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Old 05-15-2013, 03:52 PM   #151
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Default Re: Stuff you like to believe happened in Nolan's series

Like the OP, I also like to believe that Bane survived the blast, however, in my imagination, he ran away and left Gotham to find himself and rethink his moral code. When he first met Talia, he saved her due to his having a good heart and wanting to protect children, yet she took advantage of him and corrupted his nature. I think he would realise that and disappear to begin anew, like in that comic after Knightfall.

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Old 05-15-2013, 04:02 PM   #152
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One thing I like to personally believe is that in the series universe the dead can visit people in dreams and so Bruce's visits from Ra's and his father were genuinely their ghosts and not hallucinations.

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Old 05-15-2013, 04:13 PM   #153
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Default Re: Stuff you like to believe happened in Nolan's series

I would like to believe that Gotham Knight is canon.

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Old 05-15-2013, 08:15 PM   #154
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I still continue to believe that Bruce stayed around as Batman even after the ending of TDK and watched from a distance on how cleaner Gotham City was becoming ever since the top mob guys died and the lower level ones are hauled up in prison for that forthcoming year plus until the Dent Act went into action, and then Bruce quit the cape and cowl and only watched from his super computer.

His leg injury is a prime example of how, if not through surgery, could be capable when worked on/walked on/etc. and wouldn't be a serious problem if Bruce was still Batman for a little while longer without any major activity since Gotham was becoming a safer place. Those last three years before TDKR's events though, that would easily make his leg even worse when Bruce did zilch.

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Old 05-16-2013, 09:37 AM   #155
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I believe that the events of TDKR is a dream/nightmare that Bruce has as he bleeds out at his penthouse after eluding the cops at the end of The Dark Knight.

He hallucinates about a Gotham that no longer needs Batman, him being in a horrible state, Alfred leaving him, the return of the League of Shadows, him being incompetent and crippled.

Then he wakes up, Alfred has patched him up and on the television screen we see that the GCPD has put a warrant out for the Dark Knight to hunt him and Jim Gordon has announced that he has severed all ties with the masked vigilante known as the Batman and has leads on the whereabouts of the caped crusader.

Joker is due in court/trial hearing within a month with plans of an elaborate escape . . .

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Old 05-16-2013, 09:59 AM   #156
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I like to think Joker is in federal custody, or there was an "accident" while he was being taken into custody. I sort of wonder if Bane didn't brainwash Talia any. Recall she was very young and impressionable when she first met him. Before escaping the Pit. We don't have the details of their time in the Pit, so its a bit of headcanon for me.

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Old 05-16-2013, 12:29 PM   #157
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I believe that the events of TDKR is a dream/nightmare that Bruce has as he bleeds out at his penthouse after eluding the cops at the end of The Dark Knight.

He hallucinates about a Gotham that no longer needs Batman, him being in a horrible state, Alfred leaving him, the return of the League of Shadows, him being incompetent and crippled.

Then he wakes up, Alfred has patched him up and on the television screen we see that the GCPD has put a warrant out for the Dark Knight to hunt him and Jim Gordon has announced that he has severed all ties with the masked vigilante known as the Batman and has leads on the whereabouts of the caped crusader.

Joker is due in court/trial hearing within a month with plans of an elaborate escape . . .
Speaking of dream sequences...

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I like to think Joker is in federal custody, or there was an "accident" while he was being taken into custody.
Him being locked up in Arkham Asylum fits perfectly, imo. Batman telling Joker he'll be locked up within four padded walls forever and it holds true so far....until the new Batman shows us. I bet that'll get Joker interested again as he once was when the old Batman was active.

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Old 05-17-2013, 09:59 PM   #158
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I want to believe The Riddler existed in this series, somewhere along the line.

I don't want to believe that JGL became Batman.

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Old 05-17-2013, 10:48 PM   #159
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Him being locked up in Arkham Asylum fits perfectly, imo. Batman telling Joker he'll be locked up within four padded walls forever and it holds true so far....until the new Batman shows us. I bet that'll get Joker interested again as he once was when the old Batman was active.
I sense Batman Beyond: Return of the Joker.

"You are not Batman"

And then, he is proven wrong... again... as it should be.

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Old 05-18-2013, 01:17 AM   #160
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OR the Joker captures Blake, unmasks him, pulverizes him into a bloody pulp with a crow bar, displays his corpse on television then calls Bruce/Batman out to try and coax him back out of retirement.

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Old 05-18-2013, 02:00 AM   #161
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So in your version, Joker has a hunch the old Batman is still alive then?

I like what BlueLightning is thinking...Joker returns after finally feeling like he can have fun again with another Batman after years being in AA while his "other half" has been gone and then gets even more depressed when he saw Batman die on TV, but is intrigued with this new Batman.

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Old 05-18-2013, 06:37 AM   #162
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In my world after TDKR the Joker is dead, there is a new Ra's leading the LOS, Robin john blake becomes Batman, Bruce & Selina stay in Florence and never go back to Gotham, Alfred never contacts Bruce & Selina, Gordon turns on the bat-signal, Fox & Blake never meet, The LOS don't come back to Gotham, Gotham Knight is apart of the Nolanverse.

