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Old 03-09-2014, 10:50 AM   #276
TJByrum
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

Here's the clip of the entire Thor+Cap moment:

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Old 03-09-2014, 10:52 AM   #277
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

I really don't buy the whole "Cap got nerfed" argument that some people keep trying to push when it comes to Avengers. The reason why Thor, Iron Man and Hulk got more shots in the final battle is simple. Them fighting looks cooler and more epic than Cap or BW or Hawkeye punching or shooting people on the street. We saw Cap taking out Chitauri and we got the big "Cap takes charge" moment. He was giving orders to Iron Man (an arrogant narcissist), Thor (a god with millennia of combat experience) and the freaking Hulk, and they obeyed those orders. That kind of kills any argument that they short-changed him in the movie, at least to me.

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Old 03-09-2014, 10:58 AM   #278
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

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No, Stark couldn't contend with Loki. Neither of the repulsor blasts that he hit Loki with hurt Loki AT ALL. He got knocked down and then got right back up completely unharmed. The only reason why he got caught in Germany was because he WANTED to be caught. Also, I would have called BS if Cap were able to beat Loki. I don't care how skilled or smart he is, in a battle between man and god, god wins, period.
Agree with all of this.

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Old 03-09-2014, 11:01 AM   #279
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

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Originally Posted by TJByrum View Post
On the subject of Cap's abilities in Avengers:

Some people dismiss it as him being 'rusty', but I know that Whedon wasn't doing that.

If I had written the movie, I would have shown Cap fighting the mind-controlled SHIELD agents, Iron Man trying to distract the Hulk, and have Thor in a battle with Loki, while Widow tried to free Hawkeye.

And then in New York, I would have shown Cap fighting off those Chituari on that street; instead we got a few seconds of him doing something; meanwhile you see extended shots of Iron Man blasting dozens of their ships, Thor and Hulk taking out dozens of them.

Cap actually took out quite a bit of Chitauri; just on his own he cleared that entire street, plus there's no telling how many he fought alongside Thor. But on-screen, Cap only killed a few, I'd wager less than 15. He's largely absent by the end of the battle. I saw a clip of when Thor and Cap was back-to-back, and the scene was a lot longer. Instead we saw Cap hit 1 Chitauri and then he got shot down; the actual clip had him and Thor working together to take out much more.
Cap got a VERY lengthy segment of his own, freeing the people in that building. That was one of the longer, and more emotional points in the Chitari battle. He also organized the police AND the Avengers. I think he was well showcased in the Chitari invasion.

Remember, Cap being shot in that moment was when ALL the Avengers were getting pinned down/injured. Hulk got blasted 50 times, Iron Man got surrounded, Hawkeye crashes through the building, etc. It fit the theme of that montage.

As for Helicarrier, Stark was doing something important to keep the ship afloat. I think that was an important job, and the falling Helicarrier made for a creative sequence. Stark was best option for fixing the problem, and his team-up with Cap provided great comedy. I can see why Whedon paired them. I also think in that sequence (and when they talk alone) they bonded. It was important.

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Old 03-09-2014, 11:15 AM   #280
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

There was a scene in which Cap was fighting in the alleyway, which we saw in the trailer, but it was cut out. I think that scene would've given us more fighting footage of Capt. America taking out the Chitari in the battle. Unfortunately, we never get to see that missing scene, even on blu ray (which I own).

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Old 03-09-2014, 11:18 AM   #281
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

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No, Stark couldn't contend with Loki. Neither of the repulsor blasts that he hit Loki with hurt Loki AT ALL. He got knocked down and then got right back up completely unharmed. The only reason why he got caught in Germany was because he WANTED to be caught. Also, I would have called BS if Cap were able to beat Loki. I don't care how skilled or smart he is, in a battle between man and god, god wins, period.
Yeah, except if that man is the Hulk, then god loses.

I'm okay with Cap not winning against Loki, but I do have a problem with the Helicarrier scene of him being pinned down by a pair of grunts. I do hope after TWS, Whedon will give Cap better fighting scenes to work with in Avengers 2, and let him become the leader of the team from the beginning.

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Old 03-09-2014, 11:21 AM   #282
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

"X got nerfed!"

where X = poster's favorite character

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Old 03-09-2014, 11:25 AM   #283
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

I guess if you look at it the right way, Cap did get a lot of good parts in the Avengers. I guess I'm just getting biased.

Let's get back on track with this interview with Sebastian Stan!

http://screenrant.com/captain-americ...n-stan-future/

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Old 03-09-2014, 11:28 AM   #284
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

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Yeah, except if that man is the Hulk, then god loses.

