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View Poll Results: Batman Begins vs The Amazing Spider-Man
Batman Begins 123 86.01%
The Amazing Spider-Man 20 13.99%
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Old 07-03-2013, 11:59 PM   #326
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Default Re: Batman Begins vs The Amazing Spider-Man?

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Originally Posted by flickchick85 View Post
I'm a DC fangirl, and I found BB to be the better-crafted film, but I still preferred TASM overall. Why? 1.) None of the dialogue in TASM had me cringing as much as some of Goyer's worst moments in BB. 2.) Emma Stone/Gwen Stacy was a FAR superior love interest and I felt the connections with most of the relationships more. 3.) I liked the action scenes more. 4.) The score for TASM is one of my favorite superhero scores ever. BB's? I enjoy it, but it doesn't have that "magic" for me. 5.) I loved the characterization of Spidey so much. It was much closer to the one I'm familiar with than the Raimi versions were, whereas the Nolan Batman, much as I loved it, wasn't as close to the Batman I grew up with. 6.) The weakest factor in TASM - the villain - just happens to be the aspect I care the least about in all superhero flicks, so it didn't bother me the way it bothered most.
This is the only area where ASM could have superiority over Begins. The movie got a lot of things wrong but the Peter/Gwen aspect was handled excellently. I almost wish the movie was framed primarily as a love story between them.

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Old 07-04-2013, 01:05 AM   #327
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Default Re: Batman Begins vs The Amazing Spider-Man?

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Originally Posted by flickchick85 View Post
I'm a DC fangirl, and I found BB to be the better-crafted film, but I still preferred TASM overall. Why? 1.) None of the dialogue in TASM had me cringing as much as some of Goyer's worst moments in BB. 2.) Emma Stone/Gwen Stacy was a FAR superior love interest and I felt the connections with most of the relationships more. 3.) I liked the action scenes more. 4.) The score for TASM is one of my favorite superhero scores ever. BB's? I enjoy it, but it doesn't have that "magic" for me. 5.) I loved the characterization of Spidey so much. It was much closer to the one I'm familiar with than the Raimi versions were, whereas the Nolan Batman, much as I loved it, wasn't as close to the Batman I grew up with. 6.) The weakest factor in TASM - the villain - just happens to be the aspect I care the least about in all superhero flicks, so it didn't bother me the way it bothered most.

For those reasons, despite the exceptional craftsmanship Nolan & Co. brought to the table with BB, and despite the fact that it influenced so many origin films to come - including TASM - I found TASM to be a more enjoyable movie-going experience overall. So it got my vote. I'm no Spidey fangirl, but there ya go. I'm sorry you can't accept that other parties might feel that way for rational reasons.

Flickchick, you rule.

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Old 07-04-2013, 01:10 AM   #328
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When Gwen eventually bites it it is going to be heart breaking because Pete and Gwen for me have the best chemistry in superhero movies.

'Promise to leave Gwen out of it'
'But those are the best kind'

Oof! The drama practically writes itself.

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Old 07-04-2013, 01:16 AM   #329
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Default Re: Batman Begins vs The Amazing Spider-Man?

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Flickchick, you rule.
She certainly does.

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Old 07-04-2013, 08:22 AM   #330
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Default Re: Batman Begins vs The Amazing Spider-Man?

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Originally Posted by spider-neil View Post
When Gwen eventually bites it it is going to be heart breaking because Pete and Gwen for me have the best chemistry in superhero movies.

'Promise to leave Gwen out of it'
'But those are the best kind'

Oof! The drama practically writes itself.
So, basically what he's said here is "I ****ed up, I'm happy I ****ed up and I will continue to **** up in new and unbelievable ways because ****ing up is fun!"

(Yes, I did steal that from the Nostalgia Critic lol)

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Old 07-04-2013, 11:43 AM   #331
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Default Re: Batman Begins vs The Amazing Spider-Man?

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So, basically what he's said here is "I ****ed up, I'm happy I ****ed up and I will continue to **** up in new and unbelievable ways because ****ing up is fun!"

(Yes, I did steal that from the Nostalgia Critic lol)
He's saying I'm a teen and I shouldn't be held to a promise made to a dying man I hardly knew but that broken promise will have consequences and that's good drama regardless of what Nostalgia Critic says.

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Old 07-04-2013, 11:44 AM   #332
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Default Re: Batman Begins vs The Amazing Spider-Man?

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Flickchick, you rule.
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Originally Posted by UltimateWebhead View Post
She certainly does.
Aw, thanks guys. You're not so bad yourselves.

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Old 07-04-2013, 02:44 PM   #333
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Default Re: Batman Begins vs The Amazing Spider-Man?

The problem isn't that he broke the promise, but that he did without any thought or remorse whatsoever. It should have been something he really struggled with.

That might be what a real teenager might do, but it is not what the Peter Parker that I've known for thirty years would do. Webb completely missed the mark on who this character is supposed to be. Almost as badly as Joe Quesada. Let's just say I would have no problem believing that THIS Parker would sell his marriage to the devil. That's bad.


