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Old 07-28-2013, 08:20 AM   #176
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Default Re: The Avengers 2! The Official News and Speculation Thread - Upgrade section 4 -

Tony is technically the ropot's guy, and the traser showed an iron man mask morphing into Ultron's dead, so i'm sure he's going to be the main architect of that. My problem now is that he never learns, it'll be just another one of his mistakes.

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Old 07-28-2013, 08:35 AM   #177
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Thing I don't like about Tony being the creator is it's predictable, boring and lazy. Also, why? He has JARVIS, which is able to do all the things Ultron is able to do. He'd never sell JARVIS to SHIELD, and he'd never build anything for SHIELD either (this Tony Stark at least). It doesn't make sense.

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Old 07-28-2013, 09:01 AM   #178
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I don't know if the masters of evil will be in the film, but I can't imagine that Ultron will be the only villain. What MS movie has only had one villain?
Well, The Avengers.

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So you see Ultron being the focus of an entire movie? There has to be something else.
Why?

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Old 07-28-2013, 11:00 AM   #179
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Well, The Avengers.



Why?
Well, because Loki wasn't the entire focus of Marvel's The Avengers. You had S.H.I.E.L.D., Thanos and The Other, The Chitauri and the Tesseract.

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Old 07-28-2013, 11:04 AM   #180
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Well, because Loki wasn't the entire focus of Marvel's The Avengers. You had S.H.I.E.L.D., Thanos and The Other, The Chitauri and the Tesseract.
Thanos wasn't a focus of the film. He wasn't in the movie until the first post credits scene. The Other was a means of dishing out exposition and the Tesseract was a macguffin, two things that will probably be in The Avengers 2 in some form. SHIELD will probably be in Avengers 2 again, and the Chitauri were just goons. Ultron will probably also have goons, most likely in the form of multiple copies of himself as is his usual MO.

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Old 07-28-2013, 11:16 AM   #181
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I'm still trying to figure out how you can add Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver now. This movie has so much jammed in it's going to be interesting seeing how they juggle the Avengers as well.


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Old 07-28-2013, 11:20 AM   #182
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Thanos wasn't a focus of the film. He wasn't in the movie until the first post credits scene. The Other was a means of dishing out exposition and the Tesseract was a macguffin, two things that will probably be in The Avengers 2 in some form. SHIELD will probably be in Avengers 2 again, and the Chitauri were just goons. Ultron will probably also have goons, most likely in the form of multiple copies of himself as is his usual MO.
But don't we need time to see Ultron created? How many versions of himself will he go through until the General Audience gets bored with it? I just have a hard time seeing Ultron being a personal threat for everyone. Also how do you add in Wanda and Pietro?

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Old 07-28-2013, 11:21 AM   #183
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But don't we need time to see Ultron created?
Initially, yeah. We don't need to stop and see him create every back up body for himself.

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How many versions of himself will he go through until the General Audience gets bored with it?
How many identical alien goons did The Avengers go through before the General Audience got bored with it?

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I just have a hard time seeing Ultron being a personal threat for everyone.
I think an indestructible robot with aims of genocide who can built duplicates of himself is plenty threat for everybody.

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Also how do you add in Wanda and Pietro?
They're a pair of super powered criminals/ex cons who get themselves involved in The Avengers' mission while being sarcastic and critical of them until they join the team officially, I'd suspect.

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Old 07-28-2013, 11:34 AM   #184
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Thing I don't like about Tony being the creator is it's predictable, boring and lazy. Also, why? He has JARVIS, which is able to do all the things Ultron is able to do. He'd never sell JARVIS to SHIELD, and he'd never build anything for SHIELD either (this Tony Stark at least). It doesn't make sense.
Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
Which is why I think Tony only builds the body. Stark was director of Shield in the comics wasn't he? With his arc ending, and Fury and Cap going rogue (possibly due to this AI), perhaps stark becomes director for a brief bit???


