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View Poll Results: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...
Love it! 92 36.51%
It's okay... 56 22.22%
Hate it! 104 41.27%
Voters: 252. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-02-2013, 11:25 AM   #1
kaijunexus
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Default The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

So, just for clarification, the Mandarin referred to in this thread title is not just the one played by Ben Kingsley (who is actually playing an actor named Trevor Slattery), but also the REAL Mandarin in the movie, Aldrich Killian (played by Guy Pearce).

So...a quick rundown of how the Mandarin is handled in this film (at least as far as I understand it)...

Aldrich Killian is humiliated by Tony Stark in 1999, and goes on to create the AIM organization in public and the Ten Rings terrorist organization in private. He does this in an effort to control demand and supply on both sides of a general war on terrorism by weaponizing the human body with Extremis to fight terrorists (?).

Killian also creates a persona called "the Mandarin" that will act as the head of his terrorist organization and hired drunken, but gifted actor Trevor Slattery to play the part. He outfits Trevor with robes and rings, and writes the words he will speak. For all intents and purposes, the bearded Mandarin in the terrorist videos is a puppet, and Killian is pulling the strings.

In fact, Killian has injected himself with Extremis, and has gained superpowers as a result. With his glowing dragon tattoo, he exclaims in the end that he himself is actually the Mandarin...which would in turn make Ben Kingsley's Mandarin something of a facade.


So what's your opinion on the Mandarin in Iron Man 3?

*This thread is something of a rebirth of the "twist of Mandarin" thread...just with everyone posting SPOILERS in SPOILER TAGS or BLACKOUT TEXT...and a less spoilery title!

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Old 05-02-2013, 11:48 AM   #2
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

I loved him. I'm not knowledgeable of him in comics though, so i dont know if not knowing much about him helped me not have expectations.

Having said that, i think
Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
both actors did an outstanding job portraying him
and i'm very happy with the twist and how it was done. I went in unspoiled for the most part, and i was (pleasantly) surprised.

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Old 05-02-2013, 12:11 PM   #3
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

I liked it.

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Old 05-02-2013, 12:20 PM   #4
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

I thought it was hilarious.

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Old 05-02-2013, 12:44 PM   #5
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

I thought it was excellently scripted and executed. We literally didn't see it coming.

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
And whoever says they felt cheated may have simply been fixated on trappings and rings. The Mandarin we got was awesome, and he even had shades of Fin Fang Foom. He did all the things he did to Tony in the comics, including besting his armor and fighting him on a psychological level. A truly terrifying villain (that I'm not convinced is dead, by the way.)

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Old 05-02-2013, 12:54 PM   #6
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

^ this

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Old 05-02-2013, 01:06 PM   #7
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

It was okay in my eyes, I would have liked to see The Mandarin of the comics, and in a way I did in this movie, but I understand why they went with the twist, and honestly, the Mandarin we got at the very end was great, so I wasnt thrilled by it, but I didnt mind it either, in the movie, it works.

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Old 05-02-2013, 01:12 PM   #8
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

It was okay for me.

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Old 05-02-2013, 01:19 PM   #9
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

I posted this in another thread, but this pretty much sums up my thoughts:

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
The REAL Mandarin, Killian, was a great man of science, who showed desire to control the world's greatest powers, hence the line 'I'll have the two biggest weapons in each hand and own the War On Terror'(or something like that). We see at the beginning of the film he was a nobody, but through his knowledge (and probably his powers), he built himself up. He showed great hand-to-hand combat talents. Notice the other Extremis soldiers were not nearly as good at hand to hand combat, so he must have some training.
Now the COMIC Mandarin, was born in a rich family who spent all their wealth teaching him science and training him in the martial arts. By the time he was an adult, he was dirt poor, but extremely brilliant, like Killian at the beginning of Iron Man 3. Also like Killian, The Mandarin's strength is his knowledge of SCIENCE. This is what enabled him to study Axon-Karr and tap into the powers of the ten rings. He used his powers and knowledge to build himself up and desired world domination, often using Countries own weapons against them, like Killian's plan with Extremis, Iron Patriot and Iron Man. The Mandarin also is extremely talented in martial arts and hand-to-hand combat.

