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Old 07-16-2013, 05:35 AM   #651
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

^^^ That could make him seem like a bad guy if he's not fighting the right people. And I don't know if BP could have a secret identity in the films because even in the comics he's revealed his identity to the world. His revealing his identity to the world in the films would fit with his wanting people to know about Wakanda. If they wanted to keep his identity secret it would be difficult in my opinion.

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Old 07-16-2013, 05:49 AM   #652
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

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^^^ That could make him seem like a bad guy if he's not fighting the right people. And I don't know if BP could have a secret identity in the films because even in the comics he's revealed his identity to the world. His revealing his identity to the world in the films would fit with his wanting people to know about Wakanda. If they wanted to keep his identity secret it would be difficult in my opinion.
1. You're correct. It would seem this Black Panther guy was a villain. But if the rest of the world does not know the Panther has a Wakandan connection then that could be to his advantage, at first. Also, you are right to bring up "not fighting the right people". That is always the Panther's modus operandi when it comes to Vibranium. Can he entrust Fury/Stark/Cap with Vibranium tech? We know he can. Can he entrust a Justin Hammer or WSC? That's the question, and it may put him initially in a bad light from the MCU's civilian population. It is one more plot idea to throw on the fire.

2. I am not saying to have a film where his status as this "Black Panther" remains hidden for it's entire length, but for about half of the runtime perhaps the ID of this rogue agent on the world stage is unknown to the general public.

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Old 07-16-2013, 11:22 AM   #653
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

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I don't think on location shooting is always all that necessary. Cities can double as other cities, as long as you're not trying to do extensive outside scenes. The globetrotting might be pretty awesome... another way to set T'Challa apart. Another way to do globetrotting without spending a lot of money actually doing it is to do non-urban areas. You can do a desert scene anywhere. You can do a mountain scene anywhere.
If you film a New York scene in Cleveland, its still considered "on location". Star Wars wasn't actually filmed on an alien planet, but Tunisia still counts as "on location". If it's a real desert and a real mountain, then its on location.

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Old 07-16-2013, 11:35 AM   #654
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

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Star Wars wasn't actually filmed on an alien planet,
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Old 07-16-2013, 12:28 PM   #655
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

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If you film a New York scene in Cleveland, its still considered "on location". Star Wars wasn't actually filmed on an alien planet, but Tunisia still counts as "on location". If it's a real desert and a real mountain, then its on location.
Oh that's all it is? Well then there's no reason to worry about shooting on location driving the budget any more than any other film. I don't really get this idea about showing Wakanda will skyrocket the budget. I mean, yeah, actually shooting on location in South Africa AND Tokyo AND Chile AND Sydney would drive up the budget, but if they're not doing all that, what's the exceptional cost?

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Old 07-16-2013, 01:15 PM   #656
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

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Here's a thought I have had for a couple of days. In the MCU there is not a lot of love shown to the secret identity trope of superhero fiction. Does any body have a "secret ID" in the MCU? Well maybe this could be played with in a BP film? If Wakanda is this mystery to be solved by the outside world, who is to say how much the rest of the planet really knows about it and it's government. Maybe a solo figure calling himself The Black Panther has been engaging criminals, terrorists and the intelligence agencies of countries all over? One week he is seen battling in Mexico against some cartel type who has acquired some Vibranium weapons of some kind? (Or maybe some mafia type just plated some jewelry for one of his honey's and the Panther comes to collect/destroy it?) Next week a military convoy in the Jungles of south asia is ambushed by this same mystery man. A G-12 type summit is crashed and some figure on the world stage gets roughed up by the Panther to extract information. All the while no one makes a connection in the film to T'challa/Wakanda until BP unmasks himself or is forced to do so through narrative contrivance.
No MCU doesnt have any secret identities. There's no reason to yet. I guess the closest wouldve been Black Widow or Hawkeye because they're "spies" but since they were caught by millions of cameras in New York it doesnt really matter.

