different to the original films, and something that I would hope demand a different approach.

I hope it's not a throwback to Singer's films either. It will be interesting to see how he handles the 60s elements - Vaughn brought a fun, groovy, stylish swing to the era and Singer's material is usually much more serious. I hope it isn't all heavy and gloomy.

It might be nice for instance to see a visual (flashback?) of the first Sentinel attack as in the comics when the new X-Men team (Storm, Banshee etc) are out in town socialising/celebrating at Christmas. It would be a chance to show a normal setting and some more stylish, sexy clothing on the ladies. The story is called Merry Christmas X-Men and is in issue 98 of Uncanny X-Men (first published April 1976!). Storm creates a hurricane over the Rockefeller Centre to dispatch one of the robots.

[Angamb]

Im really interested in how Singer will approach the 60's elements too. He has done some movies sets in past period, but this will be the first one on the 60's and more interestingly, inside a superhero movie, so it should be a pretty interesting watch, specially taking into account the tone of X1 and X2, but specially on X1.

at the same time, Ive been thinking that it could be a bit weird to see one tone on the future and a totally different tone right after on the 60's but I guess Singers directing style would create a cohesive feeling from viewers point of view. so Im confident with that, at the end.

[Lightning Strykez!]

Originally Posted by Mrs Vimes

I would really, really, really hope not. FC felt so fresh and new, I think it would be a real pity to then just put it aside and go back for the sake of nostalgia or continuity or Singer wanting to do the X3 he never got to make.

Unfortunately, I wouldn't hold my breath.

One thing I've noticed about Singer is that he's a director who appreciates tying in nuanced nostalgia. His Superman Returns film is a prime example of this; he was pretty much hell bent on reinvigorating Richard Donner's films to the point of actually trying to cast a Chris Reeve look-a-like. Ultimately the film suffered for that unwillingness to break away from tradition.

I fully expect him to cling to his original vision for this franchise and cancel out what's been done since 2006. So let's just brace for impact, because continuity-wise, we're all in for headaches methinks.