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Old 07-04-2013, 03:13 PM   #334
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Default Re: Batman Begins vs The Amazing Spider-Man?

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Originally Posted by Kahran Ramsus View Post
The problem isn't that he broke the promise, but that he did without any thought or remorse whatsoever. It should have been something he really struggled with.

That might be what a real teenager might do, but it is not what the Peter Parker that I've known for thirty years would do. Webb completely missed the mark on who this character is supposed to be. Almost as badly as Joe Quesada. Let's just say I would have no problem believing that THIS Parker would sell his marriage to the devil. That's bad.
To be fair, it happened right at the end. The next scene is literally Spidey swinging, so in ASM2 Webb could highlight Peter struggling with his decision. I believe certain leaked photos of a returning character will show Peter's remorse or at least some of his thought process.

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Old 07-04-2013, 05:16 PM   #335
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I hope so, but even if they salvage the series with a good second installment it won't change my opinion on the first film.

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Old 07-04-2013, 10:03 PM   #336
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It's pretty close, but I'd pick Batman Begins.

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Old 07-05-2013, 01:14 AM   #337
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Default Re: Batman Begins vs The Amazing Spider-Man?

what bothers me is not that he broke the promise. it's that he broke it five minutes after he made it. Let him break it in the second movie. It would have been better imo.

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Old 07-05-2013, 01:23 AM   #338
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Default Re: Batman Begins vs The Amazing Spider-Man?

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what bothers me is not that he broke the promise. it's that he broke it five minutes after he made it. Let him break it in the second movie. It would have been better imo.
Everyone and their dog knows Gwen's fate so we know there are consequences down the line. I just took it that he is a teen and no teen is going to keep that promise, not if they have a pulse.

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Old 07-05-2013, 01:58 AM   #339
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Everyone and their dog knows Gwen's fate so we know there are consequences down the line. I just took it that he is a teen and no teen is going to keep that promise, not if they have a pulse.
I don't think that's an acceptable excuse. After going through both tragedy and trauma, I'm pretty sure he would have acquiesced, especially considering his moral compass after Ben's death. What he said at that moment was completely out of character, teenager or not. Even in spite of it all, her eventual death will surely have less impact for me just because of this. They're both far too insensitive about the situation to take either character seriously.

Personally, I think they shouldn't have written themselves into that corner in the first place; this is one instance where I think the comic arc did it better - keep Peter's identity a secret from her, and have Spider-Man take the fall for Capt Stacy's death.

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Old 07-05-2013, 03:00 AM   #340
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Personally, I think they shouldn't have written themselves into that corner in the first place; this is one instance where I think the comic arc did it better - keep Peter's identity a secret from her, and have Spider-Man take the fall for Capt Stacy's death.
Then you would have the Harry arc from the Raimi movie all over again.
I wont lie, I thought the 'those are the best kind' line was insensitive but I remember when I was a teen and no way would I have kept that promise under similar circumstances not when potential girlfriend looks like Emma Stone. It's like Peter humilating Flash, sure he should have kept his powers under wraps but as someone who was bullied as a teen, if I got powers that is exactly what I would do. Peter isn't a 30 year old Batman or Superman with a life time of experience he is 17 years old and I'm glad the movie makes a teen act like a teen.

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Old 07-05-2013, 03:26 AM   #341
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Then you would have the Harry arc from the Raimi movie all over again.
Irrelevant. Normally I would concede the point, but there have been plenty of recycled sub plots as it stands which fans of this film apparently don't have a problem with. This one, on the other hand, could be explored with more depth as it would include the romantically linked leads; it wouldn't need to retrace the way it was done in the Raimi films precisely because of the dynamics involved.

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I wont lie, I thought the 'those are the best kind' line was insensitive but I remember when I was a teen and no way would I have kept that promise under similar circumstances not when potential girlfriend looks like Emma Stone.


So, you're saying that you could accurately gauge your actions and state of mind, as a fragile minded teenager no less, after a traumatic experience that resulted in the death your girlfriends father? So, forget PTSD, remorse, guilt, integrity, or anything, just because your girlfriend looks like Emma Stone? Color me cynical. I won't sit here and tell you what you would do, but I don't think you're giving the gravity of the situation its due consideration. Either way, we aren't talking about you or me, we're talking about Garfield's Peter Parker, and I will say that it was completely out of character for him, with all he apparently learned and went through. After the deaths of two of his mentors, the imprisonment of another, the revelations about his estranged/dead parents, and the symbolism of the egg scene with his aunt, that one carelessly written line eradicated nearly every bit of development the character had.

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It's like Peter humilating Flash, sure he should have kept his powers under wraps but as someone who was bullied as a teen, if I got powers that is exactly what I would do. Peter isn't a 30 year old Batman or Superman with a life time of experience he is 17 years old and I'm glad the movie makes a teen act like a teen.
That's a false dichotomy; the way you say this assumes that there was no alternative to the way he acted. From a writing standpoint, there's more than one way to skin a cat, and there are certainly more archetypes to consider with regard to a teenagers actions. I don't even like children, and even I would give them more credit than that.

