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Old 07-07-2013, 01:17 PM   #151
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

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Please don't call me dumb.

Shredder is literally the title of the leader of the foot clan. Several people have been the leader in the comics, including Saki's adopted daughter and even Raphael at one point.

Oroku Saki is usually played as a dumb revenge driven fool. He was killed off in the first story so if they wish to skip him as the head then I have no problem with it. I can see him killed off before the movie for sure. If they want to keep him more power to them. Depends on how much of an origin film this is to be. I am not going to give up on the film due to it as it isn't necessary to be faithful to the comics. Iconic doesn't always mean best.

And yes you can have others then Bruce Wayne be Batman... I've read several stories as such. Though he needs to be the first Batman.
I don't believe I personally called you dumb, more so the fact that the post on these forums (not just the TMNT one) are getting dumber and dumber as the days pass. I am aware that there have been other Batman's, but tell me that you don't say Batman and instantly think Bruce Wayne. I was excited when I heard that a new TMNT film was being made as my 3 year old is in love with them, then I started reading and the more I read the less excited I became. I am now to the point that I just shake my head every time something news related for this movie comes out.

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Old 07-07-2013, 05:13 PM   #152
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

Oroku Saki...Eric Sachs...that sound similar enough that Saki could've been a past incarnation of Sachs. I'd be okay with that angle. Give me my sci-fi and mysticism!

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Old 07-07-2013, 06:10 PM   #153
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

In IDW, wasn't Saki resurrected, while Yoshi and his sons reincarnated? Just a nitpick. If Saki is reincarnated, I think I would like that. I'm still getting used to the IDW setup, but it presents a fresh twist without trampling the core relationship between Saki and Yoshi.

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Old 07-07-2013, 09:23 PM   #154
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

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In IDW, wasn't Saki resurrected, while Yoshi and his sons reincarnated? Just a nitpick. If Saki is reincarnated, I think I would like that. I'm still getting used to the IDW setup, but it presents a fresh twist without trampling the core relationship between Saki and Yoshi.
Yeah, I think the IDW setup might be the best so far. It's not as silly as Yoshi's pet rat learning ninjutsu before becoming a mutant or as implausible as the whole "last animal you touched" thing with the ooze. I can probably take the reincarnation angle the most seriously of all the versions of the origin. Including Shredder as part of that only simplifies the whole conceit, which is a good thing. I'm all for it.

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Old 07-08-2013, 08:25 AM   #155
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

I liked both the pet rat and Yoshi-is-Splinter takes on the origin. The pet angle really has more of the what goes around comes around moral, but the Yoshi being mutated take makes it a little more personal. The reincarnation kind of melds the two, and throws in that bit of fantasy that really opens up a whole new world of possibilities and depth. I love that Donatello really struggles to grasp the concept when he and his family are tangible evidence of it. I think I've said before on this forum that, as I've grown older, Don has become perhaps my favorite turtle because there's a wealth of characterization there. Of the few redeeming qualities for Secret of the Ooze, Don's need to understand the accidental nature of their existence is my favorite.

Right now, it's the only hope for Fitchner being Shredder. The Ra's/Ducard switch and the Mandarin gag really cannot be played again.

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Old 07-08-2013, 02:18 PM   #156
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

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I don't believe I personally called you dumb, more so the fact that the post on these forums (not just the TMNT one) are getting dumber and dumber as the days pass. I am aware that there have been other Batman's, but tell me that you don't say Batman and instantly think Bruce Wayne. I was excited when I heard that a new TMNT film was being made as my 3 year old is in love with them, then I started reading and the more I read the less excited I became. I am now to the point that I just shake my head every time something news related for this movie comes out.
I'll be worried about it when they change the heroes rather then the villain.
Especially since they are obviously going the reincarnation route that IDW has made the new canon.

The reason why are posts are getting so stagnate and dumb is more the fact they aren't releasing any info and we are all going on rumors and a old crappy script that is hopefully nothing like the shooting script.

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Old 07-08-2013, 04:45 PM   #157
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

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I'll be worried about it when they change the heroes rather then the villain.
Especially since they are obviously going the reincarnation route that IDW has made the new canon.

The reason why are posts are getting so stagnate and dumb is more the fact they aren't releasing any info and we are all going on rumors and a old crappy script that is hopefully nothing like the shooting script.
Trust me, based on what I've seen in set photos alone, none of what made "Blue Door" script terrible is being retained.

