All Things Superman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 27

[UaalaDan]

Things went downhill for me regarding SR when I found out Jason was Superman's son and saw a lot of plot points from the trading cards that came out a bit before the movie premiered. I remember getting pissed of when I saw the first pics of Lex Luthor wearing wigs, stealin money from the old lady and all... Story and his characterization basically killed it for me. I still had faith though that when I would watch it, being the first Superman movie that I would see in the theaters, It was still going to be good...In vain.

Hopefully that's not going to happen with MOS

 

[craigdbfan]

The airplane scene was pretty cool.

 

[UaalaDan]

The Smallville scenes, Plane rescue and Flight with Lois were the only decent scenes in the movie for me. I fast-foward every Luthor moment and eject the DVD every time the 3rd act comes.

It's funny how the movie basically killed Bosworth's and Spacey's careers and Singers would've been doomed if it didn't have X-men to fall back on. Routh was a nobody and still is so nothing has changed there.

 

[titansupes]

Yeah, Thor wasnt much better than GL imo. They were both pretty weak regardless of popularity and fanboyism.

Thank you, they were both bad. Green Lantern was worse, but... Not by much.

 

[dark_b]

I know who the critic is, and it's an actual person who writes for a major film site who Pony Boy is referring to. That being said, who cares? Why does it bother anybody either way?

I hope that the section of the SHH that I moderate doesn't lower themselves to the actions I find in other sections of The Hype where every negative review is just "wrong" and the writers are "stupid". On the other side every positive review is "right on the money" and the writers should "win an award".

There are going to be negative reviews and there are going to be positive reviews. It's not going to score 100% on Rotten Tomatoes. There will be posters that will love it and some will hate it, why does that mean either side of the fence is right or wrong?

Henry Cavill isn't an Academy Award winner automatically just because he is putting on a Superman suit, and he doesn't have to be. He just has to be Superman to whomever the individual is watching him in the role.

It would be nice if we could find the middle between the "No Way, Cavill Is The Best!" and the "Cavill Is Awful!". I'm not saying you can't actually have those opinions, but you could also try to understand why "the opposition" feels that way and accept it.

 

[titansupes]

Between this and your avatar it looks like you're having a hell of a party.

 

[herolee10]

Things went downhill for me regarding SR when I found out Jason was Superman's son and saw a lot of plot points from the trading cards that came out a bit before the movie premiered. I remember getting pissed of when I saw the first pics of Lex Luthor wearing wigs, stealin money from the old lady and all... Story and his characterization basically killed it for me. I still had faith though that when I would watch it, being the first Superman movie that I would see in the theaters, It was still going to be good...In vain.

Hopefully that's not going to happen with MOS

It also doesn't help that Superman didn't feel like the main character out of his own film; well that and the fact that they didn't allow Routh to have much dialogue to work with.

I'm really hoping that with MOS that Clark Kent has the most ST, especially when Cavil is portraying the role (since there are other actors playing Clark at different ages)

 

[G.Godfrey]

I'm really hoping that with MOS that Clark Kent has the most ST, especially when Cavil is portraying the role (since there are other actors playing Clark at different ages)

Be careful what you wish for. It could be that the Clark side of things is where Cavill is lacking (something nobody brought up yet, I think). I already don't like the look of his sad, depressed CK and if they gave that part too heavy scenes, I could see them being painful to watch. Everyone is so focused on Superman we forget his CK will probably take up half of the film. His CK already looks to be Earth One inspired but I think Cavill would be far better suited for a Birthright type CK. I have a lot of faith in his Superman, but CK, not sure. Never was.

 

[herolee10]

Be careful what you wish for. It could be that the Clark side of things is where Cavill is lacking (something nobody brought up yet, I think). I already don't like the look of his sad, depressed CK and if they gave that part too heavy scenes, I could see them being painful to watch. Everyone is so focused on Superman we forget his CK will probably take up half of the film. His CK already looks to be Earth One inspired but I think Cavill would be far better suited for a Birthright type CK. I have a lot of faith in his Superman, but CK, not sure. Never was.

Well, I'd like to think that there's some hope based on what Goyer mentioned on how he's an unabashed hero..but then again, that could just be in reference towards his Superman persona.lol

Didn't Cavil mention in a recent interview on how they'd show the character in a way where audiences will come to love the character even during the times when he makes mistakes?

 

[G.Godfrey]

Didn't Cavil mention in a recent interview on how they'd show the character in a way where audiences will come to love the character even during the times when he makes mistakes?

Cavill's thoughts on MOS and his character are probably the most biased out of anyone on the planet so I wouldn't read too much into them.

 

[LeMartien]

what are your feelings about the Lois / CLark / Daily Plenet parts ?

I think we're not going to see Clark in the daily planet until the end of the movie... And the movie will end with the mett between clark with glasses and Lois. in a "Lois & Clark TV show style"

 

[Krumm]

There are going to be negative reviews and there are going to be positive reviews. It's not going to score 100% on Rotten Tomatoes. There will be posters that will love it and some will hate it, why does that mean either side of the fence is right or wrong?

I think it's also important to note that not all opinions are created equal. Nowadays, any Joe Blow with a blog thinks they are a film critic and that simply isn't true. There is a certain level of education and experience needed to do the job just like any other. For me, I only pay attention to the Top Critics on Rotten Tomatoes.

People may say critiques are only an opinion, which is obviously true but only to an extent. There are aspects to a film that are good and bad, hence why there can be a majority consensus about the quality of a film. It's why we can say someone is a good filmmaker or a bad filmmaker.

