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View Poll Results: Which was better?
X-Men: First Class 46 64.79%
Captain America: The First Avenger 25 35.21%
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Old 10-17-2013, 11:03 PM   #51
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

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Originally Posted by psylockolussus View Post
Then how do you explain criticisms like
-Captain America easily wiping out Red Skull's army
-The weak execution Cap's reaction to Bucky's death
-Predictable story
-Red Skull being a weak villain
I explain them as all being opinions. I felt the film did a fine job, personally. The Red Skull and Cap were obviously mirrors of one another, and it was VERY apparent with the way the script played out (Red Skull having the decision of pushing passed 70% on the Tesseract just like Rogers does during the experiment that creates Cap, both going MIA in order to achieve their goals, etc). The script does a great job with symbolic imagery, and the Red Skull was supposed to be done in the style of an old school Indiana Jones or Bond villain, and I thought he worked as that type of villain very well.

As for Steve Rogers and Bucky. Cap's film had a lot of story to cover, but it is apparent from the beginning he looks up to Bucky. Bucky is the type of man Steve wanted to be, and Steve was Bucky's inspiration as well. When Bucky died to save Steve, it helped Steve in making the decision to ultimately sacrifice himself in order to stop the Skull's plane. Did he die too suddenly? It's a matter of opinion.

As for the minions dying easy, name me 10 major blockbuster action films where minions are competent and/or don't die easily or in great numbers? Especially, name me Indiana Jones or Bond films, because that is the type of movie Cap 1 was trying to be.

I loved both FC and Cap 1. I enjoyed Cap 1 more. Cap is my favorite superhero, and the film did a great job with him. But, I love both films. It is probably a biased opinion, but my bias doesn't bother me. Most people in these types of debates are biased.

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Old 10-18-2013, 01:08 AM   #52
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

I thought they were both pretty mediocre.

Fassbender is always great though.

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Old 10-18-2013, 01:12 AM   #53
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

Fass was the best thing about FC. The bar scene and the coin scene.... two of the best scenes in all of comic book movies

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Old 10-18-2013, 07:41 AM   #54
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

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Originally Posted by Spider-Fan View Post
Indiana Jones or Bond films, because that is the type of movie Cap 1 was trying to be..
I always felt there was something off about Cap 1 in comparison to the other MCU flicks, and this nailed it. I need to rewatch it with this in mind actually

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Old 10-18-2013, 09:26 AM   #55
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

X-Men First Class

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Old 10-18-2013, 12:32 PM   #56
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider-Fan View Post
I explain them as all being opinions. I felt the film did a fine job, personally. The Red Skull and Cap were obviously mirrors of one another, and it was VERY apparent with the way the script played out (Red Skull having the decision of pushing passed 70% on the Tesseract just like Rogers does during the experiment that creates Cap, both going MIA in order to achieve their goals, etc). The script does a great job with symbolic imagery, and the Red Skull was supposed to be done in the style of an old school Indiana Jones or Bond villain, and I thought he worked as that type of villain very well.

As for Steve Rogers and Bucky. Cap's film had a lot of story to cover, but it is apparent from the beginning he looks up to Bucky. Bucky is the type of man Steve wanted to be, and Steve was Bucky's inspiration as well. When Bucky died to save Steve, it helped Steve in making the decision to ultimately sacrifice himself in order to stop the Skull's plane. Did he die too suddenly? It's a matter of opinion.

As for the minions dying easy, name me 10 major blockbuster action films where minions are competent and/or don't die easily or in great numbers? Especially, name me Indiana Jones or Bond films, because that is the type of movie Cap 1 was trying to be.

I loved both FC and Cap 1. I enjoyed Cap 1 more. Cap is my favorite superhero, and the film did a great job with him. But, I love both films. It is probably a biased opinion, but my bias doesn't bother me. Most people in these types of debates are biased.
Lol if Cap is your favourite hero then why is your name Spider-Fan?

