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Old 07-25-2013, 11:00 AM   #976
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Default Re: The Avengers 2! The Official News and Speculation Thread - Upgrade section 4

About something another poster bought up, in Joss's quote ' You don't need A Pym to create AN Ultron',

what if this isn't the 'first' Ultron? Like, in the movie Ant-man, Hank Pym is suppose to be old, so perhaps he worked with Howard Stark and a bunch of projects together or on his own with Starks funding, and he actually created the first Ultron prototype so to speak, and this one, in Avengers could be like version 2.0 or 6.0 or something.

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Old 07-25-2013, 11:08 AM   #977
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Why is it dumb?
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Old 07-25-2013, 11:08 AM   #978
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Jennifer Lawrece would be amazing (though maybe a bit uninspired). I don't see it happening, though I would love it.

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Old 07-25-2013, 11:13 AM   #979
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarlettess View Post
About something another poster bought up, in Joss's quote ' You don't need A Pym to create AN Ultron',

what if this isn't the 'first' Ultron? Like, in the movie Ant-man, Hank Pym is suppose to be old, so perhaps he worked with Howard Stark and a bunch of projects together or on his own with Starks funding, and he actually created the first Ultron prototype so to speak, and this one, in Avengers could be like version 2.0 or 6.0 or something.
As much as I would like to see that happening, I don't think Whedon was trying to be cryptic. I believe he was just saying that Pym won't be involved with the creation of Ultron at all and that Pym isn't necessary for the existence of the character. I could be wrong. I hope I'm wrong haha

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Old 07-25-2013, 11:14 AM   #980
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Wouldn't that enter in conflict with her Mystique character for another Marvel/Fox property?

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Old 07-25-2013, 11:15 AM   #981
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And playing Katniss in the HG movie, yeah it's not going to be her. I recommend Kseina Solo (Kenzi from Lost Girl).

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Old 07-25-2013, 11:16 AM   #982
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Default Re: The Avengers 2! The Official News and Speculation Thread - Upgrade section 4

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Originally Posted by Scarlettess View Post
About something another poster bought up, in Joss's quote ' You don't need A Pym to create AN Ultron',

what if this isn't the 'first' Ultron? Like, in the movie Ant-man, Hank Pym is suppose to be old, so perhaps he worked with Howard Stark and a bunch of projects together or on his own with Starks funding, and he actually created the first Ultron prototype so to speak, and this one, in Avengers could be like version 2.0 or 6.0 or something.
1. Can someone show me Whedon saying this?
2. Do we know Hank Pym is gonna be old? Is it confirmed? Also source please.

I am just interested in finding all the interviews I can get a hold off. I also want to be certain of whatīs confirmed and not.
so itīs not that I donīt believe you or anything.

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Old 07-25-2013, 11:19 AM   #983
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Default Re: The Avengers 2! The Official News and Speculation Thread - Upgrade section 4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarlettess View Post
About something another poster bought up, in Joss's quote ' You don't need A Pym to create AN Ultron',

what if this isn't the 'first' Ultron? Like, in the movie Ant-man, Hank Pym is suppose to be old, so perhaps he worked with Howard Stark and a bunch of projects together or on his own with Starks funding, and he actually created the first Ultron prototype so to speak, and this one, in Avengers could be like version 2.0 or 6.0 or something.
Works for me.

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Old 07-25-2013, 11:19 AM   #984
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We know that Pym will be in the Ant-Man movie (Wright confirmed it himself a couple of days ago). Beyond that, we know nothing else for sure (we don't even know if Wasp will be in the AM movie, I REALLY hope that she is, but we don't know).

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Old 07-25-2013, 12:09 PM   #985
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Default Re: The Avengers 2! The Official News and Speculation Thread - Upgrade section 4

Jennifer Lawrence would be awesome, but I don't really believe that rumor.

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Old 07-25-2013, 12:16 PM   #986
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Its not a rumor. Let's move on.

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At the risk of being totally offensive...there's a quote from Ghandi about Christianity that can be reappropriated for this.

