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Old 03-24-2014, 07:10 PM   #51
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

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But we have seen comic book movies carried by unknowns before, how many people heard of Andrew Garfield before he was cast as Spider-Man and Christopher Reeves was an unknown before he was cast as Superman. Unknowns are cast in these roles often. Maybe they are spending the money that would have gone towards some super star's salary to make the movie look really great.

Plus we don't know if this will just be a straight adaption of UFF, rather then a hybrid between the 616 FF and the UFF. Avengers has taken aspects of the Ultimates and very few seemed to complain. Plus I thought the UFF had a few good ideas, I think Ultimate Mole Man has a better motive then 616 Mole Man and I usually don't like the Ultimate villains.

Personally I want to see a trailer and learn more about the plot, before I judge this cast and movie, one way or the other. If there is a trailer with phoned performances or the has Doom being a tycoon with goat legs, rather then a dictator with normal feet, then I would assuming this film sucks.
You need some star power to sell tickets. Having a big name attached to a film lends credibility.

Christopher Reeve was unknown but Superman: The Movie had names like Gene Hackman, Margot Kidder, Jackie Cooper and of course Marlon Brando.

Michael Keaton (a more recognizable name but a questionable choice at the time) had Jack Nicholson to draw audiences.

Christian Bale (not a huge draw) had names like Michael Caine, Morgan Freeman, and even Liam Neeson.

Robert Downey Jr. (another questionable choice at the time) had Gwynneth Paltrow, Jeff Bridges and Terrence Howard (hot off of Oscar winning Crash).

Chris Hemsworth had Anthony Hopkins and Natalie Portman.

Chris Evans had Tommy Lee Jones and Hugo Weaving.

Henry Cavill had Russel Crowe, Kevin Costner, Diane Lane, Laurence Fishburne and Amy Adams.

Even Guardians of the Galaxy this summer has lead Chris Pratt supported by talent like Glenn Close and Benicio Del Toro.

What does the Fantastic Four have? I haven't heard of any big names attached to this project and who would want to be? We don't even have an actor cast for Dr. Doom yet. And they're supposed to be filming in less than four weeks?

It's almost like Fox has intentionally gone out of the their way to find cheap disposable talent. They are not really serious about this film. And aside from announcing a sequel date (that can easily be allocated to another film) and a paltry $100 million dollar budget (laughable considering the material) they've done nothing to indicate otherwise.

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Old 03-24-2014, 07:39 PM   #52
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13


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Old 03-24-2014, 07:40 PM   #53
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

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You need some star power to sell tickets. Having a big name attached to a film lends credibility.

Christopher Reeve was unknown but Superman: The Movie had names like Gene Hackman, Margot Kidder, Jackie Cooper and of course Marlon Brando.

Michael Keaton (a more recognizable name but a questionable choice at the time) had Jack Nicholson to draw audiences.

Christian Bale (not a huge draw) had names like Michael Caine, Morgan Freeman, and even Liam Neeson.

Robert Downey Jr. (another questionable choice at the time) had Gwynneth Paltrow, Jeff Bridges and Terrence Howard (hot off of Oscar winning Crash).

Chris Hemsworth had Anthony Hopkins and Natalie Portman.

Chris Evans had Tommy Lee Jones and Hugo Weaving.

Henry Cavill had Russel Crowe, Kevin Costner, Diane Lane, Laurence Fishburne and Amy Adams.

Even Guardians of the Galaxy this summer has lead Chris Pratt supported by talent like Glenn Close and Benicio Del Toro.

What does the Fantastic Four have? I haven't heard of any big names attached to this project and who would want to be? We don't even have an actor cast for Dr. Doom yet. And they're supposed to be filming in less than four weeks?

It's almost like Fox has intentionally gone out of the their way to find cheap disposable talent. They are not really serious about this film. And aside from announcing a sequel date (that can easily be allocated to another film) and a paltry $100 million dollar budget (laughable considering the material) they've done nothing to indicate otherwise.

How do we there are not famous people in the supporting cast? I think some people are being a bit quick to cast judgments on this film, when we don't have all the facts yet. I personally just want some more information before I judge this film.