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Old 10-18-2013, 04:29 PM   #57
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

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Originally Posted by Spider-Fan View Post
I explain them as all being opinions. I felt the film did a fine job, personally. The Red Skull and Cap were obviously mirrors of one another, and it was VERY apparent with the way the script played out (Red Skull having the decision of pushing passed 70% on the Tesseract just like Rogers does during the experiment that creates Cap, both going MIA in order to achieve their goals, etc). The script does a great job with symbolic imagery, and the Red Skull was supposed to be done in the style of an old school Indiana Jones or Bond villain, and I thought he worked as that type of villain very well.

As for Steve Rogers and Bucky. Cap's film had a lot of story to cover, but it is apparent from the beginning he looks up to Bucky. Bucky is the type of man Steve wanted to be, and Steve was Bucky's inspiration as well. When Bucky died to save Steve, it helped Steve in making the decision to ultimately sacrifice himself in order to stop the Skull's plane. Did he die too suddenly? It's a matter of opinion.

As for the minions dying easy, name me 10 major blockbuster action films where minions are competent and/or don't die easily or in great numbers? Especially, name me Indiana Jones or Bond films, because that is the type of movie Cap 1 was trying to be.

I loved both FC and Cap 1. I enjoyed Cap 1 more. Cap is my favorite superhero, and the film did a great job with him. But, I love both films. It is probably a biased opinion, but my bias doesn't bother me. Most people in these types of debates are biased.
Great post.

Beside Avengers,Cap is tied with Thor for being the most re-watchable Marvel film,IMO.I just love it beginning to end.

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Old 10-18-2013, 05:08 PM   #58
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

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Originally Posted by Green Goblin View Post
Lol if Cap is your favourite hero then why is your name Spider-Fan?
When I was very young, I read basically any comics that I could, but the main ones I made a point to collect/follow were anything Spider-Man, Captain America, Iron Man, and Avengers. Fantastic Four and X-Men are probably about tied for 5th. Spidey and Cap were always my 2 favorites, and I was a Spider-Man fan primarily most of my life. However, recent developments into the Spider-Man comic book and other changes in my life have elevated Cap from being my #2 hero to my #1. I have been on this forum for years (since 2003), so I just never decided to change my name. Plus, I love what Marvel has done with their Avengers properties, while I think Sony's recent Spidey reboot was mediocre and I am honestly not that excited for TASM2.

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Old 10-18-2013, 05:20 PM   #59
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

Poor Spidey really has taken a beating in terms of quality in all mediums (films, comics, animation) over the last few years. It has been all downhill since One More Day and the cancellation of the Spectacular Spider-Man cartoon.

I completely understand where you are coming from.


Last edited by Kahran Ramsus; 10-18-2013 at 05:26 PM.
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Old 10-18-2013, 05:32 PM   #60
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

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Originally Posted by Human Torch View Post
Great post.

Beside Avengers,Cap is tied with Thor for being the most re-watchable Marvel film,IMO.I just love it beginning to end.
Of the solo films, Captain America and Thor were also my 2 favorites. Cap I loved more overall, but I absolutely love the score for Thor and what they did with Loki in the film was simply brilliant (added so many layers to the character that not that many really ever played with). Definitely have the most replay value for me as well. But, I was a fan of Iron Man's films and TIH as well (just not to the same degree I was for Cap and Thor).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kahran Ramsus View Post
Poor Spidey really has taken a beating in terms of quality in all mediums (films, comics, animation) over the last few years. It has been all downhill since One More Day and the cancellation of the Spectacular Spider-Man cartoon.

I completely understand where you are coming from.
Yeah, Spidey has taken a massive beating. Spectacular Spider-Man is 100 times better than that crappy USM show that replaced it, his comics by and large have sucked for years (I would say even before One More Day it was bad...The Other was garbage, etc. etc. etc). Spider-Man 3 disappointed, and I wasn't in love with the reboot at all. I actually envy the X-Men series (when you compare it to Spidey's) in that even after the unpopular 3rd installment (and the terrible Origins: Wolverine), FOX has been able to give life back to the X-Men (FC, Wolverine, and looks like DoFP will be awesome) all without hitting the reset button. Sony hit the reset button instead, and it's meh.

