The Batsuit Thread - Part 5

[Shikamaru]

Originally Posted by Afrobean

Because that's a defining trait for the character. He is "just a man". He is supposed to be at the peak of human conditioning, but he's just a man.

I've seen Batman do ridiculous things like jumping directly on top of a building. I've seen him easily survive falls without injury that should have killed him. This sort of stuff happens in the comics too, because fantasy permeates the whole world even moreso than in the adaptations. Seeing Batman do something fantastic like jumping 7+ feet straight up in the air is acceptable in the comic books, but people generally demand a higher degree of realism in live action.

The logic behind this is self-contradicting. A peak human is capable of doing all the things you just brought up. The reason you don't believe that to be the case is because you're under the assumption that it is possible to be a peak human. It isn't. It is impossible to become a peak human in real life, which is why you'll never see a person in real life being physically on par with Batman. Maybe science will be able to create a peak human in the future much until then, the concept is as fictional as any other superpower. There is no way for someone to become a peak human by natural means at this point in time like Batman did.

The world record for highest jump is over 8 feet btw.

This is also why people are opposed to dropping the armor-look. Realism is more important in live action. Real life police officers regularly wear bulletproof vests when they're in situations where they are more likely to be shot at. And I bet you've heard of the "real life superhero movement"; Phoenix Jones, perhaps the best known of them all, wears bulletproof armor. People expect heroic persons who may be shot at to wear visible armor. But you know, I've been watching Arrow lately and I think some less armored designs could still be relatively believable, because I find myself not having a problem with Green Arrow not being visibly armored. Maybe even a simple fabric suit not entirely unlike the lycra that cosplayers usually wear could work. I wouldn't want to see Batman's chest be completely armor-less though, as that would ring as foolishly irresponsible. I think an in-universe sculpted chest armor under fabric might be what I want. Imagine throwing tights over the suit from Burton's 1989 film. Yeah.

We already addressed this. Realism or not, the armor suit still loses to the fabric suit. The irony is that the fabric suit from the comics is the most realistic Batman suit there is. There are lightweight fabric-armor suits we have in real life that offer the same level of protection the thick bulky armor does. The only difference between them? The fabric suit doesn't weigh/slow down Batman anywhere as much and allows him to blend into the shadows better (black-and-grey and grey-and-blue blend in the shadows much better than all-black).

It's just nuts. Bruce's applied science department from the Nolan films is supposed to be 10 years ahead of everyone yet Batman still wore a suit that was considered dated by our current real-world standards.

My understanding was that the movie version of Captain America has a degree of super strength and all that jazz. Like the Ultimate imprint version of the character. Because the Ultimate line is a big influence on all of the Marvel films.

Even in that case, how do you explain Black Widow and Hawkeye? Most people didn't have problems with them and Comic Book Batman is on an entirely different level compared to them both physically and mentally. Heck, some people even thought Black Widow was useless despite her still being physically superior to all live-action versions of Batman so far. So how would going back to a more grounded realistic take on Batman still be the solution?

[Vaibow]

Originally Posted by Bathead

No.

But, if you look at the metropolis design, there are elements in it, nods, to the superman suit, silver/grey piping, s shield etc - i think it hints to a dark suit with gold

[WSNProductions]

Originally Posted by Tatsumarushinob

This Batman needs to be nothing like we've seen before. At the very least these elements are key:

1) master of disguise
2) formidable detective
3) cunning and shrewed
4) surgical combatant (a logical display of various martial arts)
5) agile (as in parkour), but nothing fancy
6) methodic
7) and las but not least, a bad ass and not a pusssy

I would love to see Batman portrayed like this.

[Bathead]

Originally Posted by BatLobsterRises

If they go with some sort a high-tech mesh suit like in MOS that'd be alright with me. That at least looks like a fairly solid material. But same fans talk like they want actual cotton.

Absolutely NO fans are asking for that. They (me included) are asking for bulletproof fabric, that is just as protective as armor plating, but allows Batman the flexibility to pull off the acrobatic martial arts and parkour-esque moves he's famous for.

[roach]

I am asking for a leather body suit with a denim cape

[Bathead]

Originally Posted by Vaibow

But, if you look at the metropolis design, there are elements in it, nods, to the superman suit, silver/grey piping, s shield etc - i think it hints to a dark suit with gold

Let's just say I hope it's not all black and gold. Let's get away from that and go with a proper grey and black suit. (with a dark gold belt)

[D.P.]

Originally Posted by roach

I am asking for a leather body suit with a denim cape

This is the funniest post here honestly.

[roach]

Originally Posted by D.P.

This is the funniest post here honestly.

i try

[SilentWarriorZ]

Need A suit in which he could fly fight superman .

[Bren]

No suit should allow him to even remotely fight Superman. All Superman had to do is punch Batman just hard enough to accelerate Batman to the extent he concusses himself within the armoured suit. If it's indestructible or close, even better for Superman.