I'm okay with Cap not winning against Loki, but I do have a problem with the Helicarrier scene of him being pinned down by a pair of grunts. I do hope after TWS, Whedon will give Cap better fighting scenes to work with in Avengers 2, and let him become the leader of the team from the beginning.
I am okay with Cap having to earn that title in the 1st movie. All the other Avengers do fine on their own. They all have faith in their abilities and have egos. Cap was never just going to walk in the room and be respected. But, he clearly earns that as the movie goes on. Stark was just the one most opposed to him, and this is why they needed to be together on the hellicarrier and why them talking alone after Fury's speech are vital. It is here Cap earns his respect, and finally gets the respect as leader.

That said, I do think maybe more people should have been shooting at Cap. Make it a legion of evil SHIELD agents as opposed to 1 guy. That I think would have made Cap look a lot better, and that only would have required more extras (not even altering any of Cap's shots outside of more bullet flashes and metal noises). I agree that 1 guy is sort of weak.

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Old 03-09-2014, 11:49 AM   #285
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

I think the issue for me was that he was basically told, see this small area, stay in that small area. Then we have a scene of them spraying rounds at each other. Both Cap and the grunt appeared inexperienced and really Cap's "tension" moment was him hanging from a rope.

I think that it would have been better to have him have to find the lever Stark was referring to by acrobats through the levels, and taking out grunts along the way ala the recent clip of BW in TWS. And maybe end with a shield throw to push the lever if he was "pinned" down. That entire sequence he goes shieldless (for obvious theatrical reasons).

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Old 03-09-2014, 12:10 PM   #286
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

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It's true that CBMs tend to be front-loaded due to their high opening weekend grosses. However, CATFA was less front-loaded than most. It made $65 million its first weekend and went on to earn $176 million, which gives it a 2.7 multiplier. Iron Man 3, in contrast, had around a 2.3 multiplier. It's a lot to ask for but I'm rooting for a similar 2.7 multiplier (or better) for TWS. With an opening in the mid $90 million range it would top $250 million with that sort of multi.



Look up Sif in the Marvel wiki. She is said to be able to press 30 tons. Lorelei has similar strength, which would be more than enough to send a human flying like a ragdoll.

ETA: I don't get why the Captain America/Loki fight in TA upsets some people. Loki is and should be far stronger than Cap. It would have been shocking if Cap had been able to go toe-to-toe with Loki, frankly. The disparity in their physical strength is enormous.

I was much more upset that Loki was able to hold his own with Thor and even get the better of his brother. Thor is canonically twice as strong as Loki so their fight at Stark Tower shouldn't even have been a contest. Happily, this was explained away in TDW by Thor telling Loki that he held back in their fights but could and would kill him if need be.
Yeah, the MCU and the Marvel wiki isn´t the same thing as you know. So one must also take in considiration what we´ve actually seen in the MCU. But basically you´re right. Sif is strong, that´s as it should be but Amora the Enchantress younger sister? She can lift somewhere between 800lbs to 25 ton according to Marvel wiki. In my opinion the average MCU Asgardian doesn´t seem to be that strong but yes.

Me too, we can always say it was the scepter that boosted him, did you notice he had blue eyes as opposed to the green ones?


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Old 03-09-2014, 12:11 PM   #287
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

I can't wait for tomorrow night when we hear first twitter reactions about the film!

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Old 03-09-2014, 12:52 PM   #288
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

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Originally Posted by Raiden View Post
There was a scene in which Cap was fighting in the alleyway, which we saw in the trailer, but it was cut out. I think that scene would've given us more fighting footage of Capt. America taking out the Chitari in the battle. Unfortunately, we never get to see that missing scene, even on blu ray (which I own).
I think you are talking about this scene.
VIDEO-CLick to Watch!:

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Old 03-09-2014, 01:20 PM   #289
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

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I can't wait for tomorrow night when we hear first twitter reactions about the film!
Thanks for mentioning that; I'll check them out to!

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Old 03-09-2014, 01:34 PM   #290
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16



I don't know what Cap is doing...

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Old 03-09-2014, 01:37 PM   #291
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

Thanks for the link to Sebastian's interview, TJByrum. Man, those Marvel contracts must be ironclad if they can announce the sequel's title prior to informing the actor previously contracted to play the main character needed for that plot. If I remember correctly, Stan was quite busy with other projects at the time as well.

