The SuperHeroHype Forums  

Go Back   The SuperHeroHype Forums > Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice > Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-20-2014, 04:26 AM   #1
Gu3ree
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: China
Posts: 215
Default Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

Man of Steel had many flaws. Not that I disliked Man of Steel entirely, but that whole hand-held thing was another takeoff from Nolan's Batman trilogy, but from what I saw, Nolan's films were not entirely hand held, for specific and IMPORTANT scenes or action sequences, they were NOT hand-held, other scenes were. I think some hand-held shots are okay, but for me, it just did not work in Man of Steel. I think some of it worked in Nolan's trilogy, however I thought it was done terribly in Man of Steel.

Man of Steel is one of the worst hand-held shooted film I have ever seen. I would like to see what the eff is going on when Jor-El is fighting Zod. It's just shaky, shaky, shaky and it makes me frustrated and think why is that necessary?

Firstly, hand-held usually is a poor and cheap way to do a film. You want to make a beautiful film, use a more formal and traditional approach. Keep the camera still.

Let me re-phrase that, hand-held isn't all bad, but "SHAKY CAM" is awful.

One of Man of Steel's major flaws for me, along with how dark themed and too much action that it had.

Man of Steel failed to keep the camera stayed in one position and balance it. Now there are a certain number of scenes that are not hand-held in MOS, and I think those shots in particular were beautiful shots, such as the shot of Superman walking down the arctic. Perry, Lombard, Jenny walking down the pile of destruction.

Or Superman floating away from his father in space. It looks great in 3D and it's not hand-held. Or that shot of Superman with his fist down the snowy ground about to take off. That's beautiful. Why can't they just keep the shots like that? Another shot that was not hand held was Lois walking towards to the scout ship.

I did not think that hand-held was relevant nor suited this story. I know they want to keep it as realistic as possible, but I don't think hand-held was necessary. It made me conscious that we were watching a movie, rather than feeling as if we were in the movie, especially the beginning on Krypton at the council. Everything is seemingly perfect for the film, the design, costumes, visual effects, background and color, everything looks great for what should be an epic film...the problem is the hand-held shots. And another thing is we are on another planet I found hard to believe due to the shaky camera. Could I contemplate anymore for why the camera simply could not just stay still.

Most of the action sequences were not hand held. What was the point if the camera stayed still in the sky, when you have Superman or Zod flying when the rest of the film is shot hand held?

Snyder said in an interview that the reason the camera is shaky when Superman flies on screen is because the camera is constantly struggling to stay in position with Superman because he flies so fast. Superman's arms and half of his head is cut off from screen, why does it have to be that way? In addition, Cavill moves around the camera to act like he's flying, it feels unrealistic. When Reeve flew, I actually believed it. part of that had to do with the way it was filmed. I could actually see Superman flying and believe he was flying. Like WOW!

I mean when Superman and Zod are fighting in the Metropolis skyline in MOS, the camera seems to have no problem catching up with them, so why in other shots, does the camera struggle to stay in position with Superman? That's another reason why this hand-held approach was not necessary. Come on.

Or how about that shot of Superman rescuing Lois from the phantom drive? It's an amazing shot. The camera is not really shaking. You can see Superman flying and carrying Lois. The rest of the film should have just been shot in this style, a more formal approach.

So why did everything else have to be hand held? It was very documentary style. I felt like there were several camera men documenting the Smallville disaster. It really felt like someone was walking in front of Superman and all the other characters filming it. Like Superman could just smile at you or look at you in the camera.

My point is, the shots I described that were not "shaky" looked beauitful and should have been shot like this through-out the entire movie. Those few shots suited the epic film. That hero shot of Superman in the center looking at Zod down his knees as he gives the speech, and the rest of the Superman vs. Zod fight. It would seem awkward to keep most of this fighting sequence hand-held and shaky. The epicness called of a formal approach to keep the camera still. A formal approach would be so much better.

I hope Batman vs. Superman won't be filmed hand-held, or at least not entirely shaky. Post your thoughts.

P.S. like the scene where Clark arrives back at the Kent farm, and we have that scene with Martha Kent talking to each other...notice how shaky the camera is...it would be so much better if....

Gu3ree is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 05:05 AM   #2
Uroboric Forms
Your Move, Creep
 
Uroboric Forms's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 982
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

I disagree absolutely. I never noticed any shaky camera in TDKT that Snyder was supposedly aping, and I thought it worked wonderfully in MOS. In the Kansas scenes it adds a homespun quality, in the action scenes it forces a first-person perspective. It's not intrusive like Cloverfield or any of those found-footage films, and it wasn't shaky throughout. Sure, scenes like the interview scene (with Lois and the military behind the glass) are obviously hand-held, it's not shaky enough to be noticeable unless you're obsessing over it.

Uroboric Forms is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 05:09 AM   #3
Gu3ree
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: China
Posts: 215
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

Well that's another scene I could argue for. Why can't they require a stand for the camera when they are sitting down?

