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Old 06-06-2013, 07:21 AM   #101
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Default Re: The Benicio Del Toro Thread - Who Is He Playing?

What? I don't understand how you come to that.

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Old 06-06-2013, 07:47 AM   #102
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dis information is a common tactic

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Old 06-06-2013, 07:54 AM   #103
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Personally, I think this is further evidence of Marvel Studios blowing smoke up our asses, just like they did with IM3. IM3 was practically headed for post when they *finally* dropped the bombshell that Mandarin *would* be in the movie after all. (Sorta --- don't get me started on that, please.)

Collector makes no sense at all in the context of what little we know about GOTG, let alone Avengers or any other Marvel movie. You're not going to make a story about the cosmic curator of a museum full of captive superheroes/villains from across the galaxy interesting.

Instead, I'm willing to bet right now any amount of Internet dollar$ anyone cares to lose that it's another smokescreen, and BDT *is* actually playing Thanos, as most of us expect, but it'll be Marvel Studios' worst kept secret until the "big reveal" halfway through the shoot.
This makes a lot of sense. With the "Iron Man flying off into space to join the Guardians" rumor having been disproven, Thanos is the one link remaining between GOTG and the $1.5 billion Avengers franchise. If you try to think like a Disney/Marvel exec, which character is going to move more tie-in product? A quirky senior citizen with a hoarding problem or a massive purple space-god?

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Old 06-06-2013, 08:08 AM   #104
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This makes a lot of sense. With the "Iron Man flying off into space to join the Guardians" rumor having been disproven, Thanos is the one link remaining between GOTG and the $1.5 billion Avengers franchise. If you try to think like a Disney/Marvel exec, which character is going to move more tie-in product? A quirky senior citizen with a hoarding problem or a massive purple space-god?

Exactly.

Hell, I think the whole last few weeks could turn out to be an organized disinfo campaign. We've gotten anonymous "sources" who tell us that a movie about the Guardians of the Galaxy is now going to feature The Collector, Carina, a Rhomann Dey who sounds nothing like his comic-book counterpart (a human liaison on alien affairs to SHIELD? When the hell was Nick Fury and SHIELD announced for this movie?), Ronan the Accuser, Yondu the Archer, a lead villainess of some sort, a female head (maybe literally...lolz) of Nova Corps....hey, if they're right, this is no longer "Guardians of the Galaxy," but "Cosmic Marvel: The Movie."

Wouldn't it make *more* sense if all this was just smokescreening to disguise something as simple as an expanded GOTG roster....? Michael Rooker as Rocket Raccoon; Lee Pace as Adam Warlock; Ophelia Lovibond as Phyla-Vell or Mantis; Glenn Close as Moondragon; Benicio del Toro as Thanos; Karen Gillan as Lady Death. This would explain why most of these actors are apparently being signed to multiple movies (i.e., a GOTG franchise), as opposed to WTF characters like Ronan, Collector and Rhomann Dey getting their own series.

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Old 06-06-2013, 09:28 AM   #105
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Exactly.
Wouldn't it make *more* sense if all this was just smokescreening to disguise something as simple as an expanded GOTG roster....? Michael Rooker as Rocket Raccoon; Lee Pace as Adam Warlock; Ophelia Lovibond as Phyla-Vell or Mantis; Glenn Close as Moondragon; Benicio del Toro as Thanos; Karen Gillan as Lady Death. This would explain why most of these actors are apparently being signed to multiple movies (i.e., a GOTG franchise), as opposed to WTF characters like Ronan, Collector and Rhomann Dey getting their own series.
While they may introduce a few additional characters over the course of the movie, my guess is that Gunn & Company will keep a tight roster for the initial introduction. Moondragon and Lady Death are strong possibilities to make an appearance due to their connection to Drax and Thanos, respectively, though I would suggest switching Ms. Gillian to the role of Moondragon and Ms. Close to Lady Death.

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Old 06-06-2013, 09:34 AM   #106
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Exactly.

