Ben Affleck IS Bruce Wayne/Batman - Part 1

[idiot09]

...

I like Terrio as well. Why wasn't he involved in this from the start ? And I don't get how anyone can call the writing cheesy and praise the MCU at the same time.

I just done see how Terrio's dialogue is cheesy. Its among the most sophisticated,smart and layered Ive seen in this genre.

"Men fall from the sky, the gods hurl thunderbolts, innocents die. That's how it starts, sir. The fever, the rage, the feeling of powerlessness that turns good men... cruel."

"You know you can't win this. It's suicide."
" I'm older now than my father ever was. This may be the only thing I do that matters."
"Twenty years of fighting criminals amounts to nothing?"
" Criminals are like weeds, Alfred; pull one up, another grows in its place. This is about the future of the world. This is my legacy."


" Devils don't come from hell beneath us. No, they come from the sky."

"Master Wayne, since the age of seven you've been into the art of deception like Mozart to the harpsichord, but you've never been too hot at lying to me."

"This is how it all caves in, civilization on the wane, manners out the window."

Just beautiful.

 

[FunkMiller]

I just done see how Terrio's dialogue is cheesy. Its among the most sophisticated,smart and layered Ive seen in this genre.

"Men fall from the sky, the gods hurl thunderbolts, innocents die. That's how it starts, sir. The fever, the rage, the feeling of powerlessness that turns good men... cruel."

"You know you can't win this. It's suicide."
" I'm older now than my father ever was. This may be the only thing I do that matters."
"Twenty years of fighting criminals amounts to nothing?"
" Criminals are like weeds, Alfred; pull one up, another grows in its place. This is about the future of the world. This is my legacy."


" Devils don't come from hell beneath us. No, they come from the sky."

"Master Wayne, since the age of seven you've been into the art of deception like Mozart to the harpsichord, but you've never been too hot at lying to me."

"This is how it all caves in, civilization on the wane, manners out the window."

Just beautiful.

The best dialogue is natural, believable and real. The greatest dialogue writers in film know how to impart large and important themes using dialogue that sits in reality.

Nearly every single line you quote there is from a comic book. It's overwrought, larger than life, unrealistic dialogue that you'd never hear from a real human being. It's grandiose bull written by and for people who think long words and grand phrases are impressive. They aren't. Meaning is impressive. Emotional truth is impressive. Clear motivation is impressive.

 

[Lone]

I just done see how Terrio's dialogue is cheesy. Its among the most sophisticated,smart and layered Ive seen in this genre.

"Men fall from the sky, the gods hurl thunderbolts, innocents die. That's how it starts, sir. The fever, the rage, the feeling of powerlessness that turns good men... cruel."

"You know you can't win this. It's suicide."
" I'm older now than my father ever was. This may be the only thing I do that matters."
"Twenty years of fighting criminals amounts to nothing?"
" Criminals are like weeds, Alfred; pull one up, another grows in its place. This is about the future of the world. This is my legacy."


" Devils don't come from hell beneath us. No, they come from the sky."

"Master Wayne, since the age of seven you've been into the art of deception like Mozart to the harpsichord, but you've never been too hot at lying to me."

"This is how it all caves in, civilization on the wane, manners out the window."

Just beautiful.

 

[Polux]

The best dialogue is natural, believable and real. The greatest dialogue writers in film know how to impart large and important themes using dialogue that sits in reality.

Nearly every single line you quote there is from a comic book. It's overwrought, larger than life, unrealistic dialogue that you'd never hear from a real human being. It's grandiose bull written by and for people who think long words and grand phrases are impressive. They aren't. Meaning is impressive. Emotional truth is impressive. Clear motivation is impressive.

You're operating under the impression that no person in the real world speaks in a grandiose, larger than life manner...which would be incorrect to assume.

Yes, those lines have that theatrical quality to it, but it fits the characters that spoke those words; some characters should spew poetry every time they open their mouths and some others shouldn't. Personally I find Terrio to be really good and giving characters the voice that fit them.

 

[idiot09]

The best dialogue is natural, believable and real. The greatest dialogue writers in film know how to impart large and important themes using dialogue that sits in reality.

Nearly every single line you quote there is from a comic book. It's overwrought, larger than life, unrealistic dialogue that you'd never hear from a real human being. It's grandiose bull written by and for people who think long words and grand phrases are impressive. They aren't. Meaning is impressive. Emotional truth is impressive. Clear motivation is impressive.

Not every movie needs to be grounded in reality. Some can have a heightened sense of reality, and be larger than life. It is by design operatic. I am not saying you have to like it, but to say all dialogue should be a certain way is very close minded.

 

[matt47]

The best dialogue is natural, believable and real. The greatest dialogue writers in film know how to impart large and important themes using dialogue that sits in reality.

