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Old 11-24-2013, 09:24 PM   #326
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

I don't think they both shouldn't have trunks in order to be the same, but I do think they both shouldn't have trunks for the same reason.

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Old 11-24-2013, 09:29 PM   #327
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

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You might not have been. But you were apparently fooled by them nontheless.

Gotta be honest, I don't recall him looking blankly at the screen after his triumph in The Pit.

I don't see any fear of death on his face in The Bat. I don't see much of anything. He's just blank, maybe calm. But since we haven't seen him "descend" into calm, it's got next to no impact as a performance. They're utilizing a classic cinematic trick. The actor does more or less NOTHING, and the camera either pushes in, or they work with editing and sound and lighting.

But he's doing next to nothing there as an actor, even with his eyes. Well, that's not fair, he closes his mouth. The least they could have had him do is slowly close his eyes, a la Ra's Al Ghul in BATMAN BEGINS. That would at least have been full circle, tying him to and separating him from Ra's and also full circle from when he opens his eyes as adult Wayne in the prison in BEGINS.

But nope. He just stares out the window. Bale gave more emotion to "I've got to steeply climb The Bat over this tall building" than this supposed moment of reflection and tranquility. Heck, he gave more emotion to "waiting for the canopy of The Bat to close".
What was he supposed to do? Did you want to see him cry or smile? Sometimes the absence of emotion captures the moment perfectly. I don't know about you, but I wouldn't know what emotion to feel if I was facing certain death after saving millions. I think this is a true nitpick....if Christain Bale's acting is criticized so much, you know a movie has been nitpicked to death.

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Old 11-24-2013, 10:26 PM   #328
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

What was he supposed to do?

Stay with me here...

Act.

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Old 11-24-2013, 11:16 PM   #329
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

Lolol people are looking way too deep into a blank expression Bale makes right before the bomb goes off

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Old 11-24-2013, 11:21 PM   #330
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

There's no need to be condescending. Yes, we are aware that you think he should "Act", but you don't seem to specify exactly what emotion you wanted him to "Act" out.

Perhaps, just maybe, his calm look of relief while also displaying a sense of fear and his deep, expressive breathing WAS his acting?

I'm really interested in what you wanted to see from him. Extreme face contortions? Tearful eyes?

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Old 11-24-2013, 11:24 PM   #331
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

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You might not have been. But you were apparently fooled by them nontheless.

Gotta be honest, I don't recall him looking blankly at the screen after his triumph in The Pit.

I don't see any fear of death on his face in The Bat. I don't see much of anything. He's just blank, maybe calm. But since we haven't seen him "descend" into calm, it's got next to no impact as a performance. They're utilizing a classic cinematic trick. The actor does more or less NOTHING, and the camera either pushes in, or they work with editing and sound and lighting.

But he's doing next to nothing there as an actor, even with his eyes. Well, that's not fair, he closes his mouth. The least they could have had him do is slowly close his eyes, a la Ra's Al Ghul in BATMAN BEGINS. That would at least have been full circle, tying him to and separating him from Ra's and also full circle from when he opens his eyes as adult Wayne in the prison in BEGINS.

But nope. He just stares out the window. Bale gave more emotion to "I've got to steeply climb The Bat over this tall building" than this supposed moment of reflection and tranquility. Heck, he gave more emotion to "waiting for the canopy of The Bat to close".
Hafizbat said it perfectly, but I'll add this:

The whole point of me bringing up the Pit scene is that they both complement one other nicely. Otherwise, if it wasn't the fear of death, then why doesn't he just sacrifice himself and die for Gotham's sake?

That being said, it seems very obvious to me that being this close to death, that Wayne had the urge to let go before he harmed himself. The Bat scene wrapped that idea up nicely, IMO.

But jesus christ guys, I knew TDKR wasn't well-received amongst the fanbase but I never expected this much vitriol over a subjective analysis. Agree to disagree is one thing (since what I said is completely subjective), but to completely bash (not you, the Guard) Bale's acting skills because of what I said...

