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Old 01-11-2013, 12:02 AM   #51
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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I really really really don't get all the hand wringing with fanboys! Stop worring about issue numbers and "status quos!" It's a story arc! Marvel does it all the time! Slott just had an idea for a Doc Ock story and it just so happened to time up with Marvel NOW, so they thought of a fun way to use it!

Just read it! I'm a looooong time fan and I'm loving it! It was a fun book! Loved Ock making use of Pete's life, but you can clearly see it is Ock, mostly through dialogue. I like Ock's refinements to crime fighting. Yeah, it's creepy Ock leering at MJ. Guess what? It's suppose to be! It's funny because it's Pete. Ock's thoughts are plastered all over MJ's dialogue, idicating he's not even listening. It's also funny hearing Pete call with genius co-workers as "dolts!"

Just enjoy the ride, people!
I don't mind the developments and changes to the status quo...just don't troll me to 'boost' sales. Don't purposely get the fans worked up and then surprised because they are reacting to the news.

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Old 01-11-2013, 02:25 AM   #52
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

It's not about whining, or hating the story or whatever. I, for one, loved ASM700, Avenging 15.1 and Superior 1. But they hyped this arc to the death with stuff such as "Peter Parker fans will fade away", "he's gone forever" "bla bla bla". Only to show, one issue later, that he wasn't gone, and that he was gonna come back for good, sooner or later. It's not even about hating this move, it's just that it doesn't make sense from a storytelling POV. It's clearly a lack of faith in their story. They're afraid of reader's reactions. So instead of telling a true story about hod Spock became a true hero, with great character development, we had this half-assed story with Peter dying, but wait, not really, he's there.... Which is disappointing.

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Old 01-11-2013, 02:44 AM   #53
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

^ I don't think they care that much about the fan reaction, they already suffered the blow back of it. The problem with having Ock act slowly on his own was shown this issue: he would not hesitate to kill his enemies and abandon innocents if he felt his life were at risk. You can't have a Spider-Man that does that. Having Peter in there as a type of unseen influence is a neat twist that sets up the story in a way that can prove to be more interesting to see than Ock pretending to be Peter/Spidey, as it adds an element besides Ock trying to be a good guy or redeem himself, which is ultimately not in his character.

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Old 01-11-2013, 06:49 AM   #54
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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And WTF is up with you having an opinion on Spider-Man when you haven't bought an issue since the Marla Madison death storyline?

It has nothing to do with the story. I've said a few times on here that I'm not faulting Dan or the story itself. It's the way Marvel handled the promotion of the story, and I'm obviously not alone. Personally, I think the story would have been stronger without it.

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Old 01-11-2013, 06:53 AM   #55
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

So basically everyone is mad because Marvel tried to promote one of their books so that more people would buy it...

Wowzers... what an evil concept...


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Old 01-11-2013, 08:28 AM   #56
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

When they do it at long time fans expense.... Yes

EVERYTHING does not need hyped. Its the same crap along with collectible variants that put them in the hole in the 90s.

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Old 01-11-2013, 08:34 AM   #57
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

I don't think Spider-Ock & MJ sleeping together will happen.... If Peter can stop Ock from killing someone, I think he can stop Ock from sleeping with her....

Also, Superior #1 last page was a cop out, for me. Hack writing.

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Old 01-11-2013, 08:38 AM   #58
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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So basically everyone is mad because Marvel tried to promote one of their books so that more people would buy it...

Wowzers... what an evil concept...

I'm not mad. I thought ASM700 ending was powerful and sad. But SSM1 destroyed its momentum. it was too soon. And it destroyed their hype as well. But still, I liked SSM1 and I'm gonna read this serie.

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Old 01-11-2013, 09:38 AM   #59
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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When they do it at long time fans expense.... Yes

EVERYTHING does not need hyped. Its the same crap along with collectible variants that put them in the hole in the 90s.
I get why you'd be mad at all the hype/events shenanigans that all comic book companies do nowadays, but with the print industry dying, they're hands have been forced to react this way...

Let's face it... it's not the 60's/70's/80's/90's anymore when comic books were bigger than ever... heck, back in the 80's, Marvel had a policy to cancel books that sold LESS than 100k... that's a top 5 book at any given month in this day and age...

So do I like it? No...

But I understand why they do it...

It's all about sales...


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Old 01-11-2013, 09:40 AM   #60
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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I'm not mad. I thought ASM700 ending was powerful and sad. But SSM1 destroyed its momentum. it was too soon. And it destroyed their hype as well. But still, I liked SSM1 and I'm gonna read this serie.
I wasn't finger pointing... I was just generalizing... if you're not pissed, then that's great...