Gu3ree is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 06:29 AM   #4
Glassjaw
In training
 
Glassjaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Brighton/Somerset, UK
Posts: 1,395
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

I groan when I think about the hand held shakiness in MoS. It's fine in a action scene, but when Pa Kent and Clark are talking next to a truck, or Jor El is addressing the council, and the camera is shaking all over the place, I just have this picture of Synder being really pleased with himself for subverting expectations, since instead of using his well known over the top slow motion techniques, he's now doing an artsy hand held camera shake. For some reason.

Glassjaw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 06:38 AM   #5
Harley2004
Side-Kick
 
Harley2004's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 691
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

Man of steel, was very well directed. The fact that he shot the movie with one camera and on film is amazing. There was a lot of handheld, but you could see what was going on. The Smallville scene, was one of the best shot action scenes in any of these types of movies. The film aspect was important as well, it did not look like shiny video as all these movies are going that way.

Harley2004 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 06:57 AM   #6
Gu3ree
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: China
Posts: 215
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glassjaw View Post
I groan when I think about the hand held shakiness in MoS. It's fine in a action scene, but when Pa Kent and Clark are talking next to a truck, or Jor El is addressing the council, and the camera is shaking all over the place, I just have this picture of Synder being really pleased with himself for subverting expectations, since instead of using his well known over the top slow motion techniques, he's now doing an artsy hand held camera shake. For some reason.
I completely agree. That's all I'm arguing about and this is what surprised me that he suddenly changed his style. 300 is so beautifully shot and Watchmen. Superman is just as epic. Don't get me wrong, much of Man of Steel is beautifully shot. Krypton, the sun, the shots of the dragonfly bird...I forget what they called it. That amazing shot where Superman rescues Lois and is trying to speed away from the phantom drive dragging him in. It's iconic.

When it came to most of the action scenes or with visual effects, it looked great. When they have a bird's eye view shot, it's never hand held. Just simple camera movement. Or those shots of the ships flying in on Krypton. Beautiful.

Though it is hand held, the shot of Superman facing Zod with the background of the destruction in Metropolis is a great shot, and the following shot of Superman just standing and listening to Zod.

I felt like other scenes in particular that should have stayed still with the camera angle, like when Clark talks to Jor-El. All those pretty visuals in the background, couldn't he just have kept the camera still?

Another good shot was Superman flying himself up from the ground getting ready to fight Zod, "You're a monster Zod..." The CGI cape looks awesome.

Gu3ree is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 11:29 AM   #7
113
Side-Kick
 
113's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 933
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

tl;dr

But I will say that while I was watching the movie I didn't even notice it. And I'm surprised how many people have issues with it.

__________________
Favorite Fictional Characters
1. Superman 2. Spiderman 3. Iron Man 4. Green Lantern (John Stewart) 5. Flash

Best CBMs
1. Batman Begins 2. Man of Steel 3. Captain America: The Winter Soldier 4. The Dark Knight 5. Avengers
113 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 12:02 PM   #8
KillerMcQueen
Mildly sociopathic
 
KillerMcQueen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Oregon
Posts: 2,589
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

Quote:
Originally Posted by 113 View Post
tl;dr

But I will say that while I was watching the movie I didn't even notice it. And I'm surprised how many people have issues with it.
Yeah, wasn't an issue for me either. MOS doesn't come anywhere remotely close to fitting my definition of shaky cam.

__________________
"Life is locomotion, if you're not moving, you're not living."
KillerMcQueen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 12:07 PM   #9
InJustice
Side-Kick
 
InJustice's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,135
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerMcQueen View Post
Yeah, wasn't an issue for me either. MOS doesn't come anywhere remotely close to fitting my definition of shaky cam.
Thirded, people act as if the movie was shot like The first Hunger Games movie's final battle between Katniss and a tribute whose name escapes me...

InJustice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 12:22 PM   #10
The Endless
WE are Groot
 
The Endless's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 4,712
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

The cinematography was probably the strongest aspect of the film, for me. And the production design.

__________________
People think dreams aren't real just because they aren't made of matter, of particles. Dreams are real. But they are made of viewpoints, of images, of memories and puns and lost hopes
The Endless is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 01:39 PM   #11
John-An
The Man of Tomorrow
 
John-An's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Metropolis
Posts: 10,012
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uroboric Forms View Post
I disagree absolutely. I never noticed any shaky camera in TDKT that Snyder was supposedly aping, and I thought it worked wonderfully in MOS. In the Kansas scenes it adds a homespun quality, in the action scenes it forces a first-person perspective. It's not intrusive like Cloverfield or any of those found-footage films, and it wasn't shaky throughout. Sure, scenes like the interview scene (with Lois and the military behind the glass) are obviously hand-held, it's not shaky enough to be noticeable unless you're obsessing over it.

__________________
"I'll always be there. It's not the powers, not the cape. It's about standing up for justice. For truth. As long as people like you are out there, I'll be there. Always." - Superman
Diversity: The art of thinking independently together.
John-An is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 02:09 PM   #12
Lencho01
Shazoogle! Shazoogle!
 
Lencho01's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 15,783
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. MOS had both times.