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What was he supposed to do? Did you want to see him cry or smile? Sometimes the absence of emotion captures the moment perfectly. I don't know about you, but I wouldn't know what emotion to feel if I was facing certain death after saving millions. I think this is a true nitpick....if Christain Bale's acting is criticized so much, you know a movie has been nitpicked to death.
So much this. It's the emotion of calmness (or lack thereof if people are so adamant) that Wayne shows that captures the brilliance of the scene.

If I knew there were people that nitpicked Bale's acting, I wouldn't have opened this apparent can of worms to begin with...jeez.


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Old 11-24-2013, 11:29 PM   #332
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

I fail to see how criticizing Bale's performance means that the movie has been nit picked to death. Personally Rises is the only Bat-film in which I truly liked Bale's performance as Wayne/Batman but I respect the opinions of the people who disagree with me.

Outside of the mostly good performances I think that people have been way too easy on Rises as a film and haven't nit picked it enough. It's the first Nolan film which felt lazy and poorly thoughtout to me. I'm not a huge fan of Batman Begins either but I never felt laziness in that film.

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Old 11-24-2013, 11:42 PM   #333
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

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I fail to see how criticizing Bale's performance means that the movie has been nit picked to death. Personally Rises is the only Bat-film in which I truly liked Bale's performance as Wayne/Batman but I respect the opinions of the people who disagree with me.

Outside of the mostly good performances I think that people have been way too easy on Rises as a film and haven't nit picked it enough. It's the first Nolan film which felt lazy and poorly thoughtout to me. I'm not a huge fan of Batman Begins either but I never felt laziness in that film.

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Old 11-24-2013, 11:42 PM   #334
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

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I don't think they both shouldn't have trunks in order to be the same, but I do think they both shouldn't have trunks for the same reason.
UUMMMM ... Whut?

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Old 11-24-2013, 11:48 PM   #335
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

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UUMMMM ... Whut?
I think they both shouldn't have trunks because trunks are outdated and look silly, not because they need to have similar costumes and be in a little trunkless club together.

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Old 11-24-2013, 11:55 PM   #336
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Well, firstly, I have more female friends than male, so you are making a significant assumption there. Secondly, I think the respect afforded to WW transcends the manner in which she is occasionally drawn. The flesh she exposes is, generally, treated as incidental by writers, though the art tends not to suggest that. Overall, I would argue that WW is a character that embodies many feminist virtues; but has bare legs. I would be more troubled by the contemporary treatment if characters like Firestar or Catwoman.
Right. You have to approach female character dersign the same way you do male--on a case by case basis.

Generally speaking, I applaud any attempt to de-sexualize a female character's costume, except in cases where using sex is part of that character's personality. Wonder Woman's case is a little more complicaterd--as one of the few female heroes with a legitimately iconic appearance, you run into problems when you start throwing things like pants into the mix, even though they would seem to, at least superficially, suit her.

When you think a little more carefully about it, though, given her upbringing in a Spartan-esque society that celebrated femininity and, by virtue of being all female, certainly wouldn't have the same view of bare legs as our own, it's difficult to imagine that Wonder Woman would give a crap how much skin she's showing anyway. Moreover, warriors from the societies upon which she draws influence would have gone pantless.

In the comics, Cliff Chang draws a killer Wonder Woman interpretation that is both classic and non-sexual. It doesn't look like a bathing suit. On film, costume designers may find an armoured skirt is more appropriate, but really, if ever there was a female hero who could get away without wearing pants, it's Wonder Woman.

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Old 11-24-2013, 11:55 PM   #337
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Lolol people are looking way too deep into a blank expression Bale makes right before the bomb goes off
This is called fandom. When people have an actor they worship, they will literally see anything in that actor's performance that they want to see.

Its not the way with me personally, if my favorite actors give bland performances, I'll be the first to admit it and not make up stuff.