I dont think BP needs a secret identity

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Old 07-16-2013, 01:51 PM   #657
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

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Oh that's all it is? Well then there's no reason to worry about shooting on location driving the budget any more than any other film. I don't really get this idea about showing Wakanda will skyrocket the budget. I mean, yeah, actually shooting on location in South Africa AND Tokyo AND Chile AND Sydney would drive up the budget, but if they're not doing all that, what's the exceptional cost?
Actually, shooting in South Africa would give them significant tax breaks and lower costs.

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Old 07-16-2013, 03:46 PM   #658
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

I'd agree with that. And the revealing of his secret identity could be seen as a rip-off of Iron Man. The secret identity doesn't really help the story per se.

But, yeah, part of Black Panther's schtick, his best introductions are when he shows up, fights the heroes and kicks their ever-loving tail. That's part of why he's not the POV character when he comes already established. He is the misunderstood one... the one who appears to be evil, but in actuality is anything but.

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Old 07-16-2013, 04:07 PM   #659
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

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Actually, shooting in South Africa would give them significant tax breaks and lower costs.
I had heard something like that. I'm sure that's a big part of why District 9 was so cheap. That's what I would do, go up into the country and do an outdoor set for Wakanda, use Johannesburg/Cape Town as a stand in for Downtown Rio (Carnivale?) or a New York alley or whatever, come back to LA and the soundstage there for all the other stuff, including any other urban locations you need.

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Old 07-16-2013, 05:39 PM   #660
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

If they want to film in SA, which makes a ton of sense for the above reasons, they really have to give first dibs to Blomkamp.

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At the risk of being totally offensive...there's a quote from Ghandi about Christianity that can be reappropriated for this.

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Old 07-16-2013, 06:28 PM   #661
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Blomkamp would mean one great thing for sure, outside of a director that can get the most bang for his buck and shoot great gritty action. Copley as Klaw, or a Klaw ancestor. I'd be pleased as punch.

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Old 07-16-2013, 09:19 PM   #662
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

There shouldn't be a secret identity for T'Challa. It's more interesting to see how they lead to the moment he dons his own Black Panther costume. They can show the costumes of past Black Panthers to establish how important the title is to him and Wakanda's culture.

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Old 07-16-2013, 10:51 PM   #663
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

Honestly, I think they should save secret IDs of the full classical variety for characters whom its *really* important, like Spider-man and Daredevil. Street level types, largely, or people where having two personas is actually a major part of their premise.

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Old 07-16-2013, 11:12 PM   #664
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

Such a big deal was made out of Stark revealing he was Iron Man at the end of the first movie when the FF have always been public with their true IDs...

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Old 07-17-2013, 12:30 AM   #665
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Such a big deal was made out of Stark revealing he was Iron Man at the end of the first movie when the FF have always been public with their true IDs...
They're still stuck in a wish-fulfillment mentality.

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Old 07-17-2013, 06:14 AM   #666
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If you want to do a New York focused story, that's a possibility. That's a variation on what Thor did, take the character away from their uber home and take away everything that makes them uber. The Prince in Coming to America did this willingly, while Thor was forced to by his father, but the result is the same, we see this person dealing with normal mundane human problems and having to solve them the same way we do, though perhaps with a notable amount more fighting spirit/training. Then the story ends in the original uber home. It's an inversion of the hero's journey that's kinda cool. I'm more of a Wakanda guy myself, but that's the kind of thing that it makes sense to agree to disagree on.
They could use New York in the same way that "The Dark Knight" used Hong Kong. Let's say that Black Panther wants to extradite someone who has information or may have committed a crime against Wakanda. Nicky Fury says he can't have him so T'Challa grabs the targets ass straight off the streets, throws him in a private jet, and reaches Wakanda before Nick Fury can say 'Uncle Sam'.

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Old 07-17-2013, 11:56 AM   #667
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

That would be pretty cool. Wouldn't be the Coming to America thing I was responding to, but that kind of thing fits in awesome with the world-traveler type of story. Go to New York to grab Klaw's science guy, travel to Switzerland to raid his headquarters, maybe Nepal to see the last place Klaw raided and then realize he's in Wakanda and come racing back.

