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Old 01-06-2014, 05:55 PM   #26
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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No we don't. It's pretty clearly been a very sexist trend against female leads in action moves by the major studios. It's always obviously been that.
Then how is it that female leads have proven themselves in such movies as: Terminator 2, The Hunger Games, Kill Bill, Resident Evil, and The Girl with a Dragon Tattoo, to name a few?

To me, the problem seems to be more on the side of providing great material for these movies to thrive, as a lot of female lead actioners have crappy screenplays. To say that it's a sexist trend is a reductive argument IMO.

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Old 01-06-2014, 05:55 PM   #27
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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^^What is going on in this thread?

Nothing much. Ignorant anti-feminists and baboons with enormous asses.

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Old 01-06-2014, 05:55 PM   #28
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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It's the false belief that she's too "complicated." It's ****.

It's very easy to make her a character that isn't over-sexualized and minimized. They just need to focus on making her a character and stop worrying about offending men that throw fits if she's not in a bustier and panties.
To pay devil's advocate, you could say that it would also be easier if no-one worried about women taking offence.

The sexism debate is like a bad penny. Both sides begin by being reasonable, and become steadily less so. It means that I never want to agree with anyone.

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Old 01-06-2014, 05:56 PM   #29
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

Lol I was wondering to, after skimming through and seeing a baboons inflated ass....I had to exit...

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Old 01-06-2014, 05:58 PM   #30
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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Nothing much. Ignorant anti-feminists and baboons with enormous asses.
I thought you were talking about the men

But yeah, the WW costume would have to be tweaked for film.

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Old 01-06-2014, 05:58 PM   #31
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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To pay devil's advocate, you could say that it would also be easier if no-one worried about women taking offence.

The sexism debate is like a bad penny. Both sides begin by being reasonable, and become steadily less so. It means that I never want to agree with anyone.
It's true. Not worrying about women taking offense would solve it.

But it would be wrong to do that.

And women are literally half the people in the world. It might not be prudent to just say "**** 'em"

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Old 01-06-2014, 06:01 PM   #32
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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To pay devil's advocate, you could say that it would also be easier if no-one worried about women taking offence.

The sexism debate is like a bad penny. Both sides begin by being reasonable, and become steadily less so. It means that I never want to agree with anyone.
Exactly, the traditionalists overlook, defend, or don't care about the argument of sexist perception, and the revisionists go as far as putting a monk cloak on her.

I don't want the WW costume to be AFRAID of showing skin, but I also don't want it to be designed in that manner. I'd lean on the conservative side, though.

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Old 01-06-2014, 06:04 PM   #33
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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Exactly, the traditionalists overlook, defend, or don't care about the argument of sexist perception, and the revisionists go as far as putting a monk cloak on her.

I don't want the WW costume to be AFRAID of showing skin, but I also don't want it to be designed in that manner. I'd lean on the conservative side, though.
Not all "revisionists" are that way. I never requested any sort of monk cloak.

I have pretty much the same "Wants" for the costume as you. And also no stupid "ass/chest out" poses. It's that easy.

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Old 01-06-2014, 07:34 PM   #34
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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Males aren't often sexualized, either. They are idealized, as I said before, by members of their own sex. The muscled bodies and tight clothes on male characters are designed by men. These men didn't intend them to be sexy for females. The intended them to be ideal male forms that the average could imagine being and aspire to. It's called wish-fulfillment.
This jumped out at me.

Why can't an "idealized female form" as female characters are often depicted in comics be considered the same thing?

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Old 01-06-2014, 07:47 PM   #35
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

Not everything she wears has to look "historical/Amazonian". If she's walking around, she can throw on a black coat over her outfit, it's fine.

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Old 01-06-2014, 07:53 PM   #36
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

The same way that Batman is often spotted carrying an umbrella.

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Old 01-06-2014, 07:59 PM   #37
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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This jumped out at me.

Why can't an "idealized female form" as female characters are often depicted in comics be considered the same thing?
Because what's usually represented in comics isn't a female power fantasy, it's a male sex fantasy. The skimpy outfits and the enormous breasts with the obvious cleavage aren't things women necessarily fantasize about being, but they're more often things men fantasize about ****ing.

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Old 01-06-2014, 08:01 PM   #38
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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Not everything she wears has to look "historical/Amazonian". If she's walking around, she can throw on a black coat over her outfit, it's fine.
I'm okay with that. Like if she's in public and not in "warrior mode."

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Old 01-06-2014, 08:03 PM   #39
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

elmayimbe ‏@elmayimbe 57s Gal Gadot's WONDER WOMAN outfit will consist of ARMOR. Not the Lynda Carter itty bitty outfit. I hear it looks dope. RT & embed!

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Old 01-06-2014, 08:04 PM   #40
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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Because what's usually represented in comics isn't a female power fantasy, it's a male sex fantasy. The skimpy outfits and the enormous breasts with the obvious cleavage aren't things women necessarily fantasize about being, but they're more often things men fantasize about ****ing.
The outfits themselves, maybe not.