Hell, I think the whole last few weeks could turn out to be an organized disinfo campaign. We've gotten anonymous "sources" who tell us that a movie about the Guardians of the Galaxy is now going to feature The Collector, Carina, a Rhomann Dey who sounds nothing like his comic-book counterpart (a human liaison on alien affairs to SHIELD? When the hell was Nick Fury and SHIELD announced for this movie?), Ronan the Accuser, Yondu the Archer, a lead villainess of some sort, a female head (maybe literally...lolz) of Nova Corps....hey, if they're right, this is no longer "Guardians of the Galaxy," but "Cosmic Marvel: The Movie."

Wouldn't it make *more* sense if all this was just smokescreening to disguise something as simple as an expanded GOTG roster....? Michael Rooker as Rocket Raccoon; Lee Pace as Adam Warlock; Ophelia Lovibond as Phyla-Vell or Mantis; Glenn Close as Moondragon; Benicio del Toro as Thanos; Karen Gillan as Lady Death. This would explain why most of these actors are apparently being signed to multiple movies (i.e., a GOTG franchise), as opposed to WTF characters like Ronan, Collector and Rhomann Dey getting their own series.
I wouldn't go that far to say that all of that is smokescreen. The only way Guardians of the Galaxy was NOT going to be Cosmic Marvel: the Movie was if they crash landed on Earth. If these guys are having superhero adventures in deep space of course they are going to flesh out the cast with other Cosmic characters.

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Old 06-06-2013, 01:31 PM   #107
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I wouldn't go that far to say that all of that is smokescreen. The only way Guardians of the Galaxy was NOT going to be Cosmic Marvel: the Movie was if they crash landed on Earth. If these guys are having superhero adventures in deep space of course they are going to flesh out the cast with other Cosmic characters.
Yes, it's definitely going to be a great cosmic journey; but Gunn is still going to need and want to create a tight, coherent story. What we've heard in the past few rumors is so all over the dartboard that the central focus of the Guardians seems to have been lost entirely. Nova Corps? Ronan and the Kree? The Collector? Yondu the Archer as a space pirate? Rhomann Dey acting as an intermediary for ETs in SHIELD? There's literally no room left to tell the Guardians story amidst all that.

Not to mention the fact that we're all still looking for casting news on principals like Rocket Raccoon, Groot and Thanos. (Because who here *honestly* believes that they're not going to have The Mad Titan in a movie that features Drax and Gamora definitely; and quite possibly Adam Warlock/Magus, Nebula, The Collector, and/or Lady Death as well? All of these characters' stories are intimately tied to Thanos.) Do you think they'd announce a whole boatload of totally extraneous characters' casting instead of casting for the actual principals of the movie?

Plus, where's any indication of anybody other than Guardians of the Galaxy in the concept art we've seen so far? Surely we would've caught at least a glimpse of Yondu, or the Nova Corps, or Ronan, or The Collector in the concept art if any of these rumors held water.

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Old 06-06-2013, 02:18 PM   #108
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Yes, it's definitely going to be a great cosmic journey; but Gunn is still going to need and want to create a tight, coherent story. What we've heard in the past few rumors is so all over the dartboard that the central focus of the Guardians seems to have been lost entirely. Nova Corps? Ronan and the Kree? The Collector? Yondu the Archer as a space pirate? Rhomann Dey acting as an intermediary for ETs in SHIELD? There's literally no room left to tell the Guardians story amidst all that.
Why are you assuming that all of these other characters have more screentime than the Guardians?

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Not to mention the fact that we're all still looking for casting news on principals like Rocket Raccoon, Groot and Thanos. (Because who here *honestly* believes that they're not going to have The Mad Titan in a movie that features Drax and Gamora definitely; and quite possibly Adam Warlock/Magus, Nebula, The Collector, and/or Lady Death as well? All of these characters' stories are intimately tied to Thanos.) Do you think they'd announce a whole boatload of totally extraneous characters' casting instead of casting for the actual principals of the movie?
I'm not that surprised we haven't heard about them. Casting Thanos is probably not Gunn's responsibility for one. If he is going to be king **** of the whole shared universe, I would think Feige would do it himself or maybe Joss Whedon. Rocket and Groot are probably just voices. They can do those later, and I don't know if I care who plays Groot. I certainly don't expect him to be marquee or anything.

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Plus, where's any indication of anybody other than Guardians of the Galaxy in the concept art we've seen so far? Surely we would've caught at least a glimpse of Yondu, or the Nova Corps, or Ronan, or The Collector in the concept art if any of these rumors held water.
I think Marvel's played pretty close to the vest and most concept art released has been minimal for most of their movies.