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Old 07-25-2013, 12:20 PM   #987
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Default Re: The Avengers 2! The Official News and Speculation Thread - Upgrade section 4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarlettess View Post
About something another poster bought up, in Joss's quote ' You don't need A Pym to create AN Ultron',

what if this isn't the 'first' Ultron? Like, in the movie Ant-man, Hank Pym is suppose to be old, so perhaps he worked with Howard Stark and a bunch of projects together or on his own with Starks funding, and he actually created the first Ultron prototype so to speak, and this one, in Avengers could be like version 2.0 or 6.0 or something.
It was me

as I said, what I think will happen is that we may find out howard stark and a colleague were working on this AI, or perhaps, Stark was helping his colleague with this AI. Brain patterns were used, and Since Stark new his son was close to his butler, he used Jarvis brain patterns on an early version of this AI, branching off a part of it so Tony can still talk to Jarvis. (and then later use as his own person AI from a professional stand point) The AI goes nuts, kills Pym in the past. It goes dormant, puts itself with AIM, and works with and manipulated the events of Ironman 3, cause
he needed bodies to be built for him. It becomes known by shield, stark discovers that this AI is what J.A.R.V.I.S came from, and his dad helped create it, so he wants to use it, as others have said, as a sort of global defense system. Cap and Fury disagree, hence the whole "going rogue" thing, but Stark and company do it anyway. tries to reprogram it, gives it control of many things through out the world, and stark builds it his body, and it goes nuts. And creates it's age. tony's responsibility. It's personal for Tony because one, it's his fault for trusting it, JARVIS has a connection to it, and it's something his dad created. Pym is absent because he's dead

Then we see in ant-man Pym's struggles with this AI, and his eventual death.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyally View Post
1. Can someone show me Whedon saying this?
2. Do we know Hank Pym is gonna be old? Is it confirmed? Also source please.

I am just interested in finding all the interviews I can get a hold off. I also want to be certain of whatīs confirmed and not.
so itīs not that I donīt believe you or anything.
Not sure age, but Mr. Wright did say something about flashbacks, and whedon's comments

http://io9.com/joss-whedon-no-you-do...tron-860162779

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You'll have to wait and and see, but you don't need a Pym to create an Ultron.

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Old 07-25-2013, 12:23 PM   #988
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I may be late to the party but I am extremely disappointed that Hank Pym will not be the creator of Ultron in the MCU. As a long-time Avengers fan, it just feels wrong. In the comics world Ultron and Pym are synonomous - kind of like Batman and the Joker. Ultron may be a threat requiring all of the Avengers but, for Pym, it's personal. You can argue that the movie universe is different all you want but it cannot be argued that making such a change is not a huge departure from the source material. Additionally, anyone who doesn't recognize Pym's role in the formation and evolution of the Avengers as a team has little to no knowledge of the property. My guess is that the vast majority of the commentors who look down upon Pym and/or Wasp are not really familiar with either. To say "who cares about Pym" like it's a definitive statement is foolhardy. Who cares about Pym? The fans who have stuck by the property long enough to keep it alive for Whedon to adapt, that's who.

Show some respect for the opinions of others. Hating the decision to replace Pym as Ultron's creator does not make someone a "whiney fanboy" and telling others to "get over it" does not make you better/more rational than them. It's more than okay to be disappointed by this news but it's important not to over-react... this goes for both sides of the argument.

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Old 07-25-2013, 12:27 PM   #989
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Default Re: The Avengers 2! The Official News and Speculation Thread - Upgrade section 4

Thanks, most helpful Jaqua!

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Old 07-25-2013, 12:32 PM   #990
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Not to further add to the complaints or stir the conflicting opinions on the board but excluding Pym from the film because it would make the story "too complicated" is stupid. Why can't they introduce him as brilliant scientist (freelance or with S.H.I.E.L.D.) who creates the Ultron A.I. and is consulted on how to defeat it. They could even hold off on the whole Ant-Man/Giant Man thing until Wright's movie if the plot has too many new heroes and powers to explain. Pym doesn't need to suit up - his intelligence is what makes him special. And to everyone saying that the team has too many scientists - that's an easily fixable problem through specialization. Tony Stark doesn't have to be the best in every field. He could be the hardware guy and Pym could be the software guy, so to speak. Banner can deal with organics.