I think saying Fox doesn't care about this film because the main cast is not super famous seems like a rush to judgment. To me hiring someone someone super famous is the least important thing this movie can do, Jessica Alba was famous in 2005 and she didn't make those FF movies better or more popular. There are so many more important things that show whether or not Fox cares about this movie, then how famous the main cast is. Kate Mara may not be as famous as Jessica Alba, but unless she is drunk through out the entire movie, she will likely do a better job then Jessica Alba.

At least I know some of the cast are actually good actors, I would be unhappy if they hired Shia Labeouf as Reed Richards or Kristen Stewart as Susan Storm, then I would have a reason to complain, because these two may be more famous then any of this cast, but they are bad actors.

Will Smith's star power didn't save After Earth, I think a strong script is far more important then having some flavor of the month as part of the cast.

Don't get me wrong, this film could suck, big time, but I want some information before I make that judgment.


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Old 03-24-2014, 07:54 PM   #54
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

The only other major role left now is the villain, then supporting roles with Alicia (if they have her) and maybe be a love interest for Johnny.

Of those only the villain would have a big enough role to be equivalent to say Nicholson's Joker, Hackman's Luthor, Neeson's Ras A'Ghul etc.

So far the names we have seen rumoured being up for Doom are no bigger at all than those cast for the 4.

Given that the other casting rumours for each part have had at least one right in those listed (MBJ..well he was the only one really, Teller, Mara and Bell), I don't think it's out of bounds to suspect one of those already touted already has or will be given that part.

If so then there's no 'marquee' name draw at all here. All up and comers for sure, but that's it, with a Director on his 2nd film trying to reboot a franchise most people didn't think too much of last time round.

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Old 03-24-2014, 08:12 PM   #55
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

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The only other major role left now is the villain, then supporting roles with Alicia (if they have her) and maybe be a love interest for Johnny.

Of those only the villain would have a big enough role to be equivalent to say Nicholson's Joker, Hackman's Luthor, Neeson's Ras A'Ghul etc.

So far the names we have seen rumoured being up for Doom are no bigger at all than those cast for the 4.

Given that the other casting rumours for each part have had at least one right in those listed (MBJ..well he was the only one really, Teller, Mara and Bell), I don't think it's out of bounds to suspect one of those already touted already has or will be given that part.

If so then there's no 'marquee' name draw at all here. All up and comers for sure, but that's it, with a Director on his 2nd film trying to reboot a franchise most people didn't think too much of last time round.
The Captain America movie had Tommy Lee Jones playing a rather obscure character from there is no reason to assume an FF movie can't do the same or simply make up some character and put a famous face there. To me, how many famous faces are in this is film is irrelevant as a measuring stick to how much Fox cares about this film, if I saw a crappy trailer, then I would be more harsh. I like Kate Mara and Michael B. Jordan, to me that's more important then how famous they are.

I think a solid script and good performances will make this movie a success or failure, super stars don't have the same drawing power anymore compared to an interesting and often well realized concepts.

If star power made big movies, After Earth would be a big hit, instead of a flop.

To me I like some of the actors and to me that's more important then some famous face in the cast who I didn't care for.

Take a look at this article:

http://www.thewrap.com/movies/articl...s-video-100826

Star power is not as important as it used to be.


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Old 03-24-2014, 10:09 PM   #56
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

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The Captain America movie had Tommy Lee Jones playing a rather obscure character from there is no reason to assume an FF movie can't do the same or simply make up some character and put a famous face there. To me, how many famous faces are in this is film is irrelevant as a measuring stick to how much Fox cares about this film, if I saw a crappy trailer, then I would be more harsh. I like Kate Mara and Michael B. Jordan, to me that's more important then how famous they are.

I think a solid script and good performances will make this movie a success or failure, super stars don't have the same drawing power anymore compared to an interesting and often well realized concepts.

If star power made big movies, After Earth would be a big hit, instead of a flop.

To me I like some of the actors and to me that's more important then some famous face in the cast who I didn't care for.