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Old 07-05-2013, 12:37 PM   #342
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Amazing Spider-man was wet dog food.

Batman Begins raised the bar of quality CMB's to new heights. And shifted Sony and Fox's comic book reign.

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Old 07-05-2013, 01:03 PM   #343
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Amazing Spider-man was wet dog food.

Batman Begins raised the bar of quality CMB's to new heights. And shifted Sony and Fox's comic book reign.
Raised the bar so much that I wasn't interested in seeing the sequel until WOM started to filter down how good TDK was.

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Old 07-05-2013, 01:15 PM   #344
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Default Re: Batman Begins vs The Amazing Spider-Man?

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Raised the bar so much that I wasn't interested in seeing the sequel until WOM started to filter down how good TDK was.
That's sort of your point of view and not really reflective of the general reaction to the film however.

I know you've already commented on how you have your own point of view on the film which is justifiable nobody can tell you what you like or don't but you have acknowledged how you know it is a minority view you hold of begins at least compared to TASM.

Overall i think Begins did an amazing job at setting up excitement for its sequel, in a way that wasn't just a blatant cliff-hanger but was actually clever.

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Old 07-05-2013, 01:58 PM   #345
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That's sort of your point of view and not really reflective of the general reaction to the film however.
Interest in TDK was build almost entirely on the movie starring Batman (famous) nemesis Joker, a viral campaign and the actor playing the lead villain dying. People can retroactively put importance on BB if they wish but I pretty much clearly remember the general reaction to BB and people weren't that bothered.

I really wish I had kept the article on the BB Blu ray sales because that wasn't so great either. TDK is great, BB is an adequate reboot with a tedious 3rd act, the movie is so overrated it's not even funny.

To illustrate my point on Rotten Tomatoes the general audience score for BB is 3.9/5 for ASM the general audience average score is 4/5 so is BB bad or ASM good?


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Old 07-05-2013, 02:11 PM   #346
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Interest in TDK was build almost entirely on the movie starring Batman (famous) nemesis Joker, a viral campaign and the actor playing the lead villain dying. People can retroactively put importance on BB if they wish but I pretty much clearly remember the general reaction to BB and people weren't that bothered.

I really wish I had kept the article on the BB Blu ray sales because that wasn't so great either. TDK is great, BB is an adequate reboot with a tedious 3rd act, the movie is so overrated it's not even funny.

To illustrate my point on Rotten Tomatoes the general audience score for BB is 3.9/5 for ASM the general audience average score is 4/5 so is BB bad or ASM good?
Video sales for begins were quite good actually and played into the eventual excitement for TDK. The interest for TDK started before the viral campaign and had its roots in like i mentioned begins last scene. Blu ray sales would be irrelevant as Blu-ray had barely taken off during that time. Begins came out in 2005 and blu-ray wasn't even released to the public until 2006.

I don't really pay much attention to the RT user scores but more so imdb user scores as most people do i believe and Begins is at 8.3 (after 8 years mind you quite impressive) to TASM 7.1 (after 1 year).

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Old 07-05-2013, 02:20 PM   #347
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As for more proof of Begins strong DVD sales this is an article from 2006 and it mentions begins strong dvd sales of $167 million already.

http://variety.com/2006/film/news/wb...ux-1200342128/

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Old 07-05-2013, 02:27 PM   #348
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As for more proof of Begins strong DVD sales this is an article from 2006 and it mentions begins strong dvd sales of $167 million already.

http://variety.com/2006/film/news/wb...ux-1200342128/
There is no comparison of makes 'strong' sales, though. I remember hearing that SM3 had 'poor' sales and when I actually did research it was the number 3 selling blu ray of the year.

'Meh' whatever, I'm arguing in circles. I think BB is overrated and I'll leave it there. More power to the people that rate that movie as anything other than an average crime thriller.

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Old 07-05-2013, 04:17 PM   #349
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TASM was not an enjoyable film to watch at all and Garfield i do not think is good as Spidey however i hate him as an actor.

Begins was totally different from anything they had done in previous batman films, it seemed very fresh. Where as TASM was more 'HEY LOOOOK! SHINEY SHINEY!'

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Old 07-05-2013, 04:31 PM   #350
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Default Re: Batman Begins vs The Amazing Spider-Man?

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Video sales for begins were quite good actually and played into the eventual excitement for TDK. The interest for TDK started before the viral campaign and had its roots in like i mentioned begins last scene. Blu ray sales would be irrelevant as Blu-ray had barely taken off during that time. Begins came out in 2005 and blu-ray wasn't even released to the public until 2006.

I don't really pay much attention to the RT user scores but more so imdb user scores as most people do i believe and Begins is at 8.3 (after 8 years mind you quite impressive) to TASM 7.1 (after 1 year).
You would know that SM2 is at 7.4, there has been a fanboy war between fans of both franchises so that is why both have unusally low user scores compared to their RT user ones. Each have been making lots of span accounts, seriously look at their message boards. Again BB is better but TASM is still great...

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