How many times in the comics has a problem been so large that it required Stark, Richards, Pym, and even Banner to solve?

Edit: As for introducing new characters in the film - Hawkeye was (practically) new to Avengers. It takes maybe 10-15 minutes to introduce a new character, especially if you do the most of the exploration/growth in another film (like Ant-Man).

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Old 07-25-2013, 12:32 PM   #991
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Default Re: The Avengers 2! The Official News and Speculation Thread - Upgrade section 4

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Show some respect for the opinions of others. Hating the decision to replace Pym as Ultron's creator does not make someone a "whiney fanboy" and telling others to "get over it" does not make you better/more rational than them. It's more than okay to be disappointed by this news but it's important not to over-react... this goes for both sides of the argument.
True dat.

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Old 07-25-2013, 12:45 PM   #992
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My final rant (and I'll get off this soapbox, I promise) is on the rumor that Stark will create Ultron. While this seems to be the most likely scenario, it is incredibly lazy on the part of the film-makers and shows what could soon be a huge problem in the movie universe. Tony Stark, or really Robert Downey Junior, has become way too important to the MCU. Let me preface by saying that I love Iron Man as a character (been reading the solo comics for nine years now) and Downey's portrayl of the character throughout Phase 1. However, Iron Man 3 seemed to be a showcase not for Iron Man, or even Tony Stark, but for Downey Junior. The franchise has made a killing and Marvel is equating its success solely with the actor and his portrayl and not on the character and his place within the universe. I never thought I'd say this, but I am getting so sick of Iron Man and his increasing role as the center of the cinematic universe. Having him be responsible for Ultron is only making the situation worse - this is supposed to be Avengers II not Iron Man 4 (or Iron Man and friends). Fox went overboard with the popularity of a single character and did this with Wolverine. I'm really hoping Marvel does not do the same with Stark.

Iron Man is one of my favorite comic characters (top five easily) but you can have too much of a good thing. Replacing Pym with Stark (which I'm 99% sure they'll do) is throwing off the power balance and some fans are beginning to feel burnt-out.

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Old 07-25-2013, 12:48 PM   #993
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It would be great if someone could post a word for word transcript of what Joss Whedon said about the Avengers 2: Age of Ultron movie. So that it wont get misinterpreted or misconstrued or miss-something or other than what he actually said and intended it to mean. I have heard things like Ant Man wont be in Avengers, its a new origin for Ultron, and so on. But I wasn't there. So I have no clue what he actually said.

I also really hope that I can read between the lines that Hank Pym may not be an Avenger in the film or even Ant Man yet, but would still be the creator of Ultron and still be part of the film somehow.
I can go into a long song and dance about why I think Pym and Ultron are inseperable and I'd actually love to. But I wont, unless you want me to.
But I hope they do something like, if Pym isn't an Avenger or Ant Man yet, he is still in the film as much as that human scientist Eric Selvig (name?) from Avengers 1, the guy manipulated by Loki. And that he is a former friend and colleague or Stark (helped created the Jaris AI) and Banners and used to work for SHIELD before they were SHIELD. Now he has fallen from grace. He sees his former friends and bosses celebrated as heroes while he struggles to fund his work. He creates Ultron and the Avengers have to stop it, and he in a human non-action hero way helps them stop Ultron too, in the same way that the human scientist helped in Avengers 1. I want to see Pym react to Ultron.
Would all this be possible after the fact? Having Ultron's creator be mentioned as Hank Pym but never show him? Have the Avengers fight and take down Ultron without Pym? Then later have Pym reacting to his failure of Ultron in the Ant Man movies and later Avengers movies? And have the world and other Avengers react to him since he created Ultron? I guess, but it might not be the same.

I agree though about Stark getting too big a part in the MU, and now Downey Jr. has a bigger paycheck which means he could get a bigger role still. I don't mind if he takes the AI created by Pym and gives it a body, but I'd rather it was Pym as the focus.