Take a look at this article:

http://www.thewrap.com/movies/articl...s-video-100826

Star power is not as important as it used to be.
The FF doesn't need star power.
Or a big budget.
Or actors that resemble their comicbook counterparts.
Or a script that adapts the vastly more popular 616 version.
Or positive perception from the public based on the prior series.
Or ties to the wildly successful MCU.

But can it survive lacking all of these? I don't see how.

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Old 03-24-2014, 11:16 PM   #57
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

^Thank you!

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Old 03-25-2014, 01:35 AM   #58
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

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The FF doesn't need star power.
Or a big budget.
Or actors that resemble their comicbook counterparts.
Or a script that adapts the vastly more popular 616 version.
Or positive perception from the public based on the prior series.
Or ties to the wildly successful MCU.

But can it survive lacking all of these? I don't see how.
No offense, but only comic book fans are going to care how much the actors look like the characters, the general audience will not and the general audience just wants an entertaining film, they don't care if its based more on the 616 or Ultimate FF. Spider-Man is not connected to the MCU and his films still do well. Movie Electro doesn't look like 616 Electro, I don't think that will drive away patrons from the theaters.

Besides again I ask, how do we know this film won't be a cross between the 616 FF and the Ultimate FF, like Avengers was a cross between 616 Avengers and Ultimates? How do we know there won't some big name actors in the supporting cast? Also that article I posted argued star power is less of an important factor for a move's success nowadays.

Also where has the budget for this film been revealed?

No offense, but it seems like people are condemning this film, before we have enough information to make a good judgment.

I understand that many here are unhappy that Fox still has the rights to the FF, when they could easily fit into the MCU and feel that Fox is rushing a movie just to keep the rights. I would prefer Marvel have the rights back too, but that is not the situation we have.

However you could have made the same argument for X-Men First Class, it was a film designed to keep the rights that was made quickly and came off some bad X-Men films, but it was a good film.

I think Fox is doing a better job with the X-Men films, so they are at least making some quality super hero movies. Whether they can make a quality FF film, that remains to be seen, but Fox has at least made some decisions in the right direction recently.

I do think a good trailer could make the public excited for this film, but have to be a really good one to get the taste of those previous FF movies out of people's mouths.

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Old 03-25-2014, 03:28 AM   #59
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

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How do we there are not famous people in the supporting cast?
We know this with near certainty because of everything else Fox has said and done regarding this film and their history with the FF.

Fox has treated FF like a second-class property from the beginning, and they're not showing any signs of changing now. While nearly every other Marvel or DC film in the past 20 years has been treated seriously by their respective studios, FF has not, and Fox has not lifted one finger to illustrate in any tangible way that their attitude has changed.

Is it possible that FF will beat the odds and despite a complete lack of faith and effort from the studio still succeed? Sure. But Fox is not giving anybody who wants to defend this property anything to work with. Why don't you ask Fox to step up and give us something rather than defending their indefensible actions?

Anybody who cares about the FF or anybody who cares about Fox should realize that it would be better for FF and Fox and all of us if Fox gives a ***** about this film. So nobody is doing anybody any favors by rationalizing it away when they don't provide us with any evidence that they do give a *****.

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Old 03-25-2014, 07:04 AM   #60
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

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We know this with near certainty because of everything else Fox has said and done regarding this film and their history with the FF.

Fox has treated FF like a second-class property from the beginning, and they're not showing any signs of changing now. While nearly every other Marvel or DC film in the past 20 years has been treated seriously by their respective studios, FF has not, and Fox has not lifted one finger to illustrate in any tangible way that their attitude has changed.

Is it possible that FF will beat the odds and despite a complete lack of faith and effort from the studio still succeed? Sure. But Fox is not giving anybody who wants to defend this property anything to work with. Why don't you ask Fox to step up and give us something rather than defending their indefensible actions?

