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Old 10-14-2013, 12:47 PM   #76
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

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Originally Posted by mercureyx View Post
He's older than the members of the Fantastic Four -- but not that old. In his late 20s...
Can you confirm that he is Victor Von Doom, ruler of Latveria? Armies, robots, the whole 9 yards...genius intellect..origin like classic Doom?

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Old 10-14-2013, 02:39 PM   #77
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

He's Victor Von Doom, yes. He's a genius and comes from Latveria. Robots are a part of the story. His origin is not that of the classic Doom.

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Old 10-14-2013, 02:48 PM   #78
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

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He's Victor Von Doom, yes. He's a genius and comes from Latveria. Robots are a part of the story. His origin is not that of the classic Doom.
Any idea how close they are to having a script and FoX pulling the trigger and start shooting?

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Old 10-14-2013, 03:00 PM   #79
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

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He's Victor Von Doom, yes. He's a genius and comes from Latveria. Robots are a part of the story. His origin is not that of the classic Doom.
Ok...its getting there...ok he comes from Latveria but is he the ruler of the nation and do we actually get to see the country? Castle Doom? etc? Also classic Doom look/attire?

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Old 10-14-2013, 03:06 PM   #80
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

The latest is that Fox is moving full steam ahead on F4 -- that's why you've started hearing bits of casting...

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Old 10-14-2013, 03:13 PM   #81
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I see. Thanks for the reply.

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Old 10-14-2013, 03:26 PM   #82
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

Hmm, will be interesting to see how they combine Ultimate FF with Doom as a villain.

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Old 10-14-2013, 04:21 PM   #83
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

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Hmm, will be interesting to see how they combine Ultimate FF with Doom as a villain.
From Wikipedia:

In the Ultimate Marvel universe, Doctor Doom is Victor van Damme (he'll be Doom in the movie). Victor is introduced as part of the Baxter Building, a government think-tank of young geniuses, which counts among its students Reed Richards and Susan Storm. He works to help Reed Richards develop a teleporter to the "N-Zone," but reprograms its coordinates without telling anyone. This causes the accident that gave the Ultimate Fantastic Four their powers, though Victor maintains that the original Richards programming was so bad that even he couldn't fix it, and that it was this that led to the accident. Van Damme is caught in the same accident...

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Old 10-14-2013, 04:34 PM   #84
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

Okay Doom is caught in the accident, but please tell me that it just causes scarring and such...tell me that once again, we aren't dealing with metallic skin nonsense?

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Old 10-14-2013, 04:46 PM   #85
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

So, because fans didn't like the last take on Dr.Doom Fox is once again taking elements from the Dr.Doom of Ultimate Fantastic four. Not really liking that so far.

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Plenty of male-led action films fail, yet the actors' gender is not blamed. Why should it be different for women? Especially since far more male-led action films are made than female-led action films?
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Old 10-14-2013, 04:54 PM   #86
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

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Again, I am not necessarily disagreeing, but let those Hollywood writers earn their pay check and sort out any short comings these villains may have.

I am all for a good Dr. Doom too, but if we get a reboot that not only retells the origin but also features the same villain how can the general audience not feel like they have seen this all before? The new FF could be Doomed before it gets started...
I understand that, but the film makers have to be very carefully selecting a villain. I can understand the idea of not using Doom right away, instead building him up right away, but you have to have a villain who is compelling in his own right, rather then someone who just feels like someone lame place holder for Doom. Not very villain can be as compelling as Doom, but to carry a movie a villain should be compelling right away.

I think that almost every rogues gallery has tiers of villains and while Doom is always on top for me, guys like Wizard, Red Ghost and Mole man tend to end up at the bottom.

I actually like Annihilus, he is likely my third favorite, he is not as complex as Doom is, but he is the most monstrous and scary villain the FF has. Mad Thinker is an interesting concept that is hardly ever realized, here is a villain who can predict almost anything and he is often just written as a 3rd rate mad scientist. I think would favor certain villains over others.

But here is a good question, if the Ultimate Mole Man was the inferior ho hum version of the character, how much change would you accept to make Movie Mole Man a more interesting and relevant character then he generally is the comics? How many changes to a B-list villain being transitioned to the Big Screen are acceptable?

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So, because fans didn't like the last take on Dr.Doom Fox is once again taking elements from the Dr.Doom of Ultimate Fantastic four. Not really liking that so far.
I hope they don't go with Ultimate Doom, he is one of my least favorite Ultimate characters, I think the Ultimate version tried to fix something that wasn't broken.

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Old 10-14-2013, 04:59 PM   #87
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

Considering this is taking from Ultimate i don't think Mole Man should be used, but instead of Dr.Doom, Annihilus would have been a perfect choice as the villain, the characters experiment with the negative zone and end up hurt, now they would have to travel through the Negative Zone to find a solution and enter in conflict with anihilus, basicallye taking elements from the first 2 storylines of Ultimate Fantastic Four.