Light, maybe plastic body armour, with a dark grey kevlar mesh fabric convering the lot. Styled like the AA suit with reasonable gauntlets and job done.

[Irony-Man]

Originally Posted by roach

I am asking for a leather body suit with a denim cape

I'm wearing one right now!

[Bathead]

Originally Posted by Bren

No suit should allow him to even remotely fight Superman. All Superman had to do is punch Batman just hard enough to accelerate Batman to the extent he concusses himself within the armoured suit. If it's indestructible or close, even better for Superman.

Light, maybe plastic body armour, with a dark grey kevlar mesh fabric convering the lot. Styled like the AA suit with reasonable gauntlets and job done.

No amount of armor will help if Superman is determined to win the fight. The only thing that will help Batman is his cleverness and an unwillingness to kill on Superman's part.

[Ultra Nolanite]

Originally Posted by Nathan

Where did you get this ? Who is the artist ?

[Lencho01]

Originally Posted by Ultra Nolanite

Where did you get this ? Who is the artist ?

http://nebezial.deviantart.com/gallery/

[Afrobean]

Originally Posted by roach

No they don't. Realism is no important in live action. If that were true people would be complaining about Black Widow and Hawkeye.

Black Widow and Hawkeye were seen taking on alien energy blaster things. Would an earthly ballistics vest help in that case?

Consider the history of armor in wars. Originally, warriors wore large, bulky, heavy armor. It hindered movement, but effectively protected against blunt weapons and bladed weapons. And that's what everyone used. Then longbows changed things. Suddenly the heavy plate armor didn't protect as well as it once had and the loss in mobility from the armor really hurt warriors. In time, guns and bullets became the norm, and when that happened, the armor did NOTHING, and so warriors stopped wearing armor altogether. Eventually, technology advanced and we developed affordable means of stopping bullets, and that's where we are now, with our modern warriors wearing heavy armor to block bullets.

With Batman going up against bullets, he has an affordable means to protect himself. But normal human Avengers going up against strange energy weapons that can't be stopped by normal armor? Iron Man and Captain America seemed to be effective at protecting themselves, so it is possible, but there wasn't room in the story to give Hawkeye and Black Widow new Vibranium or Iron-Man-esque armor suddenly out of nowhere. Until we have Batman going up exclusively against weapons he cannot defend against (Darkseid's Omega Beams?), I don't want to see him leave his chest visibly unprotected. And we already saw armor provide some defense against a fully-powered Kryptonian in this universe when the unpowered Kryptonians were fighting Superman, so even a Kryptonian's might isn't something Batman shouldn't be able to defend against.

Originally Posted by Shikamaru

The world record for highest jump is over 8 feet btw.

I said "straight up". Olympic high jumping where the record currently stands at over 8 feet is not the same thing. The way they do it by throwing themselves over a pole, not jumping straight up onto a flat platform. Human physical limitation there is probably around 4 feet. But I've seen Batman frequently jumping onto platforms higher than is possible, I've seen him take falls that should have seriously injured or killed him, I've seen him jump down from heights without properly distributing his momentum as you would expect a parkour user would. It is possible to be the best physically trained person in the world, it is not possible to frequently jump down 30+ feet and absorb all of the energy in one's legs without serious injury. I guess you could say that what I want is a Batman who doesn't need wire work for every athletic feat her performs, I want a Batman who only performs things that we can know humans are physically capable of doing, even if it's not possible for any one single person to be an Olympic level athlete in EVERY field.

And just to be clear again, I'm not arguing for heavy armor here. I like the idea of a fabric suit. I don't want a heavy rubber suit. But at the same time, I don't want Batman to be fully unprotected. No matter how good at terrorizing mobsters, he'll be taking gunfire occasionally, so he should be prepared for it. Ideally, I want some light armor in the chest, shaped in a sculpted form like 1989's Batman, but covered in a skin-tight fabric maybe like Man of Steel's Superman.

Or, here's an idea I had a while back. How about for a "realistic" justification for the cape as being his bulletproof armor. Rather than the scifi glider we got in Batman Begins, I mean. This way he could have a nice heavy cape (probably just looking like leather in reality) while being completely unarmored underneath and it would have a reason other than the common superhero trope that superheroes are just supposed to have capes. And maybe he could pull off the cape in instances when he needs to go all out in a fight and knows he won't be shot at.

[Shikamaru]

Originally Posted by Afrobean

I said "straight up". Olympic high jumping where the record currently stands at over 8 feet is not the same thing. The way they do it by throwing themselves over a pole, not jumping straight up onto a flat platform. Human physical limitation there is probably around 4 feet. But I've seen Batman frequently jumping onto platforms higher than is possible, I've seen him take falls that should have seriously injured or killed him, I've seen him jump down from heights without properly distributing his momentum as you would expect a parkour user would. It is possible to be the best physically trained person in the world, it is not possible to frequently jump down 30+ feet and absorb all of the energy in one's legs without serious injury. I guess you could say that what I want is a Batman who doesn't need wire work for every athletic feat her performs, I want a Batman who only performs things that we can know humans are physically capable of doing, even if it's not possible for any one single person to be an Olympic level athlete in EVERY field.