Anybody who cares about the FF or anybody who cares about Fox should realize that it would be better for FF and Fox and all of us if Fox gives a ***** about this film. So nobody is doing anybody any favors by rationalizing it away when they don't provide us with any evidence that they do give a *****.
This. Even the first time round, none of the actors were that big. Sure, Evans and Alba have gone on to become bigger stars, but at the time it was cast, it was cast because they were cheaper to work with. So we got the likes of Julian McMahon as Doom. It wasn't as if we got a bigger name for him or a more accomplished actor.

This time round, it looks very much like Fox are trying to repeat the same pattern and want to get away with as minimal effort as possible and still hope to make a profit.

So Fox get to keep the FF rights if this movie does go ahead. But what are they going to do with it if it flops? Do they still want to even have the FF associated with their X-Men franchise? Why would anyone want that? It's better and safer to keep them separate in case one has an adverse effect on the other. So FF will just be gathering dust on the shelf being unusable by anyone. A complete dog in the manger situation. If they can't make a success of it, they don't want anyone else to either.

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Old 03-25-2014, 07:17 AM   #61
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This. Even the first time round, none of the actors were that big. Sure, Evans and Alba have gone on to become bigger stars, but at the time it was cast, it was cast because they were cheaper to work with. So we got the likes of Julian McMahon as Doom. It wasn't as if we got a bigger name for him or a more accomplished actor.

This time round, it looks very much like Fox are trying to repeat the same pattern and want to get away with as minimal effort as possible and still hope to make a profit.

So Fox get to keep the FF rights if this movie does go ahead. But what are they going to do with it if it flops? Do they still want to even have the FF associated with their X-Men franchise? Why would anyone want that? It's better and safer to keep them separate in case one has an adverse effect on the other. So FF will just be gathering dust on the shelf being unusable by anyone. A complete dog in the manger situation. If they can't make a success of it, they don't want anyone else to either.
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Old 03-25-2014, 09:11 AM   #62
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We know this with near certainty because of everything else Fox has said and done regarding this film and their history with the FF.

Fox has treated FF like a second-class property from the beginning, and they're not showing any signs of changing now. While nearly every other Marvel or DC film in the past 20 years has been treated seriously by their respective studios, FF has not, and Fox has not lifted one finger to illustrate in any tangible way that their attitude has changed.

Is it possible that FF will beat the odds and despite a complete lack of faith and effort from the studio still succeed? Sure. But Fox is not giving anybody who wants to defend this property anything to work with. Why don't you ask Fox to step up and give us something rather than defending their indefensible actions?

Anybody who cares about the FF or anybody who cares about Fox should realize that it would be better for FF and Fox and all of us if Fox gives a ***** about this film. So nobody is doing anybody any favors by rationalizing it away when they don't provide us with any evidence that they do give a *****.
I'm just saying because there are no famous faces among the main cast, to me is not proof that Fox has no faith in this project, I can bring up a couple entertainment articles that say star power is not the big driver of success of movies that it used to be:

http://variety.com/2013/biz/news/pet...al-1200567820/

http://www.thewrap.com/movies/articl...s-video-100826

Last summer we say several over produced movies with huge budgets and famous faces that flopped.

Fox jamming in random famous faces into these roles doesn't mean anything, its not a sign of quality or faith in the film, if they made it into a star vehicle for some big star that wouldn't be treating it with respect and if the movie had a truly huge budget, it would still suck if it had bad script. An FF movie that became the next Lone Ranger or After Earth, wouldn't be very good either, would it?

That's what's missing here, we don't anything about the plot and we have not seen a trailer, I can't make judgement one way or the other until I see more. This film may very well suck and people have a right to worried about Fox. But I think people are judging the actors and the director before we seen any results from them. Sometimes you can't make a good judgment about something until you get a better picture of it. Green Lantern was another over produced movie with star power, a huge budget and a bad script, big names and a truly huge budget wouldn't make an FF film good unless the script is good.

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Old 03-25-2014, 09:32 AM   #63
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People also know who this cast are. Kate Mara is on a hugely popular show, MBJ just came off of Fruitville Station which was a huge critical hit and won a ton of awards, Jamie Bell has been around for a while and is known for Billy Elliot, really the only relative unknown in the group is Teller, and he's nowhere near Reeve's unknown status when he got cast, Teller has been in quite a few fairly successful films.