But I would think argument could very much be made that the female characters in comics, like the male ones, are representations of the female physical ideal in many cultures.

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Old 01-06-2014, 08:40 PM   #41
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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This jumped out at me.

Why can't an "idealized female form" as female characters are often depicted in comics be considered the same thing?
Because it serves a different purpose. They key is that these women are drawn by men for men. They are drawn to appeal to men sexually. They are not targeted towards women at all. They are drawn as idealized forms, but they're ideals according to men and what men find sexy.

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Old 01-06-2014, 08:50 PM   #42
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

^ And we know the same isn't true of women's entertainment



All kidding aside, movies are aimed at a slightly more balanced audience, so they should be fairer in their depiction of women (and minorities, but that's another bag)

Not saying that it's okay for females to be sexualized. It just comes with the territory. Thoughtless illustrators (and writers, to an extent) pandering to their core demographic. I personally think that in order to make a change, more women writers/artists/readers would have to be involved to make that happen. Otherwise, the publishers will just fall back on their guaranteed demographic.

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Old 01-06-2014, 09:09 PM   #43
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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^ And we know the same isn't true of women's entertainment



All kidding aside, movies are aimed at a slightly more balanced audience, so they should be fairer in their depiction of women (and minorities, but that's another bag)

Not saying that it's okay for females to be sexualized. It just comes with the territory. Thoughtless illustrators (and writers, to an extent) pandering to their core demographic. I personally think that in order to make a change, more women writers/artists/readers would have to be involved to make that happen. Otherwise, the publishers will just fall back on their guaranteed demographic.
Again, I'm not saying men aren't objectified. They are, but it's not as frequent and isn't part of a larger social problem and a long standing system of oppression. I covered that in my giant post to the user that doesn't believe in the male gaze

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Old 01-06-2014, 09:15 PM   #44
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

System of oppression?

I don't think most men today are TRYING to oppress women. They just might not care enough or be sensitive to their emotional needs

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Old 01-06-2014, 09:16 PM   #45
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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So, you're ignoring decades of scholarly research into the fields of sociology and psychology in favor of a hunch.
Nope, I said I don't buy a lot of modern feminist theory especially the "universal male gaze" or "rape culture" stuff. That aside, I also said
that sexual imagery from the view of a Lesbian, "Lesbian gaze" if your will, might be similar to a heterosexual male. Considering that I haven't seen such sexual imagery, I said it's a hunch but if you know of such imagery feel free to show me. I'd really like to know how a lesbian sexually objectifies a female when it comes to pictures.

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Old 01-06-2014, 09:18 PM   #46
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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^ And we know the same isn't true of women's entertainment



All kidding aside, movies are aimed at a slightly more balanced audience, so they should be fairer in their depiction of women (and minorities, but that's another bag)

Not saying that it's okay for females to be sexualized. It just comes with the territory. Thoughtless illustrators (and writers, to an extent) pandering to their core demographic. I personally think that in order to make a change, more women writers/artists/readers would have to be involved to make that happen. Otherwise, the publishers will just fall back on their guaranteed demographic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctlEBHDROAw

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Old 01-06-2014, 09:27 PM   #47
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

So Wonder Woman's costume?


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Old 01-06-2014, 09:29 PM   #48
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It's more like you want to absolve yourself of facing potential critiques into your words from hypesters, due to the fact that the debate on objectifying Wonder Woman has framed the debate since the thread was first posted.
Not really, I'm quite happy to discuss the whole thing till the cows come home. Though don't blame me then if the thread turns completely into an argument about sexism and what constitutes sexual objectification and how modern feminist views about this thing make a mountain out of a mole hill, imho. Though if you feel the desire to continue this debate, we can gladly discuss this in PM and leave the people who want to make suggestions for a WW costume design able to post their ideas and pics without having to sift through pages and pages of debate.

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Old 01-06-2014, 09:29 PM   #49
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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Not everything she wears has to look "historical/Amazonian". If she's walking around, she can throw on a black coat over her outfit, it's fine.
Thank you for being the voice of reason around here! As if she would be walking around with an American flag cloak to blend in.

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elmayimbe ‏@elmayimbe 57s Gal Gadot's WONDER WOMAN outfit will consist of ARMOR. Not the Lynda Carter itty bitty outfit. I hear it looks dope. RT & embed!

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Old 01-06-2014, 09:30 PM   #50
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Default Re: The Wonder Woman Costume Thread - Part 1

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System of oppression?

I don't think most men today are TRYING to oppress women. They just might not care enough or be sensitive to their emotional needs
I'm not saying they are. Well, some are. Violence against women is still prevalent. But what I mean is that there's a history there. Women couldn't even vote that long ago. And to this day, we still make less money than men doing the same jobs. "System of oppression" is an umbrella of things that did affect us and still does.

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