BATWOMAN News & Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Batwoman' started by Binker, Jul 17, 2018.

  1. Flash525 The Scarlet Messenger

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    As it should be. I wonder though whether we'll have supporting characters and whether she'll eventually form a team (of sorts) like all the other shows have done. Generally, Green Arrow, Flash, Supergirl and (presumably) Batwoman are self sufficient and don't really rely on a team, yet in all the shows they're never far from a friend, so what characters could possibly be friends of Batwoman?
     
  2. Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

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    Chyler could probably have played the part of Kate Kane and done a great job.

    What lesbian actresses are there out there who would be suitable for the part?

    And does she have to be lesbian or can she be bi?

    Were all the actresses in the L Word actually lesbians? I'm pretty sure not all were.
     
  3. Fincher Coming Undone

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    Well, some of the allies on these shows are original characters or inspired by comics characters. As far as comics characters go, though, if there's no Batman in this world, she could take a page from his book and have Stephanie Brown as a Batgirl sidekick. It's not like Stephanie will be in the movies anytime soon. Or, if Batgirl's off limits for whatever reason, Stephanie could still be there as Spoiler.
     
  4. Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

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    What are they envisioning Kate Kane to be like, if she's a Jewish lesbian?

    Will she be like Mia Kirschner's character Jenny Schecter on the L Word? Or like Jennifer Westfeld in Kissing Jessica Stein?

    Or they see her being like Monica in Friends (who was not lesbian but was Jewish)?
     
  5. Joined:
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    ...you know just because characters share an identity, they don't have to be the same character, right? Why would she be like any of them instead of, I don't know,her own character that they're adapting.
     
  6. Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

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    Because people do that all the time for every comic character, regardless of whether they're gay or straight. Even casting directors do that. They say they want a type who is like a young/old (name of actor). Or the Marvel movies do that. Eg - Kevin Feige compares Winter Soldier to Three Days of the Condor, Homecoming to a Jon Hughes movie etc.

    People wonder how these characters might be like and want a point of reference as something to compare it to. It's not a big deal.
     
  7. Joined:
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    I'm not disgreeing with the idea of comparisons. But why those ones outside of their identities? What's their personality similarities or reason for comparison beyond identity? I'm not saying it's a big deal, but what I'm raising here is that the comparison between, say Homecoming and Hughes is tone and style. But that's not the comparison you made. Your comparison wasn't over what her character is and what they have in common, it was just listing other characters that are just lesbians and/or Jewish.
     
  8. Thome216 Registered

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    That's the usual way shows or characters are pitched. They use known character to give the director/producers the general feel of where the character or show is going.


    Like Star Wars would be pitched as a wild western meets Seven Samurai - in space.
     
  9. Joined:
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    I'm familiar with the practice and I'm not saying it's bad to compare. But that instead of focusing on similar characters or story types, solely going for identities rather than how characters are similar in traits makes for a shallow comparison. It wasn't a question of what characters she would be like based on her personality or character, but simply because she's a Jewish Lesbian, so here are other lesbian and Jewish characters for her to be like. It'd be like asking if Batman's going to be like Ross Gellar or Ian Malcolm because they're all guys and white and straight.
     
  10. Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

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    But they do that for characters too, not just genres and tones of films, which was my point in the first place.

    For example, with Star Trek the Next Generation, when they were casting the roles of Tasha Yar and Deana Troi, they wanted someone based on the character of Vasquez in Aliens. Their character in ST:TNG was originally meant to be called Macha Hernandez. Both Denise Crosby and Marina Sirtis auditioned for this role. They liked Marina, who fit that type, but then eventually cast her as Deana Troi. Since Denise Crosby wasn't at all anything like a Latino or Mediterranean, they changed her "Vasquez" character to Tanya and eventually Tasha Yar.

    So casting people do this all the time. You look at what is similar and what has gone before and want that type for a new character.

    Jenny Schecter and Jessica Stein were both Jewish Lesbians. While Kate Kane will undoubtedly be her own character, they can always pull influences from these, especially when both characters had to deal with the issues of being both Jewish and lesbian.

    Now that's not to say Kate Kane will be exactly alike at all. Even when Feige and Jon Watts said Homecoming was like John Hughes, it actually hasn't turned out so much like that in certain respects. And with ST:TNG, Tasha Yar didn't even make it out of Season 1 so she wasn't really anything like what they first envisioned. But it was a template they had to work with.
     
  11. Thome216 Registered

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    Right, those comparisons are just the place to start from. They can evolve either slightly or radically from there.
     
  12. Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

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    Yep.

    For Supergirl, they originally said they wanted someone like Felicity Smoak. Someone blonde, dorky and sometimes socially awkward.

    Fortunately Melissa Benoist (who is a much better actress) didn't turn out anything like Felicity and made the character her own. But that was one of the inspirations.
     
