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View Poll Results: How do you feel about Goyer writing the script for the first Superman Batman film
His work on MOS was VERY GOOD. He'll do GREAT. 27 20.45%
His work on MOS was OKAY. I am Skecptical. 30 22.73%
His work on MOS was POOR. I feel dread. 32 24.24%
He NEEDS Affleck's help and guidance to deliver a great script 43 32.58%
Voters: 132. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-17-2013, 05:06 PM   #351
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

I don't why WB hasn't hired a co-writer for Goyer. It boggles my mind. Unless Affleck is gonna do that undercover. And if he does, I hope he applies his skills to all areas of the film, not just to Batman's lines.

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Old 12-17-2013, 05:10 PM   #352
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

People talking about hiring a co-writer, but it seems like I have read a lot of news articles where they always mention someone "uncredited" coming in to help. This person goes uncredited I'm assuming in the actually credits, but don't movies often bring in "uncredited" help when needed?

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I've heard so many people talk about how Superman would kill Lois if they ever had sex, but I've never heard someone make this point before and it's brilliant. If Superman's bodily fluids are so dangerous, then he'd have to use a kryptonite toilet every time he takes a dump.
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Old 12-17-2013, 05:21 PM   #353
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

I don't know to be honest. But I wish they would bring in someone to polish Goyer's dialogue. He can be good with help, I think. I don't even care if they're credited. Just someone please help Goyer!

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Old 12-17-2013, 05:23 PM   #354
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

They didn't bring anyone in last time and I don't think they'll bring in anyone else this time.

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Old 12-17-2013, 05:26 PM   #355
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

Last time they at least had Chris Nolan as a credited writer.

David Goyer and Zack Snyder alone don't inspire much confidence from a writing perspective.

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Old 12-17-2013, 05:30 PM   #356
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

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David Goyer and Zack Snyder alone don't inspire much confidence from a writing perspective.
No, they don't. And I'm not even a hater of either of them. I just recognize they have skills in some areas and limitations in others. But WB seems to be confident in them and is putting them in control of 200 million dollars. Seems odd to me.

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Old 12-17-2013, 05:31 PM   #357
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

Well we all know Ben is in this too. I cannot see him not taking some sort of advisor role if needed because his rep is also on the line, but I don't see that role being credited.

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I've heard so many people talk about how Superman would kill Lois if they ever had sex, but I've never heard someone make this point before and it's brilliant. If Superman's bodily fluids are so dangerous, then he'd have to use a kryptonite toilet every time he takes a dump.
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Old 12-17-2013, 05:32 PM   #358
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

I hope he does, as long as he spreads the love to the whole script, not just his character.

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Old 12-17-2013, 05:33 PM   #359
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

I think Ben will help them work through a scene while onset. But I don't see him actually taking the script and writing it.

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Old 12-17-2013, 05:34 PM   #360
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

Any input from him would be welcome on my part. While I don't always praise his acting, his writing and directing is great.

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Old 12-17-2013, 06:27 PM   #361
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

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I will agree about Goyer and the dialogue. That needs some work...lol. The language is so stiff. Normal people don't talk that like that.
1. It's a movie, and the people within the movie aren't normal. Normal people don't do a lot of things.

2. There are not really any rules for how normal people can talk.

3. What matters when it comes to dialogue is whether a character sounds natural in context, not whether the dialogue itself is entirely natural.

People just seem to pick out one or two cheesy lines and hyperbolize that MAN OF STEEL had bad dialogue throughout.

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Old 12-17-2013, 06:35 PM   #362
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

I don't think Man of Steel had bad dialogue throughout. There were only a couple lines I found really bad. My problem was that there seemed to be a lack of dialogue and whenever someone had more than a couple lines to say, it was exposition rather than a conversation. I wanted to have a bit more talking between characters about their views/feelings, instead of just one character explaining something while another listened or there just being a couple of lines and nothing more. But there were some great moments. The interrogation scene was too brief, but what we saw was great. And there were some great lines like "welcome to the planet," and "Krypton had its chance."

