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Old 03-18-2014, 11:44 AM   #601
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There wasnt for Frigga's I will admit, though the scene still lacked emotion for me. With Loki he screams at him dying, then they make to the cave and talk for a moment until Jane's phone goes off and it turns into a comedic moment, that was really poorly placed humour IMO. Loki had 'died' literally minutes ago.

I think Selvig's joke later to Thor would have been the right time for a comedy element to follow.
That's a better way to put it than to specify 30 seconds which isn't correct. I'm a bit surprised that you think it would have been fine with the Selvig joke though since that's not even 2 minutes after the phone rings and from the phone moment on the grief is still not very present since you instead focus on how they are getting back.

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Again, I actually thought that humour worked. It was mostly the stuff in the 2nd half of the movie which ruins things for me (though not the Thor and Loki stuff). And with Taylor, he stated that Marvel demanded more humour be added to the movie, and he just said he went along with it.
It's subjective as always but you can't be sure which parts he wanted and which parts he didn't want, if there are such parts. All the things I've heard that have sounded negative from him have been about other things. For example, the scene after Loki's death, as you criticized, doesn't seem like it's an addition since it's directly crucial to the story moving forward. It's also been a common thing to try to say that active producers, like Marvel has, are much more uncommon in movie making than they really are.

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Old 03-18-2014, 11:47 AM   #602
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I haven't heard it as I only have the digital version but I'd assume there was something else in place to give a bit of information. It would be hard to understand the plot if you just remove the prologue and don't add any other info.

Other than that I think the Vanaheim battle was probably a very early scene, and likely the full one. I can imagine that they cut it down to not delay Thor's entrance too long into the movie when they added two other scenes before it.
That makes a lot of sense and helps me understand why they abbreviated the beginning of the battle. I thought the Loki trial scene was excellent and really helped the film so I don't begrudge its inclusion.

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Old 03-18-2014, 09:43 PM   #603
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Fair enough. I've said my piece on Man of Steel on other forums so I don't feel a need to go into detail and I don't like harping on films that other people seem to like. Honestly even though the final battle seemed very dragged out, I actually really liked the film when I first saw it and bought it as soon as it came out on Blu-Ray. However, I liked it less and less with repeat viewings and after having time to ruminate on it realized a lot of the criticisms against it were spot on. Whereas with The Dark World the more I think about it and watch it the more I like it. We're similar in that I'm mostly a Marvel guy but love Superman. This is just one area we diverge.
We are complete opposites on this one, for me MOS gets better with more viewings while TDW gets worse, IM3 got worse with repeat viewings for me as well, I loved it when I first saw it.



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You may very well be right. That's something we'll never know for sure. Both Iron Man 3 and Thor received similar percentage bumps (of course Iron Man 3 came immediately after and had the benefit of the 3D bump as well). But if either of the films were turkeys they would not have done as well as they did and not have gotten repeat viewings in the theater. Plus if everyone who saw Avengers saw Thor 2 it would have done even better at the box office. Based on the gross differential between the two post Avengers films, I think the people who saw the films were the ones who were interested in each respective character's story arc.
TDW was in 3D as well so got the same bump as IM3. And among box office guru's its certain that Thor 2 got a boost from The Avengers, as did IM3, there is no doubting they both got a boost in BO because of how much people enjoyed TA, Cap 2 will get the same boost, not by as much I think because some people havent liked IM3 or TDW.



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I'm actually of the opinion that if Man of Steel did not turn out to be the type of film it was and did not get the reception it did that Thor 2 would've been different. The characters are very similar in a lot of ways and I believe that Marvel wanted to distance itself from the negative backlash of Man of Steel by having a climax that was not dreary and depressing but actually fun. I could be totally wrong about this but that was my first impression.
I dont think so, Thor 2 was well into its production when MOS came out, I doubt they had the time to change much once MOS, only really being able to add in more scenes. The CGI for the final battle, etc would have been developed from when before MOS came out.

