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Old 06-13-2013, 01:17 AM   #51
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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Originally Posted by fake View Post
Ok, I have to say I completely enjoyed the movie. The acting was spot on by everyone. Going in, I was worried that the shadow of the initial movies would hang over this one - I was wrong. Coming out of the movie I realized that I never even thought about comparing the two movies even once.

The performance by Cavill was brilliant. He owns the role completely. Shannon was not as good as expected. Costner and Crowe were both great. Amy Adams and Antje Trauea were both good.

All the criticisms I have heard of lack of character development for everyone apart from Superman do apply, but everyone is forgetting that
Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
the movie takes place in a timespan of 48 hours total for the main parties involved. And in this timeframe every single character almost gets a character moment. Perry White would rather stay and die than leave people behind. Steve Lombard is a perennial flirt, Lois is spunky, Colonel Hardy is for the greater good. Only Jenny doesn't get any defining trait.


The audience I watched it with applauded 5 times (apart from the ending which got the most applause especially when
Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
Clark Kent is introduced


The 5 instances were
Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:

1. The truck
2. First flight
3. Gravity beam smash
4. The smallville fight
and most surprisingly
5. when Superman killed Zod.


The final sequence of fights is just brilliantly done. They nailed Superman's flight.

The audience I watched it with loved it, could hear the talk in the lobby post the movie. Don't know if this will translate to all audiences everywhere, but this truly is a great beginning for a new Superman.


EDIT: The most important thing - the movie passes the Bechdel test. There are 2 specific conversations (both one lines, but we are talking letter of the law, not spirit of the law)
Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:

1. When Jenny tells Lois - "You have got to see this" regarding the news playing on the TV
2. When Faora tells Lois - "This is a breathing apparatus, it will help you adapt to the atmosphere on our ship". Wouldn't be surprised if this was just added to pass the test actually
Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
The Smallville fight, Metropolis fight, and the final scene got the most applause in my theater and that's saying something because they were pretty much into everything.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:19 AM   #52
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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Their upbringings also play a big if you look at it from the context of Man of Steel. 1) Superman - The Kryptonian who was raised with good morals and character by Pa and Ma Kent vs 2) General Zod - The Kryptonian who was predestined to a world of violence as a militant. It certainly does make you wonder...what would Kal-El be without his Yellow Sun powers in Krypton?

It also gives rise to the theme of free will vs. destiny.

Yes, I should have said, Nurture and Nature.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:19 AM   #53
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

Anyone else want to take an stab at guessing on why the reaction to this film is so divided?lol I mean from the looks of it, an majority of the people from the general audience have enjoyed the film, and there have been an good amount of people just gushing over it, whereas we have just as much seeing the film in the exact opposite.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:19 AM   #54
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

Could someone give me a time stamp for when zod gives his telecast. Like how far into the movie.

And I'm very disappointed to hear that Shannon didn't give it his all or wow. I'm sure ill still enjoy him but the guy blows me away when he is firing on all cylinders and I really wanted to see that.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:23 AM   #55
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

I told you guys. Trust the fans.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:24 AM   #56
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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Anyone else want to take an stab at guessing on why the reaction to this film is so divided?lol I mean from the looks of it, an majority of the people from the general audience have enjoyed the film, and there have been an good amount of people just gushing over it, whereas we have just as much seeing the film in the exact opposite.
Without seeing the film yet, I assume the film failed to live to expectations set by how they advertised the film (outside of the action) and what was said in interviews and to the press.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:24 AM   #57
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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I told you guys. Trust the fans.
This.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:31 AM   #58
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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Anyone else want to take an stab at guessing on why the reaction to this film is so divided?lol I mean from the looks of it, an majority of the people from the general audience have enjoyed the film, and there have been an good amount of people just gushing over it, whereas we have just as much seeing the film in the exact opposite.
I think one reason is because expectations are so high. Many seem to have wanted a deep, character driven "masterpiece" like TDK, but what they got was an entertaining popcorn flick. Perhaps some are being overly harsh and overstating the shortcomings? And perhaps others just enjoy it for what it is? I have not seen MOS but this is the impression I am getting.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:34 AM   #59
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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I told you guys. Trust the fans.
Should have trusted your judgment over the RT score. Sorry for that.