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Old 12-17-2013, 07:44 PM   #363
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

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I don't think Man of Steel had bad dialogue throughout. There were only a couple lines I found really bad. My problem was that there seemed to be a lack of dialogue and whenever someone had more than a couple lines to say, it was exposition rather than a conversation. I wanted to have a bit more talking between characters about their views/feelings, instead of just one character explaining something while another listened or there just being a couple of lines and nothing more. But there were some great moments. The interrogation scene was too brief, but what we saw was great. And there were some great lines like "welcome to the planet," and "Krypton had its chance."
The best part about that line is that it was just as Jor El had been saying from the start, yet I don't recall him ever mentioning that thought to his son.

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Old 12-17-2013, 07:54 PM   #364
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

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1. It's a movie, and the people within the movie aren't normal. Normal people don't do a lot of things.

2. There are not really any rules for how normal people can talk.

3. What matters when it comes to dialogue is whether a character sounds natural in context, not whether the dialogue itself is entirely natural.

People just seem to pick out one or two cheesy lines and hyperbolize that MAN OF STEEL had bad dialogue throughout.
I would say there are some rules for how normal people talk, yet I will agree too much is being placed on the cheesy lines. Though, there are a lot of areas where the dialogue is stiff, and it doesn't allow the characters to really shine. For my two cents even if it is in context, if you don't feel the emotion then something is off.

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I've heard so many people talk about how Superman would kill Lois if they ever had sex, but I've never heard someone make this point before and it's brilliant. If Superman's bodily fluids are so dangerous, then he'd have to use a kryptonite toilet every time he takes a dump.
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Old 12-17-2013, 07:56 PM   #365
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

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The best part about that line is that it was just as Jor El had been saying from the start, yet I don't recall him ever mentioning that thought to his son.
I thought "Krypton had its chance" was essentially the reason Lara and Jor-El didn't plan on escaping Krypton with Kal-el. They didn't want Kal to recreate Krypton as it had been, with people being artificially born and predestined to be a certain thing. They wanted Kal to start things over for Krypton because "Krypton had its chance." Kal did the same thing as his father: He sacrificed Old Krypton for free people that have choice over who they become. Powerful stuff. And genius line by Goyer.

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Old 12-17-2013, 08:00 PM   #366
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

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I thought "Krypton had its chance" was essentially the reason Lara and Jor-El didn't plan on escaping Krypton with Kal-el. They didn't want Kal to recreate Krypton as it had been, with people being artificially born and predestined to be a certain thing. They wanted Kal to start things over for Krypton because "Krypton had its chance." Kal did the same thing as his father: He sacrificed Old Krypton for free people that have choice over who they become. Powerful stuff. And genius line by Goyer.
Yea many might disagree but I feel Goyer is one whom finally cracked the 'why didn't jor/lara join clark' riddle.
For me anyways.

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Old 12-17-2013, 08:06 PM   #367
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

He did crack it. By having Krypton be a society that predetermines who people become and uses up its own resources, they gave Jor-el and Lara a reason to want a do-over. So they had this one little hope to bring Krypton back to a free society in the form of a baby in a spaceship. T'was beautiful.

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Old 12-17-2013, 08:06 PM   #368
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

I thought the script was quite strong for MOS. Both the story and the dialogue (despite a few cheeseball lines).

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Old 12-17-2013, 08:09 PM   #369
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

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I thought the script was quite strong for MOS. Both the story and the dialogue (despite a few cheeseball lines).
Don't get me wrong...I didn't think it was bad. Not at all. I just thought there were some very stiff areas that could have been improved to help better convey the emotion of the scene and the characters themselves.

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I've heard so many people talk about how Superman would kill Lois if they ever had sex, but I've never heard someone make this point before and it's brilliant. If Superman's bodily fluids are so dangerous, then he'd have to use a kryptonite toilet every time he takes a dump.
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Old 12-17-2013, 08:21 PM   #370
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

There were small narrative choices about the MoS script that bugged me.