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Old 10-18-2013, 05:41 PM   #61
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

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Originally Posted by Kahran Ramsus View Post
Poor Spidey really has taken a beating in terms of quality in all mediums (films, comics, animation) over the last few years. It has been all downhill since One More Day and the cancellation of the Spectacular Spider-Man cartoon.

I completely understand where you are coming from.
I quite liked TASM and Superior. While TASM isn't underrated but Superior is for sure. I found what Dan Slott did to move the franchise forward more interesting than what other writers have done for years.

I do not care for cartoons at all. Despite what some here say, they are targeted at young children and it seems to be making Marvel alot of money.

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Old 10-18-2013, 05:42 PM   #62
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

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Of the solo films, Captain America and Thor were also my 2 favorites. Cap I loved more overall, but I absolutely love the score for Thor and what they did with Loki in the film was simply brilliant (added so many layers to the character that not that many really ever played with). Definitely have the most replay value for me as well. But, I was a fan of Iron Man's films and TIH as well (just not to the same degree I was for Cap and Thor).



Yeah, Spidey has taken a massive beating. Spectacular Spider-Man is 100 times better than that crappy USM show that replaced it, his comics by and large have sucked for years (I would say even before One More Day it was bad...The Other was garbage, etc. etc. etc). Spider-Man 3 disappointed, and I wasn't in love with the reboot at all. I actually envy the X-Men series (when you compare it to Spidey's) in that even after the unpopular 3rd installment (and the terrible Origins: Wolverine), FOX has been able to give life back to the X-Men (FC, Wolverine, and looks like DoFP will be awesome) all without hitting the reset button. Sony hit the reset button instead, and it's meh.
FOX are hitting the reset button with DOFP

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Old 10-18-2013, 05:46 PM   #63
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider-Fan
Yeah, Spidey has taken a massive beating. Spectacular Spider-Man is 100 times better than that crappy USM show that replaced it, his comics by and large have sucked for years (I would say even before One More Day it was bad...The Other was garbage, etc. etc. etc). Spider-Man 3 disappointed, and I wasn't in love with the reboot at all. I actually envy the X-Men series (when you compare it to Spidey's) in that even after the unpopular 3rd installment (and the terrible Origins: Wolverine), FOX has been able to give life back to the X-Men (FC, Wolverine, and looks like DoFP will be awesome) all without hitting the reset button. Sony hit the reset button instead, and it's meh.
The X-Men comics have been far better lately too. All New X-Men and Wolverine and the X-Men in particular.

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Old 10-18-2013, 05:52 PM   #64
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

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FOX are hitting the reset button with DOFP
Not entirely. They're merging the 2 existing X-Men casts, and then using this film as a way to remold the franchise a bit. But, it isn't ignoring any continuity. The Wolverine was VERY grounded in what happened in X3 shaping Wolverine's journey in the film. They have said X3 also won't be ignored in DoFP. Now, the reality may change depending upon what happens in the movie. But, they are not reintroducing the world to the X-Men, like Sony had to with TASM.

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The X-Men comics have been far better lately too. All New X-Men and Wolverine and the X-Men in particular.
I think X-Men fans have a lot to look forward to and be proud of in with how they have been treated lately. I know my interest in the X-Men has peaked once again!

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Old 10-18-2013, 06:01 PM   #65
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

I might be wrong but I think Singer said that he was rebooting the continuity in a similar way to what Star Trek 09 did. I heard that because of the continuity mess the only thing that will ultimately be apart of it will be First Class.