But seriously guys, you won't be disappointed. I have not read all reviews, so I can't actually speak to what the critics are finding bad in this movie, especially seeing how everyone gushed over Avengers.

The movie was an amazing ride. It builds and builds and builds for the first 100 odd minutes with a few action scenes thrown in to get us ready for the final 30 minutes where the movie just finds another gear.

To paraphrase (and change) a Roger Ebert quote: I loved this movie. Loved, loved, loved, loved, loved. Loved it.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:34 AM   #60
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

In regards to the issue of Superman's relateability, I am reminded of a classic post that has been quoted several times on this topic. I don't recall the original author but the basic idea is that Superman is in essence an adult fantasy whereas Batman, Spider-Man and other angst driven characters are more relateable to teenagers. Despite the outsider issues that come with being an alien and adopted, Superman is emotionally and in terms of upbringing an average person.

He is a good hearted person who was raised by a supportive family who is simply trying to share his talents with the world and live up to his potential. The woman he pines after is a co-worker who he is attracted to because of her personality and the fact that she shares the same core values, not because she is the hottest girl in school and beyond his reach or some femme fatale. Maybe that is the problem, Superman is so relateable that he is boring.

Psychologically speaking, characters like Batman and Iron Man are far more abnormal and fantastically. Despite being a huge Batman fan first and foremost in my teenage and university years, I find that now as an adult in the real world I relate to Superman more. I identify with the character more.

Furthermore, as a generally good person, I find Superman' generousity and goodness a compelling "flaw". I mean who hasn't been taken advantage of when trying to do the right thing but continue to do it anyways just because you know it is what you should do.


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Old 06-13-2013, 01:35 AM   #61
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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Originally Posted by fake View Post
Should have trusted your judgment over the RT score. Sorry for that.

But seriously guys, you won't be disappointed. I have not read all reviews, so I can't actually speak to what the critics are finding bad in this movie, especially seeing how everyone gushed over Avengers.

The movie was an amazing ride. It builds and builds and builds for the first 100 odd minutes with a few action scenes thrown in to get us ready for the final 30 minutes where the movie just finds another gear.

To paraphrase (and change) a Roger Ebert quote: I loved this movie. Loved, loved, loved, loved, loved. Loved it.
Glad to hear you loved it. At the moment, I currently have MOS in my top 5 favorite CBMs of all time. Where would you place it?

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:36 AM   #62
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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Or Peter Parker-lite.
The pinnacle of comic book emos.

Also will someone please answer Marvolo's question.

I'm curious as well.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:36 AM   #63
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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Originally Posted by herolee10 View Post
Anyone else want to take an stab at guessing on why the reaction to this film is so divided?lol I mean from the looks of it, an majority of the people from the general audience have enjoyed the film, and there have been an good amount of people just gushing over it, whereas we have just as much seeing the film in the exact opposite.
It's kind of hard to say. Snyder never gets any love from Rotten Tomatoes. I personally liked 300 and thought Watchmen was great, but both films were rated pretty low on that site.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:37 AM   #64
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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Glad to hear you loved it. At the moment, I currently have MOS in my top 5 favorite CBMs of all time. Where would you place it?
I am not good at ranking movies individually. Instead, they fall into clusters. This one is definitely in the top cluster.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:37 AM   #65
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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Anyone else want to take an stab at guessing on why the reaction to this film is so divided?lol I mean from the looks of it, an majority of the people from the general audience have enjoyed the film, and there have been an good amount of people just gushing over it, whereas we have just as much seeing the film in the exact opposite.
1) Some aren't superhero/CBM fans like us, so naturally they hate it. Especially when one posted a weird article about how the public is "done" with CBMs, pretty much imposing their hate on everyone.