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Old 07-17-2013, 01:53 PM   #668
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

In terms of directors, how about Edward Zwick? His work with The Last Samurai and Blood Diamond could work very well with a BP movie.

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Old 07-17-2013, 01:58 PM   #669
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It's interesting that Zwick get's brought up because until you did I was not even imagining him doing a BP type film. But you got a winner there. He could make a grand looking BP movie.

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Old 07-17-2013, 01:59 PM   #670
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

If he can switch the focus from the outsider POV character to the cultural 'superhero' character, Zwick could be good.

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Old 07-17-2013, 03:01 PM   #671
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If he can switch the focus from the outsider POV character to the cultural 'superhero' character, Zwick could be good.
I don't think he'd have a problem with that. Remember Glory?

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Old 07-17-2013, 03:18 PM   #672
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

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In terms of directors, how about Edward Zwick? His work with The Last Samurai and Blood Diamond could work very well with a BP movie.
Zwick has too many movies where white characters take the lead in the story of other ethnicities. With Glory he had the white commander being more of a focus than any of the black regiment the story should be about. In Blood Diamond he had a white guy as the focal point with the black Africans just sort of being in his way. In Last Samurai he had a white guy taking the lead in a story set in feudal Japan, and now he's producing a movie about the building of the Great Wall of China where....surprise! It's a fictional story that allows white people to be there.

I would really hate it if that happened with BP. I'm not opposed to any white characters at all. I love Ross and Nikki, and I would love to see if they had someone like Cap, Pym, or another hero in there. What I don't want is for a movie about a black African king to feature so many white characters that he's the only relevant black guy in the piece. I've been so sick of that from Hollywood for so long.

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Old 07-17-2013, 05:29 PM   #673
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

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I would really hate it if that happened with BP. I'm not opposed to any white characters at all. I love Ross and Nikki, and I would love to see if they had someone like Cap, Pym, or another hero in there. What I don't want is for a movie about a black African king to feature so many white characters that he's the only relevant black guy in the piece. I've been so sick of that from Hollywood for so long.
Amen

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Old 07-17-2013, 05:55 PM   #674
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How would everybody feel about this: What if the story is not so much the rise of a young prince to Kingship, but more a return of the King? Let's say that the villain (lets say it's Man-Ape) has already achieved his coup before the films start. He's in charge of Wakanda and it's Vibranium so there is starting to be a trickle of vibranium going out into the world. Wakanda, the isolationist "Japan of Africa" is making diplomatic overtures to the world. Most just see a new country's resources and market to exploit. Most in the U.S. govt./ NSA/State dept. see these Wakandan changes as an overall positive thing. Fury has his suspicions, especially since they still won't allow free travel of it's citizens. He also does not like seeing all this vibranium showing up in all the wrong hands. Now somebody seems to be taking care of the more shady purchasers of Vibranium. Fury himself get's hands on with trying to find this mysteryman at the behest of the WSC, who are responding to requests by the Wakandan govt. While Fury is present during one of these ops they actually capture this person (I know and you know BP is only letting himself be taken down). The charming but stoic man get's a face to face with Fury before his SHIELD transport takes him back to Wakanda and tells his tale. We then get the flashback of his personal story that also tracks the state of Wakandan politics before it's supposed "opening" to the world, from T'challa being guided to Kingship by his father to T'chaka's death (Klaw/Man-Ape natch) and T'challa being exiled/escaping. (Ironically it's the disident movement in Wakanda, those that want a more openess and freedom of movement for Wakandans that helps T'challa leave safely). We see Wakandan society in this section, and T'challa's connection to home and his father so we know the stakes both broadly and personally for him. We see him set to turn things around from the moment he is out of Wakandan territory. Long story short (too late, I know) his capture and transport by SHIELD was all part of the plan to return and take out his enemies and he's been manipulating things to this outcome. More or less the broad strokes for this idea.

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Old 07-17-2013, 06:42 PM   #675
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Default Re: EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

I don't know. I always thought the best way to get BP out of Wakanda in a BP movie was a shodown at the UN headquarter. Regaining the throne of his country on a political level too. (also leading Wakanda out of isolation)

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