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Old 07-24-2013, 03:16 PM   #151
Mightyally
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

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I would just HATE HATE to see Ultron created, then defeated in one movie, I think it's a waste and Ultron is a villain that I ALWAYS thought should have a multiple film presence before his climax
I didnīt mean that jaqua

I just meant that since he isnīt going to be in the third movie, itīs good that they are connecting Gotg and other movies that makes Ultronīs reappearence possible.
As you said, it would be bad if he was created and defeated in one movie. So I agree!

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Old 07-24-2013, 06:44 PM   #152
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

The kneejerk reaction is that Ultron must be some modern creation. An AI gone rogue, so either Tony Stark or SHIELD or somebody else developed it to "protect the world" or some such.

But Ultron might not be a modern invention at all. In fact, it could've been developed in WWII. By HYDRA. By a guy who is intimately familiar with AI and robots, since he, you know, becomes one himself. Arnim Zola.

That's why they keep saying that CATWS is the lynchpin of Phase II, and the movie that most informs AoU. *Not* IM3. It's all about Cap and his past catching up to him in the present. That's what they keep trying to hammer into us, telling us how there's going to be a major change in the MCU and all that at the end of CATWS.

Think Cap. Think Zola. Think HYDRA. Think Sleepers. Think Red Skull's return.

Plus, Ultron is a dorky name that belongs to the Golden Age. WWII would be the right frame of reference for that kind of naivete. Not the sort of thing that the sardonic Tony Stark would come up with.

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Old 07-24-2013, 06:47 PM   #153
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON



as for the name, they probably go for an acronym, something like...

Universal Large Threat Response Only Network

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Old 07-24-2013, 06:51 PM   #154
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

Didnīt Hugo Weaving a.k.a. RS say that he wasnīt going to play RS no more?

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Old 07-24-2013, 06:58 PM   #155
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

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No disrespect of course, but I think this is horrible.

To be flat out honest, if they do that, I would put it in the galactus cloud category
Yes, it is horrible, and I said above that this isn't something I want to see. I'm not putting forward this suggestion as a creative way to bring Ultron to the big screen. I'm saying that this is something that could easily happen given Hollywood's way of humanising certain characters to make them more relatable to audiences.

Ultron would be a pure CGI creation with no expression and highly impersonal as a character. Marvel might find such a character difficult to sustain as the lead villain for an entire movie in that form.

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Old 07-24-2013, 07:31 PM   #156
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

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The thing is that Whedon or at least Marvel Studios will probably humanise Ultron, otherwise the main actors are playing against a CGI creation or prop. That makes it too impersonal, especially for a main villain. Maybe he'll have an outer skin like Terminator and only when that's burnt off will it reveal the classic Ultron look.

Of course, that goes against Ultron's very philosophy as he hates humans, but it fits very much into Hollywood's mentality. Even in the Avengers, they had Loki as the human face of their enemies, with the Chitauri just faceless supporting characters.

And in Star Trek First Contact they gave the Borg a human face (in the form of a Borg Queen) for Picard to interact with, otherwise it would just be these anonymous drones.
I don't think they'll go so far as to change Ultron's basic silhouette. I believe the complaint was that Ultron only has one facial expression. It's like acting against a prop in that way. At least guys in CGI suits have facial expressions, y'know? That's something they'll have to wrestle with, either by doing the whole sexy Jan/Jocasta emissary of Ultron (which would be kind of cool) or perhaps playing with the light from the helmet (different colors? Video?) You really don't want that Power Rangers effect where the voice feels totally disconnected from the body.

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Old 07-24-2013, 07:39 PM   #157
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

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You really don't want that Power Rangers effect where the voice feels totally disconnected from the body.
Haha! No we do not. Itīs very interesting how they will manage to do that. I think they will use some red light that works like an eq or something.

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Old 07-24-2013, 08:31 PM   #158
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

Eh, what if it's someone doing Mo-Cap, for that reason?

I want to see Ultron, not a robot that calls itself Ultron. No need to change his face cause he doesn't have an expression. They are actors. They are fighting a robot without expression. Thats how it should be.