2) Legitimate concerns such as storytelling, plot, character arcs especially when you have to realize that we are working with Snyder and Goyer, who quite frankly are hit-and-miss at their best.

3) Bipolar nature of critics: bash SR for lack of action/heart, bash MoS for too much plot/action.

4) Maybe we can't explain this...

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:43 AM   #66
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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The pinnacle of comic book emos.
And we got enough of that nonsense on Smallville.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:44 AM   #67
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

Fake, have you been watching all the spots and clips prior to seeing the film; and did that take away from your viewing experience at all?

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:44 AM   #68
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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And we got enough of that nonsense on Smallville.
How dare you!!!
Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:44 AM   #69
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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Anyone else want to take an stab at guessing on why the reaction to this film is so divided?lol I mean from the looks of it, an majority of the people from the general audience have enjoyed the film, and there have been an good amount of people just gushing over it, whereas we have just as much seeing the film in the exact opposite.
Critics don't care to see Superman kick butt for a good 30 minutes straight, but we're starving for it?

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:45 AM   #70
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

I cannot explain where this "Superman is Emo" or "Superman is brooding" talk is coming from either. We are never shown either Superman or Clark brooding and saying "Woe is me." Hell, he genuinely is shown having fun with his powers.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:46 AM   #71
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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I cannot explain where this "Superman is Emo" or "Superman is brooding" talk is coming from either. We are never shown either Superman or Clark brooding and saying "Woe is me." Hell, he genuinely is shown having fun with his powers.
Whilst being very naive and alien(no pun intended). I loved Cavill's portrayal, even if he didn't have that much to say.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:47 AM   #72
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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That's the thing, in terms of relatability to our modern times and problems Superman could very well be used an an allegory for America. This country was founded on virtuous principles, ones that many feel have been ignored for selfish reasons. Do we still get brownie points because we were founded one way but now act another? We've become the strongest world power physically, but are we using it for good? I find it very akin to Superman, and feel it could very much work well in a film if that relativity is explored.
Excellent point. I've said something similar for a while. People forget that Superman: The Movie also hit during a similarly dark and cynical time in American history (the aftermath of Vietnam, Watergate, Stagflation). If you really think about it, even STM treated Superman as an archaic character, a throwback to the greatest generation and Rockwell's America. Superman acted a reminder of virtues lost. As a result, if Man of Steel was well written and well made, I predicted in the past that it could have been another zeitgeist movie like The Dark Knight that it hit at just the right moment to resonate with audiences wanting to believe in hope again. Sadly, the film's critical response seems to indicate otherwise.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:47 AM   #73
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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Fake, have you been watching all the spots and clips prior to seeing the film; and did that take away from your viewing experience at all?
Nope. The tv spots and trailers are cut in a way that they show next to nothing in context. The team behind the trailers and tv spots deserves an award - they have shown a lot while showing next to nothing.

Most of the "BIG" moments are completely preserved. Can't wait to watch this again tomorrow at midnight.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:50 AM   #74
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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Nope. The tv spots and trailers are cut in a way that they show next to nothing in context. The team behind the trailers and tv spots deserves an award - they have shown a lot while showing next to nothing.

Most of the "BIG" moments are completely preserved. Can't wait to watch this again tomorrow at midnight.
Good to know! Thanks.

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Old 06-13-2013, 01:54 AM   #75
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - Part 81

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How dare you!!!
Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
"Lana won't like me if she knows the truth about me! Lana is all that matters! Lanaaaaaaaaaa!!!!"

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"
Hes much more of a working class superhero, which is why we ended the whole book with the image of a laboring Superman. Hes Everyman operating on a scifi Paul Bunyan scale." - Grant Morrison

"Self Portrait" By Batman
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