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Old 06-06-2013, 03:02 PM   #109
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Why are you assuming that all of these other characters have more screentime than the Guardians?
Because (a) they're marquee names, and (b) they're listed, according to these alleged rumorsmiths, as "lead villains"? Hell, they don't even need to have *more* screentime than the Guardians --- just the time necessary to spend on each one's backstory would eat up half the movie. Let's spend 5-10 minutes each developing (1) John C. Reilly, (2) Glenn Close, (3) Benicio del Toro, (4) Lee Pace, (5) Ophelia Lovibond, (6) Karen Gillan, (7) Michael Rooker. That's 35-70 minutes just trying to explain to confused audiences who the Nova Corps, Ronan and the Kree, Yondu and the *other* Guardians of the Galaxy (from the 31st century), and The Collector and His Lovely Daughter are. And that's *before* you've even introduced that Big Purple Guy from The Avengers Post-Credits, let alone The Guardians themselves.

But if these are actually other Guardians, then the time spent on each backstory can be significantly reduced. All that matters is that each is a charter member of our cosmic Avengers, and they all share a common goal; as opposed to Clash of the Plotlines.

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Old 06-06-2013, 03:31 PM   #110
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Because (a) they're marquee names, and (b) they're listed, according to these alleged rumorsmiths, as "lead villains"? Hell, they don't even need to have *more* screentime than the Guardians --- just the time necessary to spend on each one's backstory would eat up half the movie. Let's spend 5-10 minutes each developing (1) John C. Reilly, (2) Glenn Close, (3) Benicio del Toro, (4) Lee Pace, (5) Ophelia Lovibond, (6) Karen Gillan, (7) Michael Rooker. That's 35-70 minutes just trying to explain to confused audiences who the Nova Corps, Ronan and the Kree, Yondu and the *other* Guardians of the Galaxy (from the 31st century), and The Collector and His Lovely Daughter are. And that's *before* you've even introduced that Big Purple Guy from The Avengers Post-Credits, let alone The Guardians themselves.

But if these are actually other Guardians, then the time spent on each backstory can be significantly reduced. All that matters is that each is a charter member of our cosmic Avengers, and they all share a common goal; as opposed to Clash of the Plotlines.
Depending on who these people are playing you won't need backstory, besides we only need what is relevant.

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Old 06-06-2013, 10:19 PM   #111
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Here's DCMF's original post:



Sounds to me like DCMF is saying he knows up front that it's disinfo to be spread to CBM to keep the fanboys busy, while he remains mum on info that he can't reveal.
I think you're right.

"in exchange for something I can't say, they gave me this information"...

that leaves one of two possibilities, instead of giving away real info that is realllllllly important and needed to be kept low, they give him a lesser important thing

it's tricky

or it's that inorder to preserve the secret of whatever it is, they gave him missinformation to reveal, ending the discussion.

but it's interesting, because this information was given to him to reveal most likely BECAUSE there was something bigger going on...WHY they did this, that's what's interesting...this information was exchanged

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Old 06-06-2013, 11:26 PM   #112
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How does what you guys are saying make any sense? In exchange for his source giving him something, his source gave him something else? That's not how exchanges work. He had to have given something to his source. That's like paying for your groceries by stealing from the cash register. The other person gains nothing.

Also, why would he purposefully post false information? That would damage his reputation. It's one thing for Marvel themselves to spout false info to keep the fanboys at bay, it's another thing for a journalist to post false information (especially KNOWING it's false information). If BdT is in fact playing Thanos and DCMF knew it, then he never should have posted the story about him playing The Collector AT ALL. It's not a journalists job to lie on behalf of the studio. A journalists job is to try to be the first to post TRUE information.

What's so hard to believe about BdT playing The Collector?

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Old 06-07-2013, 12:38 AM   #113
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How does what you guys are saying make any sense? In exchange for his source giving him something, his source gave him something else? That's not how exchanges work. He had to have given something to his source. That's like paying for your groceries by stealing from the cash register. The other person gains nothing.