They're really not unknowns you guys. They're not A-list celebrities who everybody and their grandma knowns intimately, but they're about on the level Chris Evans or Chris Hemmensworth or Tom Hiddleston were when they first got cast in superhero movies. Probably a little better known than Hemmensworth and Hiddleston, actually.
I think you're overestimating the general audience's familiarity with the four names chosen for this movie. The fact of the matter is that while these people may be recognized by their face, as in "Oh, I remember that guy from The Wire!" or "Hey, that guy was the douche in Divergent," their name value is not enough to catch the attention of the vast majority of the movie-going public.

All of the things listed that you think makes these people recognizable, it's not as wide-reaching as you might believe. You say House of Cards is "a hugely popular show," but estimates say that between 1.5-2.7 million people have seen at least one episode. I imagine that's not a huge percentage of the summer blockbuster crowd they're hoping to attract. Fruitvale Station may have been a hit with critics, but that means very little to the average movie-goer looking for a popcorn flick (and that's what Fox wants this to be, make no mistake). Jamie Bell has been a fair amount of movies, but if Billy Elliot is what he's best known for then he's not that well-known. You say Teller is relatively unknown? I'd say he's now the most well-known following the release of Divergent, since it'll be the biggest box-office earner that any of these four have been involved in.

Since you've brought Evans, Hemsworth & Hiddleston into the discussion, others have made the point for me. They surrounded those guys with established names and highly recognized actors/actresses as supporting characters. Fox hasn't done that in the casting for FF up to this point and it doesn't seem likely that they will.

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Old 03-25-2014, 10:07 AM   #64
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

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I'm just saying because there are no famous faces among the main cast, to me is not proof that Fox has no faith in this project, I can bring up a couple entertainment articles that say star power is not the big driver of success of movies that it used to be:

http://variety.com/2013/biz/news/pet...al-1200567820/

http://www.thewrap.com/movies/articl...s-video-100826

Last summer we say several over produced movies with huge budgets and famous faces that flopped.

Fox jamming in random famous faces into these roles doesn't mean anything, its not a sign of quality or faith in the film, if they made it into a star vehicle for some big star that wouldn't be treating it with respect and if the movie had a truly huge budget, it would still suck if it had bad script. An FF movie that became the next Lone Ranger or After Earth, wouldn't be very good either, would it?

That's what's missing here, we don't anything about the plot and we have not seen a trailer, I can't make judgement one way or the other until I see more. This film may very well suck and people have a right to worried about Fox. But I think people are judging the actors and the director before we seen any results from them. Sometimes you can't make a good judgment about something until you get a better picture of it. Green Lantern was another over produced movie with star power, a huge budget and a bad script, big names and a truly huge budget wouldn't make an FF film good unless the script is good.
There are certainly films that are big-budget flops and there are films that are low-budget stand-outs.

. . . but if somebody wants to make a great superhero film - particularly with a property like Fantastic four that has 4 superpowered characters and exotic sets, costumes etc. - I don't think the way to do it is to go cheap.

I don't think the first two FF films would have been any better with big-name stars, but big-name stars illustrate a faith and commitment that other, succesful, superhero films have. I've watched how Fox treats FF and I'm convinced they won't give us a big-name for the simple fact that they don't value the FF (if I'm wrong, we should hear soon since filming is scheduled to start in less than a month. I hope I'm wrong and please feel free to rub it in my face if they do bring in a Tommy Lee Jones type name).

If filming starts in April, I'll have no choice but to hope we'll get a better film than I expect, but I'll never say: "Thank you Fox for giving this film a lower budget, a less experienced director and writer and a weaker cast than every other successful superhero film of the last 20 years."

I'm an FF fan and I want Fox to do it right, so I won't make excuses for them when they show a lack of commitment. Sure they could surprise everybody and produce a great film without putting much effort in, but I'm an FF fan and I refuse to quietly accept (or worse yet make excuses for) them treating this property with less respect than every other successful superhero film.

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Old 03-25-2014, 10:25 AM   #65
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Nobody outside of movie buffs and comic nerds really knows these actors that Fox is scrounging up.