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In the end I don't think there is any more humor in TDW than in the Avengers. Darcy and Ian kissing in the middle of the battle was no less silly than a SHIELD agent playing Galaga - in my opinion anyway.
The SHIELD agent playing Galaga wasnt in the middle of a fight scene or the universe ending though, it was in the middle of a dialogue scene which was humerous in nature anyway. THATS the difference, the placing of the humour. I never had a problem with the humour in MCU movies until IM3 and TDW were they just ran rampant with it for no reason. Its like they want every MCU movie to be a Joss Whedon movie but only Whedon himself can do a Whedon movie so why even try?

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I agree with you that Marvel can't stick with that tone all the time though and hope they mix it up. I think they have to mix it up. Some characters naturally lend themselves to more serious material than others. Of course it also has to do with how a character is written. We've seen Batman campy and we've seen Batman dark as hell. I have high hopes for The Winter Soldier as well. Positive buzz for this one is more universal than the last two Marvel Studios films so we'll see.
Well, Fiege said in phase because of how well TA did they were going to take some risks and do things differently, then IM3 and TDW come out and are basically more of the same. This added to my disappointment for both movies.

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Marvel isn't perfect but they are maintaining a very high level of quality especially relative to their quantity of output. They are making mistakes along the way but nothing egregious and they are learning from their mistakes. I look at TDW as an exciting chapter in a larger story and am totally game for the character to be pulled in different directions as they try new things. I am really enjoying the characterizations and world building and I'm always wondering what's next. You can't please everyone but I hope Thor 3 is a film that delivers elements that other people would really like to see. I actually think it's high time that Thor really cut lose in a battle. I'm of the opinion that Surtur appearing might be jumping the gun but if he is part of the next installment, Thor's going to need to give it everything he's got.
For me Thor 3 really needs to knock it out of the part to get this solo franchise back on track, the 1st movie was great, and still is, the sequel had too many problems.

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BTW, Thor 2 was actually a troubled production from the beginning with the whole Patty Jenkins and Natalie Portman fiasco, Josh Dallas unable to reprise his role as Fandral, and Jamie Alexander getting seriously injured on set, the butting heads between Taylor and Marvel over the soundtrack and rumors about the director split and disagreements over runtime, etc. With all of that, I'm amazed that we got as good of a film as we did.
I know all of this, I have followed Thor 2 since it was announced, it was actually my most anticipated phase 2 movie for a while, then I heard about the reactions to the movie and that tempered a little bit.

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This was also Taylor's first box office film so naturally Marvel would want to try and reign him in a little. I would like to see what Taylor could do with more latitude but I'm beginning to think he might not be back for the third installment. Also as much as I liked his grounded approach, I want to see a little more fantasy and less sci fi. I liked the way Branagh presented the Jotuns. If fire demons from Muspelheim show up with laser guns I'll be pissed.
But my point is why hire the GoT guy if you arent going to let him do his thing? Why not just hire a director no one has heard off if they going to meddle in the movie so much. Jenkins obviously wasnt happy with the amount of input Marvel wanted, hence her leaving.


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That's a better way to put it than to specify 30 seconds which isn't correct. I'm a bit surprised that you think it would have been fine with the Selvig joke though since that's not even 2 minutes after the phone rings and from the phone moment on the grief is still not very present since you instead focus on how they are getting back.
Half of the scene after Loki's death wasnt grieving, so 30 seconds isnt that much of an exaggeration. The Selvig joke is after the whole scene of them getting back, its about 5 mins after Loki which to me is still too soon, but it would have been better than what we got.



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It's subjective as always but you can't be sure which parts he wanted and which parts he didn't want, if there are such parts. All the things I've heard that have sounded negative from him have been about other things. For example, the scene after Loki's death, as you criticized, doesn't seem like it's an addition since it's directly crucial to the story moving forward. It's also been a common thing to try to say that active producers, like Marvel has, are much more uncommon in movie making than they really are.
The scene after Loki's death is crucial to moving the plot forward I agree, but it didnt need to be comedic in nature. It could easily have been a serious scene but no, Marvel mandates there must be a joke every 60 seconds in these movies now after The Avengers.

Whats so frustrating about that is that TA got its comedy spot on and in the right places.

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Old 03-18-2014, 10:35 PM   #604
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Default Re: Thor 2 Dark World news, speculation and pictures possible Spoilers - - -

If you guys didn't SEE the sneak peek of AoU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=imtCIDsNVEI

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Old 03-18-2014, 11:55 PM   #605
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We are complete opposites on this one, for me MOS gets better with more viewings while TDW gets worse, IM3 got worse with repeat viewings for me as well, I loved it when I first saw it.
Yeah we're definitely complete opposites. Actually Iron Man 3 was my least favorite MCU film but that also got better with repeat viewings and now I rank it above Man of Steel.

