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Old 11-21-2013, 07:50 AM   #151
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Googling a regular person and coming up with a picture is much harder than a celebrity.
Not for reporters, not today, almost every online publication posts a small pic of the writer next to the byline. Even many print publications do that. Plus the mandates of many corps for their reporters to have twitter and linkedin profiles and the social media interaction that goes with journalism or if he is doing video reporting for the web or TV.

For a reporter it is almost impossible to hide their face. I have friends who work in journalism and goggling them brings up lots and lots of stuff.

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Old 11-21-2013, 07:58 AM   #152
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

I don't think he needs to explain clark kent and the whole glasses thing because this happened:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bd4XkV5ojT8

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Old 11-21-2013, 08:09 AM   #153
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

There was also the TV show I Get That a Lot that had celebs doing regular jobs.

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Old 11-21-2013, 08:33 AM   #154
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

I hope they don't even address the absurdness of the Clark Kent disguise. It's a sci-fi movie about a flying alien in a cape, just let it be. It's not any less believable now than it was 50 years ago, but people were able to enjoy it and look past the issue.

Also, I don't think Lois would be in any danger because she knows his secret ID, because why would anyone know she knows his secret ID? When the guy on TV said "lois lane knows who he is" he was referring to the alien living on earth that Zod was searching for. For all they know, Lois found and met the alien called Superman/Kal-El, but that doesn't mean she knows he has a private life with a secret ID.
I think Snyder/Goyer put the issue to rest when at the end of MOS Superman destroyed the drone and told the General adamantly that the government wasn't going to figure out where he hangs his cape. So hopefully they move on from this plot point and focus on other things for the next movie.

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Old 11-21-2013, 08:39 AM   #155
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Not for reporters, not today, almost every online publication posts a small pic of the writer next to the byline. Even many print publications do that. Plus the mandates of many corps for their reporters to have twitter and linkedin profiles and the social media interaction that goes with journalism or if he is doing video reporting for the web or TV.

For a reporter it is almost impossible to hide their face. I have friends who work in journalism and goggling them brings up lots and lots of stuff.
Not all companies have the same mandates so it's entirely likely that the DP wouldn't require that of Clark. Regardless, Goyer would have to go out of his way to say whether or not there are pictures of Clark out there for this point to even matter. It's completely hypothetical and therefore moot.

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Old 11-21-2013, 08:58 AM   #156
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

Well at this point everything is moot isn't it.

Goyer's script represents cheese in two ways - cheesy AND full of holes.

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Old 11-21-2013, 08:59 AM   #157
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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I don't think he needs to explain clark kent and the whole glasses thing because this happened:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bd4XkV5ojT8
The problem is not even people recognizing him.

It is that they know where the alien ship landed and who lived in that house and they knew the aliens were after one single man (public broadcast) and they know that there is only one man in the above house.

So even without photos they know Clark Kent = Superman.

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Old 11-21-2013, 09:20 AM   #158
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Well at this point everything is moot isn't it.

Goyer's script represents cheese in two ways - cheesy AND full of holes.
The things that aren't moot are the things that are in MOS, which have evidence behind them. Things we talk about for a movie yet to be made on the other hand...

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Old 11-21-2013, 09:28 AM   #159
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Allow me...

my work is done here. Need more??





any questions?
Between this, and this, from 0:28 on, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIaF0QKtY0c there's no reason to "question" the disguise, IMHO.

No, it doesn't have to be the feeble, dorky, Clark Kent to achieve this, but in that one shot (one of my favourite in cinema history, for several reasons*) with no words, they NAILED it. Just that posture change, the confidence, the attitude, etc, before he even says a word, you believe the "disguise."

If Clark is a modest, humble guy, doesn't have to be goofy, or anything resembling Reeve's brilliant portrayal, but just exudes a different attitude/projection of his personality, then they can make this completely believable.

They don't have to "explain" it, they just have to SHOW it. That's one of the fundamentals of good story telling/film making.

Although I actually kind of liked what they did with Lois and Clark, with Lois tracking him down just like an intrepid reporter like herself would do, I think that the first two Donner/Reeve Superman films (let's ignore Lester for a while, and by for a while, I mean forever) actually made the "how does she not see it" make sense.

