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Old 04-10-2013, 07:47 PM   #76
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

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Originally Posted by Brian Braddock View Post
What 'treatment'?

People were openly vocal of their hatred for the woman when she was alive [and I dont use that word lightly] so why should those same people suddenly be expected to shower her with praise - furthermore, if she was an evil b***ard when she was alive, why should an opinion of her alter just because she's died?
You missed my point...I am simply saying that we, here in the US, seem to hold the title of our leader, I guess more respectful when they die, even though we may vehemently disagree with their ideology.

I didn't say you shouldn't or couldn't speak out about her, simply that he is different here in the US when our leaders die, from my experience. People here absolutely hated Reagan, Ted Kennedy, etc....but when they died, there seem to be more respect for them, and if people had absolutely nothing good to say, they pretty much kept it to themselves...just different, was my point.

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Old 04-10-2013, 08:00 PM   #77
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

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Originally Posted by Webfoot Hero View Post
Because in the US, people will tend to not speak as ill of the dead like they would if they were still alive, sort of out of a basic sense of common courtesy and decency. With how people from Britain are talking, it seems like gloating or bashing someone that can no longer defend themselves. But I guess that's the difference between the 2 countries.
In general, we do not speak ill of the dead. Not unlike yourselves, that usually comes when the skeletons come a creeping from the cupboards after the deceased is gone.

So sorry, but that's a false presumption from you, and one obviously based on ignorance of what this vile woman did to our country in her reign.

Understand, this isn't muck slinging or skeletons being dragged out of the cupboard post mortem. This is the merited hatred of the many who suffered badly under her reign, who were just as vocal about her publicly recorded sins while she was still alive and in power, and have been just as vocal in the 2 decades since her own party kicked her out of office when her arrogant contempt for the working classes went too far even for them (the brazenly obvious steal from the poor to make the rich even richer 'Poll Tax' sealed her political fate).

In life she offered no defence because there was none. The hatred for her was simply justified and she knew it (I suspect she revelled in it) and her death does not vanquish what she did in life.

For those who benefited under her, let them pay their respects. For those who suffered let them vent their spleens. They've more than earned that right.

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Old 04-10-2013, 08:06 PM   #78
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

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Originally Posted by moviedoors View Post
This NAILS why "not speaking of ill of the dead" simply need not apply to powerful, divisive, public figures:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...eath-etiquette

That does nail it right on the head

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"People praising Thatcher's legacy should show some respect for her victims."

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Old 04-10-2013, 09:31 PM   #79
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

Having looked through this thread I have to point certain people in here towards this link...

http://www.londonlovesbusiness.com/b...s/5218.article

To those buying the song and celebrating her death... Stop for a moment and think about how her family have lost a treasured member.... How would you like it if we all talked **** about your recently passed mother/grandmother? I also hope that none of the ****ers try anything during the funeral....

I was too young to really take notice of her when she was in power, but having taken an interest in the entire Falklands issue.... I can't help but praise the fact that she had the balls to send the troops to take them back... I highly doubt that Blair or Brown would do that...

She wasn't perfect... But she stopped the country from going to ruin and stood up to the militant unions (something we need more of today IMHO).

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Old 04-10-2013, 09:36 PM   #80
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

I don't really see a problem with it. Most of these people hated her when she was alive. Why stop now?

It's not like they're literally dancing on her grave... I assume.

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Old 04-10-2013, 10:03 PM   #81
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

The only political figure that I can't see myself being the least bit respectful when they pass would be Dick Cheney. With that man, it goes way beyond politics. I honestly think he's vile, destructive and vindictive on so many different levels and that he's inflicted so much irreparable harm on this country and other countries, that I would be hard-pressed to give a crap. I wouldn't gloat when he dies or "dance on his grave" or sing "ding-dong" ditties. I probably wouldn't say anything, since it is in bad taste to mock anyone's passing (except maybe Bin Laden's). But I sure as hell won't be shedding any tears. To think a good heart was wasted on him. So I guess he's my Margaret Thatcher.

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Old 04-11-2013, 01:09 AM   #82
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

I never knew Thatcher was so disliked by many people in her own country, and even around the world. I remember when Mandela went to visit her after he got out of prison, but I didn't know the whole context and history of it until now. She won't be missed.

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Old 04-11-2013, 02:20 AM   #83
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

Was there ever an attempt to bring her to justice while she was alive for the evils she committed?

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 04-11-2013, 02:54 AM   #84
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

Are you Argentinian? Otherwise, I don't know what justice you would bring her to.

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Old 04-11-2013, 03:30 AM   #85
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

Maybe bury her in one of the empty pits


I joke. Some of the reactions have been brutal. But on the other hand, the amount of money it's cost to recall Parliament is ridiculous. I also hate how she's having a funeral that a royal would have. So much for austerity. We have no money for the NHS, schools, ect, but we can afford a funeral for the woman that destroyed so many people's livelihoods.

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Old 04-11-2013, 04:40 AM   #86
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

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Are you Argentinian? Otherwise, I don't know what justice you would bring her to.
Crimes against humanity?

Or maybe hire some Argentinians?

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 04-11-2013, 06:40 AM   #87
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

What crimes against humanity?