Until people are putting their names on critiques, I'm not too concerned.

 

[Super Kal]

beauty will always be in he eye of the beholder. dont let someone else tell you how you will like the movie. make up your own darn mind

 

[Mad Love]

True but I don't want negative buzz to impact BO performance before people can make up their minds.

 

[Krumm]

beauty will always be in he eye of the beholder. dont let someone else tell you how you will like the movie. make up your own darn mind

Are there filmmakers or movies that you think are "good" or "bad?"

 

[matrix_ghost]

It's mostly for cast, crew, studio, and sometimes critics or reporters to get together to watch something that has been worked on for many months in the case of Friends and Family Screening.

There are moments though that critics screenings can do wonders.
As with all movies there is a review embargo though when buzz is extremely positive , the studio can left the embargo in order to let WOM spread.
That definately was the case with Avatar. Reactions on Twitter were extremely positive and Fox decided to lift the embargo pretty early on.
T

 

[superman2090]

Plenty of people bashed batman begins and Christian Bale and all we heard about SR was how great Routh was. Which one did better? I still think Bale was the wrong guy for Batman, but I love the movies. You just never know until you see the movie.

 

[Super Kal]

Are there filmmakers or movies that you think are "good" or "bad?"

of course i do (i have favorite movies, and movies i cant stand), but again, what i may find "good" or "bad" is subjective to my own personal opinion.

 

[JimJimBinks]

So from what I heard, the score wasn't complete in the cut that was shown. I don't know about most people, but to me the score can make or break a movie. I was lucky enough to attend an early screening of Fellowship of the Ring. The score they used was a combination of Dragon: The Bruce Lee Story, Dragonheart, and a couple of other movies. Key scenes had a much different feel, and didn't have quite the same emotional effect. Gandalf's death, the end, and even the introduction to the Shire felt completely different when the temp music used was written for a different movie. Try watching the opening battle from Gladiator with the Breakfast Machine music from Pee-Wee's Big Adventure playing.

Also, weird coincidence: Half way through writing this post, Pandora started playing the John Williams Superman theme.

 

[Krumm]

of course i do (i have favorite movies, and movies i cant stand), but again, what i may find "good" or "bad" is subjective to my own personal opinion.

I wouldn't say so. You may like or dislike something, which is completely a matter of opinion. I don't like Denzel Washington, but I wouldn't go as far to say that he's a bad actor -- he's just not for me. But to qualify something as good or bad is a different story.

For instance, if an entire movie was underexposed and you couldn't see anything, could you say the cinematographer is bad? Yes, you could.

If movie cut randomly from scene to see with no rhyme or reason, could you say the editor or writer is bad? Yes, you could.

There are elements to a film (structure, acting, lighting, directing, edit, sound, cinematography, etc.) and there is a logic behind those elements. Combine them together and you can make an informed decision on it being good or bad. That's why there is a complete school of thought behind it and there are film critics that have an understanding of this better than others. Roger Ebert is one and Mr. Nobody from CBS-TV Tulsa, OK is most likely not.

That is not to say that opinion does not factor into it at some point, it most definitely does, but the whole "beauty is in the eye of the beholder" is a bit of a cop out.

 

[Micromind]

So from what I heard, the score wasn't complete in the cut that was shown. I don't know about most people, but to me the score can make or break a movie. I was lucky enough to attend an early screening of Fellowship of the Ring. The score they used was a combination of Dragon: The Bruce Lee Story, Dragonheart, and a couple of other movies. Key scenes had a much different feel, and didn't have quite the same emotional effect. Gandalf's death, the end, and even the introduction to the Shire felt completely different when the temp music used was written for a different movie. Try watching the opening battle from Gladiator with the Breakfast Machine music from Pee-Wee's Big Adventure playing.

Also, weird coincidence: Half way through writing this post, Pandora started playing the John Williams Superman theme.

Agreed.

Maybe that is one of the reasons why Zimmer's score has not been finalized, maybe Zimmer wants more time to do something better.

 

[Dr.]

I think it's also important to note that not all opinions are created equal. Nowadays, any Joe Blow with a blog thinks they are a film critic and that simply isn't true. There is a certain level of education and experience needed to do the job just like any other. For me, I only pay attention to the Top Critics on Rotten Tomatoes.

Also - even if it is a “professional critic,” it helps to know who the critic is. Rex Reed, for example, seems to despise the superhero genre as a matter of principle (though, to be fair, I think he did enjoy the Schumacher movies ). Basically, this is not a man whose opinion a serious fan seeks out. So it comes down to knowing the critic’s track-record (particularly in a given genre) and noting a reasonably close match to one’s own tastes. Only then can you credit their opinion as useful/reliable.

 

[Super Kal]

i take my opinion for what it is: my own opinion. i couldn't care less what you, krumm, or anyone else thinks, because your opinion doesn't concern me nor affect me.

i dont like the Godfather series, but i loved Green Lantern... that's my opinion. you can have whatever opinion you want, and i couldn't care any less.

 

[Mad Love]

People are too attached to their opinions as a defense and not the pursuit of truth. Exercise different point of views, or don't.

 

[Super Kal]

People are too attached to their opinions and not the pursuit of truth. Exercise different point of views, or not.

i can exercise different points of view easily, but i choose to close my mind when it comes to those who think their opinion is better than everyone else's... and when it comes to Superman, everyone is going to have their own version of Superman. that's the truth. so everything is going to be a matter of opinion, especially when it comes to Superman.