In those films she DOES see it. Some people talked about how, in MOS, they lost a lot of the by play of their relationship that came from her not knowing, but Donner showed that it wasn't one or the other. Yes, there were a lot of more silly/goofy elements to the byplay they used, but that all could have been updated to be more realistic.

In S:TM and Superman II the by play doesn't come from her trying to figure out who Superman is, and him trying to hide it; she clearly sees the resemblance, as made clear in the beginning of the second film. The by play comes from her trying to prove it, and him trying to cover up.

This could easily work today by having her not knowing, but starting to suspect it, but not being as out there about it as Kidder's Lois was. Being more of an investigative reporter trying to uncover a story without her subject suspecting a thing.

Clark could, given his senses, see this, and still be working to counter her efforts if you will.

Sadly, they obviously can't do this with the way they've gone. Hell, even if she did NOT track him down in MOS they probably couldn't go this route. If Superman is exposed to the world, and suddenly Clark shows up right at the end of everything, then I think, unless she was just so blown away/distracted by Superman, there's no way she wouldn't jut look at him and say "you're kidding, right?"

Clark would almost have to be introduced to the Daily Planet BEFORE Superman appears, or at least before anyone has developed any significant familiarity with him.
For example, Superman is introduced with some big rescue, like the Air Force One big save, so everyone is aware of his existence, but no one knows really anything about him, barely knows his face, etc, and then Clark shows up at the Planet, and THEN Superman starts to become more familiar to the general public.

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Old 11-21-2013, 09:33 AM   #160
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

Man...... Reeve REAALLY nailed that. Though, even Tom Welling was able to pull of the different personas:


VIDEO-CLick to Watch!:


There is another video I would've liked to post for the Welling example, but it would've spoiled the series finale for those who haven't seen it.


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Old 11-21-2013, 09:40 AM   #161
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Man...... Reeve REAALLY nailed that. Though, even Tom Welling was able to pull of the different personas:


VIDEO-CLick to Watch!:


There is another video I would've liked to post for the Welling example, but it would've spoiled the series finale for those who haven't seen it.
I love that milkshake line.

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Old 11-21-2013, 10:16 AM   #162
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Well, it's a shame you lacked the ability to notice or just failed to remember how Henry Cavill spoke in deeper, stronger tones as Superman in front of officials versus the higher, gentler timbre his voice took when talking to his mother or Lois as Clark. And no, Superman and DP Clark did not look exactly the same.
It's a shame you lacked the ability to notice that Cavill demonstrated minimal acting range. Most of his lines were monotone. He was serviceable at best. The Jor-El exposition scene with him is a good example of that.

Regardless, here's the final Daily Planet scene of MoS:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBt8f...etailpage#t=52

Same voice. Same posture. Same hairline. Obvious Cavill jaw. The cheft chin. The crooked nose. Dead giveaways.

The only real difference was the fact that he was smiling. Something that Superman didn't do throughout the film because he was brooding. The performance, or lack of, does demonstrate that they had not planned out how CK would logically work in the MoS world yet, as Goyer mentioned. It was just sidestepped.

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Old 11-21-2013, 10:22 AM   #163
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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"Obviously we sidestepped it in this movie (Man Of Steel)"

Around the 1:12:00 mark.

http://www.empireonline.com/news/story.asp?NID=37841

Goyer admits he wrote himself into a "corner" for the sequel. They never came up with a plan on how the 'Clark Kent' disguise could make sense in a film grounded in logic.

I wonder how they'll realistically explain it in the sequel or if they'll bother to explain it.
It couldn't work? Superman being a reporter couldn't work but a billionaire who dresses up like a Bat using a car that anyone could look up and figure that they are at Wayne Enterprises could work but a guy as a reporter couldn't?

You ****ing hack.

I've always felt that Clark should have started the film already as a reporter. He's not Superman yet but knows he has powers. Later on he finds out where he's from and becomes Superman.

People could ****ing believe that one little proton shot from a one man aircraft could destroy a ****ing Death Star. You could have had maybe Clark state in the car when he says he doesn't want to be a farmer say he would like to go to college and be a reporter.

As far the disguise. If you just had a ****ing scene like in Birthright or All Star where he creates the Clark Kent identity, he could ****ing work. Him and his parents talking about appearance. Wearing the glasses, changing your voice pattern, changing your stance & walk, fixing your hair.