Or not. But I don't think Stark creates the AI. I think the AI may be something found, but "created" by Zola, that he sort of get's his hands on, which makes its way to Shield. Maybe in a flashback we see that Howard Stark had a role in helping create it or find it, and uses this AI to store Jarvis' brain patterns for his son? So instead of a Jarvis going rogue, it would be that Jarvis is actually part of Ultron? Idk about that, the howard stark think, it's sort of wishful thinking, but it could be a way to make Ultron personal for Tony.. but back to what I think is possible, Due to a possible breakout, Shield wants to use this AI as a global defense net work...ready for this? U.L.T.R.O.N. Universal Large Threat Response Only Network :P...if stark supports this AI to give it control, so he builds it its body, as the trailer seems to imply. There's your origin story for Ultron...if he DOES exist, and sort of put himself in the right place, "you don't need A Pym to create AN Ultron" (I refuse to let that go :P)

Fast forward to ant-man, we find out that Pym created the AI, it ended up killing him, then put himself in position.

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Old 07-28-2013, 11:36 AM   #185
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Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
Which is why I think Tony only builds the body. Stark was director of Shield in the comics wasn't he? With his arc ending, and Fury and Cap going rogue (possibly due to this AI), perhaps stark becomes director for a brief bit???
Christ, man, spoilers.

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Old 07-28-2013, 11:38 AM   #186
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Default Re: The Avengers 2! The Official News and Speculation Thread - Upgrade section 4 -

Who says Ultron is being built for SHIELD?

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Old 07-28-2013, 11:40 AM   #187
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Default Re: The Avengers 2! The Official News and Speculation Thread - Upgrade section 4 -

I do not want to see simultaneous Ultron versions. It's too similar to IM3. I'd rather see him constantly upgrading himself to better and better versions while also being able to control already existing tech. All the worlds tech should be at his disposal.

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Old 07-28-2013, 11:40 AM   #188
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The elements are all there in *your* own mind. You choose to wave off the CATWS comments as just referring to the dissolution of SHIELD and the rebirth of HYDRA, like either of those is some great unexpected secret. I, however, choose to take the guys who know at their word, and look for CATWS to be the movie that leads directly to Age of Ultron, because of some Pandora's box or other that Cap and the other characters in that movie unleash.
No...they literally say it sets the stage and what state the world will be in come A2. That's literally what they say. But if you want them to be so involved with building Ultron or something, fine, believe that. Just prepare to be disappointed come April.

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Old 07-28-2013, 11:42 AM   #189
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Default Re: The Avengers 2! The Official News and Speculation Thread - Upgrade section 4 -

So, is unmarked spoilers about Captain America 2 just going to be a thing in here now?

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Old 07-28-2013, 11:52 AM   #190
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Christ, man, spoilers.
why does that need spoilers?

the only true thing I said was
Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
That stark becomes director of shield in the comics
everything else was just guessing

edit: oh nvm, gotcha

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Old 07-28-2013, 11:53 AM   #191
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Okay, my mistake.

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Old 07-28-2013, 11:55 AM   #192
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Okay, my mistake.
I gotcha, the only thing that I see

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
the cap and fury going rogue thing

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Old 07-28-2013, 11:58 AM   #193
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I gotcha, the only thing that I see

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
the cap and fury going rogue thing
So is that a spoiler or not? Now I'm confused.

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Old 07-28-2013, 12:01 PM   #194
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So is that a spoiler or not? Now I'm confused.
idk lol I thought it WAS, and it took me a little while to realize that's what you were referring to. (I didn't even realize that I typed it), it may be.

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
We know Fury is on the outs, by the set footage, I would assume Cap does too


So yeah, it shoulda been in spoiler tags, didn't even realize. My bad

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Old 07-28-2013, 12:07 PM   #195
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Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
Which is why I think Tony only builds the body. Stark was director of Shield in the comics wasn't he? With his arc ending, and Fury and Cap going rogue (possibly due to this AI), perhaps stark becomes director for a brief bit???