Clark's directionless life and lack of evidence of writing skills or an ambition to work in a newsroom were one. The way he goes to work at the planet felt a little forced because of this. An audience unfamiliar with the Superman character would think he was going to work there just because his girlfriend works there.

I also thought it was a little stupid that the Kryptonians would want to terraform Earth to match the harsh environment of Krypton. It only took a few hours for Zod to completely adapt to Earth's atmosphere. So if they turned Earth into Krypton wouldn't they lose their powers and be stuck with a planet full of corpses?

Wouldn't a better plan have been to take advantage of their newfound godlike abilities and conquer humanity then use it as a work force?

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Old 12-17-2013, 08:21 PM   #371
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

I thought Jor El's story time, Zod's exposition dream scene, and the last scene between Ghost Jor El and Zod were particularly stiff.

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Old 12-17-2013, 08:26 PM   #372
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

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I thought Jor El's story time, Zod's exposition dream scene, and the last scene between Ghost Jor El and Zod were particularly stiff.
I thought the visuals in Jor El's story time were very strong.

But it did beg the question, if Jor El's image can be presented in a perfect quality hologram, then what's the point of the Pin Art style visual communication? It's even more strange when you consider that the Scout ship is 20,000 years old suggesting they had the technology to make perfect hologram presentations for that long.

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Old 12-17-2013, 08:29 PM   #373
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

lol...lol....LOLOLOL

You know Kelex rocked Wise...lol

I just wish there was more about the Kryptonians and why and how they adapted. I swear to God. I still have a hard time buying the air thing and Zod's quick transition. That for me was the hardest buy in the movie.

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Originally Posted by Rowsdower! View Post
I've heard so many people talk about how Superman would kill Lois if they ever had sex, but I've never heard someone make this point before and it's brilliant. If Superman's bodily fluids are so dangerous, then he'd have to use a kryptonite toilet every time he takes a dump.
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Old 12-17-2013, 08:29 PM   #374
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

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Originally Posted by Wise View Post
There were small narrative choices about the MoS script that bugged me.

Clark's directionless life and lack of evidence of writing skills or an ambition to work in a newsroom were one. The way he goes to work at the planet felt a little forced because of this. An audience unfamiliar with the Superman character would think he was going to work there just because his girlfriend works there.
The way I saw it, Lois is a big reason why he wants to work there. And I assume the idea of journalism was inspired by Lois's profession. There was nothing that suggested to me that he wouldn't have had the right ingredients of qualifications as a 33 year old.

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I also thought it was a little stupid that the Kryptonians would want to terraform Earth to match the harsh environment of Krypton. It only took a few hours for Zod to completely adapt to Earth's atmosphere. So if they turned Earth into Krypton wouldn't they lose their powers and be stuck with a planet full of corpses?

Wouldn't a better plan have been to take advantage of their newfound godlike abilities and conquer humanity then use it as a work force?
I don't think they'd want a world of Kryptonians that can shoot laser beams out of their eyes. It would be a little hard to control, no?


Last edited by FeedOnATreeFrog; 12-17-2013 at 08:39 PM.
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Old 12-17-2013, 08:31 PM   #375
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Default Re: David S. Goyer IS the Script Writer! - Part 2

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I thought the visuals in Jor El's story time were very strong.

But it did beg the question, if Jor El's image can be presented in a perfect quality hologram, then what's the point of the Pin Art style visual communication? It's even more strange when you consider that the Scout ship is 20,000 years old suggesting they had the technology to make perfect hologram presentations for that long.
Maybe...resources for hologram technology became scarce on Krypton?

They did say that they exhausted their resources after all.

Plus, it seems like Jor El's hologram was created from Jor El's consciousness. Would Jor El be able to create hologram replicas of Zod, scenic landscapes, etc?


Last edited by FeedOnATreeFrog; 12-17-2013 at 08:41 PM.
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