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Old 05-18-2013, 06:51 AM   #163
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Bane is dead and never got back up.

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Old 05-18-2013, 11:58 AM   #164
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Fox and Blake have met though...at Bruce Wayne's "funeral".

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Old 05-19-2013, 11:17 AM   #165
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Default Re: Stuff you like to believe happened in Nolan's series

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I believe that the events of TDKR is a dream/nightmare that Bruce has as he bleeds out at his penthouse after eluding the cops at the end of The Dark Knight.

He hallucinates about a Gotham that no longer needs Batman, him being in a horrible state, Alfred leaving him, the return of the League of Shadows, him being incompetent and crippled.

Then he wakes up, Alfred has patched him up and on the television screen we see that the GCPD has put a warrant out for the Dark Knight to hunt him and Jim Gordon has announced that he has severed all ties with the masked vigilante known as the Batman and has leads on the whereabouts of the caped crusader.

Joker is due in court/trial hearing within a month with plans of an elaborate escape . . .
No, not that it was all a dream conclusion. Could you imagine how that would've held up in theaters? Christ, that would be the worst thing ever.

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Old 05-29-2013, 08:45 PM   #166
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Bruce Wayne eventually returns to Gotham and keeps a watchful eye on Blake and the police. At some point he needs to wear the cowl again.....

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Old 06-04-2013, 11:43 AM   #167
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I like to believe that other villians like Riddler, Black Mask, Dead Shot, Deathstroke, Penguin exist in the Nolan verse. And Joker and Harley Quin ha

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Old 06-04-2013, 12:45 PM   #168
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Wasn't there something regarding marketing or an easter egg that had the Iceberg Lounge in Batman Begins?

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Old 06-04-2013, 01:10 PM   #169
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I think it was TDK viral marketing. Edward Nashton wrote something in the paper about not trusting Harvey Dent as a DA and the Iceberg Lounge was mentioned.

So if we want, we could say Penguin and Riddler sort-of exist in that universe.

And didn't the novelization to BB mention Talia? Just like TDKR novelization mentions Arkham/Joker.

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Old 06-04-2013, 05:46 PM   #170
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Yah, I believe the BB novelization said something to the lines of Ra's has been writing letters to his daughter or something like that.

So anyways, I had this weird epiphany of sorts when it comes to the Joker being in TDKR....and I thought of, in keeping with the 165 mins, and to use Joker properly, I would have to let go of Blake as well as the whole orphanage angle.

Much like how TDKRises takes nods from TDKReturns, Joker's arc will be very similar in that he's been quiet ever since there were no more official sightings of The Batman, not peeping one word to psychiatrists, doctors or even nurses(and Harley Quinn is not related to this story at all) but once Batman makes his return, there is some movement in Joker, although he simply states he will only talk to Batman where he is then locked back up in his cell but he is finally freed when, during Bane's revolution, we see him and his men break into Arkham Asylum and where they free Crane, they let go of Arkham's inmates, including Joker as Bane doesn't view him threatening(one of his biggest mistakes ) and during the whole siege, Joker slowly starts to find out what's been going on and decides to make a name for himself during this siege and has most of the Arkham inmates as his army so when the war infront of City Hall happens, it's a three army war consisting of Bane's men and the Blackgate inmates, Batman and the GCPD and Joker and the Arkham inmates.

Batman tries to stay focus on only Bane as the bomb is his main objective and we get past the whole Talia reveal and when she leaves, Joker enters to situation, stopping Bane from killing Batman and Bane then turns his attention to Joker where he tries to choke him out, leading to Catwoman still blasting Bane away using the Bat-pod, which also knocks Joker down, but doesn't kill him as the blast was directed to Bane. Batman tells Catwoman to go after Talia while we get another dual of wits between Batman and Joker and even when Batman wins clearly with his strength as he leaves City Hall, Joker grabs the same shotgun Bane was using and before he get get the kill, he is shot by...Foley.

Yes, I imagined this would help Foley's arc in that besides being inspired to help by viewing the bat logo on the bridge, he can actually help Batman. Instead of dying by the hands of the Tumbler, he is knocked out during the war by Joker who sneaks his way into the fight between Bane and Batman and Foley, coughing up blood, dazed and confused, does one last heroic act and shoots Joker down since Batman was never going to kill Joker with it being his one rule.

And since Blake won't be involved to give all of his time to Joker while keeping under the 165 mins. and to also use Bane and Talia, the film ends with Bruce actually sacrificing himself, Gordon being the one and not Blake to put his badge down and resign as Commissioner, Alfred still moving on, Fox and Wayne Enterprises picking up the pieces, and Catwoman throwing away her clean slate and only has a figurative clean slate and she now watches over Gotham City.

So...what do you guys think? Don't be too harsh now, I just thought of this today, haha.