  13. DarthSkywalker May the Force Be With You

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    What? Your entire last paragraph proves the entire problem with your initial logic. :funny:

    The also obvious major flaw in this entire argument, is Kate Kane is already a character. She isn't something they are making up whole cloth. We know what she is like. I know most here don't seem to know the character, but that doesn't mean she doesn't exist. She isn't a random Jewish lesbian character from something. She's Kate Kane. This would be like saying, well I am castin a bisexual woman from the Middle East. Let's break out the framework for Shaw from Person of Interest. Negating everything else that makes Shaw, Shaw there. You know, an assassin with an emotional disorder.

    This would be like trying to cast Batman on someone that isn't Batman, because they are straight, male and white. Its Batman. You cast Batman.
     
    #113 DarthSkywalker, Jul 18, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2018
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    Hey, look, character traits in common rather than simply it boiling down to blonde white woman, exactly what I was talking about.
     
  15. Rorschach2012 Hi Freeze, I’m Batman

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    Martian Manhunter is completely misused and wasted on Supergirl and would be a way better fit here as Detective John Jones working for the GCPD

    What’re we thinking villain-wise for season 1?
     
  16. Wheels Eat my shorts

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    CW just needs to rebrand itself as Fandom Network. All their big shows basically target geeks/genre fans.
     
    #116 Wheels, Jul 18, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2018
  17. DarthSkywalker May the Force Be With You

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    It is definitely headed that way. I wonder what non-superhero shows will be around after they have cancelled a few of those going into their 5th season.
     
  18. Sithborg Oooh, plot twist!

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    I think a lot will depend on how WB wants to keep the current, profitable arrangements with CW and Netflix.

    And really, all shows survive on CW by their international and Netflix deals.
     
  19. Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

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    Well, when people talk about a type for Reed Richards, they will often mention people like the Professor from Gilligan's Island (which I think isn't right), Doc Savage, Indiana Jones, etc. In other words, they look at other characters who exist and impose those things onto the existing character of Reed.

    It's not then imply that Reed is a random or made up character, but it's taking things which would serve as a good template to give people an idea of what they should go for.

    It's the same with how the Supergirl creators gave Felicity Smoak as an inspiration for their version. Supergirl is an existing character already, but that doesn't mean that they didn't have an idea of how they wanted to portray her.

    Well when I mentioned Jenny Schecter or Jessica Stein, they were mentioned as shorthand for all the various traits they embodied. It's like if I said "Felicity Smoak" but didn't say more. Does that mean quoting her name is just saying she's a white blonde female?

    Some of the typical Jewish traits you might find in those 2 above characters (eg being neurotic, having a self deprecating humour etc) sometimes conflicted with their lesbian identity. So they had to balance being both at the same time. The two being in conflict with each other (especially with Jessica Stein) presented some humourous situations and problems.

    I'm not randomly bringing up people who were Jewish and lesbian, but taking two characters who had their share of issues and certain character traits which could serve as a template for Kate Kane.

    Monica Geller I mentioned because again, she's another neurotic and almost obsessive compulsive. Not simply because she's Jewish. Otherwise I could've said Natalie Portman or any other Jewish person.
     
  20. Primal Slayer Let the Siren scream

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    lol, those are the only shows that manage to get decent ratings and media coverge.

    But I think that Batwoman is totally there to help ease the transition from Arrow ending (I think if S7 isnt the last, S8 definitely will be)

    Here's to hoping that Bette Kane is added to the roster as Flamebird and that they keep the characters wealth and life as part of the upper elite, something she isnt interested in being part of.

    Now who her epic love interest will be.....im going to guess it aint gonna be no Maggie Sawyer or Renee Montoya.
     
    #120 Primal Slayer, Jul 18, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2018
  21. DarthSkywalker May the Force Be With You

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    You should really read your own post.

     
  22. Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

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    And you really should read my post above which is the explanation for that post. I know what I wrote and I was elaborating on it. I even had that post open at the time, so it's not like suddenly you've hit me with a revelation of what I wrote.
     
  23. DarthSkywalker May the Force Be With You

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    This is the post above it. I am failing to see the connection.

    That is about actresses being cast. This is about the characteristics of the character according to you.

    And then you said this:

    Beyond the fact that you just said typical Jewish traits along with what seems to be the implication of a typical lesbian identity, I ask, where does this come up for Kate? When is this an issue? She got kicked from the army for being gay, but her being Jewish and gay hasn't really ever been an issue I can think of? And if so, how much of her character is that?

    You basically branded Kate as a stereotype on a 90s sitcom or romcom, because apparently they were the only Jewish lesbian characters to you could think of. Why? It sounds like you are taking assumptions because she Jewish and lesbian. Would you do this for Batman?
     
  24. Primal Slayer Let the Siren scream

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    Since Batwomans costume is already utter perfection, I really hope they put the money into it and just do a straight adaption.
     
  25. Thome216 Registered

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    It needs to have the same care and attention to detail that gave to Supergirl's suit. That one is perfect. There's no reason not to do the same with Batwoman's. Especially that mask!
     

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