Hopefully though, they are smart enough to keep what was fantastic about that script: The Turtles themselves. Their, and Splinter's, personalities and abilities (in strength, fighting, and acrobatically) were excellently portrayed. And they also did fantastic portraying the relationship between the 4 brothers.

And hell, even Bebop and Rocksteady, despite getting little development, were perfected. They would've appeared just as we know them, getting their ass kicked by the severely outsized Splinter, whom is basically like Yoda, no less.


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Old 07-08-2013, 06:22 PM   #158
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

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Trust me, based on what I've seen in set photos alone, none of what made "Blue Door" script terrible is being retained.
That's just plain wrong. We have photos of the turtles being led in chains by the Foot and even though there's no photos we know for a fact they've filmed an SUV chase on a snowy hill.

That's two very specific scenes from the leaked script that are present in the movie. Add in a a white Shredder and a very military looking Foot that certainly suggests that there's more from that leaked script.

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Hopefully though, they are smart enough to keep what was fantastic about that script: The Turtles themselves. Their, and Splinter's, personalities and abilities (in strength, fighting, and acrobatically) were excellently portrayed. And they also did fantastic portraying the relationship between the 4 brothers.

And hell, even Bebop and Rocksteady, despite getting little development, were perfected. They would've appeared just as we know them, getting their ass kicked by the severely outsized Splinter, whom is basically like Yoda, no less.
Forgive me but you're the first person I've encountered that liked anything from that script. I've long come to terms that the script is the main basis of the movie despite what Bay says but to be honest I don't think there was anything from that script worth keeping. Personaly the whole 'vibe' and 'tone' of it was wrong for me. The turtles were described as their personalities ie: Leo was the leader, Mike the goof and so on but I never got that from what they said or how the acted.

The action scenes seemed wrong headed. The turtles have pretty much done every genre and I'm big fan of their sci fi based stories but a large part of their appeal is that they are more street level. Even in the Fred Wolf cartoon the it was cool to see the Technodrome active but it was never for long. Big scenes of the military led by Splinter against Krang's forces don't really fit with TMNT in fact it's funny you make the comparison to Yoda as it felt like Yoda leading the clones at the Battle of Geonosis. I have visions of any action sequences with Splinter to be reminiscent of Yoda vs Dooku which was good for a laugh but not what I would want for Splinter but with the casting of Woodburn I'd put money that's what we're going to get.

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Old 07-08-2013, 06:55 PM   #159
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

Where can I get this script?

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Old 07-08-2013, 07:13 PM   #160
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

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That's just plain wrong. We have photos of the turtles being led in chains by the Foot and even though there's no photos we know for a fact they've filmed an SUV chase on a snowy hill.

That's two very specific scenes from the leaked script that are present in the movie. Add in a a white Shredder and a very military looking Foot that certainly suggests that there's more from that leaked script.

Forgive me but you're the first person I've encountered that liked anything from that script. I've long come to terms that the script is the main basis of the movie despite what Bay says but to be honest I don't think there was anything from that script worth keeping. Personaly the whole 'vibe' and 'tone' of it was wrong for me. The turtles were described as their personalities ie: Leo was the leader, Mike the goof and so on but I never got that from what they said or how the acted.

The action scenes seemed wrong headed. The turtles have pretty much done every genre and I'm big fan of their sci fi based stories but a large part of their appeal is that they are more street level. Even in the Fred Wolf cartoon the it was cool to see the Technodrome active but it was never for long. Big scenes of the military led by Splinter against Krang's forces don't really fit with TMNT in fact it's funny you make the comparison to Yoda as it felt like Yoda leading the clones at the Battle of Geonosis. I have visions of any action sequences with Splinter to be reminiscent of Yoda vs Dooku which was good for a laugh but not what I would want for Splinter but with the casting of Woodburn I'd put money that's what we're going to get.
Have you even read the script? or are you, like the VAST majority, going off of what you've heard about it?

Because while I will give you the turtles being captured by Shredder and the Foot, it happens much differently than described in the script.

Also, Splinter did NOT lead the military against Kraang's forces in the original script. He never even interacts with the military.
Not once.

Also, where in the blue hell has a SUV chase on a snowy hill been reported since filming began?

I beg you to link me.

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Where can I get this script?
I can pm it to you.


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Old 07-08-2013, 09:08 PM   #161
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

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Have you even read the script? or are you, like the VAST majority, going off of what you've heard about it?
Nope. I downloaded the pdf when it was up on that TANT site. Granted it's been a while and I zoned out a few times when reading but I remember some parts pretty vividly and not for the right reasons.

I might chance another read at some point to refresh my mind on details but if I recall even the one or two things I could roll with I'd prefer to not be there in the final picture.