Killian as The Mandarin is very much a Nolan villain interpretation. Similar to how Joker isn't permawhite and Bane isn't a venom-out wrestler, Killian isn't a Chinese ruler with powerful rings. However, similar to how Ledger's Joker and Hardy's Bane represent all the major aspects of the characters themselves, Killian has just about everything from a characterization stand point that The Mandarin has and is. If Killian returned in a sequel with 10 Rings, he'd be a damn near perfect live adaption interpretation of the character.
The twist wasn't just a plot twist, and it wouldn't work for every villain. It was used with The Mandarin for a reason and it was to acknowledge the character's past in the comics and to critique the original, racist stereotype that the original character was. IM3 showed us the VISUAL aspects of The Mandarin character and turned it into a joke because thats what it is, a racist, stupid joke of a character. However, the character himself, which is a great villain, they showed respect to and made him the primary villain with Killian.

Also, this COMIC BOOK Mandarin looks almost exactly like Mandarin/Killian in the climax of Iron Man 3:

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Old 05-02-2013, 01:27 PM   #10
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

:
Quote:
Originally Posted by weezerspider View Post
I posted this in another thread, but this pretty much sums up my thoughts:

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
The REAL Mandarin, Killian, was a great man of science, who showed desire to control the world's greatest powers, hence the line 'I'll have the two biggest weapons in each hand and own the War On Terror'(or something like that). We see at the beginning of the film he was a nobody, but through his knowledge (and probably his powers), he built himself up. He showed great hand-to-hand combat talents. Notice the other Extremis soldiers were not nearly as good at hand to hand combat, so he must have some training.
Now the COMIC Mandarin, was born in a rich family who spent all their wealth teaching him science and training him in the martial arts. By the time he was an adult, he was dirt poor, but extremely brilliant, like Killian at the beginning of Iron Man 3. Also like Killian, The Mandarin's strength is his knowledge of SCIENCE. This is what enabled him to study Axon-Karr and tap into the powers of the ten rings. He used his powers and knowledge to build himself up and desired world domination, often using Countries own weapons against them, like Killian's plan with Extremis, Iron Patriot and Iron Man. The Mandarin also is extremely talented in martial arts and hand-to-hand combat.

Killian as The Mandarin is very much a Nolan villain interpretation. Similar to how Joker isn't permawhite and Bane isn't a venom-out wrestler, Killian isn't a Chinese ruler with powerful rings. However, similar to how Ledger's Joker and Hardy's Bane represent all the major aspects of the characters themselves, Killian has just about everything from a characterization stand point that The Mandarin has and is. If Killian returned in a sequel with 10 Rings, he'd be a damn near perfect live adaption interpretation of the character.
The twist wasn't just a plot twist, and it wouldn't work for every villain. It was used with The Mandarin for a reason and it was to acknowledge the character's past in the comics and to critique the original, racist stereotype that the original character was. IM3 showed us the VISUAL aspects of The Mandarin character and turned it into a joke because thats what it is, a racist, stupid joke of a character. However, the character himself, which is a great villain, they showed respect to and made him the primary villain with Killian.

Also, this COMIC BOOK Mandarin looks almost exactly like Mandarin/Killian in the climax of Iron Man 3:

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Old 05-02-2013, 01:36 PM   #11
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by weezerspider View Post
I posted this in another thread, but this pretty much sums up my thoughts:

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
The REAL Mandarin, Killian, was a great man of science, who showed desire to control the world's greatest powers, hence the line 'I'll have the two biggest weapons in each hand and own the War On Terror'(or something like that). We see at the beginning of the film he was a nobody, but through his knowledge (and probably his powers), he built himself up. He showed great hand-to-hand combat talents. Notice the other Extremis soldiers were not nearly as good at hand to hand combat, so he must have some training.
Now the COMIC Mandarin, was born in a rich family who spent all their wealth teaching him science and training him in the martial arts. By the time he was an adult, he was dirt poor, but extremely brilliant, like Killian at the beginning of Iron Man 3. Also like Killian, The Mandarin's strength is his knowledge of SCIENCE. This is what enabled him to study Axon-Karr and tap into the powers of the ten rings. He used his powers and knowledge to build himself up and desired world domination, often using Countries own weapons against them, like Killian's plan with Extremis, Iron Patriot and Iron Man. The Mandarin also is extremely talented in martial arts and hand-to-hand combat.