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TDW was in 3D as well so got the same bump as IM3.
I'm comparing to previous films. Thor 1 was in 3D. Iron Man 2 was not. Hence Iron Man 3 got a 3D bump in gross receipts relative to Iron Man 2. Thor 2 did not.

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And among box office guru's its certain that Thor 2 got a boost from The Avengers, as did IM3, there is no doubting they both got a boost in BO because of how much people enjoyed TA, Cap 2 will get the same boost, not by as much I think because some people havent liked IM3 or TDW.
It's not an exact science. Like I said I'm sure it played a role and am not arguing the point but I don't believe it is the only reason and you can't state it like it's a fact. As far as some people not liking the Phase 2 movies so far, some people didn't like the Phase 1 movies. Some people trash Avengers. That's all nothing new.

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I dont think so, Thor 2 was well into its production when MOS came out, I doubt they had the time to change much once MOS, only really being able to add in more scenes. The CGI for the final battle, etc would have been developed from when before MOS came out.
You could be right. I just know per Taylor they were "plussing" the movie till the very end. Who knows? Like I said I could be way off base - it was just a vibe I got.

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The SHIELD agent playing Galaga wasnt in the middle of a fight scene or the universe ending though, it was in the middle of a dialogue scene which was humerous in nature anyway. THATS the difference, the placing of the humour. I never had a problem with the humour in MCU movies until IM3 and TDW were they just ran rampant with it for no reason. Its like they want every MCU movie to be a Joss Whedon movie but only Whedon himself can do a Whedon movie so why even try?
No comedy during fight scenes or climactic battles? I think you're having selective amnesia...

Cap: You sure about this?
Black Widow: Yeah it'll be fun.

Black Widow: It's like Budapest all over again.
Hawkeye: You and I remember Budapest very differently.

Tony Stark: I'm bringing the party to you.
Black Widow: I don't see how that's a party.

Whereas I can't recall a single person cracking a joke during the battle with Malekith. The comedy was all situational. The comedy's placement was also consistent with the dichotomy between Asgard and Earth. Earth scenes are funnier because from the perspective of Earth - it's all very wacky. I know you detest it but I've seen many people (mostly non comic fans) comment that they wish there were more Earth scenes - including critics.

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Well, Fiege said in phase because of how well TA did they were going to take some risks and do things differently, then IM3 and TDW come out and are basically more of the same. This added to my disappointment for both movies.
I felt they took a lot of risks. They upped the personal stakes.

They took Tony out of the suit. The Mandarin twist was a HUGE risk and look - the fanboy community freaked out.

They also killed off at least one major member of Thor's family. We still don't know what happened to Odin. I'm just glad Thor still has his hand.

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For me Thor 3 really needs to knock it out of the part to get this solo franchise back on track, the 1st movie was great, and still is, the sequel had too many problems.
Well I really hope you like the next one. I loved the first Thor too but think this one is way better. However you clearly didn't. I'd hate for us to lose a Thor fan. Go Thor 3!

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Old 03-19-2014, 12:01 AM   #606
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I know all of this, I have followed Thor 2 since it was announced, it was actually my most anticipated phase 2 movie for a while, then I heard about the reactions to the movie and that tempered a little bit.

But my point is why hire the GoT guy if you arent going to let him do his thing? Why not just hire a director no one has heard off if they going to meddle in the movie so much. Jenkins obviously wasnt happy with the amount of input Marvel wanted, hence her leaving.
Well it seems to me Alan did do his thing. He killed off Frigga and changed the feel of Asgard and the battles. The costumes are amazing and have his fingerprints all over them. The scene where Loki cuts off Thor's hand was more graphic than other scenes we've seen so far in the MCU. You could see flesh and bone. There are a lot of elements that were very influenced by him. He just didn't have autonomy apparently. But it's not like other studios don't influence or put pressure on their directors. He also never made a major motion picture before.