People wonder why so many of us fans want the FF in the MCU. Well just look how much faith Marvel has in their properties. Bloody Ant-Man gets:

Edgar Wright
Michael Douglass
Paul Rudd
Patrick Wilson
Michael Peña
Evangeline Lilly

Ant-Man. Let that sink in a moment. An obscure 50+ year old property that could never carry a title and a character who has become the butt of jokes even in the comics.

Whereas the FF, the title that put Marvel on the map, what do they get?

A meager $100 million budget, with a bunch of no-name kid actors and a director that's made a grand total of one film - a "found footage" film at that. SMDH.

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Old 03-25-2014, 10:38 AM   #66
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Also all this talk about the script. How many rewrites has this thing gone through? And now Simon Kinberg? What has he done? X-Men: The Last Stand and XXX: State of the Union? I'm supposed to be excited about this guy?

And then there's Vaughn "It's not a comedy" and Teller "I didn't feel like I was reading this larger-than-life, incredible superhero tale". Comments like these tell me the script is absolutely nothing like what an FF film should be. Then you look at the cast and you say why call this the Fantastic Four at all (other than the obvious rights grab)? Why not just make a cool movie and call it whatever you want?

If Fox really goes through with this and does this thing, believe me I want to be blown away by it. I want it to be the most incredible comic book movie ever. But nothing I've heard leads me to believe that is even a remote possibility and you can't blame many of us for having nothing but dread for this film being put into production which, in the likelihood that it either fails utterly or is merely yet another mediocre outing, will keep our favorite comic characters condemned to the equivalent of cinematic purgatory.

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Old 03-25-2014, 10:47 AM   #67
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Nobody outside of movie buffs and comic nerds really knows these actors that Fox is scrounging up.

People wonder why so many of us fans want the FF in the MCU. Well just look how much faith Marvel has in their properties. Bloody Ant-Man gets:

Edgar Wright
Michael Douglass
Paul Rudd
Patrick Wilson
Michael Peña
Evangeline Lilly

Ant-Man. Let that sink in a moment. An obscure 50+ year old property that could never carry a title and a character who has become the butt of jokes even in the comics.

Whereas the FF, the title that put Marvel on the map, what do they get?

A meager $100 million budget, with a bunch of no-name kid actors and a director that's made a grand total of one film - a "found footage" film at that. SMDH.
The original live-action Ant Man -



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Old 03-25-2014, 11:00 AM   #68
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the original live-action ant man -



he's as strong as a normal sized man.
lol!

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Old 03-25-2014, 11:02 AM   #69
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

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There are certainly films that are big-budget flops and there are films that are low-budget stand-outs.

. . . but if somebody wants to make a great superhero film - particularly with a property like Fantastic four that has 4 superpowered characters and exotic sets, costumes etc. - I don't think the way to do it is to go cheap.

I don't think the first two FF films would have been any better with big-name stars, but big-name stars illustrate a faith and commitment that other, succesful, superhero films have. I've watched how Fox treats FF and I'm convinced they won't give us a big-name for the simple fact that they don't value the FF (if I'm wrong, we should hear soon since filming is scheduled to start in less than a month. I hope I'm wrong and please feel free to rub it in my face if they do bring in a Tommy Lee Jones type name).

If filming starts in April, I'll have no choice but to hope we'll get a better film than I expect, but I'll never say: "Thank you Fox for giving this film a lower budget, a less experienced director and writer and a weaker cast than every other successful superhero film of the last 20 years."

I'm an FF fan and I want Fox to do it right, so I won't make excuses for them when they show a lack of commitment. Sure they could surprise everybody and produce a great film without putting much effort in, but I'm an FF fan and I refuse to quietly accept (or worse yet make excuses for) them treating this property with less respect than every other successful superhero film.
I will rub it in your face if they get Ashley Tisdale - as big a name as any around here.

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Nobody outside of movie buffs and comic nerds really knows these actors that Fox is scrounging up.