Killian as The Mandarin is very much a Nolan villain interpretation. Similar to how Joker isn't permawhite and Bane isn't a venom-out wrestler, Killian isn't a Chinese ruler with powerful rings. However, similar to how Ledger's Joker and Hardy's Bane represent all the major aspects of the characters themselves, Killian has just about everything from a characterization stand point that The Mandarin has and is. If Killian returned in a sequel with 10 Rings, he'd be a damn near perfect live adaption interpretation of the character.
The twist wasn't just a plot twist, and it wouldn't work for every villain. It was used with The Mandarin for a reason and it was to acknowledge the character's past in the comics and to critique the original, racist stereotype that the original character was. IM3 showed us the VISUAL aspects of The Mandarin character and turned it into a joke because thats what it is, a racist, stupid joke of a character. However, the character himself, which is a great villain, they showed respect to and made him the primary villain with Killian.

Also, this COMIC BOOK Mandarin looks almost exactly like Mandarin/Killian in the climax of Iron Man 3:
THIS x 1000 for me!

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Old 05-02-2013, 01:41 PM   #12
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

I think it could have been handled better and more thoroughly executed but I like that it's a post modern take on the classic comic book vilain. In the end it's not just for fun even if it provides a lot of laughs, it definitely adds depth to the movie.

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Old 05-02-2013, 02:05 PM   #13
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

I loved it, thought it worked really well in the film. It probably helps that I don't read the comics so I didn't have a predisposed mental image of him and what I wanted to see beforehand. Thought it was a great representation of the character just passed out to 2 different characters.

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Old 05-02-2013, 02:39 PM   #14
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

It worked for the film at the expense of ruining the real characterization, for the sake of a cheap plot twist.

I didn't go well as a trilogy. I would describe it as an impressive (lack of accurate word here) and entertaining but hollow and poor character... A "firework" villain, for a "firework" movie if you want it that way. It depends highly on the strong and awesome acting of both actors, but it feels poorly written and really underdeveloped. Shane Black dropped the ball with the character, and in closer look, with the movie.

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Old 05-02-2013, 02:53 PM   #15
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocanrol View Post
It worked for the film at the expense of ruining the real characterization, for the sake of a cheap plot twist.

I didn't go well as a trilogy. I would describe it as an impressive (lack of accurate word here) and entertaining but hollow and poor character... A "firework" villain, for a "firework" movie if you want it that way. It depends highly on the strong and awesome acting of both actors, but it feels poorly written and really underdeveloped. Shane Black dropped the ball with the character, and in closer look, with the movie.
Right, it butchered the Mandarin just for the surprise effect.

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Old 05-02-2013, 06:46 PM   #16
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

Well it sounds as if
Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
the real Mandarin could return as a villain in the MCU. Extremis has regenerative properties? If so, I could see Guy back with the robe to hide any excessive damage that Extremis couldn't heal.
.

However

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
I like to watch movies in the now rather than as pieces for something that's coming down the pipeline later; as it is I don't really dig Kilian's motive. I could appreciate the character as a parody of a Nolanized villain: "realistic" dress style, preachy as all get-out, but reveling in sci-fi goodness (the Extremis)

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Old 05-02-2013, 06:56 PM   #17
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

I think you need a better worded poll.

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Old 05-02-2013, 06:59 PM   #18
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by weezerspider View Post
I posted this in another thread, but this pretty much sums up my thoughts:

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
The REAL Mandarin, Killian, was a great man of science, who showed desire to control the world's greatest powers, hence the line 'I'll have the two biggest weapons in each hand and own the War On Terror'(or something like that). We see at the beginning of the film he was a nobody, but through his knowledge (and probably his powers), he built himself up. He showed great hand-to-hand combat talents. Notice the other Extremis soldiers were not nearly as good at hand to hand combat, so he must have some training.
Now the COMIC Mandarin, was born in a rich family who spent all their wealth teaching him science and training him in the martial arts. By the time he was an adult, he was dirt poor, but extremely brilliant, like Killian at the beginning of Iron Man 3. Also like Killian, The Mandarin's strength is his knowledge of SCIENCE. This is what enabled him to study Axon-Karr and tap into the powers of the ten rings. He used his powers and knowledge to build himself up and desired world domination, often using Countries own weapons against them, like Killian's plan with Extremis, Iron Patriot and Iron Man. The Mandarin also is extremely talented in martial arts and hand-to-hand combat.

