The SuperHeroHype Forums  

Go Back   The SuperHeroHype Forums > Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice > Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-13-2014, 01:00 AM   #1
Thread Manager
SHH! Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 0
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

This is a continuation thread, the old thread is Here

Thread Manager is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:00 AM   #2
Thread Manager
SHH! Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 0
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

This is a continuation thread, the old thread is Here

Thread Manager is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:00 AM   #3
The_Shadow
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 314
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Josh Holloway for Aquaman or Green Arrow?

The_Shadow is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:01 AM   #4
Marvin
Side-Kick
 
Marvin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Toronto
Posts: 16,884
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Shadow View Post
Josh Holloway for Aquaman or Green Arrow?
Amell does a fine enough job. I think anyways.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DA_Champion View Post
Aquaman has legs so that he can walk. He is not a mermaid.
Kryptonians are the equivalent. Same with most/all birds.

__________________
Stephen Lang for Cable, the most obvious casting in cbm history.
Marvin is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:07 AM   #5
InJustice
Side-Kick
 
InJustice's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,137
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jekecy View Post
Since when was Superman above people plotting behind his back? Lex has made a living out of it. Am I to presume you think it's impossible for the likes of Bruce Wayne to slip through the cracks and salvage Kryptonian architecture for future manipulation?

Ok, why does anyone go anywhere new? Either because it is an actual destination, or it leads to an intended destination. Whichever it is, any number of scenarios can be created to naturally place him in that area.

The trap is literally invisible and undetectable. I'm not seeing these obvious warning signs you're talking about.

Batman doesn't have to be immediately seen. In any case, it doesn't matter as it would be too late. The very fact Batman is in the same room would indicate the trap had already taken place.
You're talking about a Superman with X-Ray vision, there's no way Batman would be left in plain sight when Superman can simply see him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Masone View Post
To display Batman's preparation and intelligence, show him training himself to breathe in Krypton's atmosphere. So he builds the room and has to continuously enter it, pass out coughing like Superman, have Alfred drag him out, recover, and then do it again.
You do realize Faora and Jor-El both suggested how Krypton's gravity was far stronger than Earth's? At least Superman can handle it because his body is originally of Kryptonian descent (born in Krypton with no problem, yet Martha said that Clark had trouble breathing as a child). Batman trying to train himself would simply be suicide due to his human composition.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jekecy View Post
Ok, and?

Where does this fit into the suggestion Batman would eventually explore Superman's cause for being so super, via thorough examinations of several scientific hypotheses?
Because it's not simply atmospheric chemistry that gives Superman his powers. It's a mix of both atmosphere and yellow sun light. Therefore, it's as simple as Batman testing out a Kryptonian specimen to see how it derives its powers.

InJustice is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:08 AM   #6
Wise
Watchtower Janitor
 
Wise's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,375
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Shadow View Post
Josh Holloway for Aquaman or Green Arrow?
He'd make a fantastic Ollie. His character in Lost was alot like Ollie in many ways. Sarcastic, gruff, resourceful, rouguishly charming

Wise is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:09 AM   #7
Jekecy
Side-Kick
 
Jekecy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,831
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by InJustice View Post
You're talking about a Superman with X-Ray vision, there's no way Batman would be left in plain sight when Superman can simply see him.
No way, as in 'no way can X-Rays be blocked' type of no way?

Jekecy is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:15 AM   #8
Lencho01
Shazoogle! Shazoogle!
 
Lencho01's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 15,997
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Cool art, but weird story...

http://moonheadpress.blogspot.mx/2014/01/gods-end.html

__________________
I was at some diplomatic party once. Got to talking to this princess who told me that when it came to Superman, I was missing the point. She told me, "His real strength lay in his generous spirit and sense of what's fair." - King Faraday

"
Hes much more of a working class superhero, which is why we ended the whole book with the image of a laboring Superman. Hes Everyman operating on a scifi Paul Bunyan scale." - Grant Morrison

"Self Portrait" By Batman
Lencho01 is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:15 AM   #9
InJustice
Side-Kick
 
InJustice's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,137
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jekecy View Post
No way, as in 'no way can X-Rays be blocked' type of no way?
Again, how would Batman know how to stop X-Ray Vision? Or even better, how does Batman know Superman has X-Ray Vision? There's nothing that says X-Rays can be stopped in terms of the Man of Steel universe (I'm not saying using lead is not a possibility, what I'm saying is that the knowledge that X-Ray Vision can be stopped isn't available yet).