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Old 07-24-2013, 08:48 PM   #159
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

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Eh, what if it's someone doing Mo-Cap, for that reason?

I want to see Ultron, not a robot that calls itself Ultron. No need to change his face cause he doesn't have an expression. They are actors. They are fighting a robot without expression. Thats how it should be.
Whedon's already said that he's going to change that though.

And Marvel could easily approve the change. After all, they seemed to approve it for Toybiz Marvel Legends, first with this dog face design:



That turned out not to be the final head sculpt though (because fans were enraged at the change).

And then this rabbit ear design:



Both heads fell short of the mark, and both sported that awful body. Even his glider had a head that looked more like classic Ultron.

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Old 07-24-2013, 09:08 PM   #160
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

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Whedon's already said that he's going to change that though.

And Marvel could easily approve the change. After all, they seemed to approve it for Toybiz Marvel Legends, first with this dog face design:



That turned out not to be the final head sculpt though (because fans were enraged at the change).

And then this rabbit ear design:



Both heads fell short of the mark, and both sported that awful body. Even his glider had a head that looked more like classic Ultron.
He said Ultron would go through multiple iterations, didn't he? He didn't say anything regarding Ultron's physical appearance, did he?

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Old 07-24-2013, 09:12 PM   #161
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

He said that we are going to see him evolve I think. I always see him taking adamantium or vibranium and the making a supersuit out of it

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Old 07-24-2013, 09:29 PM   #162
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

yeah, especially since the helmet turned into an Ultron head..idk about his body, but for his face, I am sure it will be distinctly Ultron.

I mean, if there is one character you can bring to the big screen without changing basically any of its appearance from the comics, it's Ultron

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Old 07-24-2013, 09:38 PM   #163
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

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Originally Posted by cherokeesam View Post
The kneejerk reaction is that Ultron must be some modern creation. An AI gone rogue, so either Tony Stark or SHIELD or somebody else developed it to "protect the world" or some such.

But Ultron might not be a modern invention at all. In fact, it could've been developed in WWII. By HYDRA. By a guy who is intimately familiar with AI and robots, since he, you know, becomes one himself. Arnim Zola.

That's why they keep saying that CATWS is the lynchpin of Phase II, and the movie that most informs AoU. *Not* IM3. It's all about Cap and his past catching up to him in the present. That's what they keep trying to hammer into us, telling us how there's going to be a major change in the MCU and all that at the end of CATWS.

Think Cap. Think Zola. Think HYDRA. Think Sleepers. Think Red Skull's return.

Plus, Ultron is a dorky name that belongs to the Golden Age. WWII would be the right frame of reference for that kind of naivete. Not the sort of thing that the sardonic Tony Stark would come up with.
Red Skull is not returning in C:TWS. It defies any bit of logic presented to us in the MCU so far.

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Old 07-24-2013, 09:41 PM   #164
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

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yeah, especially since the helmet turned into an Ultron head..idk about his body, but for his face, I am sure it will be distinctly Ultron.

I mean, if there is one character you can bring to the big screen without changing basically any of its appearance from the comics, it's Ultron

Im fine with him being the same in the face. I just donīt want the voice to feel disconnected from the body.
He doesnīt need to have an expression, just something that indicates that he is creating sound.

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Old 07-24-2013, 09:54 PM   #165
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

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He said Ultron would go through multiple iterations, didn't he? He didn't say anything regarding Ultron's physical appearance, did he?
Whedon basically said that some things need to be changed for the big screen because Ultron always looks like ... and then he did an impersonation of Ultron's mouth and said how it's always like that butterfly shape (he didn't use those words to describe it). So at the very least, I'm assuming he wants a more movable mouth that looks like it's talking, and beyond that, that he wants more expression in his face.

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Old 07-24-2013, 10:00 PM   #166
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

Wouldnīt just an eq of red light that shows Ultronīs voice pattern be sufficient?
We arenīt going to be able to read his lips so it doesnīt have to be better than that.
They could just make his head move around so that you see to whom he speaks.
Expressions can be made out of shoulders/neck->moving head/adjusting chest/arms etc.