People wonder why so many of us fans want the FF in the MCU. Well just look how much faith Marvel has in their properties. Bloody Ant-Man gets:

Edgar Wright
Michael Douglass
Paul Rudd
Patrick Wilson
Michael Peña
Evangeline Lilly

Ant-Man. Let that sink in a moment. An obscure 50+ year old property that could never carry a title and a character who has become the butt of jokes even in the comics.

Whereas the FF, the title that put Marvel on the map, what do they get?

A meager $100 million budget, with a bunch of no-name kid actors and a director that's made a grand total of one film - a "found footage" film at that. SMDH.


Getting Miles Teller as Reed seems a bit like if they got Gabe from "Good Luck Charlie" if he had grown up a bit more.

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Old 03-25-2014, 11:03 AM   #70
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

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Also all this talk about the script. How many rewrites has this thing gone through? And now Simon Kinberg? What has he done? X-Men: The Last Stand and XXX: State of the Union? I'm supposed to be excited about this guy?
Keep in mind, Kinberg didn't write it. Jeremy Slater wrote it. T. S. Nowlin cleaned it up and then Kinberg did the final revisions.

Who are Jeremy Slater and T. S. Nowlin? Two writers who do not have any previous screen-writing credits.

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Old 03-25-2014, 11:28 AM   #71
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

I would have been considered a part of the General Audience back in 2004. ALL of my family and friends are considered General Audience when it comes to comic book movies. I believe there is one teacher that is a comic book fan...he's a DC man. Most people know the Fantastic Four NOT from the comic books, but from the 3 different Saturday morning cartoon programs that span about 40 years of TV. I would bet that the General Audience knows far more about the FF than we think they do, most of it from the cartoon I can assume.

I was not allowed to read comic books growing up, to my mom they were not proper reading material, I read some from my friends that was it, but I came into the forum in 2004 with a pretty solid understanding of the FF, at least at the basic level, and I bet many others do as well just from viewing the cartoons of the 60's, 70s, 90s, and 00's.

So, to say that the GA doesn't really have a good understanding of the F4, I think is incorrect. I've now moved through 4 decades, in my 4th the cartoons only changed the storyline, the F4 basically looked, acted and sounded the same as they did 60 years ago. ALL THE WAY UP to this very last version of the cartoon just a few years ago. The GA probably understands far more than we give them credit for.....

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Old 03-25-2014, 11:34 AM   #72
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

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Originally Posted by Kelly View Post
I would have been considered a part of the General Audience back in 2004. ALL of my family and friends are considered General Audience when it comes to comic book movies. I believe there is one teacher that is a comic book fan...he's a DC man. Most people know the Fantastic Four NOT from the comic books, but from the 3 different Saturday morning cartoon programs that span about 40 years of TV. I would bet that the General Audience knows far more about the FF than we think they do, most of it from the cartoon I can assume.

I was not allowed to read comic books growing up, to my mom they were not proper reading material, I read some from my friends that was it, but I came into the forum in 2004 with a pretty solid understanding of the FF, at least at the basic level, and I bet many others do as well just from viewing the cartoons of the 60's, 70s, 90s, and 00's.

So, to say that the GA doesn't really have a good understanding of the F4, I think is incorrect. I've now moved through 4 decades, in my 4th the cartoons only changed the storyline, the F4 basically looked, acted and sounded the same as they did 60 years ago. ALL THE WAY UP to this very last version of the cartoon just a few years ago. The GA probably understands far more than we give them credit for.....
yeah, people severely underestimate the power of pop-culture. Hell, I remember the Rugrats episode of Super Diaper Babies, where Lil was "dotted line girl" and i knew they were completely referencing The Invisible Woman and how she was drawn in comics, and i certainly was not reading comics then, nor did i know much about the F4 besides the basics.

the GA use to get a bad wrap. And while at times they have horribly poor taste, i also don't think they're nearly as stupid as some like to pretend they are... Most people don't see movies "just to see movies" especially superhero films.. they see them because...

