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AMAZING Podcast review/discussion of MoS - Very long

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This is the best review/discussion of Man of Steel I've heard in the past week. It's thoughtful, fair, and detailed. There is no vitriol towards those that dislike the film, but a genuine attempt to try and address their critiques in a fair and accurate manor.

It's quite long (I'm currently only at the 1 hour mark) but it's well worth it.

http://www.modernmythmedia.com/2013/06/mmm-podcast-130-man-of-steel-qa/
 
Does it have people from both sides? Cause if its only from one side addressing issues that the other side have brought up, I'm not really interested in.
 
This film is proving to be very polarizing among the comic book community. You either love this film to death, or you are very chilly and cool towards it.

It seems like a writer/director are kind of free to portray Batman, Iron Man, Hulk, Spiderman any way they wish without too much backlash, but if they don't get Superman right....? Yeeesh!
 
This film is proving to be very polarizing among the comic book community. You either love this film to death, or you are very chilly and cool towards it.

It seems like a writer/director are kind of free to portray Batman, Iron Man, Hulk, Spiderman any way they wish without too much backlash, but if they don't get Superman right....? Yeeesh!

Well if you remember, and the guys on the podcast make this point, Batman Begins was initially quite polarizing among the comic community as well. People didn't like that the detective elements of Batman weren't highlighted. They also took issue with the "realistic"/non-stylized version of the world and character. People were nit-picking the movie to death and many preferred the Tim Burton Batman films over Batman Begins. It wasn't until TDK that people really started to appreciate Nolan's vision as a masterpiece. It took the 2nd film to validate the 1st as a classic.

I personally always preferred Batman Begins over every other CBM. The point the guys in the podcast were getting across is that MoS ruffles some feathers because it's a new interpretation and it isn't what people necessarily expect. When/if MoS ends up being a masterpiece people will look back more fondly on MoS.
 
Does it have people from both sides? Cause if its only from one side addressing issues that the other side have brought up, I'm not really interested in.

Why do you need "both sides? (as if there is just two)" These are thoughtful comic book fans, not just internet fanboys. Why is that not enough? Just because they happen to all like the movie (some more than others) they're just automatically biased? By that logic you shouldn't listen to a discussion about TDK or Avengers unless the discussion has an even amount of haters and lovers right?

Listen to the podcast, you'll see that your concerns are unwarranted.
 
Why do you need "both sides? (as if there is just two)" These are thoughtful comic book fans, not just internet fanboys. Why is that not enough? Just because they happen to all like the movie (some more than others) they're just automatically biased? By that logic you shouldn't listen to a discussion about TDK or Avengers unless the discussion has an even amount of haters and lovers right?

Listen to the podcast, you'll see that your concerns are unwarranted.

Because no one likes a ********** when it comes to discussions?
 
Why do you need "both sides? (as if there is just two)" These are thoughtful comic book fans, not just internet fanboys. Why is that not enough? Just because they happen to all like the movie (some more than others) they're just automatically biased? By that logic you shouldn't listen to a discussion about TDK or Avengers unless the discussion has an even amount of haters and lovers right?

Listen to the podcast, you'll see that your concerns are unwarranted.

Cause usually when I listen to a discussion or debate on something I like for there to be someone to respond to whatever the other side says. Cause there's a chance no matter how thorough you are to miss something and no one is there to bring it up.
 
Well if you remember, and the guys on the podcast make this point, Batman Begins was initially quite polarizing among the comic community as well. People didn't like that the detective elements of Batman weren't highlighted. They also took issue with the "realistic"/non-stylized version of the world and character. People were nit-picking the movie to death and many preferred the Tim Burton Batman films over Batman Begins. It wasn't until TDK that people really started to appreciate Nolan's vision as a masterpiece. It took the 2nd film to validate the 1st as a classic.

I personally always preferred Batman Begins over every other CBM. The point the guys in the podcast were getting across is that MoS ruffles some feathers because it's a new interpretation and it isn't what people necessarily expect. When/if MoS ends up being a masterpiece people will look back more fondly on MoS.

Strangely enough, you are right. The second film always seems to do better than the first. Superman II, Spidey 2, TDK, even Batman Returns. I wonder why that is? No origin story to muck up the story telling, just getting into the meat and potatoes?

Hopefully it will help MOS 2. Get right into a solid story without having to wonder how they will introduce Superman.
 
Cause usually when I listen to a discussion or debate on something I like for there to be someone to respond to whatever the other side says. Cause there's a chance no matter how thorough you are to miss something and no one is there to bring it up.

As I said, listen to the podcast and then you can come to conclusion. Even just the first 20-30 minutes.

Judging the discussion before even listening to it would be like judging MoS without even seeing it.
 
Ill be downloading this tonight love MMM
 
Ill be downloading this tonight love MMM

Nabbed one! :applaud:applaud:applaud

This is the first time I've heard of MMM and I'm loving what I'm hearing so far. These guys are really good.
 
Nabbed one! :applaud:applaud:applaud

This is the first time I've heard of MMM and I'm loving what I'm hearing so far. These guys are really good.

Well you didn't really nab me I download the show every week :cwink:
 
The point the guys in the podcast were getting across is that MoS ruffles some feathers because it's a new interpretation and it isn't what people necessarily expect. When/if MoS ends up being a masterpiece people will look back more fondly on MoS.

I really don't think the approach was the problem though. I really don't. Dark, brooding, grounded, modern... whatever. None of that matters. What matters is whether the film is able to tell a compelling and engaging story. Had Snyder succeeded in that regard, I don't think we would be having this debate.

I believe most of the criticism stems from the belief that it just wasn't a competent film to begin with.
 
/\ but most of the negative reviews haven't really said that they've labelled the film as dark and brooding as their criticisms.
 
