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Old 11-21-2013, 02:08 AM   #126
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Originally Posted by FeedOnATreeFrog View Post
I sort of doubt that he was working on that fishing boat so that he could look in the Ocean for spaceships.

I also doubt he worked at that bar because he thought there might be spaceships nearby.
No obviously not, but part of his wandering and searching was for a reason why he was here on earth. He kept moving because whenever he showed his powers he had to go.

This did not seem like a nebulous concept in the movie. Not sure why some missed it.

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Old 11-21-2013, 02:29 AM   #127
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

What I'm saying is that the actual active 'searching' began once he overheard the convo in the bar.

Before that, it seemed like he had a lack of purpose if anything.

But I wouldn't say that it's "drifting for the sake of drifting" either, as the other user wrote.

He's trying to cover his tracks while making ends meet.


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Old 11-21-2013, 02:32 AM   #128
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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He looked exactly the same. Exactly.

The jawline makes it obvious. His hairline and hairstyle makes it obvious. His voice was the same. His mannerisms were similar enough.

Nothing was really changed except for the addition of the glasses, which on their own do nothing.




Despite the fact that he admits in the interview that it's a "corner." They didn't plan it out. They sidestepped it in MoS and now they're going to have to try and contrive something together.
Well, it's a shame you lacked the ability to notice or just failed to remember how Henry Cavill spoke in deeper, stronger tones as Superman in front of officials versus the higher, gentler timbre his voice took when talking to his mother or Lois as Clark. And no, Superman and DP Clark did not look exactly the same.

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Old 11-21-2013, 02:34 AM   #129
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Originally Posted by FeedOnATreeFrog View Post
What I'm saying is that the actual active 'searching' began once he overheard the convo in the bar.

Before that, it seemed like he had a lack of purpose if anything.

But I wouldn't say that it's "drifting for the sake of drifting" either, as the other user wrote.

He's trying to cover his tracks.
That's the only searching we saw. I wouldn't doubt Clark had been all over the world hoping he'd come across some sort of clue.

The thing that clued me to into this is when he went home and told Martha...."I found them".

It's a movie so we got the clue right at the beginning, but it did seem that he was always looking for something.

Agreed...he wasn't drifting for drifting's sake.

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Old 11-21-2013, 03:00 AM   #130
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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He looked exactly the same. Exactly.

The jawline makes it obvious. His hairline and hairstyle makes it obvious. His voice was the same. His mannerisms were similar enough.

Nothing was really changed except for the addition of the glasses, which on their own do nothing.




Despite the fact that he admits in the interview that it's a "corner." They didn't plan it out. They sidestepped it in MoS and now they're going to have to try and contrive something together.
That's because we'd been looking at him for two and a half hours without glasses. If you step back and think of the characters in the story, it works for me. And dude, Cavill looked gawky as ****.

Goyer may see it as a corner, I do not.

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Old 11-21-2013, 03:11 AM   #131
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

I've said this before but celebrities tend to more often than not look completely normal in real life once you take away the glitz and glamour of Hollywood. Same principle applies here.

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Old 11-21-2013, 03:13 AM   #132
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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It is a staple of Superman and has to be there. It is what should be in a Superman movie, naturally.
This actually isn't true. Superman has been done before where he has given up the Clark Kent identity altogether. It could technically be done again. I believe I also read somewhere that they almost eliminated Clark early in the comics' infancy. I think this topic would be playing out a lot differently if they had gone that direction so many years ago.

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They sidestepped it in MoS and now they're going to have to try and contrive something together.
I don't see the issue. Many of us have already "contrived" an answer. The secret identity can work because no one who sees Superman's face clearly will meet Clark. Period. That's all. It fits with what we've already seen (only military, Lois, and Kryptonians saw Superman), and knowing he destroyed that drone, we can trust that he's willing to destroy property to keep his secret (e.g., cameras).

Any changes in Clark's behavior or look would just be extra insurance.

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Old 11-21-2013, 03:21 AM   #133
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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I will admit that I was surprised by some things. Like for instance, when Lois comes to tell Clark how to stop the Kryptonians. She calls him Clark in front a police officer in Smallville and in front of his house. Then there is Supes telling Swanick where he's from.

They did try to put in some touches like when Pete saw Supes and squinted at him like he sort of looked familiar.

It will be interesting to see how they pull this off, but as others have said Lois could be used quite effectively in this aspect. Truthfully, the only people that need to fooled all work at the DP. He just needs to fool them.
Actually in the MOS world, Clark's identity cannot be hidden at all. At All.

For the simple fact that police and military know where his mom lives (because they would visit all the places which Zod visited). And if they know Superman's house and just check the official records, it would be very very very very very very very very very easy for a normal sane journalist or even police officer to figure out that Clark Kent is Superman.

How can then there be a secret identity in B Vs S when plain logic would dictate that it is plain as day than Clark Kent is Superman.