__________________
I was at some diplomatic party once. Got to talking to this princess who told me that when it came to Superman, I was missing the point. She told me, "His real strength lay in his generous spirit and sense of what's fair." - King Faraday

"
He’s much more of a working class superhero, which is why we ended the whole book with the image of a laboring Superman. He’s Everyman operating on a sci–fi Paul Bunyan scale." - Grant Morrison

"Self Portrait" By Batman
Lencho01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 02:14 PM   #13
TheFlamingCoco
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,880
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

I want a mix. Handheld shots for distant, POV views from bystanders, and steadycam for dialog moments and up close action. And don't go whipzoom crazy this time

TheFlamingCoco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 02:17 PM   #14
hafizbat
Side-Kick
 
hafizbat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,730
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

The Winter Soldier had a fair bit of shaky cam, and they pulled it off pretty well. I don't see anyone complaining about it. I guess overall disappointment with a film exacerbates issues....or even makes new ones out of nowhere.

hafizbat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 02:23 PM   #15
IronSoldier
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 49
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

Some should be the hand held camera. Some should not. I also think they should have some in 16:9 ratio like in TDKR.

IronSoldier is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 02:33 PM   #16
jonathancrane
I love Marvel, DC & EC!
 
jonathancrane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Caverns in Arkham Island
Posts: 6,869
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

As long as they do not zoom, I could care less what they do.

__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Aaron
"I've known since I first took over the series that I wanted to eventually have someone else pick up the hammer," says the writer. "It's kind of a time-honored Thor tradition at this point, isn't it? Going back to the days of Beta Ray Bill."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Johns
“At DC, we really see film and TV as separate worlds."
jonathancrane is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 03:50 PM   #17
X Knight
Straight Edge Knight
 
X Knight's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 26,629
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

yeah.....please no shaky cam.

__________________
Straight Edge and Proud!!

Disney Lover and Proud!!
X Knight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 04:07 PM   #18
fake
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,439
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

I had read the reviews saying the Shaky Cam was bad, so I went in expecting some awful shaky cam work. But after the Krypton council scene, I didn't notice any overt shaky cam in the movie. So I actually have no idea what the argument is around shaky cam - since it was just not noticeable for me.

fake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 04:32 PM   #19
RadioSha
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 619
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

I hated it too. The shakiness and the auto-zoom. The film could've done better with a more conventional cinematography IMO.

RadioSha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 06:28 PM   #20
MrsKent26
Whatever.
 
MrsKent26's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Fortress of Solitude
Posts: 10,459
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

I wasn't bothered by how MOS was shot. I found it pretty unique actually. I wouldn't go as far to call it shaky cam. It was...slightly unsteady cam.

__________________
"Somewhere in our darkest night, we made up the story of a man who will never let us down…" - Grant Morrison.

*
\S/T*
MrsKent26 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 06:39 PM   #21
Lord
All Mighty
 
Lord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 13,103
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

THey should definitelly drop the zoom in> unfocus> focus thing they did in the first filmevery time there was something in the sky, it works once, but not when you keep using it, at some point it just becomes tired.

__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by childeroland View Post
Plenty of male-led action films fail, yet the actors' gender is not blamed. Why should it be different for women? Especially since far more male-led action films are made than female-led action films?
Lord is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 06:56 PM   #22
Rorschach2012
$
 
Rorschach2012's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 10,405
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

yes!!!!! agreed completely, it only works for some films

Rorschach2012 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 06:59 PM   #23
STARMAN
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,282
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

Hand-held/shaky cam didn't bother me.

STARMAN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 08:13 PM   #24
EssayM
Just A Guy
 
EssayM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 776
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

I wouldn't say its distracting, but it is a little unnecessary. With a $225 M budget and the biggest possible CBM property in your care, the least you can do is spring for some tripods.

__________________
"You won't kill me out of some misplaced sense of self-righteousness, and I won't kill you because you're just too much fun."
EssayM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2014, 10:22 PM   #25
Gu3ree
Side-Kick
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: China
Posts: 215
Default Re: Please don't do hand-held/shaky cam shots for BvS

I'll say that's a better word, "unsteady cam". I liked it in some shots, I don't know why, the upclose shot of Jor-El and Superman, as Jor-El says, "You can save her, Kal..." And Superman's look, slightly shaky cam. I felt a realistic moment there.

I don't think all hand held films are terrible, because several movies are hand held, but the difference is that most directors managed to keep the camera steady.

Okay, for me, the worst hand-held movie was from Steven Spielberg himself, Saving Private Ryan. I don't care if it's because that's real life. That film was easy money and won an oscar because it was about war. Two hours of the camera shaking all over the place was distracting.

Somehow I never understood why the first shot of Superman in the Superman suit walking out of the scoutship as the doors open is shot hand held, still a beautiful shot, but a shot like that should just be "steady". That calls for a "steady" shot.

But most of the camera work in Man of Steel felt alarmingly unsteady and constantly shaking which was annoying.

Gu3ree is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:21 AM.

monitoring_string = "dee460792f24517621e3ca080805de7e"
Contact Us - Mobile - SuperHeroHype - ComingSoon.net - Shock Till You Drop - Lost Password - Clear Cookies - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Top - AdChoices


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SuperHeroHype.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.