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Old 10-18-2013, 06:13 PM   #66
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

I have heard it will result in a new universe of same kind (but that is par for the course for ANY story involving time travel), but The Wolverine is clearly a prequel to DoFP, and X1-X3 happened within that universe, so it stands to reason at least that as DoFP begins, X1-X3 & FC will count. As for what changes happen due to the time travel elements, we shall see. But, that type of reset button is different than just retelling the origin again, etc. Plus, the actual DoFP storyline involved time travel, so it is I feel an acceptable route.

I am not against reboots, I just don't think they need to be done so soon like they are anymore.


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Old 10-18-2013, 09:13 PM   #67
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

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I might be wrong but I think Singer said that he was rebooting the continuity in a similar way to what Star Trek 09 did. I heard that because of the continuity mess the only thing that will ultimately be apart of it will be First Class.
Singer said that change is a natural result of tampering with the events of one's past, and that he will take the opportunity to fix a few things, but he hasn't outright said he is rebooting continuity. Other than the proposed X-Force film, we still don't know what Fox plans to do with the X-Men franchise after Days of Future Past. My guess is, though, come May, the doors will be left open enough for Fox to do whatever it wants.

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Old 10-19-2013, 02:24 AM   #68
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

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FOX are hitting the reset button with DOFP
No they don't.

Reset means clean slate. And I don't we are getting that from DOFP. It will change some things but not change/wipe out everything that we have seen in the previous X-Men films.

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Old 10-19-2013, 03:05 AM   #69
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

At least Fox has sense enough not to reboot X-Men.Would that Sony was so wise with Web Head....

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Old 10-19-2013, 07:27 AM   #70
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

I wish studios would approach the james Bond route of just continuing with new actors and
directors.You could very easily have done a spider-man 4 with lizard as villain and Gwen Stacy as new love intrest.

I have a feeleing Bryan Singer Is going to use time travel In DOFP to change a few things In
X-Men films he wasn't involved In

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Old 10-20-2013, 08:54 AM   #71
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

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Then how do you explain criticisms like
-Captain America easily wiping out Red Skull's army
-The weak execution Cap's reaction to Bucky's death
-Predictable story
-Red Skull being a weak villain
The only one I might agree with is about Bucky's death. I think it effected Cap just as it should have but the execution of it could have been better. I don't recall Cap easily wiping out Red Skull's army. I DO recall much of it being in montage form but that's not the same thing. The story might have been predictable to those who knew Cap's origin and how he gets to the future from the comics but if sticking to the comics counts as a negative I just don't have anything to say to that other than . Red Skull was a fantastic villain, IMO. One of the best. He had much more distinctiveness than Bacon's bland Shaw(only Guy Pierce is a more bland super-villain,IMO). Plus RS had a wonderful back up in Jones's Zola. Shaw had the awful Emma Frost who couldn't act her way out of a paper bag in that movie.

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Old 10-20-2013, 08:56 AM   #72
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

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At least Fox has sense enough not to reboot X-Men.Would that Sony was so wise with Web Head....
I count that as a negative for FOX, myself. I applaud Sony for seeing the light and saving Spider-man from Raimi. If only someone would do the same for X-Men.

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Old 10-20-2013, 09:02 AM   #73
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

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Fass was the best thing about FC. The bar scene and the coin scene.... two of the best scenes in all of comic book movies
The bar scene bothered me mostly because the score at that point was hella intrusive. The coin scene was ok but in greater context it made zero sense. Basically Charles ended up being Erick's accomplice in killing Shaw. Yet we're supposed to believe he really, really, really was against it. Bull****. And XMFC was littered with stuff like that which is why I don't think it's anything other than decent/ok. I still say it's the 2nd best X-Men film, just that saying that doesn't mean a whole lot since I don't thing any of their films are all that great.

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Old 10-20-2013, 09:08 AM   #74
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To each it's own. First Class gave me actual Nazis and Soviets.
And Cap gave me a script that didn't seem like a hackneyed first draft.

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Old 10-20-2013, 10:57 AM   #75
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Default Re: X-Men First Class v.s Captain America TFA

To all your antiX-Men comments

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