However, these aren't just standalone films. They have to work in the grander scheme and a somewhat consistent tone needs to be found. It's a tricky balance. Marvel has a way they do things and if they felt he was veering too much from the plan then that's their prerogative. It's not like Taylor didn't know what he was signing up for.

Nolan did his thing and the films were cool and all but that wasn't really the Batman I know and from what I've heard DC is not doing any world building off of it. I certainly can't imagine Bale's Batman palling around with Barry Allen and Hal Jordan or having a hard time figuring out that Clark Kent is really Superman behind those glasses. So they're trying to start fresh. Marvel doesn't really have that luxury.

But even Nolan was hit or miss to me. The Dark Knight was amazing. Batman Begins was just OK. I did not like The Dark Knight Rises.

You can't possibly please everybody but I'd say based on their success Marvel's plan is working. The odds are against them - sooner or later they will probably stumble. But I'm rooting for them.

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Old 03-19-2014, 12:03 AM   #607
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Did anyone watch the Agents of Shield episode with Sif and Lorelei?

There's a comment that Sif makes about "Odin" wanting to keep Lorelei alive. Perhaps she's in Thor 3 along with her sister the Enchantress?

Yay.

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Old 03-19-2014, 12:07 AM   #608
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If you guys didn't SEE the sneak peek of AoU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=imtCIDsNVEI
Thanks for the link! I'm psyched for the film and it sounds awesome. I'm not sure how I feel about the character designs for Quicksilver and the Scarlet Witch though. I was really hoping Quicksilver would have the signature white hair. Not the thread for that though.

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Old 03-19-2014, 12:08 AM   #609
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Did anyone watch the Agents of Shield episode with Sif and Lorelei?

There's a comment that Sif makes about "Odin" wanting to keep Lorelei alive. Perhaps she's in Thor 3 along with her sister the Enchantress?

Yay.
Definitely caught that. The first thing I thought is: What does Loki want with Lorelei?

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Old 03-19-2014, 12:16 AM   #610
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He uses her in the comics to keep Thor occupied so he wouldn't interfere with Loki's plans.

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Old 03-19-2014, 08:39 AM   #611
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Yeah we're definitely complete opposites. Actually Iron Man 3 was my least favorite MCU film but that also got better with repeat viewings and now I rank it above Man of Steel.
Ah well, nothing more discuss here really. Its just frustrating to me as every phase 1 movie got better with repeat viewings. But I think thats because they knew were to put their comedy and when to be serious. The Phase 2 movies have been poor in that regard.



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I'm comparing to previous films. Thor 1 was in 3D. Iron Man 2 was not. Hence Iron Man 3 got a 3D bump in gross receipts relative to Iron Man 2. Thor 2 did not.
Ah right fair enough.



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It's not an exact science. Like I said I'm sure it played a role and am not arguing the point but I don't believe it is the only reason and you can't state it like it's a fact. As far as some people not liking the Phase 2 movies so far, some people didn't like the Phase 1 movies. Some people trash Avengers. That's all nothing new.
There is no sure about it, TA played a big role in these movies getting boosts, as it will with Cap 2 as well. GOTG I am not sure because its not really connected to the other movies. I hope its successful though, I love all of the characters but Drax and Ronan are huge favourites of mine.



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You could be right. I just know per Taylor they were "plussing" the movie till the very end. Who knows? Like I said I could be way off base - it was just a vibe I got.
Ah well, I dont think they had time personally, the choregraphy of the final battle and the CGI needed mean they would have been working on it a while ago.



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No comedy during fight scenes or climactic battles? I think you're having selective amnesia...

Cap: You sure about this?
Black Widow: Yeah it'll be fun.

Black Widow: It's like Budapest all over again.
Hawkeye: You and I remember Budapest very differently.

Tony Stark: I'm bringing the party to you.
Black Widow: I don't see how that's a party.
This was different, these were quips from characters during the battle, they had no impact on the battle itself and each lasted about 5 seconds.

As I said TA got its comedy spot on, there were no jokes after Coulsons death for example.