Nearly every single line you quote there is from a comic book. It's overwrought, larger than life, unrealistic dialogue that you'd never hear from a real human being. It's grandiose bull written by and for people who think long words and grand phrases are impressive. They aren't. Meaning is impressive. Emotional truth is impressive. Clear motivation is impressive.

 

[matt47]

Not every movie needs to be grounded in reality. Some can have a heightened sense of reality, and be larger than life. It is by design operatic. I am not saying you have to like it, but to say all dialogue should be a certain way is very close minded.

But this universe was built on the idea that everything that happens is grounded in reality!



This is why I miss Goyer....he got it.

 

[idiot09]

You're operating under the impression that no person in the real world speaks in a grandiose, larger than life manner...which would be incorrect to assume.

Yes, those lines have that theatrical quality to it, but it fits the characters that spoke those words; some characters should spew poetry every time they open their mouths and some others shouldn't. Personally I find Terrio to be really good and giving characters the voice that fit them.

Exactly and all those quotes are from either Alfred or Lex. Alfred is known for his wordplay, and Lex is one of the smartest people in the world, and is very larger than life. It totally fits.

 

[idiot09]

But this universe was built on the idea that everything that happens is grounded in reality!



This is why I miss Goyer....he got it.

Actually thats what happened in Nolans Universe. From the first scene in MOS, we see a very stylized full blown larger than life, Krypton. MOS was meant to be "heightened reality" rather than absolute reality. You cant have a universe absolutely grounded in reality with characters like Flash, Aquaman or Superman.

 

[Angel0fDeath]

What's wrong with having a bit of poetry inserted in the dialogue ?

 

[FunkMiller]

Actually thats what happened in Nolans Universe. From the first scene in MOS, we see a very stylized full blown larger than life, Krypton. MOS was meant to be "heightened reality" rather than absolute reality. You cant have a universe absolutely grounded in reality with characters like Flash, Aquaman or Superman.

True. But they could also talk like three dimensional human beings and not two dimensional comic book characters. They just sound dumb.

 

[FunkMiller]

What's wrong with having a bit of poetry inserted in the dialogue ?

Don't mistake flowery language for poetry.

"Get busy livin' or get busy dyin'."

 

[matt47]

Actually thats what happened in Nolans Universe. From the first scene in MOS, we see a very stylized full blown larger than life, Krypton. MOS was meant to be "heightened reality" rather than absolute reality. You cant have a universe absolutely grounded in reality with characters like Flash, Aquaman or Superman.

Grounded in reality (for me at least) means that everything that happens has to happen as it would on our Earth. So, everything that happens in Man of Steel is what would happen (more or less). And that's what I loved about Man of Steel.

Krypton isn't hard to believe because it's a distant planet light years away from us. With space being infinite there is a chance of a planet like Krypton being real, so what happens if a baby from that planet lands on Earth and is brought up as a human in secret? I think Man of Steel did that as best it could while still keeping with the original lore.

So, with characters like Aquaman, play that "what if" game. What if there really was a fully functioning world down at the bottom of the ocean who possess these abilities? IF that were to happen, how would it play out in our world? I hope to see that in JL and Aquaman.

Do you get what I mean now?

 

[NJCaliboy]

Not every movie needs to be grounded in reality. Some can have a heightened sense of reality, and be larger than life. It is by design operatic. I am not saying you have to like it, but to say all dialogue should be a certain way is very close minded.

You mentioned never having heard that people felt the dialoge was cheesy and since then you had 3 other people say it felt cheesy to them as well. Well I'm a 4th. I didn't have the negative reaction to the movie that a lot of others had but EVERYTHING out of Lex's mouth made me feel uncomfortable. It was like that feeling of embarassment you have when something is so unbelievably bad- and yes I felt it was ULTRA-CHEESY. Not really anything to debate as that was just how I felt. You felt differently, awesome- but to each his or her own right?

 

[matt47]

It's funny because I think under a better...well...less theatrical actor... Lex's dialogue could've worked a lot better than it did.

But man..."The red capes are coming" will never be a good line. Before you all say it, yes! I get what it means. Still.Bad.

 

[Polux]

You mentioned never having heard that people felt the dialoge was cheesy and since then you had 3 other people say it felt cheesy to them as well. Well I'm a 4th. I didn't have the negative reaction to the movie that a lot of others had but EVERYTHING out of Lex's mouth made me feel uncomfortable. It was like that feeling of embarassment you have when something is so unbelievably bad- and yes I felt it was ULTRA-CHEESY. Not really anything to debate as that was just how I felt. You felt differently, awesome- but to each his or her own right?