But that's not really Batman then. That's the thing. Batman needs wire work because it is not possible in real life to be a peak human. Most of the stuff Batman physically does cannot be done in real life.

What you're essentially saying is that you want another watered down Batman. Opinions are opinions and there's nothing I can do to change that, but may I ask why? We've already had take that on Batman done already and I think it's time for a new take. Plus it's really pointless to water down your character just case.

It's really embarrassing for a character like Batman when Green Arrow, Black Widow, and Hawkeye have all shown better physical feats in live-action than him. Over half the feats you've brought up have been done by BW in Avengers.

And just to be clear again, I'm not arguing for heavy armor here. I like the idea of a fabric suit. I don't want a heavy rubber suit. But at the same time, I don't want Batman to be fully unprotected. No matter how good at terrorizing mobsters, he'll be taking gunfire occasionally, so he should be prepared for it. Ideally, I want some light armor in the chest, shaped in a sculpted form like 1989's Batman, but covered in a skin-tight fabric maybe like Man of Steel's Superman.

That's exactly what we want too. But the fabric suit offers just that. It comes with the lightweight armor that protects the chest.

Or, here's an idea I had a while back. How about for a "realistic" justification for the cape as being his bulletproof armor. Rather than the scifi glider we got in Batman Begins, I mean. This way he could have a nice heavy cape (probably just looking like leather in reality) while being completely unarmored underneath and it would have a reason other than the common superhero trope that superheroes are just supposed to have capes. And maybe he could pull off the cape in instances when he needs to go all out in a fight and knows he won't be shot at.

I had that idea before about other characters. Yeah, I could kinda see that work.

[KillerMcQueen]

Originally Posted by Afrobean

I said "straight up". Olympic high jumping where the record currently stands at over 8 feet is not the same thing. The way they do it by throwing themselves over a pole, not jumping straight up onto a flat platform. Human physical limitation there is probably around 4 feet.

And just to be clear again, I'm not arguing for heavy armor here. I like the idea of a fabric suit. I don't want a heavy rubber suit. But at the same time, I don't want Batman to be fully unprotected. No matter how good at terrorizing mobsters, he'll be taking gunfire occasionally, so he should be prepared for it.

Or, here's an idea I had a while back. How about for a "realistic" justification for the cape as being his bulletproof armor. Rather than the scifi glider we got in Batman Begins, I mean. This way he could have a nice heavy cape (probably just looking like leather in reality)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=itqJiST7jxw

as for the armor, the subject of real life lightweight fabrics that are bulletproof has been brought up many times in this thread, the only protection needed would be for impact, which could be solved by some strategically placed light armor, as bulletproof fabrics already exist. As for the cape, the bulletproof fabrics solve that, and why would anyone want to get rid of the gliding cape? it's freakin awesome. A heavy leathery cape would slow down the actor and restrict movement (I seem to remember the B89 cape was pretty freakin heavy)

[Bathead]

I get the impression that the heavy armor advocates don't believe that a simple fabric could possibly be as protective as the heavy plate armor. Which is a rather silly attitude, as these fabrics are absolutely real, and don't require any made-up pseudo-scientific comic book physics to explain.

[KillerMcQueen]

I do believe the thicker armor is definitely more protective that the bulletproof fabrics, but Batman's a master martial artist with awesome ninja skills, he rarely plans on being seen, and when he is he certainly doesn't plan on getting hit. he's supposed to be skilled enough to avoid most of the danger, heavy armor would just weigh him down and potentially put him in danger due to slowing him down.

[roach]

Why is it that when it comes to Batman imagination goes out the window?

[DChero]

Originally Posted by roach

Why is it that when it comes to Batman imagination goes out the window?

I blame Frank Miller.

[Bathead]

Originally Posted by KillerMcQueen

I do believe the thicker armor is definitely more protective that the bulletproof fabrics, but Batman's a master martial artist with awesome ninja skills, he rarely plans on being seen, and when he is he certainly doesn't plan on getting hit. he's supposed to be skilled enough to avoid most of the danger, heavy armor would just weigh him down and potentially put him in danger due to slowing him down.

That's just it, it's not.
The rest of your post I agree with %100.

[Bathead]

Originally Posted by DChero

I blame Frank Miller.

Sort of, although I blame Nolan more for his so-called "hyper-realism" take.

[Saint]

Originally Posted by Afrobean

Seeing Batman do something fantastic like jumping 7+ feet straight up in the air is acceptable in the comic books, but people generally demand a higher degree of realism in live action.

Question: have you ever actually seen a movie? I ask because, based on this statement, it seems like you don't know what sort of things movies actually contain.

[roach]

Like I said imagination goes out of the window the minute Batman is mentioned.