InJustice is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:17 AM   #10
Wise
Watchtower Janitor
 
Wise's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,375
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by InJustice View Post
Again, how would Batman know how to stop X-Ray Vision? Or even better, how does Batman know Superman has X-Ray Vision? There's nothing that says X-Rays can be stopped in terms of the Man of Steel universe (I'm not saying using lead is not a possibility, what I'm saying is that the knowledge that X-Ray Vision can be stopped isn't available yet).
He may not know. But he can certainly hypothesize. He's Batman.

Wise is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:19 AM   #11
InJustice
Side-Kick
 
InJustice's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,137
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wise View Post
He may not know. But he can certainly hypothesize. He's Batman.
But how can he hypothesize without coming off as Bat-God? If we're talking during that same framework that Jekecy brought up, then Batman cannot realistically prepare himself for Superman having X-Ray Vision, because he cannot know that Superman possesses such a power.

InJustice is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:19 AM   #12
MrsKent26
Whatever.
 
MrsKent26's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Fortress of Solitude
Posts: 10,468
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jekecy View Post
Since when was Superman above people plotting behind his back? Lex has made a living out of it. Am I to presume you think it's impossible for the likes of Bruce Wayne to slip through the cracks and salvage Kryptonian architecture for future manipulation?
I definitely think people could get away with plotting behind his back. He can't hear everything all the time. But It would be reasonable, after learning he has this weakness to atmospheric changes, that he would pay attention to what becomes of any Kryptonian tech left over and what people are doing with it. And it would also make sense for him to pay particular attention to what Batman is up to if they are at odds. It's all about what he chooses to pay attention to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jekecy View Post
Ok, why does anyone go anywhere new? Either because it is an actual destination, or it leads to an intended destination. Whichever it is, any number of scenarios can be created to naturally place him in that area.
That's kinda vague. Why would superman walk into a random chamber of sorts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jekecy View Post
The trap is literally invisible and undetectable. I'm not seeing these obvious warning signs you're talking about.
It is detectable if Superman thinks at all about what people might be doing with Kryptonian tech.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jekecy View Post
Batman doesn't have to be immediately seen. In any case, it doesn't matter as it would be too late. The very fact Batman is in the same room would indicate the trap had already taken place.
I suppose so.

MrsKent26 is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:21 AM   #13
Jekecy
Side-Kick
 
Jekecy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,831
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by InJustice View Post
Again, how would Batman know how to stop X-Ray Vision? Or even better, how does Batman know Superman has X-Ray Vision? There's nothing that says X-Rays can be stopped in terms of the Man of Steel universe (I'm not saying using lead is not a possibility, what I'm saying is that the knowledge that X-Ray Vision can be stopped isn't available yet).
Ok, let's assume for a moment Batman is blatantly seen by Superman before walking into a room (it begs the question why he would X-Ray everything, but moving on). Is there any reason why Superman would not go to meet him? Supes has no inclination something terrible would come from it. Especially since Batman would be seen as a mere human. Again, how does one premeditate the undetectable? The second he's inside a manipulated room, it's way too late anyway.

Jekecy is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:22 AM   #14
Wise
Watchtower Janitor
 
Wise's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,375
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by InJustice View Post
But how can he hypothesize without coming off as Bat-God? If we're talking during that same framework that Jekecy brought up, then Batman cannot realistically prepare himself for Superman having X-Ray Vision, because he cannot know that Superman possesses such a power.
SvB takes place after MoS. it's conceivable that Bruce has surveillance and recon from Superman's exploits. It's also conceivable that during one of these exploits Superman exhibits evidence of being able to look through objects.

Or Lois comes out and writes about it like in 78.