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Old 07-25-2013, 01:14 PM   #994
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StreetWarrior, I don't agree that IM is taking over the MCU. He was not the star in TA, everyone got their time. IM 3 was an IRON MAN movie, so of course he was the focus. He won't appear in Thor:TDW or GOTG and may not appear in CA:TWS. Edgar Wright has been working on this movie for years and Feige doesn't want to undercut him by using Pym in AOU first. Also, having Tony create Ultron would be a continuation of Tony's character arc from IM 3 and give Ultron the same basic backstory (brillaint but mentally unstable scientist). He's actually appearing LESS in Phase Two than he did in Phase One.

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Old 07-25-2013, 01:16 PM   #995
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Isn't it possible that Ultron is not evil in this movie, but created to help the Avengers defeat Thanos, and at the end of the movie it hints at Ultron turning? Just a thought, it would also help tie into the future Ant Man movie. I heard someone, maybe Joss say that this is Ultron's origin story.

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Old 07-25-2013, 01:24 PM   #996
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Well it is possible that itīs another threat at hand and that they create Ultron and he turns in the end, yes. If they made him, it wouldnīt be because of Thanos directly. It would be more like, yeah we need something to help us in case stuff like this happens again. I am sorry but I donīt think that will happen.

There was a trailer at SDCC (I think) which pretty much suggested that he went nuts in this move. Itīs a nice theory anyways

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Old 07-25-2013, 01:24 PM   #997
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Isn't it possible that Ultron is not evil in this movie, but created to help the Avengers defeat Thanos, and at the end of the movie it hints at Ultron turning? Just a thought, it would also help tie into the future Ant Man movie. I heard someone, maybe Joss say that this is Ultron's origin story.
That's interesting. Or what if it goes the terminator route and Ultron is a baddie in this one, but then he is reprogrammed to be used to fight against a greater threat--Thanos.

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Old 07-25-2013, 01:29 PM   #998
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Mark Millar actually did the incest thing with tact (I cannot believe that I'm praising Millar of all people for subtlety or restraint). Then Loeb comes along and we get brother/sister banging in front of Wolverine.
You don't have to be afraid, his run on The Ultimates was very good, even better than the Avengers movie if you ask me

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Old 07-25-2013, 01:33 PM   #999
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StreetWarrior, I don't agree that IM is taking over the MCU. He was not the star in TA, everyone got their time. IM 3 was an IRON MAN movie, so of course he was the focus. He won't appear in Thor:TDW or GOTG and may not appear in CA:TWS. Edgar Wright has been working on this movie for years and Feige doesn't want to undercut him by using Pym in AOU first. Also, having Tony create Ultron would be a continuation of Tony's character arc from IM 3 and give Ultron the same basic backstory (brillaint but mentally unstable scientist). He's actually appearing LESS in Phase Two than he did in Phase One.
I see your point but I still disagree. All of the marketing for the Avengers showed Iron Man most prominent and while everyone had a chance to shine, Iron Man and Hulk were definitely the focus of the movie. Cap and Thor had far less screen time than the rest and Hawkeye was barely in the movie at all. I'm not saying that this was a problem - I loved the film. I'm just saying that Iron Man is front and center in the MCU. While he was always important in the Avengers (a founding member ALONG with the Pyms) he wasn't the heart of the team. That role belongs to Cap (even if he did enter a little later).

I recognize that it makes sense for Ultron to be a continuation from ideas presented in Iron Man but it seems a little too convenient. A little lazy. I like Stark a lot more than I like Pym (as characters) but it's a big universe. Each character needs a chance to shine. Tony has had enough opportunities. Now it's someone else's turn. I want Avengers II not Iron Man 3.5. No disrespect, Loki882! You're definitely right about the second half of Phase 2! I could use an Iron Man break...

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Old 07-25-2013, 01:40 PM   #1000
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IM and Hulk were NOT the focus of the movie. They may have had the best scenes, but that is because of the actors and not the writing. If anything, Cap and BW got more actual development and attention than either Stark or Banner. The posters are irrelevant, IM is their most famous character so of course he's up front (the other five looked badass too), but he wasn't the focus in the actual movie. Wright is using Pym in is film, they wan't to give him first dibs.

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