Arrow Arrow Season 3, Episode 3 "Corto Maltese" General Discussion

[Seb]

Is no one complaining about the Ted Grant scene going to mention the fact that he is apparently the most intuitive person ever to walk on this earth? I mean, seriously, his spiel about losing someone struck me as unreasonably close to home.

As to Laurel as a character; I find her to be very believable and realistic, but it doesn't make me like watching her. If she was a real human, I'd be sympathetic and probably try to help her, but as a character her story is boring and feels like it's taking away time that I could be watching literally any other character on the show be interesting. I don't doubt that I'll end up liking her, but I do think it will take a while for her stories to get to the point that they interest me.

I think this will be the hard line that the creators have to ride between realistic but tedious and exciting but jarringly unbelievable. It's part of the reason that giving Thea and Roy five months to improve streamlined their progressions. Unless there is a time jump, I worry that keeping Laurel's story going in a vaguely interesting way will be difficult.

Frankly, I wish they'd show more of her work. At least that's something she's good at. It's always easier to like a character if you showcase their skills as well as their flaws. It's why we tolerate Oliver's ***hole-ish behaviour when it happens: because he'll actually do something impressive in the next scene.

 

[Human Torch]

Is no one complaining about the Ted Grant scene going to mention the fact that he is apparently the most intuitive person ever to walk on this earth? I mean, seriously, his spiel about losing someone struck me as unreasonably close to home.

As to Laurel as a character; I find her to be very believable and realistic, but it doesn't make me like watching her. If she was a real human, I'd be sympathetic and probably try to help her, but as a character her story is boring and feels like it's taking away time that I could be watching literally any other character on the show be interesting. I don't doubt that I'll end up liking her, but I do think it will take a while for her stories to get to the point that they interest me.

I think this will be the hard line that the creators have to ride between realistic but tedious and exciting but jarringly unbelievable. It's part of the reason that giving Thea and Roy five months to improve streamlined their progressions. Unless there is a time jump, I worry that keeping Laurel's story going in a vaguely interesting way will be difficult. (Frankly, I wish they'd show more of her work. At least that's something she's good at. It's always easier to like a character if you showcase their skills as well as their flaws.)

Yeah,I generally agree.

I really didn't need to see Roy,Thea and Sara's intense training regimen to buy them being skilled.It's like I said before,they made a meal out of Laurel's path much more than they needed to.Had they did what they're doing now,around the beginning of last season,it would've been much more welcomed.

 

[JC00]

If you read the the episode summary for "Guilty" and then remember the first scene with Laurel and Ted Grant. Hilarious. So it was alright for her to accuse him of stuff with no facts and threaten him but Oliver questions him and she argues. Hypocrite much?

 

[Sterling Archer]

BS, she was hammered all last season. Saying she has had slack is a bald faced lie.

My point is she has had two years to make us care about her and she failed. There is no reason to believe that's going to change anytime soon.

 

[Verick808]

They didn't have anything to do with her until this season. What they did with Laurel was pretty much the equivalent of what would happen if they started Arrow before the the Queen's Gambit went down. Laurel is Black Canary. She should have been introduced later in the series as Black Canary. That is supposed to be her place in the Arrow universe. Problem is they introduced her too soon with plans of keeping her relevant as a love interest. That didn't work so they were forced to make one forced reason after another to keep her relevant.
Now that she is on her way to become Black Canary they don't need to tie her into the plot in ridiculous ways. She doesn't need them anymore. She has her origin and after having to deal with 2 years of the writers not knowing what to do with her I'm looking forward to see her become Black Canary.

 

[Mikelus]

I'm sure she is a nice person but I have yet to see any good acting from her, hence why her character is so annoying regardless of the situation.

She has a better résumé, is more talented, and less wooden than several cast members, but seeing your Top 5 cbm, it makes me wonder if you are just a marvelite trolling since you put TASM over TDK and all of your top 5 are based on Marvel characters, which shows lack of judgement. (for the record, I like both DC and Marvel)

Back on the episode, this Ted Grant is serviceable, but I'm glad they're keeping the DCTVU and DCCU separate, they can get a better actor for the role if later on they use Wildcat in the movies.