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Whereas I can't recall a single person cracking a joke during the battle with Malekith. The comedy was all situational. The comedy's placement was also consistent with the dichotomy between Asgard and Earth. Earth scenes are funnier because from the perspective of Earth - it's all very wacky. I know you detest it but I've seen many people (mostly non comic fans) comment that they wish there were more Earth scenes - including critics.
I agree that the comedy was situational, but it is incredibly poorly placed, the final battle has as much comedy as actual fighting it seems and thats just wrong, not to mention the WHOLE universe was about to end and comedy scenes were happening left, right and centre. The whole final battle is one big joke to me.

And I dont detest the earth scenes, dont know were you got that idea. I just hated the fact that they were so focused on comedy. Loved Darcy in the 1st movie, was really happy when she was brought back, but never in a million years did I expect her to get more screen-time than every Asgardian bar Thor. And did she need an intern who was just another comedic character? No. She shouldnt have even been involved in the final battle.



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I felt they took a lot of risks. They upped the personal stakes.
IMO they didnt at all, on paper the stakes seemed higher, but in the movies they are played for laughs and this means no stakes at all. Thats been a problem with all MCU movies though, the hero never seems in danger to me.

They took Tony out of the suit. The Mandarin twist was a HUGE risk and look - the fanboy community freaked out.

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They also killed off at least one major member of Thor's family. We still don't know what happened to Odin. I'm just glad Thor still has his hand.
Hardly a risk to kill off someone who has had about 15 lines in the whole franchise.

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Well I really hope you like the next one. I loved the first Thor too but think this one is way better. However you clearly didn't. I'd hate for us to lose a Thor fan. Go Thor 3!
I hope I love the next one as well, hope Marvel dont screw it up this time.

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Well it seems to me Alan did do his thing. He killed off Frigga and changed the feel of Asgard and the battles. The costumes are amazing and have his fingerprints all over them. The scene where Loki cuts off Thor's hand was more graphic than other scenes we've seen so far in the MCU. You could see flesh and bone. There are a lot of elements that were very influenced by him. He just didn't have autonomy apparently. But it's not like other studios don't influence or put pressure on their directors. He also never made a major motion picture before.

However, these aren't just standalone films. They have to work in the grander scheme and a somewhat consistent tone needs to be found. It's a tricky balance. Marvel has a way they do things and if they felt he was veering too much from the plan then that's their prerogative. It's not like Taylor didn't know what he was signing up for.

Nolan did his thing and the films were cool and all but that wasn't really the Batman I know and from what I've heard DC is not doing any world building off of it. I certainly can't imagine Bale's Batman palling around with Barry Allen and Hal Jordan or having a hard time figuring out that Clark Kent is really Superman behind those glasses. So they're trying to start fresh. Marvel doesn't really have that luxury.

But even Nolan was hit or miss to me. The Dark Knight was amazing. Batman Begins was just OK. I did not like The Dark Knight Rises.

You can't possibly please everybody but I'd say based on their success Marvel's plan is working. The odds are against them - sooner or later they will probably stumble. But I'm rooting for them.
Taylor had some input, but it seems most of the movie came from Marvel. Why even hire him in the 1st place if thats the case? Given more freedom I think Taylor would have given us a good movie. His GoT are the best of the series. But I think interference early on meant he heart wasnt in it for most of the time.

We totally disagree on Nolans Batman movies, loved all 3 of them, but TDK is the best.

For me Marvel are stumbling at the moment, I find myself REALLY disliking Thor 2 now, the good is they havent failed completely and done something as bad as X3 or Jonah Hex, they a FAR from that in fact, but they do need to change things up and fast, for me anyway.

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Old 03-19-2014, 08:58 AM   #612
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Old 03-19-2014, 09:26 AM   #613
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Default Re: Thor 2 Dark World news, speculation and pictures possible Spoilers - - -

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This was different, these were quips from characters during the battle, they had no impact on the battle itself and each lasted about 5 seconds.

As I said TA got its comedy spot on, there were no jokes after Coulsons death for example.

I agree that the comedy was situational, but it is incredibly poorly placed, the final battle has as much comedy as actual fighting it seems and thats just wrong, not to mention the WHOLE universe was about to end and comedy scenes were happening left, right and centre. The whole final battle is one big joke to me.
Well to be fair, The Avengers did not have events unfolding in different dimensions. I felt they took the death of Frigga very seriously. Thor, Loki and Odin were all dealing with the grief. Earth has absolutely no clue what's happening in Asgard and let's face it - the idea of a hammer wielding god playing hero on Earth in modern times is preposterous. The humor is what makes it work. In the Thor comics along with the wacky mix of fantasy, sci-fi and superheroics there are the Midgard scenes which always have humor.

