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Old 06-11-2015, 02:51 AM   #1
Hordakfan
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Default What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right for

I mean Superman Returns sounded promising at first but unfortunately Singer relied too much on fanboy love of the first 2 movies rather than being it's own movie with it's own identity as it was a sequel to a 28 year old franchise that died in 1987. Now Nolan knew what he was doing with the Batman series, he decided to discard the 1989 to 1997 movies out the window when he rebooted Batman on the big screen for the modern 21st century audience and made something fresh with his series.

Singer has regretted not rebooting Superman for today's audience.

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Old 11-23-2015, 03:48 PM   #2
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

It wasn't the love for the Donnerverse that was the problem with Superman Returns. I swear this is an excuse that came up after the film came out, what's was wrong was the film wasn't very well written and there were some poor choices i.e. some of the casting and direction. You know what I think Singer should have done? He should have made an updated version of the original film. I actually have a few ideas of how a rebooted/remake of the Donner Superman could work in the modern world.

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Old 11-23-2015, 04:31 PM   #3
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

The hate for the film is overblown. Wasn't as bad as people make it out to be. I know Singer meant well, but he didn't pull it off as well as he could have.

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Old 11-23-2015, 05:06 PM   #4
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

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The hate for the film is overblown. Wasn't as bad as people make it out to be. I know Singer meant well, but he didn't pull it off as well as he could have.
That's where the problem is really, I often find my biggest complaint when it comes to Bryan Singer is his pacing. He will often deliver a stunning action scene like the Plane Sequence or the White House sequence on X2 but will then drag the film out there after.

I also think at times he can often pick the wrong actor for a key role like Bosworth in Supermam Returns or Anna Paquin in the X-Men films. It's bad to say but with Lois not been written all that great in SR, she really needed an actress that could convey the warmth that Kidder did in the original films. Bosworth was so wrong for the role and I always felt Rachel McAdams would have been a far better choice. It's a shame that he cast this role wrong but of course it wasn't the only issue with the film.

Take a look at some of the spectacular scene in the movie, they're all followed by scenes that lag.

The plane sequence by far the best scene in the film (again an issue that the best scene is in the middle of the movie. He made this mistake in X2 when the White House sequence was the best thing in the film and it's at the start). Soon after it starts to drag, we're introduced properly to the awful version of Lois Lane and the film takes to much time to get going again.

The Metropolis rescue is an often overlooked scene that's that's followed by a great scene where Superman saves Lois & co in the sinking boat. But when he before lands on the island and is beaten near death it starts to drag again.

Then finally we have Superman lifting the island, which is kinda silly given how Kryptonite was used in the prior scene but it still delivers a sense of wonder. Then it's followed again by a scene that lags, is he dead?, is he not?, then suddenly oh no he isn't. Not that we believed he was but still make some suspense if you're going to do that.

I also think he completely missed the point of the love angle in the Donner films aswell with the relationship Lois & Clark had in those movies. They were friends, she wasn't dismissive of him, introducing a new character as the third character in the love triangle was a bizarre choice.

The kid was a really poorly executed idea. It just didn't work and Singer concentrated way to much on this aspect when more should have been done to create real animosity between Lex and Superman.

One of his biggest errors in my book was not making Superman a real character. I think he did a good job with Clark personally but he didn't give Superman enough time and dialogue.

The key thing for me when it comes to Singer though is I often find his films feel to long. Well his comic book films, the only one that isn't to long in my eyes is the first X-Men and we know he had restraints on that picture true i.e. time wise and the budget. I think he may be better when he isn't given large budgets and less time. I've actually just remembered how I watched a fan edit of the film that restored some of the deleted scenes, removed some of the stalker moment and reedited the film in parts to make a tighter version. It was called Superman Restored and it's much better than the cut we got from Singer. Always felt it quite ridiculous that a fan cut was better done than his own cut.