Wise is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:25 AM   #15
ЯɘvlveR
danneB
 
ЯɘvlveR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 5,164
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lencho01 View Post

ЯɘvlveR is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:25 AM   #16
InJustice
Side-Kick
 
InJustice's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,137
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wise View Post
SvB takes place after MoS. it's conceivable that Bruce has surveillance and recon from Superman's exploits. It's also conceivable that during one of these exploits Superman exhibits evidence of being able to look through objects.

Or Lois comes out and writes about it like in 78.
How does Wayne set up surveillance without being detected? Especially considering that in MOS, Superman was able to see which Government drones were tracking him down and destroy them. Would that also not happen with Wayne's drone/surveillance tech?

InJustice is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:26 AM   #17
Masone
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 915
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by InJustice View Post
You're talking about a Superman with X-Ray vision, there's no way Batman would be left in plain sight when Superman can simply see him.



You do realize Faora and Jor-El both suggested how Krypton's gravity was far stronger than Earth's? At least Superman can handle it because his body is originally of Kryptonian descent (born in Krypton with no problem, yet Martha said that Clark had trouble breathing as a child). Batman trying to train himself would simply be suicide due to his human composition.
There's no reason to believe that a Superman "as weak as human" would be able to survive that anymore than an actual human would.

It's like saying our air and atmosphere is unique to us(humans), it's not. It's simply the atmospheric composition of Earth, we're just on it and have gotten used to it.

It's the same with Krypton. It's not "Kryptonian atmosphere(unique to Kryptonians)", it's atmosphere that Kryptonians have gotten used to. There is nothing in Superman's genes that would preclude him from this "suicide" you speak of, so the fact that he didn't die means that Batman could survive as well. It's not like their atmosphere is like the moon where you need a full suit, it's obvious it supports breathing and living. Kryptonians aren't different from Humans in that regard. They had to wear suits in space just like humans.

This is where the training comes in. He continuously puts himself through that hell to adapt to Krypton's atmosphere.

Masone is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:28 AM   #18
Wise
Watchtower Janitor
 
Wise's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,375
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by InJustice View Post
How does Wayne set up surveillance without being detected? Especially considering that in MOS, Superman was able to see which Government drones were tracking him down and destroy them. Would that also not happen with Wayne's drone/surveillance tech?
Who's to say Waynetech didn't build those military drones? Or that Bruce is able to hack into those military drones.

It's Superman. Even if Batman doesn't have surveillance the world's media and every schmuck with a camera phone will do his work for him any time Superman is seen in public.

Wise is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:32 AM   #19
Lencho01
Shazoogle! Shazoogle!
 
Lencho01's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 15,997
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by ЯɘvlveR View Post


There's a Batman one too...

http://moonheadpress.blogspot.mx/2013/11/the-deal.html

__________________
I was at some diplomatic party once. Got to talking to this princess who told me that when it came to Superman, I was missing the point. She told me, "His real strength lay in his generous spirit and sense of what's fair." - King Faraday

"
Hes much more of a working class superhero, which is why we ended the whole book with the image of a laboring Superman. Hes Everyman operating on a scifi Paul Bunyan scale." - Grant Morrison

"Self Portrait" By Batman
Lencho01 is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:33 AM   #20
Jekecy
Side-Kick
 
Jekecy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,831
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsKent26 View Post
I definitely think people could get away with plotting behind his back. He can't hear everything all the time. But It would be reasonable, after learning he has this weakness to atmospheric changes, that he would pay attention to what becomes of any Kryptonian tech left over and what people are doing with it. And it would also make sense for him to pay particular attention to what Batman is up to if they are at odds. It's all about what he chooses to pay attention to.
What he pays attention to is only valuable if it's not hidden. We're talking about a figure who is known for secrecy and a master tactician.

Quote:
That's kinda vague. Why would superman walk into a random chamber of sorts?
It's a room with an altered atmosphere. That could look like anything. It could be anything. What would be so difficult in creating a scenario where Supes is in any specified area? He could be investigating a trail of clues which lead there, he could be meeting someone for an appointment, he could be exploring a point of interest...the number of possibilities are endless.