In Avengers everything was centered around the threat towards Earth and it needed to be more serious because why else would all the heroes come together? In The Dark World, this is Thor's movie. Thor's got this folks. I love when he faces Malekith and Malekith says "Have you come to witness the end of your universe?" and Thor says "I've come to accept your surrender." Signature Thor right there.

Listen, I'm clearly not going to change your mind and don't want to beat it to death but this is your opinion. I'm not the only one who thought the final act was hugely entertaining as many critics of the movie in reviews I read who disliked the movie thought it finally hit its stride towards the end and loved the comedy.

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And I dont detest the earth scenes, dont know were you got that idea. I just hated the fact that they were so focused on comedy. Loved Darcy in the 1st movie, was really happy when she was brought back, but never in a million years did I expect her to get more screen-time than every Asgardian bar Thor. And did she need an intern who was just another comedic character? No. She shouldnt have even been involved in the final battle.
Sorry for thinking that. I assumed you felt that way because the Midgard scenes were mostly comedic in contrast to the serious Asgard scenes.

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Hardly a risk to kill off someone who has had about 15 lines in the whole franchise.
I'll agree with you there. All the deleted Rene Russo scenes I've seen from both films I wish could've been included. In my opinion, both films are too short. It almost feels to me that Marvel recognizes Thor as one of its riskiest properties and are afraid to make a film over 2 hours. I hope they give him his proper due next time.

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I hope I love the next one as well, hope Marvel dont screw it up this time.

Taylor had some input, but it seems most of the movie came from Marvel. Why even hire him in the 1st place if thats the case? Given more freedom I think Taylor would have given us a good movie. His GoT are the best of the series. But I think interference early on meant he heart wasnt in it for most of the time.

We totally disagree on Nolans Batman movies, loved all 3 of them, but TDK is the best.

For me Marvel are stumbling at the moment, I find myself REALLY disliking Thor 2 now, the good is they havent failed completely and done something as bad as X3 or Jonah Hex, they a FAR from that in fact, but they do need to change things up and fast, for me anyway.
The good news for Thor, I would think is that they can't do the same thing twice or it gets stale so I would expect a completely different spin the next go around.

They haven't stumbled yet to me. I think they're just finding their way. The Avengers set the bar unrealistically high. Sometimes people go out of their way to be disappointed. I'm thrilled we're even getting these movies.

I'll be interested to hear what you think of the Winter Soldier.

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Old 03-19-2014, 09:28 AM   #614
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He uses her in the comics to keep Thor occupied so he wouldn't interfere with Loki's plans.
Yeah that was in Simonson's arc - one of my favorite Thor arcs ever. I wonder if they'll actually include her in the movies. They can't have Lorelei though and not have her big sister Amora.

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Old 03-19-2014, 09:37 AM   #615
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Half of the scene after Loki's death wasnt grieving, so 30 seconds isnt that much of an exaggeration. The Selvig joke is after the whole scene of them getting back, its about 5 mins after Loki which to me is still too soon, but it would have been better than what we got.
Why exaggerate in the first place, using such exact times? How does that do anything other than possibly annoy people? As for the Selvig joke, it's 3 minutes after Loki dies.

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This was different, these were quips from characters during the battle, they had no impact on the battle itself and each lasted about 5 seconds.

As I said TA got its comedy spot on, there were no jokes after Coulsons death for example.
The first joke after Coulson's death is 3 minutes after. Exactly like the Selvig thing would have been, which you said would be too soon.

Clearly this isn't a case of timing since your argument is very inconsistent on that point. It sounds much more like you just prefer some humor to others, or that you project other dislikes into your feelings about this.

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Taylor had some input, but it seems most of the movie came from Marvel. Why even hire him in the 1st place if thats the case? Given more freedom I think Taylor would have given us a good movie. His GoT are the best of the series. But I think interference early on meant he heart wasnt in it for most of the time.
Taylor should be used to it since TV is a producer's medium, the directors don't hold the same position as they do in movies. It's Benioff and Weiss that call the shots on GoT.