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Plenty of male-led action films fail, yet the actors' gender is not blamed. Why should it be different for women? Especially since far more male-led action films are made than female-led action films?
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Old 10-14-2013, 05:00 PM   #88
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

Late 20s doom?

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Old 10-14-2013, 05:06 PM   #89
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

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Considering this is taking from Ultimate i don't think Mole Man should be used, but instead of Dr.Doom, Annihilus would have been a perfect choice as the villain, the characters experiment with the negative zone and end up hurt, now they would have to travel through the Negative Zone to find a solution and enter in conflict with anihilus, basicallye taking elements from the first 2 storylines of Ultimate Fantastic Four.
I think the best Marvel movies taken aspects of both the 616 and the Ultimate versions and making their own stuff up, rather then just being slavish to one particular version.

Its a strategy that often works, now I would an FF movie to feature the general spirit of the Lee and Kirby FF comics, rather then copying it to the letter, but I think if they just copied the Ultimate FF, something would be lost in the process.

I am for mixing and matching aspects of both the 616 and Ultimate FF, I would favor more of the 616 universe then the Ultimate one, but if I like an idea from the Ultimate Universe I would like to see it used.

For my opinion, I generally like Ulimate Mole man better then 616 Mole Man, but I greatly prefer 616 Doom to Ultimate Doom.

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Old 10-14-2013, 05:13 PM   #90
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

I'm not saying the entire film should be Ultimate Fantastic Four, Doom should certainly not be, but if Mole Man is every done on screen i would prefer it to be in a film more in line with the Lee and Kirby spirit, from what i see the best choice for this film would be Anihilus, while leaving Doom for a sequel.

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Plenty of male-led action films fail, yet the actors' gender is not blamed. Why should it be different for women? Especially since far more male-led action films are made than female-led action films?
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Old 10-14-2013, 05:16 PM   #91
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

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From Wikipedia:

In the Ultimate Marvel universe, Doctor Doom is Victor van Damme (he'll be Doom in the movie). Victor is introduced as part of the Baxter Building, a government think-tank of young geniuses, which counts among its students Reed Richards and Susan Storm. He works to help Reed Richards develop a teleporter to the "N-Zone," but reprograms its coordinates without telling anyone. This causes the accident that gave the Ultimate Fantastic Four their powers, though Victor maintains that the original Richards programming was so bad that even he couldn't fix it, and that it was this that led to the accident. Van Damme is caught in the same accident...
I was kind of hoping that wouldn't happen because of how similar it is to the first film.

I can see why they do it though since it's such an easy way to do Doom's origin and tie him with the team.

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Old 10-14-2013, 05:21 PM   #92
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

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Considering this is taking from Ultimate i don't think Mole Man should be used, but instead of Dr.Doom, Annihilus would have been a perfect choice as the villain, the characters experiment with the negative zone and end up hurt, now they would have to travel through the Negative Zone to find a solution and enter in conflict with anihilus, basicallye taking elements from the first 2 storylines of Ultimate Fantastic Four.
You may be on to something, here...

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Old 10-14-2013, 05:27 PM   #93
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

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I'm not saying the entire film should be Ultimate Fantastic Four, Doom should certainly not be, but if Mole Man is every done on screen i would prefer it to be in a film more in line with the Lee and Kirby spirit, from what i see the best choice for this film would be Anihilus, while leaving Doom for a sequel.
I can agree with that to an extent, I think 616 Annihilus is an easier to sell the general audience then 616 Mole Man and 616 Annihilus is just a more of a threatening character then Mole Man.

Here is where I disagree, while I think it is important to capture the general spirit of the Lee/Kirby era, I don' think it has to be slavishly devote to every detail of that era and trying to recreate every detail would be problematic. That is why I don't have a problem with using the Ultimate Mole Man over the 616 Mole Man, because let's fact it, 616 Mole Man's rather one note personality was never one of the major selling points of Silver Age FF.

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Old 10-14-2013, 05:46 PM   #94
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

I guess I'll just have to wait and see the execution, but the only part of this whole thing I'm digging is that the Negative Zone may be involved.

IF something happens at the last moments and it falls through and heads back to Marvel, I kinda hope they also go a Negative Zone route as well when they do their take.

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Old 10-14-2013, 05:54 PM   #95
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

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Originally Posted by Lord View Post
Considering this is taking from Ultimate i don't think Mole Man should be used, but instead of Dr.Doom, Annihilus would have been a perfect choice as the villain, the characters experiment with the negative zone and end up hurt, now they would have to travel through the Negative Zone to find a solution and enter in conflict with anihilus, basicallye taking elements from the first 2 storylines of Ultimate Fantastic Four.
This is basically what I thought they should do too, except have it be a race against time sort of thing before Annihilus unleashes the Annihilation Wave as well.

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I can agree with that to an extent, I think 616 Annihilus is an easier to sell the general audience then 616 Mole Man and 616 Annihilus is just a more of a threatening character then Mole Man.