Or not. But I don't think Stark creates the AI. I think the AI may be something found, but "created" by Zola, that he sort of get's his hands on, which makes its way to Shield. Maybe in a flashback we see that Howard Stark had a role in helping create it or find it, and uses this AI to store Jarvis' brain patterns for his son? So instead of a Jarvis going rogue, it would be that Jarvis is actually part of Ultron? Idk about that, the howard stark think, it's sort of wishful thinking, but it could be a way to make Ultron personal for Tony.. but back to what I think is possible, Due to a possible breakout, Shield wants to use this AI as a global defense net work...ready for this? U.L.T.R.O.N. Universal Large Threat Response Only Network :P...if stark supports this AI to give it control, so he builds it its body, as the trailer seems to imply. There's your origin story for Ultron...if he DOES exist, and sort of put himself in the right place, "you don't need A Pym to create AN Ultron" (I refuse to let that go :P)

Fast forward to ant-man, we find out that Pym created the AI, it ended up killing him, then put himself in position.
I doubt Marvel will make Zola THAT important. He wasn't a huge part of the first movie, and we have no idea what capacity he'll be in the sequel for. I prefer your Howard Stark suggestion, because it makes things more personal for Tony and Steve that way.

And yes I agree that the only thing Tony should contribute to Ultron is the body

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Old 07-28-2013, 12:18 PM   #196
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I like what you say. How do you suggeset that the A.I goes nuts? There has to be a reason for why Tony failed with building it.
I'm not exactly sure. I think it having an Oedipus Complex helps though. I don't think we'll get an explanation as to how or why it turns evil. I think it just will. I really don't think it's all to big of a deal to be honest. Maybe he tries to create an A.I. much like himself and it turns evil. Something that thinks logically but instead of having some morals like Stark, has absolutely no morals whatsoever.

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Old 07-28-2013, 12:57 PM   #197
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So, is unmarked spoilers about Captain America 2 just going to be a thing in here now?
The heck are you taking about? That was no movie spoiler.

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Old 07-28-2013, 12:59 PM   #198
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I doubt Marvel will make Zola THAT important. He wasn't a huge part of the first movie, and we have no idea what capacity he'll be in the sequel for. I prefer your Howard Stark suggestion, because it makes things more personal for Tony and Steve that way.

And yes I agree that the only thing Tony should contribute to Ultron is the body
Why could Zola not have that kind of importance? He's the only character we know to be in C:TWS that we'd assume could develop advanced robotics systems based on what we know from the comics.

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I'm not exactly sure. I think it having an Oedipus Complex helps though. I don't think we'll get an explanation as to how or why it turns evil. I think it just will. I really don't think it's all to big of a deal to be honest. Maybe he tries to create an A.I. much like himself and it turns evil. Something that thinks logically but instead of having some morals like Stark, has absolutely no morals whatsoever.
I never want to see that corny Oedipus Complex stuff on screen.

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Old 07-28-2013, 01:08 PM   #199
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Why could Zola not have that kind of importance? He's the only character we know to be in C:TWS that we'd assume could develop advanced robotics systems based on what we know from the comics.
He can do, but currently I don't think he will. Nothing's really pointed towards either direction, we just know he'll be in the movie. If I had to guess why he's in it I'd say it's just flashbacks... Plus, I don't want a villain/antagonist to have any involvement in Ultron's creation. It's so much more effective and keeps the character's essence if he's created by a hero(es) and then turns evil

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Old 07-28-2013, 01:17 PM   #200
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He can do, but currently I don't think he will. Nothing's really pointed towards either direction, we just know he'll be in the movie. If I had to guess why he's in it I'd say it's just flashbacks... Plus, I don't want a villain/antagonist to have any involvement in Ultron's creation. It's so much more effective and keeps the character's essence if he's created by a hero(es) and then turns evil
There were schematics for his robot body in C:TFA.

I must've missed the rest of the discussion, but how on Earth is Ultron a creation of the entire Avengers group??? Can't wait to hear this one. We already know from The Avengers that the World Security Council and parts of the American government are not sold on the Avengers. They do not appreciate the damage they caused New York City. We'll even get to see in T:TDW that more damage is caused on Earth indirectly by another member of the Avengers. It makes simply too much sense that Ultron is born of a desire to protect Earth without requiring the use of the Avengers.

Then there's also the fact that it's likely in C:TWS, SHIELD gets infiltrated. We already saw the Vice President working with AIM in IM3. Wouldn't you think they'd want to utilize Ultron for their own purposes?

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