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Old 03-20-2014, 07:59 AM   #616
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Well it seems to me Alan did do his thing. He killed off Frigga and changed the feel of Asgard and the battles. The costumes are amazing and have his fingerprints all over them. The scene where Loki cuts off Thor's hand was more graphic than other scenes we've seen so far in the MCU. You could see flesh and bone. There are a lot of elements that were very influenced by him. He just didn't have autonomy apparently. But it's not like other studios don't influence or put pressure on their directors. He also never made a major motion picture before.

However, these aren't just standalone films. They have to work in the grander scheme and a somewhat consistent tone needs to be found. It's a tricky balance. Marvel has a way they do things and if they felt he was veering too much from the plan then that's their prerogative. It's not like Taylor didn't know what he was signing up for.

Nolan did his thing and the films were cool and all but that wasn't really the Batman I know and from what I've heard DC is not doing any world building off of it. I certainly can't imagine Bale's Batman palling around with Barry Allen and Hal Jordan or having a hard time figuring out that Clark Kent is really Superman behind those glasses. So they're trying to start fresh. Marvel doesn't really have that luxury.

But even Nolan was hit or miss to me. The Dark Knight was amazing. Batman Begins was just OK. I did not like The Dark Knight Rises.

You can't possibly please everybody but I'd say based on their success Marvel's plan is working. The odds are against them - sooner or later they will probably stumble. But I'm rooting for them.

agree with your posts 100% ragnarok.. marvel has a great plan, but there have been some small hiccups on the way, but everything is only getting better from phase 1

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Old 03-20-2014, 03:11 PM   #617
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agree with your posts 100% ragnarok.. marvel has a great plan, but there have been some small hiccups on the way, but everything is only getting better from phase 1
Thanks kosh!

Sounds like you caught the special the other night. I loved how Joss describes what they are doing for Age of Ultron. I hope it really delivers. It's a tall order following up on the first film.

Really excited about Guardians of the Galaxy too. I think with the upcoming slate this year and next, Phase 2 is just getting warmed up. Should be fun.

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Old 03-20-2014, 09:45 PM   #618
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Default Re: Thor 2 Dark World news, speculation and pictures possible Spoilers - - -

Tyler's going to Score Age of Ultron!

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Old 03-20-2014, 10:30 PM   #619
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Tyler's going to Score Age of Ultron!
I'm cool with that. I loved his soundtracks for The Dark World and Iron Man 3. I hope he keeps some of the themes from the first Avengers though. I wonder why Silvestri is not coming back?

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Old 03-20-2014, 10:43 PM   #620
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Not sure, but it's his work on the Marvel Fanfare even on WS openning, I'm betting there's some contract with him

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Old 03-21-2014, 12:22 AM   #621
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Tyler's going to Score Age of Ultron!
He's been my favorite composer from Marvel so far aside from Patrick Doyle. But I wonder why Silvestri isn't returning, he hit it out of the park with the first one. It's funny you mention this cause I was actually thinking earlier today about how the MCU had more musical continuity.

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Old 03-21-2014, 07:44 AM   #622
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Thanks kosh!

Sounds like you caught the special the other night. I loved how Joss describes what they are doing for Age of Ultron. I hope it really delivers. It's a tall order following up on the first film.

Really excited about Guardians of the Galaxy too. I think with the upcoming slate this year and next, Phase 2 is just getting warmed up. Should be fun.

if anyone can do it, it will be joss... it always helps if directors are very passionate about their projects and the comic books that they are based on..

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Old 03-21-2014, 01:14 PM   #623
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Default Re: Thor 2 Dark World news, speculation and pictures possible Spoilers - - -

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Tyler's going to Score Age of Ultron!
That sounds very good. I've enjoyed his work on Marvel movies this far.

For example I love the scene where Thor and Jane are travelling the Bifrost to Asgard in TDW, and that's all thanks to the music making it feel as epic as it would be for Jane.

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Old 03-22-2014, 12:11 AM   #624
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I think much of the criticism of Thor: The Dark World is unfair. Frigga's death basically stops the movie cold for several minutes, and there is an extended funeral. No one is cracking jokes just after that happens. In the case of Loki, the scene with him "dying" in Thor's arms is touching. Then it is followed by a nice sweeping shot of the desolate landscape, which I think helps visually show Thor's pain. Loki's death scene had few witnesses, and they were on a time crunch storywise. The film had to keep moving. So, I am okay with the phone thing.