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Old 11-24-2013, 11:57 PM   #338
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

About trunks, Snyder has spoken so decisively and strongly against them during MOS promo, (and he was commenting upon the entire underwear thing for all superhero films) that you will basically not see them in the DCCU ever. So it is a moot point.

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Old 11-24-2013, 11:58 PM   #339
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

bale had taco bell before he got into the batlobster. the expression on his face before the bomb goes off says as much

* ***k, i really shouldn't have had that 7 layer burrito*

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Old 11-24-2013, 11:59 PM   #340
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

No, I don't want contortions and crying from Batman. But something more than just straightening his head and shutting his mouth? That might have been nice.

We never see him go from anything TO calm, or, more to the point, we don't see the natural progression of emotion because the editing is designed to trick us.

Being relieved involves certain things. Exhaling. Collecting yourself. An emotional letdown of some kind from anxiety/fear, or whatever previous emotion you were experiencing.

It's much the same problem I have with Alfred just bursting into tears at the Wayne grave. There's no real build to the emotions by the actor, or if there was, it's been hacked to death in the editing room.

In that "calm" shot, Batman is just CALM. Well, great. That's their intent. But it's not a good execution of the emotion (because of the way its all edited), and it's not nearly enough for the moment right before Batman's apparent death by sacrifice.

It's ultimately just Bale in the cowl...doing next to nothing. If he's performing there, he's doing a **** job of it.

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Old 11-25-2013, 12:00 AM   #341
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

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This is called fandom. When people have an actor they worship, they will literally see anything in that actor's performance that they want to see.

Its not the way with me personally, if my favorite actors give bland performances, I'll be the first to admit it and not make up stuff.


What a crock of ********. I'm the one who made that post and I'm not by any means a Bale worshipper. The whole reason I made that post is because I saw a [subjective] connection between two scenes. So maybe it's in your best interests to tread lightly before labelling someone as a worshipper or saying that stuff is made up.

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Old 11-25-2013, 12:02 AM   #342
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Right. You have to approach female character dersign the same way you do male--on a case by case basis.

Generally speaking, I applaud any attempt to de-sexualize a female character's costume, except in cases where using sex is part of that character's personality. Wonder Woman's case is a little more complicaterd--as one of the few female heroes with a legitimately iconic appearance, you run into problems when you start throwing things like pants into the mix, even though they would seem to, at least superficially, suit her.

When you think a little more carefully about it, though, given her upbringing in a Spartan-esque society that celebrated femininity and, by virtue of being all female, certainly wouldn't have the same view of bare legs as our own, it's difficult to imagine that Wonder Woman would give a crap how much skin she's showing anyway. Moreover, warriors from the societies upon which she draws influence would have gone pantless.

In the comics, Cliff Chang draws a killer Wonder Woman interpretation that is both classic and non-sexual. It doesn't look like a bathing suit. On film, costume designers may find an armoured skirt is more appropriate, but really, if ever there was a female hero who could get away without wearing pants, it's Wonder Woman.
All this is well and good, but it does not apply to a modern movie. I will sink with that ship.

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Old 11-25-2013, 12:31 AM   #343
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Default Re: The Batsuit Thread - Part 8

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Right. You have to approach female character dersign the same way you do male--on a case by case basis.

Generally speaking, I applaud any attempt to de-sexualize a female character's costume, except in cases where using sex is part of that character's personality. Wonder Woman's case is a little more complicaterd--as one of the few female heroes with a legitimately iconic appearance, you run into problems when you start throwing things like pants into the mix, even though they would seem to, at least superficially, suit her.

When you think a little more carefully about it, though, given her upbringing in a Spartan-esque society that celebrated femininity and, by virtue of being all female, certainly wouldn't have the same view of bare legs as our own, it's difficult to imagine that Wonder Woman would give a crap how much skin she's showing anyway. Moreover, warriors from the societies upon which she draws influence would have gone pantless.