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Old 01-11-2013, 09:47 AM   #61
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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So basically everyone is mad because Marvel tried to promote one of their books so that more people would buy it...

Wowzers... what an evil concept...

Sure, if you liked being lied to and treated like a fool for the sake of them making money off of you.

Promotion is building up a title in solitications, some adds in comics or elsewhere. Bring people into the comic for the comic itself.

Canceling, killing, bad mouthing, lying.... these are acceptable forms of promotion to you? God knows, as a parent, I'd never teach my kid that's it's okay to badmouth to make money off of people. We typically call those people con-artists. I have a bit more class than that. I don't like it done to me. I like the characters but I'm certainly not a 'Marvel-Zombie' who just likes being forcefed crap like that anymore.

It's something that I feel Marvel's struggled with for a while now. They just have very little respect for their fans.

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Old 01-11-2013, 11:08 AM   #62
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

Read issue #700 finally..and I'm just angry angry at what they did to peter parker. Ive been reading spidey since I was in the 4th grade..spidey was the first comic I ever read. This is a shame, an injustice and until THE REAL SPIDER-MAN COMES BACK..im done FN DONE

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Old 01-11-2013, 11:14 AM   #63
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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Read issue #700 finally..and I'm just angry angry at what they did to peter parker. Ive been reading spidey since I was in the 4th grade..spidey was the first comic I ever read. This is a shame, an injustice and until THE REAL SPIDER-MAN COMES BACK..im done FN DONE
Yay!

See you in a few years...


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Old 01-11-2013, 11:50 AM   #64
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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I don't think Spider-Ock & MJ sleeping together will happen.... If Peter can stop Ock from killing someone, I think he can stop Ock from sleeping with her....

Also, Superior #1 last page was a cop out, for me. Hack writing.
And THAT is why I liked the final page. The MJ/Peter-Ock scene was making me feel very uncomfortable, now I know if Ock tries to take things to far (which imho is rape) Peter will step in and flat out stop Ock from going there.

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Old 01-11-2013, 11:51 AM   #65
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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Yay!

See you in a few years...

I'd say a year and a half.
I.e. when ASM2 comes out.

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Old 01-11-2013, 11:54 AM   #66
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Sure, if you liked being lied to and treated like a fool for the sake of them making money off of you.
I'd really like to know how ANYBODY felt like a fool after reading ASM #700 & SSM #1...

And what lies?

That Peter Parker died? He did die.

That the new status quo was going to last forever? While it hasn't changed back, so technically, that's not a lie (yet), but as a long time reader of comics, you know that "death" means little in comics, and nothing lasts forever in comics... and when it was announced that this new "status" was forever... PEOPLE GOT MAD!!!! and now that we know it'll only be for a few months/years... PEOPLE ARE MAD!!!!

So in regards to all the pissy little babies out there... Marvel is damned if they do, and damned if they don't...

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Promotion is building up a title in solitications, some adds in comics or elsewhere. Bring people into the comic for the comic itself.
Sure... and we all know how well that works... we got all kinds of ads for the new Defenders book last year as well as LOTS of build up... and we all know where that book ended.

Not to mention that ads in comics and solits will only attract the PEOPLE who are already reading comics... isn't it a good thing if Marvel goes off the grid to try and grab some new readers... even if most "new" people that bought the book never buy another issue... think of that one reader that will continue to buy....

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Canceling, killing, bad mouthing, lying.... these are acceptable forms of promotion to you? blah blah blah...
In the last 12 months, we've seen about 80 books (between Marvel & DC) get new #1's... many of them were from cancelled titles with long numbered runs... let's face it... whether you agree with it or not, a shiny #1 gets new readers... do I like it? Of course not. But can you blame a company for relaunching a title when they know they can get a sales boost?

And were you mad at the promotion of Crisis on Infinite Earths #7? Superman #75? Batman #428? (that last one had a 1-900 phone number that encouraged readers to kill or save Jason Todd (Robin) from being killed by the Joker... he didn't make it), Captain America #25? Final Crisis #6 (I think that's the one where bruce is killed)?

All of those comics (just to name a few) were ALL promoted based on the death of a character... Superman #75 made headlines all over the world... how is ASM #700 any different? It's all part of an on-going story that started before we were born and will go on long after we're dead... it's nothing new, so I'm really stunned at why you're so mad about this one in particular...

I'd like to know who bad-mouthed who... because that point doesn't make any sense to me... perhaps you could shed some light...

And again? Lying?

Where's the lie?

Peter Parker is dead. He died. It happened.