Quote:
Because while I will give you the turtles being captured by Shredder and the Foot, it happens much differently than described in the script.
I'd say the scene we saw being filmed was definitely inspired by the opening scene. Obviously the big difference is that it seemingly happens later in the movie whereas in the script they are still playing for suspense so we don't see the turtles.

Quote:
Also, Splinter did NOT lead the military against Kraang's forces in the original script. He never even interacts with the military.
Not once.
Again I'll probably have refresh my mind but my point still stands about the kind of battles in the script as well as the whole Splinter being like Yoda.

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Also, where in the blue hell has a SUV chase on a snowy hill been reported since filming began?

I beg you to link me.
Here ya go

http://adirondackdailyenterprise.com....html?nav=5008

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Old 07-08-2013, 09:08 PM   #162
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

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I can pm it to you.
I'd like to read it too out of curiosity.

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Old 07-08-2013, 09:40 PM   #163
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

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I can pm it to you.
Please.

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Old 07-15-2013, 02:35 PM   #164
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

So Kraang will actually be in this?? Nice.

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Old 07-15-2013, 05:19 PM   #165
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Can you pm me as well, I would like to not only refresh my mind but keep it as a reference to see what stayed and what was changed.

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Old 07-15-2013, 09:39 PM   #166
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

so shredder is a white businessman....

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Old 07-15-2013, 10:25 PM   #167
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

First IM3 now this.Can I ask an honest question....

Is hollywood suddenly afraid of having an Asian villain?

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Old 07-16-2013, 12:00 AM   #168
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First IM3 now this.Can I ask an honest question....

Is hollywood suddenly afraid of having an Asian villain?
Heck, they pander to the Chinese a lot.

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Old 07-16-2013, 01:44 AM   #169
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First IM3 now this.Can I ask an honest question....

Is hollywood suddenly afraid of having an Asian villain?
The chinese and japanese markets are a hard target to hit when it comes to films.

Many films don't get approved for release there.

That is very problematic for studios because those 2 markets can produce a **** ton of money.

So they have to play nice, in anyway they can. Such as, not having a japanese or chinese character portrayed in a negative light. Though, it still depends.

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Old 07-16-2013, 04:17 AM   #170
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

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The chinese and japanese markets are a hard target to hit when it comes to films.

Many films don't get approved for release there.
Uh, I don't get all this stupid "Oh don't you dare portray a Chinese, Japanese, Nazi, Jew villain". So all the villains should be americanized generic caucasians? How is it OK to portray American villains all the time? Isn't this a form of racism towards Americans then?

And I don't blame only Hollywood, I know China and Japan don't allow hollywood to portray it's people as villains but I find it stupid nonetheless. All countries consist of people who act noble and those who commit acts of violence. If the Mandarin in IM3 was of a Chinese race, no one would assume that all Chinese people are dangerous and evil like him. It's simple really.


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Old 07-16-2013, 12:10 PM   #171
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

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Uh, I don't get all this stupid "Oh don't you dare portray a Chinese, Japanese, Nazi, Jew villain". So all the villains should be americanized generic caucasians? How is it OK to portray American villains all the time? Isn't that racist too for America?

And I don't blame only Hollywood, I know China and Japan don't allow hollywood to portray it's people as villains but I find it stupid nonetheless. All countries consist of people who act noble and those who commit acts of violence. If the Mandarin in IM3 was of a Chinese race, no one would assume that all Chinese people are dangerous and evil like him. It's simple really.
completely agree with you

the logic behind it is ridiculous and beyond stupid

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Old 07-16-2013, 03:50 PM   #172
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I agree as well.But it's like Spidey said.There's too much money to be made in China than to risk "offending" them.I'm sure out of the billions of people in China,not one of them are criminal.

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Old 07-16-2013, 07:28 PM   #173
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Funny thing though is that this whitewashing of Asian chaaracters still offends groups like Manaa and Racebending because those roles could be a big thing for an Asian/Asian-American actor.

Never mind that The Wolverine movie has Asian villains in it.

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Old 07-17-2013, 09:52 AM   #174
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Default Re: William Fitchner IS The Shredder

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I agree as well.But it's like Spidey said.There's too much money to be made in China than to risk "offending" them.I'm sure out of the billions of people in China,not one of them are criminal.
Shredder is Japanese, not Chinese. China is a totally different country.

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Old 07-17-2013, 10:51 AM   #175
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Shredder is Japanese, not Chinese. China is a totally different country.
But I named China AND Japan as those problem areas.

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