A) they're fans
B) they know something about the character (even if just a tiny amount) and want to see it
C) they thoroughly enjoyed like films (as in the same universe films like the MCU)
D) they have kids who want to see it (or friends or significant others)
E) The trailer and reviews are beyond amazing. And they are eager to spend $13 bucks on a film they don't know about (this probably is actually the smallest percentage of people in all honesty) A massive reason theater prices have been on the rice is for the fact LESS AND LESS people are going to theaters now... It's becoming quite uncommon to go to the theater to see a movie "just to see it" when you can easily just stream or watch the film at home for much much cheaper. People go to the theaters now for the "experience" not just to "see a movie".

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Old 03-25-2014, 12:19 PM   #73
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

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Originally Posted by Kelly View Post
I would have been considered a part of the General Audience back in 2004. ALL of my family and friends are considered General Audience when it comes to comic book movies. I believe there is one teacher that is a comic book fan...he's a DC man. Most people know the Fantastic Four NOT from the comic books, but from the 3 different Saturday morning cartoon programs that span about 40 years of TV. I would bet that the General Audience knows far more about the FF than we think they do, most of it from the cartoon I can assume.

I was not allowed to read comic books growing up, to my mom they were not proper reading material, I read some from my friends that was it, but I came into the forum in 2004 with a pretty solid understanding of the FF, at least at the basic level, and I bet many others do as well just from viewing the cartoons of the 60's, 70s, 90s, and 00's.

So, to say that the GA doesn't really have a good understanding of the F4, I think is incorrect. I've now moved through 4 decades, in my 4th the cartoons only changed the storyline, the F4 basically looked, acted and sounded the same as they did 60 years ago. ALL THE WAY UP to this very last version of the cartoon just a few years ago. The GA probably understands far more than we give them credit for.....
Quote:
Originally Posted by spideyboy_1111 View Post
yeah, people severely underestimate the power of pop-culture. Hell, I remember the Rugrats episode of Super Diaper Babies, where Lil was "dotted line girl" and i knew they were completely referencing The Invisible Woman and how she was drawn in comics, and i certainly was not reading comics then, nor did i know much about the F4 besides the basics.

the GA use to get a bad wrap. And while at times they have horribly poor taste, i also don't think they're nearly as stupid as some like to pretend they are... Most people don't see movies "just to see movies" especially superhero films.. they see them because...

A) they're fans
B) they know something about the character (even if just a tiny amount) and want to see it
C) they thoroughly enjoyed like films (as in the same universe films like the MCU)
D) they have kids who want to see it (or friends or significant others)
E) The trailer and reviews are beyond amazing. And they are eager to spend $13 bucks on a film they don't know about (this probably is actually the smallest percentage of people in all honesty) A massive reason theater prices have been on the rice is for the fact LESS AND LESS people are going to theaters now... It's becoming quite uncommon to go to the theater to see a movie "just to see it" when you can easily just stream or watch the film at home for much much cheaper. People go to the theaters now for the "experience" not just to "see a movie".
A whole lot of good points in here, and I think the idea that there's us and then everybody else who has no idea who the FF are is a highly flawed concept.

There are a lot of people out there who probably couldn't name all the characters or tell you much about their origin, but they'll say something like: "Yeah, weren't they the ones with that orange-rock guy and the flame guy and the guy that stretches . . . "

There's a lot of general familiarity for these characters and the farther the film strays from those elements people recognize, the less interested people will be.

I'm not a big Iron Man fan, but I have a general idea of who he is. If Marvel had cast a 22 year old blonde kid to play Tony Stark and gave him blue and purple armor, I probably would have said: "That doesn't look like Iron Man to me." And I may have never gone to the first movie.

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Old 03-25-2014, 12:48 PM   #74
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

I have to give props to the current FF franchise for attempting fun - as much as they flopped, I really hope this new movie embraces the fun element of superheroes. Not everything has to be dark and gritty ala Nolan's Batman, or Snyder's Supe.

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Old 03-25-2014, 01:27 PM   #75
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Default Re: Fantastic Four reborn! - - - - Part 13

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Not everything has to be dark and gritty ala Nolan's Batman, or Snyder's Supe.
Some franchises should specifically NOT be. FF is one of them.

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