Also, why would he purposefully post false information? That would damage his reputation. It's one thing for Marvel themselves to spout false info to keep the fanboys at bay, it's another thing for a journalist to post false information (especially KNOWING it's false information). If BdT is in fact playing Thanos and DCMF knew it, then he never should have posted the story about him playing The Collector AT ALL. It's not a journalists job to lie on behalf of the studio. A journalists job is to try to be the first to post TRUE information.
From what I read of his post, DCMF seems to be saying that the source of the rumor may or may not be reliable. "This is coming from a Marvel Studios source who I first came in contact 2 years ago on bad terms... I'm sure most will remain skeptic, but I'm just the messenger."

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What's so hard to believe about BdT playing The Collector?
1. Benicio del Toro neither looks nor acts anything like the canonical Collector.
2. The Collector would be a very extraneous character to include in a story that seems to be about the Guardians of the Galaxy being on the run from cops and criminals trying to nab something valuable they have in their possession. Maybe "The Collector" wants it, too; but the canonical Collector is more of a kidnapper than a thief. He steals people, not objects.
3. How *the* hell could you possibly franchise an incredibly obscure and typically generic "Neutral Alien Elder With Godlike Powers" into Hollywood popcorn fare, with sequels and spinoffs already lined up?
4. It's Benicio Del Toro, one of Hollywood's perennial Oscar-baiters. They're gonna get him to play him....?
5. Thanos has still not been cast, nor announced. Yet Jim Starlin said he's in the movie. All hints point towards him being in the movie. How could Thanos *not* be in a movie that features (potentially) so many characters whose very existence is predicated on Thanos? Drax, Gamora, Adam Warlock, Nebula, Moondragon, Mar-Vell....Do you think they've got someone *even bigger* than Glenn Close, Benicio del Toro, John C. Reilly or Zoe Saldana waiting in the wings to nail the final "OMG HOLY **** " casting trophy?

The Collector is indescribably boring in the comics. BDT doesn't like to play boring characters. James Gunn doesn't like to film boring characters. None of it makes sense in a movie about Guardians of the Galaxy.

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Old 06-07-2013, 12:52 AM   #114
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I won't say it's completely impossible for the info I received to be disinformation, only because my source is associated with Marvel Studios (EDIT: and they could have used me to mislead everyone for the sake of the plot..maybe). However, the source that granted me permission to post the scoop said flat out that most people are speculating incorrectly that BDT is playing Thanos. I was only told that BDT is actually playing the Collector and nothing more.

I think Marvel will announce the cast very soon to coincide with the commencement of filming.

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Old 06-07-2013, 12:56 AM   #115
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[deleted] Said too much. Basically the source is affiliated with Marvel Studios.

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Old 06-07-2013, 07:18 AM   #116
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I won't say it's completely impossible for the info I received to be disinformation, only because my source is associated with Marvel Studios (EDIT: and they could have used me to mislead everyone for the sake of the plot..maybe). However, the source that granted me permission to post the scoop said flat out that most people are speculating incorrectly that BDT is playing Thanos. I was only told that BDT is actually playing the Collector and nothing more.

I think Marvel will announce the cast very soon to coincide with the commencement of filming.
Fair enough.

But how do you know that "The Collector" isn't just a disguise for Thanos? Maybe "The Collector" appears to be some alien interested in getting hold of whatever maguffin the Guardians have in their possession. Let's say it turns out to be an Infinity Gem. Let's say "The Collector" succeeds in getting it from the GOTG by movie's end, either by force or by negotiation. Let's say the final scenes show "The Collector" revealing himself to be You Know Who. Think Miranda Tate; John Blake; Mandarin. Wouldn't the studio/your source do everything in their power to keep (yet another) M. Night twist secret from the public?

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Old 06-07-2013, 07:42 AM   #117
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What's so hard to believe about BdT playing The Collector?
My introduction to The Collector came during the initial printing of the Korvac saga. After capturing his more powerful teammates, The Collector underestimated and was subsequently defeated by Hawkeye. He was then blasted out of existence by his son-in-law.

The Collector is a D-list antagonist, at best, and I can't see a reason why a high profile actor like BDT would want to play him, nor can I see Marvel wanting this character to appear in other features. GOTG looks like it is going to be a hoot, but it's a very risky, obscure property that needs a connection to the enormously successful Avengers film. And who better to connect the two properties than the smirking alien who non-posters to SuperheroHype were "Googling" long ago back in the summer of 2012? And which character is going to sell more action figures, lego playsets, t-shirts and backpacks?