 

[Boy Scout]

As I said before it's not about what her character does or why, it's about the fact that I groan every time she shows up because her character is dull and annoying.

So her actions and motivations don't bother you? She's annoying just because?

Her character's motivations in that scene were perfectly understandable, that doesn't make the scene more enjoyable to watch.

So what is it going to take?

It seems like the obvious reason why her scenes don't work is Katie Cassidy. I'm sure she is a nice person but I have yet to see any good acting from her, hence why her character is so annoying regardless of the situation.

We're going to have to agree to disagree.

Yes having an acquaintance ping a cell phone to find out where a woman beater is so you can sneak up on him with a baseball bat because fighting is now your main vice because booze and pills can't put out "the fire" instead of just putting in an anonymous call to get the guy with warrants picked up definitely comes off as "most human".

Wow. Way to miss the point.

 

[Quasimod0]

Kind of a boring episode, but I did enjoy the stuff with Laurel. Can't believe I'm saying this, but I'm excited to see her turn into the Black Canary.

 

[Tv's Phil]

Wow...just...ugh...the flat out irrational hatred of Laurel... there's nothing left to be argued at this point.

I've said it before but there seems to be a vocal minority that hypocritically loves the questionable actions of the characters who have costumes and superhero names but with Laurel...nuh uh. "So unlikable" with her more normal human behavior and regular line deliveries.

If you hate her now and since season 1, no amount of change is good enough for you. Her becoming Black Canary won't matter. Her learning to fight won't matter. Becoming a cold, vigilante won't.

It's not worth the debate anymore. Can we all agree on that?

 

[DigificWriter]

The Laurel haters just need to do themselves - and everyone else - a favor and quit watching and commenting on the series.

 

[Mister J]

The Laurel haters just need to do themselves - and everyone else - a favor and quit watching and commenting on the series.

Here's a better idea; stop parading around the forum, brandishing opinion as fact and touting some thinly-veiled superiority before you find yourself without the ability to further comment.

 

[Human Torch]

 

[Primal Slayer]

If you read the the episode summary for "Guilty" and then remember the first scene with Laurel and Ted Grant. Hilarious. So it was alright for her to accuse him of stuff with no facts and threaten him but Oliver questions him and she argues. Hypocrite much?

Lol because people aren't hypocrites time from time. And of course she would argue with Ollie now that she, ya know, actually knows the guy.

 

[Mike Murdock]

Laurel bothers me at times and I can't place exactly why. Thea has been far less rational, but I liked her better. I would attribute it to acting except I liked her in the first season. Maybe in the first season, she had less heavy things to carry. Being depressed and self-destructive (or angry and self-destructive) is somewhat hard to pull off. I liked her AA meeting scene this time. I liked her when she was happy and in control the first episode. It's when she's completely falling off the rails that I feel like she fails to pull it off.

But I'm fine with her becoming Black Canary. Hopefully, she gets a bit more centered when doing it. I'm sure the first time she successfully pulls it off (which will likely involve less blind rage), it'll be much better. But I expect a bit more struggle before we get to that point and I'm building up my tolerance for it.

 

[kguillou]

If you asked me last season I would have been opposed to Laurel becoming Canary especially since Sara was such a good character. However I REALLY like where they're going with her this year. People need to remember that tragedy can change people in a very profound way. All of our favorite superheroes became who they were through tragedy, because it changed them. If I could borrow a line from Dexter, " some events are so big they change your DNA." Laurel is angry, she's learning that world is a crappy place and she needs to forge herself in order to survive it. I think thats an interesting character journey to watch.

 

[JC00]

I've put all the known Laurel fanatics on my ignore list. Just can't deal with them anymore. God forbid you criticize the almighty Laurel. But they really should face facts that Laurel is the most disliked character on the show and it's not a small amount of people being 'haters". Also with how much they fight against criticisms of her they really are throwing stones when they criticize any other character.