Killian as The Mandarin is very much a Nolan villain interpretation. Similar to how Joker isn't permawhite and Bane isn't a venom-out wrestler, Killian isn't a Chinese ruler with powerful rings. However, similar to how Ledger's Joker and Hardy's Bane represent all the major aspects of the characters themselves, Killian has just about everything from a characterization stand point that The Mandarin has and is. If Killian returned in a sequel with 10 Rings, he'd be a damn near perfect live adaption interpretation of the character.
The twist wasn't just a plot twist, and it wouldn't work for every villain. It was used with The Mandarin for a reason and it was to acknowledge the character's past in the comics and to critique the original, racist stereotype that the original character was. IM3 showed us the VISUAL aspects of The Mandarin character and turned it into a joke because thats what it is, a racist, stupid joke of a character. However, the character himself, which is a great villain, they showed respect to and made him the primary villain with Killian.

Also, this COMIC BOOK Mandarin looks almost exactly like Mandarin/Killian in the climax of Iron Man 3:
This.

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Old 05-02-2013, 08:12 PM   #19
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

I liked the film as a whole, but I'm still not sure of how I feel about the Mandarin.

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Old 05-02-2013, 08:14 PM   #20
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by weezerspider View Post
I posted this in another thread, but this pretty much sums up my thoughts:

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
The REAL Mandarin, Killian, was a great man of science, who showed desire to control the world's greatest powers, hence the line 'I'll have the two biggest weapons in each hand and own the War On Terror'(or something like that). We see at the beginning of the film he was a nobody, but through his knowledge (and probably his powers), he built himself up. He showed great hand-to-hand combat talents. Notice the other Extremis soldiers were not nearly as good at hand to hand combat, so he must have some training.
Now the COMIC Mandarin, was born in a rich family who spent all their wealth teaching him science and training him in the martial arts. By the time he was an adult, he was dirt poor, but extremely brilliant, like Killian at the beginning of Iron Man 3. Also like Killian, The Mandarin's strength is his knowledge of SCIENCE. This is what enabled him to study Axon-Karr and tap into the powers of the ten rings. He used his powers and knowledge to build himself up and desired world domination, often using Countries own weapons against them, like Killian's plan with Extremis, Iron Patriot and Iron Man. The Mandarin also is extremely talented in martial arts and hand-to-hand combat.

Killian as The Mandarin is very much a Nolan villain interpretation. Similar to how Joker isn't permawhite and Bane isn't a venom-out wrestler, Killian isn't a Chinese ruler with powerful rings. However, similar to how Ledger's Joker and Hardy's Bane represent all the major aspects of the characters themselves, Killian has just about everything from a characterization stand point that The Mandarin has and is. If Killian returned in a sequel with 10 Rings, he'd be a damn near perfect live adaption interpretation of the character.
The twist wasn't just a plot twist, and it wouldn't work for every villain. It was used with The Mandarin for a reason and it was to acknowledge the character's past in the comics and to critique the original, racist stereotype that the original character was. IM3 showed us the VISUAL aspects of The Mandarin character and turned it into a joke because thats what it is, a racist, stupid joke of a character. However, the character himself, which is a great villain, they showed respect to and made him the primary villain with Killian.

Also, this COMIC BOOK Mandarin looks almost exactly like Mandarin/Killian in the climax of Iron Man 3:
Nobel Prize for this.

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Old 05-02-2013, 08:25 PM   #21
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by redfirebird2008 View Post
I thought it was hilarious.
Is that a good thing?

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Old 05-02-2013, 10:50 PM   #22
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

Its okay. I wanted him to be a real threat but I didn't hate their execution.

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Old 05-02-2013, 11:09 PM   #23
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
They pulled a Ra's Al Ghul on us. At first, it took me out of the movie. Ben Kingsley was chilling as "The Mandarin" up until the big reveal, so to see him basically turn into Sacha Baron Cohen was more than a little jarring. Afterwards, I started to warm up to Killian as the real Mandarin.

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Old 05-03-2013, 12:04 AM   #24
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
I loved Kingsley's masquerade guise as The Mandarin prior to the reveal and comic relif character twist of Trevor Slattery. Those television hijacked announcements were immensely terrifying and brilliantly performed by Kingsley.

However I also like Killian's manipulation and his part in the creation of The Mandarin to a certain extent with that being said I'd have much prefered to have seen Kingsley fully as the Traditional Mandarin with the magical ten rings as oppose to Extremis Killian.

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Old 05-03-2013, 12:10 AM   #25
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Default Re: The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it?

Hated it completely. Debating whether to just give up on Marvel completely at this point. They want to stick their middle finger in my face, then I don't need to give them my money any more.

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