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You know, I kind of have to give credit to Marvel and JJ for casting Sebastian Stan as Bucky in TFA in the first place, likely with the kernel or nugget of the idea that they'd eventually get around to telling the Winter Soldier story. And they kept him, they did NOT recast him with a bigger name actor or something. I just think that'd be something other studios would've done probably, as WS is one of Marvel's marquee villains and Stan isn't really a big name actor. He's great, but he really isn't well known, even by the people who watched the first Captain America movie.
It wouldn't have surprised me if Johnston got to helm the sequel. He seemed to really like Sebastian to the point of seeing himself doing WS franchise/stand-alone film around him. While he is not a known name in the mainstream media, he does seem to have fanbase outside of playing Bucky. They seem to be less vocal than most fanbases, however. In fact, my good friend is going to see the film with me mainly because she is a fan of Stan in OUAT. I couldn't get her to go see previous Marvel films before this.

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Old 03-09-2014, 01:44 PM   #292
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

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I don't know what Cap is doing...
Force choke hold duh

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Old 03-09-2014, 01:46 PM   #293
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

Fury's behind him going WTF...?

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Old 03-09-2014, 01:46 PM   #294
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

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Yeah, the MCU and the Marvel wiki isn´t the same thing as you know. So one must also take in considiration what we´ve actually seen in the MCU. But basically you´re right. Sif is strong, that´s as it should be but Amora the Enchantress younger sister? She can lift somewhere between 800lbs to 25 ton according to Marvel wiki. In my opinion the average MCU Asgardian doesn´t seem to be that strong but yes.

Me too, we can always say it was the scepter that boosted him, did you notice he had blue eyes as opposed to the green ones?

Where Lorelei is concerned, she is obviously being portrayed as having super-strength on AOS, otherwise she wouldn't have been able to toss that guy as she did. She is also going to fight Sif which means she has to be able to hold her own for at least a little while. Lorelei won't be stronger than Sif, of course, but she has to be very strong in her own right. We don't have much to judge Asgardian strength by but in TDW Frigga was able to beat Malekith in a one-on-one battle. He had to be saved by Kurse or she would have put the sword to him. To me that says that Asgardian women are extremely strong and formidable fighters.

As for Loki, his eyes have always been blue. In the comics he may be portrayed as green-eyed but in the MCU his eyes are Hiddleston blue.

Before Thor told Loki that he had been holding back when fighting him because he still had hope for his brother, I also assumed that the scepter had boosted Loki's strength. But Thor made it clear that that was not the case. Now I would really love to see a one-one-one showdown between the two, if only to see Thor beat Loki senseless for once.


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I can't wait for tomorrow night when we hear first twitter reactions about the film!
The most we're likely to read are vague reports of how good (or bad) various writers found the movie to be. They can't break their embargoes so they'll just tease their reactions.

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Old 03-09-2014, 01:46 PM   #295
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

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I don't know what Cap is doing...
He's throwing the shield and in a way it could be seen as an homage to the poster seen in the bar of CA:TFA. You know the one that kind of replicates the I Want You poster w/ Uncle Sam.

It's either that or his best Billy Idol impersonation.

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Old 03-09-2014, 01:49 PM   #296
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

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I don't know what Cap is doing...
Very cool. Its like he just threw it out of the poster.

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Old 03-09-2014, 01:49 PM   #297
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

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Old 03-09-2014, 02:05 PM   #298
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

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I don't know what Cap is doing...
"To me, my shield!"

Actually, I think Cap looks good there. Marvel has great artists creating its posters.

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Old 03-09-2014, 02:06 PM   #299
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

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He's throwing the shield and in a way it could be seen as an homage to the poster seen in the bar of CA:TFA. You know the one that kind of replicates the I Want You poster w/ Uncle Sam.

It's either that or his best Billy Idol impersonation.
That's very strange . It indeed kinda reminds that moment in TFA his body position is like if Cap was about to do Haka lol

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Old 03-09-2014, 02:10 PM   #300
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Default Re: Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - Part 16

I lurk over at BoxOffice.com's forums (Hi Chewy!!) and did come across this from a poster DashRendar44:

Quote:
I heard the movie has already been projected here in France for some critics and the only beef so far is the weak soundtrack that is a far cry from Silvestri "GI-Joe 2 like" but they all agree that the tone, the directing and structure are well crafted and entertaining so it could be the better Avengers follow-up than Thor 2 ever might have been...).
So… yep!

ETA: I really love reading through that BOF thread from the beginning… Dissing the Russos, "Falcon? A black dude with wings? Pass…" "Cap's boring, this movie doesn't need a sequel!" "Bucky sucks…"

Heee!! And now that thread's hopping with way more positivity than before.

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