 

[fire117]

I've put all the known Laurel fanatics on my ignore list. Just can't deal with them anymore. God forbid you criticize the almighty Laurel. But they really should face facts that Laurel is the most disliked character on the show and it's not a small amount of people being 'haters". Also with how much they fight against criticisms of her they really are throwing stones when they criticize any other character.

Agreed. Me, my nephews and mates all dislike Laurel the most of all the main characters in the show.

 

[Sterling Archer]

She has a better résumé, is more talented, and less wooden than several cast members, but seeing your Top 5 cbm, it makes me wonder if you are just a marvelite trolling since you put TASM over TDK and all of your top 5 are based on Marvel characters, which shows lack of judgement. (for the record, I like both DC and Marvel)

Back on the episode, this Ted Grant is serviceable, but I'm glad they're keeping the DCTVU and DCCU separate, they can get a better actor for the role if later on they use Wildcat in the movies.

Oh I'm so sorry my opinions bother you so much. My top 5 is based not on what movies are actually better, just the ones I enjoy the most so I guess that does make me a bad person. Of course The Dark Knight is a better movie than ASM, I just can't enjoy it as much because it doesn't feel like a Batman movie to me. I judge CBM's differently than I do other movies, I would rather see a good CBM were the character feels exactly like the comic character, than an amazing CBM where the character feels nothing like the comic character. I do have several problems with TDK from a pure film standpoint also but that's a different discussion. By the way I love DC characters, DC is my favourite in literally every medium except films (and comics nowadays but that's because I have many problems with the New 52).

I assure you I am not a troll, but if that's the only technique you have to argue with me then good for you. I'm putting you on ignore now.

 

[Naked Shia]

I didn't like Laurel in season 2, but now that she's not irrationnal and boring, I like her again.

 

[Grommers]

I wonder how much she reads into the critics, they are gonna have a hard time I think winning her back with the fans. Even on stephen amells facebook, there's quite a number bashing her, and she has to know, but try to ignore the critics.

I don't necessarily blame her, she was miscast and the writers have only set her up for continual, bringing in Caity Lotz as a BC, making felicity such a strong defining character, and even Moira, being such a strong woman.

I did appreciate her beat-up look, only because it finally felt she just wasn't a diva acting..kind of like a megan fox where you know she got the role because of her looks and not her skill, she actually felt real there.

 

[therealhitman]

Oh yeah,and "Gerry Conway".t:

Definitely. Had to pause the show to explain what was so funny to the room...

 

[Tv's Phil]

I guess I was wrong. We can't agree.

Fine, we'll all play along.

You're wrong about Laurel and should feel bad.
(There, that should do it)

 

[Mister J]

This nonsense where people can't seem to deal with opposing views without becoming snide and condescending little snots needs to stop... lest we have our own version of the Undertaking right here in the good ol' Arrow subforum.

Seriously, people. A little civility. Not that hard.

 

[JC00]

This nonsense where people can't seem to deal with opposing views without becoming snide and condescending little snots needs to stop... lest we have our own version of the Undertaking right here in the good ol' Arrow subforum.

Seriously, people. A little civility. Not that hard.

Watch out now. You might get accused of being just another "hater"

 

[LongbowHunter]

Watch out now. You might get accused of being just another "hater"

Actually I think Mr. J's statement easily applies to everyone who commented here lately. Look it's totally ok to state your oppinion on a character here, that's what this forums are for...but stating said oppinion over and over again starting a giant bickering between the same 3-4 members every day is annoying. I check in hete everyday but don't comment because fresh discussion points are always inored and after two or three posts they have to make room for the old constant exchange of hate between the same old users stating the same old oppinions.
We got it already!
JC00 hates Laurel, PrimalSlayer loves her, BoyScout has mixed feelings but likes her, HumanTorch absolutely loved Sara so he will never accept Laurel, and Luis4U will sometimes quote a "hater" and post a gif from Frozen saying LetItGo...
Jeez
After the 100th time it got slightly repetitive.