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Old 06-07-2013, 07:54 AM   #118
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Fair enough.

But how do you know that "The Collector" isn't just a disguise for Thanos? Maybe "The Collector" appears to be some alien interested in getting hold of whatever maguffin the Guardians have in their possession. Let's say it turns out to be an Infinity Gem. Let's say "The Collector" succeeds in getting it from the GOTG by movie's end, either by force or by negotiation. Let's say the final scenes show "The Collector" revealing himself to be You Know Who. Think Miranda Tate; John Blake; Mandarin. Wouldn't the studio/your source do everything in their power to keep (yet another) M. Night twist secret from the public?
Believe it or not, I started considering all that last night after you mentioned how the scoop could have been disinformation. The first indication that the Collector was in GOTG was reported with the casting of Ophelia Lovibond last month. But I rechecked THR's article yesterday, and the bits about the Collector have now disappeared.

However, with the casting of John C. Reilly turning out to be true, I also rechecked HitFix's report. "Everyone in this film has a connection of some sort to Thanos, by design." The Collector "gathering artifacts and beings in the hopes of saving them from a foretold galactic annihilation" that is later revealed to be Thanos, fits easily with what we know.

The only thing I can think of that could contradict your theory... wouldn't hiding himself take away from the big bad mofo of a character he's supposed to be?

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Old 06-07-2013, 07:58 AM   #119
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The Collector is a D-list antagonist, at best, and I can't see a reason why a high profile actor like BDT would want to play him, nor can I see Marvel wanting this character to appear in other features.
MCU character =/= Comic character. I mean Killian was just a boring desk-jokey scientist who literally only existed for two pages, during which time he wrote a confession and committed suicide.

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Old 06-07-2013, 08:04 AM   #120
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Believe it or not, I started considering all that last night after you mentioned how the scoop could have been disinformation. The first indication that the Collector was in GOTG was reported with the casting of Ophelia Lovibond last month. But I rechecked THR's article yesterday, and the bits about the Collector have now disappeared.

However, with the casting of John C. Reilly turning out to be true, I also rechecked HitFix's report. "Everyone in this film has a connection of some sort to Thanos, by design." The Collector "gathering artifacts and beings in the hopes of saving them from a foretold galactic annihilation" that is later revealed to be Thanos, fits easily with what we know.

The only thing I can think of that could contradict your theory... wouldn't hiding himself take away from the big bad mofo of a character he's supposed to be?
The Avengers already showed Thanos to be a crafty manipulator who's content to direct the action from afar, rather than jump right into the fray and show off his godliness to the puny mortals (i.e., the exact opposite of Avengers-era Loki). It's safe to say he could continue that tactic in GOTG, and only pull out all the stops and go Full Thanos on the universe in TA2.

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Old 06-07-2013, 08:12 AM   #121
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Using other bad guys to do the dirty work seems more like Thanos' style. But I suppose it's possible (and likely) that the events of this movie takes place (or start out) before The Avengers (or the mid-credits teaser). And the disguise thing could maybe be part of his origin.

Hoping to hear some official stuff soon.

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Old 06-07-2013, 08:24 AM   #122
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MCU character =/= Comic character. I mean Killian was just a boring desk-jokey scientist who literally only existed for two pages, during which time he wrote a confession and committed suicide.
But Iron Man 3 was the first film after the Avengers and had RDJ's Tony Stark. The film didn't need a big name villain, though The Mandarin filled that role in the advertising of the film. GOTG could certainly use a character who had a short but memorable role in the third highest grossing film of all time.

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Old 06-07-2013, 09:16 AM   #123
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GOTG could certainly use a character who had a short but memorable role in the third highest grossing film of all time.
Sure. I didn't say Thanos wouldn't be in it.

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Old 06-07-2013, 09:16 AM   #124
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Default Re: The Benicio Del Toro Thread - Who Is He Playing?

But Thanos is a villian only comic fans know....

And IM3's 1.2 billion gross certainly didn't all come from fanboys

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Old 06-07-2013, 09:26 AM   #125
Mr. Dent
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Default Re: The Benicio Del Toro Thread - Who Is He Playing?

bump .

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