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Old 04-11-2013, 07:41 AM   #88
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

Everyone is moaning about the ''poor taste'' in saying nasty things about her now she's dead. That's b.s... the same people were saying the same things when she was alive.

A lot of peoples lives were ruined because of decisions she made and myself being from Scotland, she never gave a **** about us. We were like the ugly step-child to her precious England.

The media say that the funeral is estimated to cost around £8-10 million.

I say burn the witch.

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Old 04-11-2013, 08:57 AM   #89
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

My family benefited from her time in power so I myself have not really got a massively negative view on her, but at the same time I'd feel more than a little uneasy to tell the Hillsborough families or anyone from the mining communities who have been wronged by her to show her the respect she never showed them. It's easy to take the moral highground when it hasn't directly affected you.

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Old 04-11-2013, 10:37 AM   #90
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

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Originally Posted by Dr Lee View Post
Having looked through this thread I have to point certain people in here towards this link...

http://www.londonlovesbusiness.com/b...s/5218.article

To those buying the song and celebrating her death... Stop for a moment and think about how her family have lost a treasured member.... How would you like it if we all talked **** about your recently passed mother/grandmother? I also hope that none of the ****ers try anything during the funeral....
I don't think her son and daughter are really that bothered by the negative reaction to their mothers death. The Thatcher family knew more than anyone how much a divisive figure she was and its not exactly a secret that when she died there would be stuff like this going on.

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Old 04-11-2013, 11:09 AM   #91
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I don't think her son and daughter are really that bothered by the negative reaction to their mothers death. The Thatcher family knew more than anyone how much a divisive figure she was and its not exactly a secret that when she died there would be stuff like this going on.
Which is why I was trying to aim that comment towards those that are making the comments. Yes, it was obvious that there wuld be people out there doing what they're doing... But that doesn't mean it's a right thing to do.

I despise Tony Blair and Gordon Brown with a passion...what those two did to this country is going to take a long time to sort out... But when they eventually pass on... You won't see me holding a street party or anything.

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Old 04-11-2013, 12:24 PM   #92
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

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What crimes against humanity?
Whatever it is that make people call her a witch after she's dead?

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Originally Posted by Matt
Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 04-11-2013, 01:57 PM   #93
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

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Whatever it is that make people call her a witch after she's dead?
Politics. She destroyed a lot of people's livelihoods with hers. But that doesn't make her a criminal. In the legal sense anyway.

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Old 04-11-2013, 02:20 PM   #94
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

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Whatever it is that make people call her a witch after she's dead?
She deliberately and remorselessly ruined lives, set communities against each other, created a North/South divide on a level seen before. She was promoting a 'Greed is Good' mentality (and tough sh#t on those who inevitably have to suffer for that greed) long before the term was used in 'Wall Street'.

Doesn't make her evil on anything like a level with Hitler or Stalin, but it's a more subtle form of evil nonetheless, and for those affected by her abuse of power utterly unforgivable.

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Old 04-11-2013, 02:31 PM   #95
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

I agree. My Dad grew up in Stoke and saw thousands of people's lives destroyed by her.

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Old 04-11-2013, 04:33 PM   #96
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

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She deliberately and remorselessly ruined lives, set communities against each other, created a North/South divide on a level seen before. She was promoting a 'Greed is Good' mentality (and tough sh#t on those who inevitably have to suffer for that greed) long before the term was used in 'Wall Street'.

Doesn't make her evil on anything like a level with Hitler or Stalin, but it's a more subtle form of evil nonetheless, and for those affected by her abuse of power utterly unforgivable.
So did the people who are openly lambasting her now that she's dead do so while she was alive, so she at least knew about it?

I have no dog in the fight, just curious.

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 04-11-2013, 04:44 PM   #97
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

I take it you grew up after she left office?

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Old 04-11-2013, 04:54 PM   #98
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I take it you grew up after she left office?
Noooo....much before that, but never really paid attention to overseas politics at the time. So I'm a bit surprised she's as hated as she is.

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 04-11-2013, 05:07 PM   #99
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But seriously, this is eye-opening. I knew she was disliked, but I didn't know she was hated this much. Her policies must have really ravaged some communities. This is way beyond the hate the left has for George W. or even the right has for Obama over here.

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Old 04-12-2013, 12:20 AM   #100
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Default Re: Margaret Thatcher (1925-2013)

Even here in Australia her policies were and are felt. Tony Abbott most certainly takes the view of unions that Thatcher promoted.

The idea that one should show respect to the dead is a vile one. She was a public figure, not Jane Doe on the street, and she changed the course of British history. Everyone dies. The idea that criticism, especially coming from an emotional place, should be stifled simply to appease is revolting.

More than ever, the cruelty, evil, and injustice promulgated by the Thatcher government needs to be voiced. It is perhaps more relevant now than when she was around, given how Cameron and the Conservatives wish to continue her legacy. Just look at the coverage of her death on official channels; it is pure revisionist history deliberately toning down her actions, her support for apartheid, her destruction of communities, in favour of 'respect'. For a younger generation, it is positively crucial that the damage she unrepentantly caused be brought to light, or else it will happen again in some form.

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