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God knows, as a parent, I'd never teach my kid that's it's okay to badmouth to make money off of people. We typically call those people con-artists. I have a bit more class than that. I don't like it done to me. I like the characters but I'm certainly not a 'Marvel-Zombie' who just likes being forcefed crap like that anymore.
I'd really like to know who bad-mouthed you in order to get your money.

Nobody bad mouthed me... and I know a few other posters in here who read the book that do not feel bad-mouthed...

Explain please...

However, in regards to what was said before the books were released vis-a-vis what has now come out, there was a "sleigh of hand" so to speak about the wording... no lies, but maybe some misdirection... but for christ's sakes... you get that from ALL kinds of advertizing every 10 minutes when you watch TV... do you really believe all the commercials on TV? Do you really think the products do what they claim to do? To some minor extent, probably... but not the way the ad tells you... it's all misdirection to get you to BUY THE PRODUCT...

And as best as I can tell, you DID NOT BUY THE PRODUCT... so why are you so-hell-bent at Marvel for doing the SAME GOD-DAMN THING that EVERY OTHER company in America does...

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They just have very little respect for their fans.
At the end of the day, Marvel is out to make money... pure and simple.

To claim that they have no respect for fans... well, as a company, who knows... but to all the creators, writers, artists... they respect the fans... they understand that the fans give them their paycheques... and as painful as this might be for you to hear... while you may feel disrespected over certain storylines involving your favourite characters, other fans love what's been done...

That last statement of yours is just a dumb blanket statement because YOU don't like certain things that have happened to certain characters.

Will you teach your kids that in order to vent your frustrations about things in life, you have to go on line and cry like a baby and make dumb blanket statements?

I doubt it.

So get some perspective... and maybe some personal growth.

Thanks for listening.

Have a nice day.



I can't wait for moraldefeciency (sic) to reply to this and tear me a new one... I love it when he does that.


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Old 01-11-2013, 12:02 PM   #67
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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Themanofbat ... Buddy to be fair, is there even a storyline that'd stop you from buying the book? I think you'd want it out and eventually just move on keep on buying and love it still in a different way...

Now that's great that you can do that... But don't diss others for being unable to
I know that was aimed at TMOB, but I'm a longtime reader, too. There has been plenty in this title I did not like or outright hate: return of Pete's (robo) parents, I Am The Spider/Peter no more, reboot, blowing up MJ, Sins Past & fast growing gobby-twins, The Other, unmasking, and most of BND.

There have been two times I came oh so close to giving up on this title. First was the Clone Saga when it was revealed that the Pete I had been reading for the past 20 years was actually a clone. The other of course was OMD. But, I didn't. You know why? Because I actually did stop in the late 70's/early 80's. The reasons included the fact that MJ and Ross Andru left the title, and generally not caring for the stories anymore (sorry TMOB, I know you like the Wolfman era). But mainly it was because I was starting high school. But, then I got interested again: MJ was back, the mysterious Hobgobiln made his debut, JR JR started doing the art, and I was starting college. And since I got back in again, I wanted to go back and fill in the back issues I missed (I'm a bit of a completist). I didn't want to have to do it again after Marvel "corrected" their "obvious" mistake. And they did just that with the Clone Saga. OMD, unfortunately, was not "corrected," but we eventually got Dan's current run which has me enjoying the title again on the same level as the post Gwen 70's era and the Hobgoblin 80's era thru the MacFarlane/Larsen era.

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I don't mind the developments and changes to the status quo...just don't troll me to 'boost' sales. Don't purposely get the fans worked up and then surprised because they are reacting to the news.
I guess my point id I did not worry about all the hype. Dan's run has earned him enough good will and trust from me that I just read the story. And I feel I have been rewarded with a fun story arc! That's why I'm "enjoying the ride," and recommending it.

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So basically everyone is mad because Marvel tried to promote one of their books so that more people would buy it...

Wowzers... what an evil concept...

Bingo!

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Read issue #700 finally..and I'm just angry angry at what they did to peter parker. Ive been reading spidey since I was in the 4th grade..spidey was the first comic I ever read. This is a shame, an injustice and until THE REAL SPIDER-MAN COMES BACK..im done FN DONE
I've been reading since the 2nd grade and that was in the early 70's! And as far as I'm concerned, the REAL SPIDER-MAN is still around. Sure, Marvel has kicked him around during the years, but, like Pete, he's still standing (albeit in some astral form or whatever currently, but you get the picture).


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Old 01-11-2013, 12:08 PM   #68
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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Yay!