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Old 06-04-2013, 05:59 PM   #171
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Yah, I believe the BB novelization said something to the lines of Ra's has been writing letters to his daughter or something like that.
And in addition to that, on the Ra's character bio on the BB DVD disc 2, it flat out says he has a daughter named Talia. I always took that to mean that Talia was in canon for this universe because all the other character bios only reference stuff from the movie, it's not like just random trivia from the comics.

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Old 06-04-2013, 06:20 PM   #172
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Yah, I believe the BB novelization said something to the lines of Ra's has been writing letters to his daughter or something like that.

So anyways, I had this weird epiphany of sorts when it comes to the Joker being in TDKR....and I thought of, in keeping with the 165 mins, and to use Joker properly, I would have to let go of Blake as well as the whole orphanage angle.

Much like how TDKRises takes nods from TDKReturns, Joker's arc will be very similar in that he's been quiet ever since there were no more official sightings of The Batman, not peeping one word to psychiatrists, doctors or even nurses(and Harley Quinn is not related to this story at all) but once Batman makes his return, there is some movement in Joker, although he simply states he will only talk to Batman where he is then locked back up in his cell but he is finally freed when, during Bane's revolution, we see him and his men break into Arkham Asylum and where they free Crane, they let go of Arkham's inmates, including Joker as Bane doesn't view him threatening(one of his biggest mistakes ) and during the whole siege, Joker slowly starts to find out what's been going on and decides to make a name for himself during this siege and has most of the Arkham inmates as his army so when the war infront of City Hall happens, it's a three army war consisting of Bane's men and the Blackgate inmates, Batman and the GCPD and Joker and the Arkham inmates.

Batman tries to stay focus on only Bane as the bomb is his main objective and we get past the whole Talia reveal and when she leaves, Joker enters to situation, stopping Bane from killing Batman and Bane then turns his attention to Joker where he tries to choke him out, leading to Catwoman still blasting Bane away using the Bat-pod, which also knocks Joker down, but doesn't kill him as the blast was directed to Bane. Batman tells Catwoman to go after Talia while we get another dual of wits between Batman and Joker and even when Batman wins clearly with his strength as he leaves City Hall, Joker grabs the same shotgun Bane was using and before he get get the kill, he is shot by...Foley.

Yes, I imagined this would help Foley's arc in that besides being inspired to help by viewing the bat logo on the bridge, he can actually help Batman. Instead of dying by the hands of the Tumbler, he is knocked out during the war by Joker who sneaks his way into the fight between Bane and Batman and Foley, coughing up blood, dazed and confused, does one last heroic act and shoots Joker down since Batman was never going to kill Joker with it being his one rule.

And since Blake won't be involved to give all of his time to Joker while keeping under the 165 mins. and to also use Bane and Talia, the film ends with Bruce actually sacrificing himself, Gordon being the one and not Blake to put his badge down and resign as Commissioner, Alfred still moving on, Fox and Wayne Enterprises picking up the pieces, and Catwoman throwing away her clean slate and only has a figurative clean slate and she now watches over Gotham City.

So...what do you guys think? Don't be too harsh now, I just thought of this today, haha.
I think it's pretty awesome; especially Foley, haha.

I imagine Joker would die laughing, seeing who it was that killed him.

That being said, I don't think Joker really has a place in TDKR thematically.

Also, I'm not huge on an ending where Batman is forced to sacrifice himself. It's a super depressing ending, and sort of narratively backwards in my opinion, for a movie about a guy who finally regains the will to live to die as a martyr at the end; something he would have done in the beginning.

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Old 06-04-2013, 07:00 PM   #173
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I never felt Joker had a place either and the only moment his name could've been mentioned(when Blake was going over what happened eight years ago), even that wasn't necessary because Batman was villainfied and shouldn't be given the acknowledgment of him being the one to take down Joker.

But if Ledger had lived, I think he could be used but I would have also changed TDKR up a bit to where it's a finite ending and Bruce Wayne does die. Yes, Bruce is given a new reason to live, but that reason could be that he needs to save his city and that's it, not to move on. But again, I feel that only works when Joker is used again and TDKR is a sort of endgame for everything.

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Old 06-04-2013, 09:03 PM   #174
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I never felt Joker had a place either and the only moment his name could've been mentioned(when Blake was going over what happened eight years ago), even that wasn't necessary because Batman was villainfied and shouldn't be given the acknowledgment of him being the one to take down Joker.

But if Ledger had lived, I think he could be used but I would have also changed TDKR up a bit to where it's a finite ending and Bruce Wayne does die. Yes, Bruce is given a new reason to live, but that reason could be that he needs to save his city and that's it, not to move on. But again, I feel that only works when Joker is used again and TDKR is a sort of endgame for everything.
so you think if ledger had lived and they did use the joker in rises they would have killed bruce wayne?

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Old 06-04-2013, 09:30 PM   #175
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If Ledger had lived then The Dark Knight Rises would not be the same movie we got. They would have written it so Joker fit right into it in some capacity.

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