/\ but most of the negative reviews haven't really said that they've labelled the film as dark and brooding as their criticisms.

Are they really criticizing the film because it's dark and brooding though? A lot of movies are dark and brooding. It could just be a roundabout way of saying the film had no "life" in it. It felt empty. When you combine that with the pacing and the thin narrative, it's no wonder people aren't taking to this movie.

Batman Begins was dark and brooding but that movie had a little juice in it. There were moments of levity. It had a pulse. I'm not even a huge fan of that film either, I'm merely using it as a point of reference. At least that film had some semblance of a narrative. Man Of Steel was just all over the place.
 
MMM is a great podcast. Even though they all like MoS quite a bit more than I did, I always enjoy listening to what these guys have to say. They can talk superhero films like nobody's business.
 
Are they really criticizing the film because it's dark and brooding though? A lot of movies are dark and brooding. It could just be a roundabout way of saying the film had no "life" in it. It felt empty. When you combine that with the pacing and the thin narrative, it's no wonder people aren't taking to this movie.

Batman Begins was dark and brooding but that movie had a little juice in it. There were moments of levity. It had a pulse. I'm not even a huge fan of that film either, I'm merely using it as a point of reference. At least that film had some semblance of a narrative. Man Of Steel was just all over the place.

Yeah but all I'm saying is that's what a lot of the reviews are saying so they've definitely found that to be a criticism of the film.

Man of Steel might have been all over the place to you but it wasn't to everyone. Personally I thought they did it better than Batman Begins did.
 
Yeah but all I'm saying is that's what a lot of the reviews are saying so they've definitely found that to be a criticism of the film.

Well if that's the case then that's not a fair criticism. "It's not Donner" or "It's not my Superman" isn't a reason to hate the film.

However if that is what's happening, then perhaps this film didn't do enough to make people forget Donner's Superman. Perhaps if MOS had excited them and engaged them in such a way where they were completely engrossed in the experience, they might have had an easier time letting go.
 
Yes. Yes some are criticizing it for this. Hating it because it isn't Donner/Reeve is thin criticism. Is this point actually arguable?

Where is Superman?

Man of Steel is no fun

Where's the fun?

To quote the Joker in "The Dark Knight," "Why so serious?" There's no joy in this story.

There's very little humor or joy in this Superman story.

This is a film we are to take seriously, because nothing says serious more than watching men in capes hitting each other with cars.

As a science fiction action extravaganza, I can't fault the latest from director Zack Snyder. But as a fun Superman comic book popcorn flick, I certainly can.

The joyless pic never won my heart.

Cavill broods handsomely as Superman, but this reboot skimps on fun and romance.

Superman is not Batman, he is not supposed to be dark, gritty, and joyless. Where is the hope?

If you're hankering after the playful innocence of Christopher Reeve's Superman, you'll definitely be disappointed.

Man of Steel contains little fun apart from the visceral thrill of seeing objects smashed in one of its endless action sequences.

Good old fashioned fun is treated as something passé in Zack Snyder's Superman reboot

I can get behind people questioning narrative choices, story structure, technical issues, whatever. Do not tell me Superman is supposed to be fun & light. This is a very narrow view of a character with a wide history.

We look. We gape in despair. We weep a too-late tear for Christopher Reeve.
:huh::huh::huh: What? What the hell does this even mean?
 
Great video so far... didn't finish it as it's very long but they have very good points in their podcast... More reason why i love MOS as is and cannot wait for the sequel.
 
Definately going to subscribe to this.

Disagree that the collateral damage in MoSis the Same in Avengers.
In Avengers there are like TWO buildings that get destroyed, in MoS it's a city block. Not comparable at all. I would say in Avengers hundreds died in MoS it's hundreds of thousands.
 
Listening now and about an hour in and I swear, these guys aren't really getting much if any points across. Might be just me but, it's like they're running around in circles over and over again with their discussion and it's really just not going anywhere for me. 15+ minutes just making sure people understand they're expressing their opinions about the movie in this roundtable discussion and that's it's ok not to like the movie if you have opinions that differ from theirs? These guys do this a lot? :doh:

As for the damage thing between Avengers and MoS I understand that the guy in the podcast is saying - which I do agree with - that in Avengers it's patently obvious to the point of seeing people still in the buildings (like the moments when Hulk is running directly through one of them with what appears to be everyone just working normally like nothing is happening) whereas in MoS we don't see that. After watching it several times so far I don't recall seeing people in any building after Zod's ship comes to town EXCEPT inside The Daily Planet and even then they refuse to leave until after the gravity pulses start. I guess I'd say that's a small issue since if some alien ship hovered over my city I'd damned sure be hauling ass to get outta wherever I happened to be and as far away from that point as possible. :D
 
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I'll have to give this a listen. If you want to listen to two people with differing views, Kevin Smith takes the positive view against his friend Ralph on his "Fat Man on Batman podcast." It's the most recent episode. Probably a lot of the same conversations I would guess.
 
I'll have to give this a listen. If you want to listen to two people with differing views, Kevin Smith takes the positive view against his friend Ralph on his "Fat Man on Batman podcast." It's the most recent episode. Probably a lot of the same conversations I would guess.

I listened to that episode a few days ago and it's also a solid discussion. I think the guys in the MMM podcast really poke holes in Ralph's critique of MoS though. The MMM guys all love/like the film but they don't just completely discount those that disagree, yet they offer really good counter-points.
 
They really don't. It's mostly gigantic assumptions made regarding what the potential intent behind the plot was, but that doesn't really help. If you're going into a film, the idea is for there not to be plot holes that need a podcast to explain what was meant to happen. Most of Garman's criticism whilst hyperbolic was quite justified.
 

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