Here is where I disagree, while I think it is important to capture the general spirit of the Lee/Kirby era, I don' think it has to be slavishly devote to every detail of that era and trying to recreate every detail would be problematic. That is why I don't have a problem with using the Ultimate Mole Man over the 616 Mole Man, because let's fact it, 616 Mole Man's rather one note personality was never one of the major selling points of Silver Age FF.
I don't think they should do Moleman at all. IMO, an ideal FF trilogy would be N-Zone/Annihilus/Doom -> Skrulls/Doom -> Galactus/Silver Surfer.

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Old 10-14-2013, 06:06 PM   #96
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I guess I'll just have to wait and see the execution, but the only part of this whole thing I'm digging is that the Negative Zone may be involved.

IF something happens at the last moments and it falls through and heads back to Marvel, I kinda hope they also go a Negative Zone route as well when they do their take.
To be honest, the more I think about it, the more I'd want Marvel to do the same things Fox are doing with this film. That includes making the FF younger. It's just an easier, if not better, way in this day and age to set up a character drama that can appeal to the most people and make the characters earn their personalities and relationships. In the first FF films, we were told/shown that Johnny was this way, Reed was this way, Sue was this way, etc etc but we didn't understand why or given a reason to care other than they were characters that some of us had read for years. By making them younger, and showing Reed growing up as a child with Sue and Johnny, we're able to see them develop and understand why exactly we're supposed to care when Reed ****s over Ben or why Sue and Reed have such a deep bond. It also adds a layer of edginess by making Reed a young man with something to prove that you just can't get with older, seasoned 616 Reed. And, in that way, it also makes Reed an easier character to use as a protagonist.

Another thing I like is that about them basing it on Ultimate FF is that Sue was also a child prodigy and while not being Reed's intellectual equal she wasn't some blond that was just there for sex appeal, and it made it easier to believe that this hot chick would be into Reed other than to gold dig, especially since they grew up together.

In terms of the MCU, making the FF a young team (meaning in their early 20's) would probably be the best way to portray them in that universe as it stands anyway. And that's probably what they would do honestly. It gets around the fact Reed has never been mentioned as one of the foremost scientists in the world, as he's still coming up, it sets them a part from the Avengers by making them a less experienced group who's not necessarily interested in policing the world, and are a young group of explorers and researchers looks to discover new things.

So, in a lot of ways, Fox, or Trank anyway, is doing the right thing.

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Old 10-14-2013, 06:10 PM   #97
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

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To be honest, the more I think about it, the more I'd want Marvel to do the same things Fox are doing with this film. That includes making the FF younger. It's just an easier, if not better, way in this day and age to set up a character drama that can appeal to the most people and make the characters earn their personalities and relationships. In the first FF films, we were told/shown that Johnny was this way, Reed was this way, Sue was this way, etc etc but we didn't understand why or given a reason to care other than they were characters that some of us had read for years. By making them younger, and showing Reed growing up as a child with Sue and Johnny, we're able to them development and understand why exactly I'm supposed to care when Reed ****s over Ben or why Sue and Reed have such a deep bond. It also adds a layer of edginess by making Reed a young man with something to prove that you just can't get with older, seasoned 616 Reed. And, in that way, it also makes Reed an easier character to use as a protagonist.

Another thing I like is that about them basing it on Ultimate FF is that Sue was also a child prodigy and while not being Reed's intellectual equal she wasn't some blond that was just there for sex appeal, and it made it easier to believe that this hot chick would be into Reed other than to golddig, especially since they grew up together.
Ultimate FF did have a lot of cool elements (heck the whole Ultimate Universe actually was pretty cool, until it got Loeb-ed). The only real thing I HATED about Ultimate FF was their Goat-legged Dr Doom.

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Old 10-14-2013, 06:13 PM   #98
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Wasn't it later revealed that she was smarter than Reed? When the writers started to push him into villain territory, ruin his life and make Sue hate him.

I don't think FF should be a trilogy, it's in the name, it's a quadrilogy, the last one would Basically be Doom amassing strength after having stolen Silver Surfer's powers. And about Mole man, i just think he fits better in a Kirbyesque Fantastic Four, even if the character is more based on his Ultimate Marvel version.

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Old 10-14-2013, 06:26 PM   #99
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Yeah they could definitely do a fourth film about Doom having amassed enough power to take over the country of Latveria and declare war on the US or something like that. And since they can't use the Cosmic Cube (...or can they? Maybe that's why Marvel changed the name to the Tesseract in Avengers) they can definitely substitute Doom ****ing around with that for the Power Cosmic.

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Old 10-14-2013, 07:49 PM   #100
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Default Re: Does anyone know who the villain is?

I really hope if they are going the UFF route that the origin is quickly told and then move on to the story...Doom NEEDS to be Latveria's ruler already...we need to see the nation for once, its citizens, etc. Further DOOM needs to LOOK the part...I mean how many times are we going to have a chance to see Marvel's ULTIMATE villain on the big screen before he is done comic book justice?

I just know that MARVEL would love to have their ultimate villain to integrate into their stories...instead Fox holds Doom ransom and will never let go

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