Gotta agree here, tho. "Eye of the beholder" type of thing. Some people find it cheesy, some people find it inspired, and it's all cool. I know that personally I tend to react when someone makes generalizations and deals in absolutes ("nobody would do this...", "only a *blank* would deny this...", "this is so OBVIOUSLY..."); but I guess that's more on me than anything, since I should know better than to give a second thought to those who deal in those terms.

 

[matt47]

Gotta agree here, tho. "Eye of the beholder" type of thing. Some people find it cheesy, some people find it inspired, and it's all cool. I know that personally I tend to react when someone makes generalizations and deals in absolutes ("nobody would do this...", "only a *blank* would deny this...", "this is so OBVIOUSLY..."); but I guess that's more on me than anything, since I should know better than to give a second thought to those who deal in those terms.

Only siths deal in absolutes...

 

[Polux]

Only siths deal in absolutes...

Jesus....I was dying for someone to get that reference....

I can go in peace now, thanks pal

 

[matt47]

Jesus....I was dying for someone to get that reference....

I can go in peace now, thanks pal

hahaha of course!

 

[idiot09]

Gotta agree here, tho. "Eye of the beholder" type of thing. Some people find it cheesy, some people find it inspired, and it's all cool. I know that personally I tend to react when someone makes generalizations and deals in absolutes ("nobody would do this...", "only a *blank* would deny this...", "this is so OBVIOUSLY..."); but I guess that's more on me than anything, since I should know better than to give a second thought to those who deal in those terms.

Fair enough I guess. If someone finds it cheesy, thats okay. We probably have a different definition of "cheesy". I find the CW shows dialogue cheesy, thats my definition of cheesy. I thought Lex's dialogues to be fitting to the charater. He was an self-entitled, rich young brat who considers himself smarter than anyone else. Its fitting that he uses wordplay(which makes normal people go "Wtf is this guy saying") to establish his mental superiority. Like you said, its a guy of the beholder thing. Agree to disagree.

 

[matt47]

Fair enough I guess. If you find it cheesy, thats okay. We probably have a different definition of "cheesy". I find the CW shows dialogue cheesy, thats my definition of cheesy. I thought Lex's dialogues to be fitting to the charater. He was an self-entitled, rich young brat who considers himself smarter than anyone else. Its fitting that he uses wordplay(which makes normal people go "Wtf is this guy saying" to establish his mental superiority. Like you said, its a guy of the beholder thing. Agree to disagree.

The weird thing is, though. Jesse and Snyder and everyone thought this Lex was all charisma when in front of the public eye.

I don't think many would agree on that, we was a weird nervous little twirp that couldn't string along a speech without near ****ting his pants.

 

[idiot09]

You mentioned never having heard that people felt the dialoge was cheesy and since then you had 3 other people say it felt cheesy to them as well. Well I'm a 4th. I didn't have the negative reaction to the movie that a lot of others had but EVERYTHING out of Lex's mouth made me feel uncomfortable. It was like that feeling of embarassment you have when something is so unbelievably bad- and yes I felt it was ULTRA-CHEESY. Not really anything to debate as that was just how I felt. You felt differently, awesome- but to each his or her own right?

Fair enough bro. It is a subjective thing, but yeah this is the first time I have heard the dialogue was cheesy. Theatrical and operatic sure. Cheesy? Nope. Well to each his own.

 

[Polux]

Fair enough I guess. If someone finds it cheesy, thats okay. We probably have a different definition of "cheesy". I find the CW shows dialogue cheesy, thats my definition of cheesy. I thought Lex's dialogues to be fitting to the charater. He was an self-entitled, rich young brat who considers himself smarter than anyone else. Its fitting that he uses wordplay(which makes normal people go "Wtf is this guy saying") to establish his mental superiority. Like you said, its a guy of the beholder thing. Agree to disagree.

Yeah...but I'm agreeing with you dude....don't get all mixed up...

What I'm saying is that some people find it cheesy, and that's their deal; I won't convince'em that it's not cheesy, just like they're not gonna convince me that it is cheesy...(agree about the CW shows too, even tho I still enjoy'em t: )

 

[idiot09]

The weird thing is, though. Jesse and Snyder and everyone thought this Lex was all charisma when in front of the public eye.

I don't think many would agree on that, we was a weird nervous little twirp that couldn't string along a speech without near ****ting his pants.

He was entertaining the audience all the way till the end of the speech where he kind of lost it.

 

[idiot09]

Yeah...but I'm agreeing with you dude....don't get all mixed up...

What I'm saying is that some people find it cheesy, and that's their deal; I won't convince'em that it's not cheesy, just like they're not gonna convince me that it is cheesy...(agree about the CW shows too, even tho I still enjoy'em t: )

agreed.

Also **** all this Lex talk. This aint the thread for it. What Terrio rewrite tells me though, is Affleck trusts Terrio to rewrite his script(so Im assuming he liked his work in BvS and JL). Thats a good thing.