In the comics, Cliff Chang draws a killer Wonder Woman interpretation that is both classic and non-sexual. It doesn't look like a bathing suit. On film, costume designers may find an armoured skirt is more appropriate, but really, if ever there was a female hero who could get away without wearing pants, it's Wonder Woman.
I wouldn't try to justify the not wearing pants on actual Amazon tradition. I mean, I don't see Wonder Woman cutting off her right breast, so I don't think historical/mythical accuracy was in the comic creators minds.

I mean, would having her wear pants really change the style of the costume that much? I don't think it would. At the same time, I do think a more respectful costume could be made using a battle skirt, but still, if she wore pants, would people really be that ticked off? I personally don't think it's a big deal.

Anywho, back on Batman again. How do people feel about a cape that goes over the shoulders and covers his chest? I would like to see that this time around as well, to really evoke that Dracula type silhouette.

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Old 11-25-2013, 02:01 AM   #344
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What a crock of ********. I'm the one who made that post and I'm not by any means a Bale worshipper. The whole reason I made that post is because I saw a [subjective] connection between two scenes. So maybe it's in your best interests to tread lightly before labelling someone as a worshipper or saying that stuff is made up.
Well if you aren't a Bale worshipper, you certainly gave a very good impression. There is no knowing actually because they are closet Bale worshippers everywhere.

Peace then. And you can see what you want to see and others can not see what they don't think there is. Again, peace.

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Old 11-25-2013, 02:04 AM   #345
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Old 11-25-2013, 02:04 AM   #346
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About the sexualization of WW, just wanna say that Snyder might not be the best person for that. His lead superhero in Watchmen Silp Spectre (both mother and daughter), were pulsating sexual fantasies. The daughter wore a tight glistening costume and walked in slow motion. Even his lead heroines in Sucker Punch all fought in skimpy lingerie with with many heaving bosoms and cleavage shots.

Snyder actually sexualizes everything, even Superman. So he might not be the go to guy if you want to desexualize WW.

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Old 11-25-2013, 02:29 AM   #347
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About the sexualization of WW, just wanna say that Snyder might not be the best person for that. His lead superhero in Watchmen Silp Spectre (both mother and daughter), were pulsating sexual fantasies. The daughter wore a tight glistening costume and walked in slow motion. Even his lead heroines in Sucker Punch all fought in skimpy lingerie with with many heaving bosoms and cleavage shots.
There's an actual cinematic reason for both of those things.

It's not just that Snyder likes boobies, though I'm sure he does.

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Old 11-25-2013, 02:47 AM   #348
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Well if you aren't a Bale worshipper, you certainly gave a very good impression. There is no knowing actually because they are closet Bale worshippers everywhere.

Peace then. And you can see what you want to see and others can not see what they don't think there is. Again, peace.
Extrapolating all that from one post...seriously? If I was a Bale worshipper, I think you'd be able to find more blatant examples. That being said, your second statement makes you a hypocrite. Labelling others based on what you think, rather than the reality of the situation.

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Old 11-25-2013, 03:00 AM   #349
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About trunks, Snyder has spoken so decisively and strongly against them during MOS promo, (and he was commenting upon the entire underwear thing for all superhero films) that you will basically not see them in the DCCU ever. So it is a moot point.
Do you have a link to that? I would sincerely like to read these comments.

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Old 11-25-2013, 03:10 AM   #350
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had to
Ahh yes, the usual sarcastic gif response that adds nothing to the argument. So, aside of this, do you have any constructive point as to why I am wrong with my position? I am not saying that Bale is worthless as an actor, but after BB, his Batman role is clearly not on par with his first attempt.

How can you disagreee with this? I don't know maybe it's that gowdawful jigsaw puzzle suit that makes it worse in my eyes and the complete drop of mysticism of the Batman persona. Or maybe it is the director's fault. But the result is undeniable.


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