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Old 11-21-2013, 03:34 AM   #134
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

I will not go out on limb here and deny any of that...because well... I do agree with you . But, we all know he has to have a secret identity...so we are going to have to roll with it.

I swear when she called him Clark in front of a Smallville LEO I was like...really? Then he told the general where's he from like Uncle Sam doesn't have the resources to check that out.

Again....not going to go out on limb except to say that they sort of tried to establish that at the end by saying he was making an effort to keep it a secret...lol.

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Old 11-21-2013, 03:37 AM   #135
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

Anyone think the military might just back off, cuz, y'know, he can shoot their drones down with his laser eyes.

More to the point, he has telescopic vision..sniper laser eyes...except, y'know, the red dot does kill you

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Old 11-21-2013, 04:17 AM   #136
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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I will not go out on limb here and deny any of that...because well... I do agree with you . But, we all know he has to have a secret identity...so we are going to have to roll with it.

I swear when she called him Clark in front of a Smallville LEO I was like...really? Then he told the general where's he from like Uncle Sam doesn't have the resources to check that out.

Again....not going to go out on limb except to say that they sort of tried to establish that at the end by saying he was making an effort to keep it a secret...lol.
The cover's already blown. In the real world, some paper would have posted the scoop online in an hour or something.

The way the movie did it, having Zod land at Clark's house and all practically paints it for the entire world.

Surely Goyer cannot explain that one away.

Which makes me realize, they really did not think this through at all.

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Old 11-21-2013, 04:23 AM   #137
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

LOL...I think Goyer can and will explain that away...or simply not address it at all. It's going to be one of the other, but I don't think they'll dismiss the secret identity a la Iron Man. I just can't see that because CK is an essential part of the mythos. They have to figure it out, or just say deal with by not addressing it at all.

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Old 11-21-2013, 04:51 AM   #138
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

They'll probably go the Smallville writer approach and hope/pretend the audience forgot how easy it is for people to know Clark and Superman are the same person beyond just the idea of glasses.

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Old 11-21-2013, 05:11 AM   #139
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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That's a bit too long for me to listen to, but if I had to think on it I would say like it's always been done.

The idea is that people can never realistically believe someone like Clark could be Superman. They just have to reinforce that notion so the audience can understand why that is the case.

It can be easily done like they always do it. Someone says Clark looks like Superman...then everyone starts to think about it. Clark hears them with super hearing then conveniently trips for their benefit and then everyone laughs that thought off as ridiculous.
Of course, i mean, what a nerd


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Plenty of male-led action films fail, yet the actors' gender is not blamed. Why should it be different for women? Especially since far more male-led action films are made than female-led action films?
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Old 11-21-2013, 05:56 AM   #140
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Actually in the MOS world, Clark's identity cannot be hidden at all. At All.

For the simple fact that police and military know where his mom lives (because they would visit all the places which Zod visited). And if they know Superman's house and just check the official records, it would be very very very very very very very very very easy for a normal sane journalist or even police officer to figure out that Clark Kent is Superman.
That stuff would be classified. Only the government would have access to that, what with it being related to an interplanetary war of sorts, and it's not unprecedented for the government to have knowledge of secret identities in other media. As I recall, Amanda Waller told off Batman in the DCAU by telling him he knew he was Bruce Wayne. The government would definitely piece it together in time, especially with Superman admitting that he was from Kansas. And what's the government or military going to do with that knowledge? Publicly reveal his identity? Not likely. They might call on him for help, but there's nothing more they'd probably do.

So yeah, there'll be plenty who know Clark Kent is Superman. Many military people, government people, Smallville people, but he could still keep his identity safe in general. Everyone in the military might be in the know, but Luthor definitely wouldn't be.

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Old 11-21-2013, 05:58 AM   #141
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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That stuff would be classified. Only the government would have access to that, what with it being related to an interplanetary war of sorts, and it's not unprecedented for the government to have knowledge of secret identities in other media. As I recall, Amanda Waller told off Batman in the DCAU by telling him he knew he was Bruce Wayne. The government would definitely piece it together in time, especially with Superman admitting that he was from Kansas. And what's the government or military going to do with that knowledge? Publicly reveal his identity? Not likely. They might call on him for help, but there's nothing more they'd probably do.

So yeah, there'll be plenty who know Clark Kent is Superman. Many military people, government people, Smallville people, but he could still keep his identity safe in general. Everyone in the military might be in the know, but Luthor definitely wouldn't be.
The government is very successful at keeping secrets on a regular basis, so there's no reason to believe that this would be leaked.

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Old 11-21-2013, 06:05 AM   #142
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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That stuff would be classified. Only the government would have access to that, what with it being related to an interplanetary war of sorts, and it's not unprecedented for the government to have knowledge of secret identities in other media. As I recall, Amanda Waller told off Batman in the DCAU by telling him he knew he was Bruce Wayne. The government would definitely piece it together in time, especially with Superman admitting that he was from Kansas. And what's the government or military going to do with that knowledge? Publicly reveal his identity? Not likely. They might call on him for help, but there's nothing more they'd probably do.