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Old 07-24-2013, 10:05 PM   #167
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

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Whedon basically said that some things need to be changed for the big screen because Ultron always looks like ... and then he did an impersonation of Ultron's mouth and said how it's always like that butterfly shape (he didn't use those words to describe it). So at the very least, I'm assuming he wants a more movable mouth that looks like it's talking, and beyond that, that he wants more expression in his face.
Not gunna lie. I think that's beyond stupid. That would totally kill the character for me.

I want to see freakin Ultron, not the terminator.

His mouth the way it is, with that deep opening, as you said, butterfly shape..literally my favorite feature about him. take that away, and I will honestly have a hard time looking at him

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Old 07-24-2013, 10:12 PM   #168
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

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Not gunna lie. I think that's beyond stupid. That would totally kill the character for me.

I want to see freakin Ultron, not the terminator.

His mouth the way it is, with that deep opening, as you said, butterfly shape..literally my favorite feature about him. take that away, and I will honestly have a hard time looking at him
Well if he does change the mouth it will change the essence of his look. That butterfly mouth (with the crackling energy) and the Jack O'Lantern eyes are his most distinct features.

But then, if Whedon reasoned the same way with Iron Man, he might not have his distinct face plate that doesn't show any expression either. Of course, we have the inside of the helmet shots of RDJ, but there wouldn't be the same thing for Ultron.

Although, I would almost prefer that they give Ultron some kind of human persona/ face that they can occasionally refer to with inside of the helmet shots just so that they can keep his expressionless face and butterfly mouth intact. This "human persona" for the sake of the audiences and the sake of expression can just be some kind of manifestation but isn't a real person.

That kind of concession I would accept just so we get an accurate translation of Ultron's look.

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Old 07-24-2013, 10:13 PM   #169
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

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take that away, and I will honestly have a hard time looking at him
Haha! I also think they should keep the mouth and I refer to my previous post where that is possible as well as not making us feel that the voice is disconnected from the body.

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Old 07-24-2013, 10:34 PM   #170
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

yeah I agree lol this whole thing is just...ahh

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Old 07-24-2013, 11:30 PM   #171
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

Do we think that Ultron will be a serious physical threat? Loki was more of an intellectual/mind games villain, so it would be something different.

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Old 07-24-2013, 11:36 PM   #172
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Do we think that Ultron will be a serious physical threat? Loki was more of an intellectual/mind games villain, so it would be something different.
Ultron is the definition of a physical threat...

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Old 07-24-2013, 11:46 PM   #173
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Excellent, Hulk won't be smashing this villain.

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Old 07-25-2013, 12:51 AM   #174
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

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Haha! No we do not. Itīs very interesting how they will manage to do that. I think they will use some red light that works like an eq or something.
I think an AI version of IM's inside-the-helmet-cam would be interesting, the way Ultron analyzes things could be kinda cool. I would dramatically prefer the EQ to the moving mouth, that's for sure.

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Eh, what if it's someone doing Mo-Cap, for that reason?

I want to see Ultron, not a robot that calls itself Ultron. No need to change his face cause he doesn't have an expression. They are actors. They are fighting a robot without expression. Thats how it should be.
There is a need. He's a character that needs to emote, and he has a body, and a face. He has to have an emotional effect on the audience and the characters around him. That is dramatically diminished if he is static in a dynamic world. We can tell the emotional storytelling to jump in a lake because we love our comics, sure, but the need is there.

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Old 07-25-2013, 01:51 AM   #175
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Default Re: The Design & Origin of ULTRON

The reason why Marc Webb didn't give The Lizard a crocodile snout was that he wanted Rhys Ifans to still be able to emote with his face even after the transformation. The reason why the GG costume in SM 1 sucked was that Willem Dafoe is such an expressive actor and the stupid Power Rangers reject costume didn't let him do that (he was creepier without the armor). I agree with DrCosmic that Ultron needs to be able to emote, it will make him a more interesting villain, as well as more menacing.

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