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Old 11-24-2015, 08:59 AM   #5
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

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The hate for the film is overblown. Wasn't as bad as people make it out to be. I know Singer meant well, but he didn't pull it off as well as he could have.
100% agreed. I'm one of the few people who think SR was better than MoS in a lot of different ways. There were some awful choices made (bastard super kid? Creepy super stalker? $200 million price tag with no fight scenes), but overall it was a well-written story. Note how SR was actually well-received by critics.

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Old 11-24-2015, 03:08 PM   #6
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

The plane sequence is quite possibly still my single favourite Superman scene of all time but as far as the full movie goes for me it sits somewhere in the lower-middle of the Superman films (yes I count Supergirl as a part of the Superman series):

Superman the Movie/Man of Steel
Superman II: The Richard Donner Cut
Superman II
Superman III
Superman Returns
Supergirl
Superman IV: The Quest For Peace

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Old 11-26-2015, 10:49 PM   #7
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

Superman Returns should have been a new origin and not relied on Donner at all. Singer just went with the wrong story.

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Old 11-27-2015, 12:51 AM   #8
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

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The plane sequence is quite possibly still my single favourite Superman scene of all time but as far as the full movie goes for me it sits somewhere in the lower-middle of the Superman films (yes I count Supergirl as a part of the Superman series):

Superman the Movie/Man of Steel
Superman II: The Richard Donner Cut
Superman II
Superman III
Superman Returns
Supergirl
Superman IV: The Quest For Peace
Superman III above Superman Returns?

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Old 11-27-2015, 01:53 AM   #9
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

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Superman III above Superman Returns?
Yup, I actually really like Superman III take away the Pryor stuff it's got see great moments and it's probably Chris Reeve's best Superman performance of the series.

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Old 11-27-2015, 02:19 AM   #10
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

Christopher Reeves best performance of the series? Come on man.
Superman III is legitimately one of the worst movies I've ever seen. There's barely any story or proper characterization, an over-reliance on unnecessary comedy, and a climax that makes absolutely zero sense. I'm sorry because I respect your opinion, but Superman III is irredeemable. Pryor was the least of the problems with that movie.

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Old 11-27-2015, 04:37 AM   #11
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

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Christopher Reeves best performance of the series? Come on man.
Superman III is legitimately one of the worst movies I've ever seen. There's barely any story or proper characterization, an over-reliance on unnecessary comedy, and a climax that makes absolutely zero sense. I'm sorry because I respect your opinion, but Superman III is irredeemable. Pryor was the least of the problems with that movie.
You will hear many say that it is his best performance. He looks his most comfortable in III too regardless of the quality of the film his performance in that one is his best. Example would be go listen to Oliver Harpers retrospective on the Superman series in YouTube even he says that it's Reeve's best performance as the Man of Steel.

For me III is a fun movie, I think the good far outweighs the bad and Clark vs Evil Superman is probably the best sequence of the original films. I don't see how the films climax makes no sense either. Sure the plot is bad but it makes sense they build a super computer than can basically do anything. That's all the explanation you need.

Anyway I'm not gonna change my mind III above Returns for me any day.

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Old 11-27-2015, 11:33 AM   #12
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

I'm not trying to change your mind, I'm genuinely just kind of baffled.

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Old 12-12-2015, 11:19 PM   #13
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

Lois was just terribly cast..
They had a great Luthor but wasted him to focus too much on Lois and Supes relationship

Everyone just lacked charisma outside of Routh, a modern film that felt very old fashioned and "small"?

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Old 12-13-2015, 06:46 AM   #14
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

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I'm not trying to change your mind, I'm genuinely just kind of baffled.
But I don't get why because a lot of people say the same thing, Chris was at his most comfortable in the role in SIII and despite the film been a mixed bag Superman is written damn near perfectly in that movie.

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Old 12-13-2015, 08:28 AM   #15
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

What blows my mind is that Singer spent 10 million on a scene and then proceeded to cut it.

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Old 12-13-2015, 11:38 AM   #16
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Default Re: What did Bryan Singer got it wrong for Superman Returns where Nolan got it right

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What blows my mind is that Singer spent 10 million on a scene and then proceeded to cut it.
Yeah bit of a strange one that, I really think Singers problems as a director really stood out with SRs. He has trouble with pacing for one.

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