So yeah, there'll be plenty who know Clark Kent is Superman. Many military people, government people, Smallville people, but he could still keep his identity safe in general. Everyone in the military might be in the know, but Luthor definitely wouldn't be.
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Old 11-21-2013, 06:22 AM   #143
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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That stuff would be classified. Only the government would have access to that, what with it being related to an interplanetary war of sorts, and it's not unprecedented for the government to have knowledge of secret identities in other media. As I recall, Amanda Waller told off Batman in the DCAU by telling him he knew he was Bruce Wayne. The government would definitely piece it together in time, especially with Superman admitting that he was from Kansas. And what's the government or military going to do with that knowledge? Publicly reveal his identity? Not likely. They might call on him for help, but there's nothing more they'd probably do.

So yeah, there'll be plenty who know Clark Kent is Superman. Many military people, government people, Smallville people, but he could still keep his identity safe in general. Everyone in the military might be in the know, but Luthor definitely wouldn't be.
Today's journalists are intrusive and snoopy as hell. There is some level of confidentiality when someone life might be at stake. Clearly not the case with Supes.

And besides these days the media prints everything, rumors as well and truths and guesses. Just the fact that the aliens landed at a remote house would be enough for local peeps to start googling and getting out information. And when they see there is only one man in the household, not caring whether it is true or not they would atleast print it saying

"Is Clark Kent of __ __ __ Superman????"

or something like that.

Something that happens today in such a public way cannot be clearly hidden.

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Old 11-21-2013, 06:25 AM   #144
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

Clark Kent in the MOS world might not end up being widely known AS Superman but he would atleast become widely known as being a prime suspect to be Superman.

Eitherways, no cover.

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Old 11-21-2013, 06:30 AM   #145
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

After watching MOS a few months back, I came to the conclussion that Goyer is not a bad writer, bud is higly overrated. Best scripts he has written shines because of the performance of both directors and actors; but the movies always have some kind of heavy plothole, deus ex, or bad developed characters.

I'm really not surprised that he didn't thought about Clark being a reporter, i have the impression that he don't think things through.

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Old 11-21-2013, 06:41 AM   #146
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I'm really not surprised that he didn't thought about Clark being a reporter, i have the impression that he don't think things through.
I think it's simply that it was not a priority for him and Snyder. They wanted to tell some "scifi" movie, where I use the term "scifi" loosely. It's not that he doesn't know how to write human Clark, it's that he doesn't care.

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Old 11-21-2013, 06:47 AM   #147
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

The Superman story is an easy and well-known archetype to follow.

Last survivor (until Kara) of his highly technological alien race, stronger than any mortal man. Proud and powerful, with a strong idea of right and wrong, constantly struggling with the idea of being allpowerful, but being sensitive and vulnerable.

Reporter and superhero. And he didn't think about him being a reporter?

That's weak :/

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Old 11-21-2013, 06:49 AM   #148
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

Cool, another Goyer bashing thread. Don't we already have about 3?

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Old 11-21-2013, 07:08 AM   #149
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

I think Goyer usully works best when involved with Nolan, outside that he has many problems, The Man of Steal, while the Nolan brothers were involved, was kind of weak when it comes to plot.

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Old 11-21-2013, 07:36 AM   #150
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Lois shouting is name with a policeman nearby, Clark revealing to the military where and when he arrived on Earth, the blog-guy saying on TV that Lois Lane knows the alien's identity ... Is this sharp execution for you or even good storytelling?

And to an extent, I even have a problem with how Lois finding out Clark's identity was showcased in the film. They made it look like it was a piece of cake.

By the end of the movie, the military should know his identity, along with almost everyone in Smallville (and anyone able to make the connection between Clark, Superman and Smallville) and Lois would be in permanent danger because the all world knows she knows the truth about Superman.

That's textbook bad storytelling. The way Goyer handled Superman's secret identity is a shame, especially because he had the opportunity to do things differently this time around.
I was speaking specifically about the DP scenario as that is what Goyer was asked and what he was speaking about.

As for the rest, Goyer has said that the people of Smallville know and are keeping the secret. And with the military, what does it matter if they know and why would they just spread the word? Superman is their ally, anonymity is a plus.

And why shouldn't Lois be able to find it out. She's supposed to be a brilliant reporter. If she was stupid, I'd say that is bad handling of her character.

And considering you have a problem with the way Goyer handled Superman's identity, I'd say he did things quite differently.

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Anyone who cares could google both of them.
Well, celebrities have 1000's of pictures taken of them -- sometimes 24 a second. Superman doesn't have to post his mug all around town and Clark surely doesn't need a facebook page. Googling a regular person and coming up with a picture is much harder than a celebrity.


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If Superman is a public figure though, as he is traditionally portrayed, then it would be hard to swallow that no one in Metropolis (especially in a building full of journalists) would recognize him as Superman.
Then the problem is with the identity dating back to nearly the beginning of the character and has less to do with Goyer... as you've pointed out.

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