See you in a few years...

damn straight

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Old 01-11-2013, 12:44 PM   #69
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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I get why you'd be mad at all the hype/events shenanigans that all comic book companies do nowadays, but with the print industry dying, they're hands have been forced to react this way...

Let's face it... it's not the 60's/70's/80's/90's anymore when comic books were bigger than ever... heck, back in the 80's, Marvel had a policy to cancel books that sold LESS than 100k... that's a top 5 book at any given month in this day and age...

So do I like it? No...

But I understand why they do it...

It's all about sales...

problem is though, by doing this they're going to burn out. And they're losing the fan's that HAVE been giving them money. That doesn't sound smart to me

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Old 01-11-2013, 12:55 PM   #70
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

I've no problem with anyone's opinion on how they found the story of the book one way or the other, but I think it's sad that some feel the need to misrepresent others arguments about how things such as the hype were handled and generally talk down to them because their opinion doesn't match up.

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Old 01-11-2013, 01:05 PM   #71
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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I know that was aimed at TMOB, but I'm a longtime reader, too. There has been plenty in this title I did not like or outright hate: return of Pete's (robo) parents, I Am The Spider/Peter no more, reboot, blowing up MJ, Sins Past & fast growing gobby-twins, The Other, unmasking, and most of BND.

There have been two times I came oh so close to giving up on this title. First was the Clone Saga when it was revealed that the Pete I had been reading for the past 20 years was actually a clone. The other of course was OMD. But, I didn't. You know why? Because I actually did stop in the late 70's/early 80's. The reasons included the fact that MJ and Ross Andru left the title, and generally not caring for the stories anymore (sorry TMOB, I know you like the Wolfman era). But mainly it was because I was starting high school. But, then I got interested again: MJ was back, the mysterious Hobgobiln made his debut, JR JR started doing the art, and I was starting college. And since I got back in again, I wanted to go back and fill in the back issues I missed (I'm a bit of a completist). I didn't want to have to do it again after Marvel "corrected" their "obvious" mistake. And they did just that with the Clone Saga. OMD, unfortunately, was not "corrected," but we eventually got Dan's current run which has me enjoying the title again on the same level as the post Gwen 70's era and the Hobgoblin 80's era thru the MacFarlane/Larsen era.
so basically they have you for life, because you will wait it out, no matter the time frame.. just for that one good era that eventually comes.?

i felt the same way eventually at one point but to each there own.. but with the rise in prices... and the disrespect towards fans, massive events, etc.. enough was enough. If i want to read a good spidey story i havent someday... ill just buy a Trade book of it

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Old 01-11-2013, 01:06 PM   #72
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

Peter Parker didn't die, his body is alive, his memories are alive, his soul is alive. Nobody actually died in ASM 700. Superior 1 made this quite clear. It's a shame really, I was looking forward to seeing doc run amok a bit but instead it's like they had to instantly bring peter almost totally back. I didn't see 700 as having much emotional impact but SSM 1 made anything there null and void. I'm slightly baffled how slott can say it's the comic he's the most proud of as Arkham Asylum or pretty much all of AtI had more character, heart, emotional impact and just good characterization.

It kinda sucks, I wanted to really see Ock do some downright ock sheninagans, fight norman and just really delve into the role but jimmny cricket gets to always be the buzz kill instead. What really is ironic is that ock would actually live peter's life more effectively but as long as peter is there to screw with him he'll ensure the parker luck carries over and ock will not be able to really succeed.

Side note, I don't see ock having sex with MJ as rape. That's silly. People lie to people to get laid, it happens. It might be different if Peter and MJ were in a relationship already but obviously peter parker wasn't interested, ock initiated the change from friendship to physical acts. Ock was the one that kissed MJ not peter. That to me is a major difference. Basically Ock has more balls then peter when it comes to actually living life in many ways. He is lying about who he is, but he's the one that started the relationship when there wasn't one.

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Old 01-11-2013, 01:10 PM   #73
The Infernal
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

You might think it's silly, try arguing that in court. We're not talking about someone who lied about being married or something like that. She clearly wouldn't sleep with Ock if she knew his identity and that he'd stolen Peter's.

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Old 01-11-2013, 01:14 PM   #74
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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You might think it's silly, try arguing that in court.
I'm pretty sure our courts don't deal with scenarios where your mind is highjacked by an Octopus man.

I believe we have insane asylum's for that.

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Old 01-11-2013, 01:15 PM   #75
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Default Re: The Amazing Spider-Man v.2 - Part 4

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I'm pretty sure our courts don't deal with scenarios where your mind is highjacked by an Octopus man.

I believe we have insane asylum's for that.
I referring to his example about sex through deception.

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