Quote:
It is detectable if Superman thinks at all about what people might be doing with Kryptonian tech.
That's not a sign of detection at all. Detection requires preemptive knowledge in an inevitably, given a sequence of events. What you're describing is just cautionary behavior. It's akin to not going outside in fear of being stabbed or getting hit by a car. Sure you're going to be successful in avoiding both those things, but on the other hand you're secluded. Supes is obviously not going that route, which means he will always be susceptible to this sort of attack. And that's purely because there is no way to know (for sure) whether any given space is tampered with.

Fortunately for him, it's unlikely. Unfortunately for him, there's also this x-factor called Batman.

Jekecy is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:34 AM   #21
Jekecy
Side-Kick
 
Jekecy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,831
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lencho01 View Post
That first page reminds me of Millar/Vaughn's pitched ending for their Superman trilogy. Most fans detested it, but with the talent involved and the unconventional themes they planned to introduce, I wouldn't have minded seeing it come to fruition.

Jekecy is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:36 AM   #22
Wise
Watchtower Janitor
 
Wise's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,375
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Personally I'm not a fan of the chamber idea. it reeks of saturday morning cartoon super-villainy.

A strategist like Batman wouldn't put all his eggs into a plan like that when he knows there's no way to guarantee that Superman would even be stupid enough to take the bait. The only way to guarantee that he'd go in there would be to put a hostage in there which Bruce would never do... UNLESS the hostage is Bruce Wayne.

Wise is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:38 AM   #23
InJustice
Side-Kick
 
InJustice's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,137
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Masone View Post
There's no reason to believe that a Superman "as weak as human" would be able to survive that anymore than an actual human would.

It's like saying our air and atmosphere is unique to us(humans), it's not. It's simply the atmospheric composition of Earth, we're just on it and have gotten used to it.

It's the same with Krypton. It's not "Kryptonian atmosphere(unique to Kryptonians)", it's atmosphere that Kryptonians have gotten used to. There is nothing in Superman's genes that would preclude him from this "suicide" you speak of, so the fact that he didn't die means that Batman could survive as well. It's not like their atmosphere is like the moon where you need a full suit, it's obvious it supports breathing and living. Kryptonians aren't different from Humans in that regard. They had to wear suits in space just like humans.

This is where the training comes in. He continuously puts himself through that hell to adapt to Krypton's atmosphere.
Except the movie already showed an infant Kal-El that had adapted to Krypton's atmosphere after he was born. That by itself means that Superman had experienced something that humans hadn't: he was already used to Krypton's atmosphere before he was sent to Earth. Therefore, it makes no sense to conclude that because a Kryptonian was re-adapting to Earth's atmosphere, that it means that humans can (esp. when they haven't yet experienced what Kal-El had. Otherwise, why would Faora give a **** about Lois's ability to breathe when she could've just forced her to adapt? That means there's something inherent about Krypton's atmosphere that humans can't adapt to, or is extremely difficult to adapt to).

By seeing what Faora did to Lois prior to meeting Zod, I find it hard to believe that Batman can survive Kryptonian atmosphere.

InJustice is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:42 AM   #24
InJustice
Side-Kick
 
InJustice's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,137
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wise View Post
Who's to say Waynetech didn't build those military drones? Or that Bruce is able to hack into those military drones.
That would depend on what type of company Snyder's Wayne Enterprises is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wise View Post
It's Superman. Even if Batman doesn't have surveillance the world's media and every schmuck with a camera phone will do his work for him any time Superman is seen in public.
Except Wayne has morals. I highly doubt he would go full-NSA without seeing the benefits and demerits of doing so. At least in TDK, he went full-NSA out of desperation to catch Joker. If he sees a superpowered god, going full-NSA isn't going to help him that much.

InJustice is offline  
Old 01-13-2014, 01:42 AM   #25
ЯɘvlveR
danneB
 
ЯɘvlveR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 5,164
Default Re: All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lencho01 View Post
DUDE! you don't even know! when i first read that i had to sit silently where i was for a half hour.

ЯɘvlveR is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:37 AM.

monitoring_string = "dee460792f24517621e3ca080805de7e"
Contact Us - Mobile - SuperHeroHype - ComingSoon.net - Shock Till You Drop - Lost Password - Clear Cookies - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Top - AdChoices


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SuperHeroHype.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.