As for the climax, I love it. It is hilarious chaos, and I think it is good old fashioned fun. I think the problem is, people wanted something epic, like Conan the Barbarian. Instead, we got something closer to Conan the Destroyer. Which, I can see the disappointment. The movie does suffer from middle chapter sydrome a bit, but I think overall, it is a solid film. I have fun watching it. I also love IM3. To me, IM2 is Marvel Studios weakest film, and even that film I find fun to watch. So, I don't think Marvel has stumbled yet. Stumbling would be making something bad. They just haven't hit home runs on every movie. Some were just singles/doubles. Which is fine.

That said, Thor 3 should seek to be more epic. Thor: The Dark World being the fun middle chapter is fine, but Thor 3 needs that epic element. I think post-AoU, we need Cap 3, Thor 3, and any potential IM4 or Hulk 2 to be epic.

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Old 03-22-2014, 01:06 AM   #625
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Default Re: Thor 2 Dark World news, speculation and pictures possible Spoilers - - -

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Well to be fair, The Avengers did not have events unfolding in different dimensions. I felt they took the death of Frigga very seriously. Thor, Loki and Odin were all dealing with the grief. Earth has absolutely no clue what's happening in Asgard and let's face it - the idea of a hammer wielding god playing hero on Earth in modern times is preposterous. The humor is what makes it work. In the Thor comics along with the wacky mix of fantasy, sci-fi and superheroics there are the Midgard scenes which always have humor.
Yeah there were no jokes after the death of Frigga for a while, but I would have liked Thor and Odin to show a bit more emotion at her death, a tear rolling down one of their cheeks at the funeral would have been sufficient.

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In Avengers everything was centered around the threat towards Earth and it needed to be more serious because why else would all the heroes come together? In The Dark World, this is Thor's movie. Thor's got this folks. I love when he faces Malekith and Malekith says "Have you come to witness the end of your universe?" and Thor says "I've come to accept your surrender." Signature Thor right there.
TDW had a bigger final event than TA. In TA only New York with later possibly the world was in danger. In TDW EVERYTHING in existence was under threat, yet it never felt that way because the humour and lightness of it all meant there were no stakes. TA didnt have that problem for me.

As for the bolded, I thought that was great to.

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Listen, I'm clearly not going to change your mind and don't want to beat it to death but this is your opinion. I'm not the only one who thought the final act was hugely entertaining as many critics of the movie in reviews I read who disliked the movie thought it finally hit its stride towards the end and loved the comedy.
I have no problem with people having a differing opinion, its been quite obvious from the start we werent going to agree on this .



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Sorry for thinking that. I assumed you felt that way because the Midgard scenes were mostly comedic in contrast to the serious Asgard scenes.
In Thor 1 I loved the earth scenes, some of the best moments of the movie happened on Earth, here, some Earth scenes were good in TDW, but the final battle wasnt IMO.



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I'll agree with you there. All the deleted Rene Russo scenes I've seen from both films I wish could've been included. In my opinion, both films are too short. It almost feels to me that Marvel recognizes Thor as one of its riskiest properties and are afraid to make a film over 2 hours. I hope they give him his proper due next time.
I think of the two movies TDW needs a DC or EE more, but it would be good to get one for both. Dont know why Marvel are afraid of making a Thor movie over 2 hours. If a Superman or Batman movie can be 2 and a half hours long, Thor can be over 2 hours easily.



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The good news for Thor, I would think is that they can't do the same thing twice or it gets stale so I would expect a completely different spin the next go around.

They haven't stumbled yet to me. I think they're just finding their way. The Avengers set the bar unrealistically high. Sometimes people go out of their way to be disappointed. I'm thrilled we're even getting these movies.

I'll be interested to hear what you think of the Winter Soldier.
I just hope for Thor 3 they get their act together early on and have a clear vision with a director they let do his thing.

As for WS you will see my rating in my sig when I see it, it sounds like its finally something different from Marvel as well as a good movie, so I think I will enjoy it a lot.

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