The more I see and watch this film, the more disrespect I see from Goyer with Superman. Superman's problem isn't him wearing underwear on the outside, it isn't the glasses, it isn't Lois not knowing the truth, it isn't the fact he doesn't kill. Hell I live in Charlotte. Muggsy is a basketball legend here. I know what he looks like along with the city. One day I was in line at Foot Locker and he was in front of me in line. I didn't notice until someone said hi to him and I said hi to him and I'm a fan.

I was caught off guard because I wasn't looking for Muggsy, I was just buying some shoes. When people think of Superman, they shouldn't think he has a secret identity. Why would a God want to live among us and have a job and pay bills and taxes. It's more "why would Superman be someone" than "who is Superman's secret identity".

Stop having a realism mind. People will believe the dumbest ****. If Superman was real and did something heroic in today's world, Miley at the VMAs twerking like an idiot would still get more press because the world is stupid.

Goyer you are nothing but a hack.

ONE MORE GODDAMN THING: some people said Zod said Superman has been living among us. Ok but why would he continue? Why would he keep living among us when his secret has been revealed. In Kingdom Come, Bruce's secret is revealed to the world. What does he do? He stops being Bruce Wayne and bes Batman. They even refer to Bruce as The Batman. In Injustice, Bruce's secret is revealed. So he stops being Bruce and bes Batman full time.

It could work.


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Old 11-21-2013, 10:22 AM   #164
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

Superman was smiling when he learn how to fly, When he came back to visit his mother, He smirked a little in the interrogation scene with Lois, He smiled when he learn his name from Jor El those are the only moments I can think of. So no it wasn't only during the last scene.

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Old 11-21-2013, 10:26 AM   #165
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

I suspect that there isn't a Clark Kent persona at all...

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Old 11-21-2013, 10:33 AM   #166
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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I suspect that there isn't a Clark Kent persona at all...
you'd' be wrong. You know no point having put the glasses on at the end then. That was his CK Metropolis persona being born.

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Old 11-21-2013, 10:48 AM   #167
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Man...... Reeve REAALLY nailed that. Though, even Tom Welling was able to pull of the different personas:


VIDEO-CLick to Watch!:


There is another video I would've liked to post for the Welling example, but it would've spoiled the series finale for those who haven't seen it.

That's just because Welling IS awkward, at acting.

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Old 11-21-2013, 10:50 AM   #168
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

Talking about characterization and development, not superflous plot detailing.

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Old 11-21-2013, 10:54 AM   #169
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Talking about characterization and development, not superflous plot detailing.

OK I get ya.

Seeing as it was the end of the film where his persona is born we really don't know until the sequel has been released. But I have seen a Henry Cavill interview where the person asks him how would he play the two different roles? It was during the build up to MOS release.

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Old 11-21-2013, 10:55 AM   #170
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

Facial recognition is a neurological, subconscious process. "In the real world" the link between Superman and Batman would be made by anybody who got to know them both an got to interact with them, like Lois Lane, and pretty quickly.

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Old 11-21-2013, 10:57 AM   #171
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

Regarding the new film series, the disguise works for one main reason: very few people besides Lois, Martha, and a select few soldiers ever saw Superman's face. In a world of over 7 billion, there's pretty good odds most wouldn't recognize him, let alone expect him to show up at the Daily Planet.

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Old 11-21-2013, 11:03 AM   #172
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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Facial recognition is a neurological, subconscious process. "In the real world" the link between Superman and Batman would be made by anybody who got to know them both an got to interact with them, like Lois Lane, and pretty quickly.
How would they identify Batman just based on interactions? Batman acts nothing like Bruce Wayne. They don't even use the same voice.

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Old 11-21-2013, 11:04 AM   #173
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

We don't recognize features per se, but proportions. That's why you can see someone from far away and guess who it is.

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Old 11-21-2013, 11:05 AM   #174
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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How would they identify Batman just based on interactions? Batman acts nothing like Bruce Wayne. They don't even use the same voice.
Well, who has the means to afford to be Batman? And out of those, who has to motivation to take on a one man crusade against justice? Maybe it's the billionaire who witnessed his parent's being murdered.

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Old 11-21-2013, 11:13 AM   #175
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Default Re: Goyer Admits They Didn't Plan How 'Reporter Clark Kent' Could Make Sense

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We don't recognize features per se, but proportions. That's why you can see someone from far away and guess who it is.
Hence why he spends most of his time in the dark and/or covering his body with the cape.

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