Rise of the Silver Surfer BOX OFFICE Discussion

[GL's Light]

Since we're brining up Superman alot, what do we think about Richard Donner taking over this movie? After all,...his Superman seems to be the text book by which people do superhero movies.

Yes, I think Richard Donner should take over and make FF 3.

 

[Carp Man]

Yes, I think Richard Donner should take over and make FF 3.

Why ? How the heck does that guarantee suscess ? Oh and Pickle, need I remind you it took 4 months to reach 200. You spend 265 on a movie, and it limps to 200, that's not something to brag about. You people amaze me. You think you bring in a new director, all of a sudden that guarantess a suscess. Give me a break. Donner would want more control then Fox would give him. That's why Singer refused X-Men 3.

 

[GL's Light]

Why ? How the heck does that guarantee suscess ?

I was joking. Y'know, poking fun at all the Superman talk in the FF forum.

 

[Carp Man]

I was joking. Y'know, poking fun at all the Superman talk in the FF forum.

I know. t: Why the thread is simply box office discussion lol. Any box office will do. This has turned into the generic box office thread. We talk TF's. We talk Rat. We talk LFODH. We talk SR's. We even talk FF 2 from time to time. Whatever.

 

[Agent 194]

Point is we're talking. Discussions like this get things going in lots of directions for other projects. The superhero movie business is benefited by success. When one movie does well it encourages others to follow. When they start doing bad...no more forums like this. Nothing to talk about...Marvel or DC. It's not like there are massive amounts of new information to talk about on the status of this movie. Brainstorming ideas helps bring forth new ideas. I never have understood the exclusivity of discussion on forums.

 

[GL's Light]

I know. t: Why the thread is simply box office discussion lol. Any box office will do. This has turned into the generic box office thread. We talk TF's. We talk Rat. We talk LFODH. We talk SR's. We even talk FF 2 from time to time. Whatever.

Yeah, but at least this summer's films are all fresh topics to chew over. Talking about SR is just going over the same ground we've already covered ad infinitum.

 

[Pickle-El]

I still love how people throw around the 265 million dollar figure.....even though that 65 million (40 or so to Burton and Cage) was paid out in like 1997.

Tis funny.....

Oh and Carpy, it took 4 months....that's because people watched it. On it's 11th weekend it still did over 1.1 million.

http://boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=weekend&id=superman06.htm

People call SR a 'failure' relative to its cost (209 million actual budget). But you can't sit there and say no one saw it...it didn't make much less than X3 WW. (60 million less)

As far as FF3 goes, I'm not sure how much more you could expect...Even IF it were to improve on FF2 like this recent sequel did, how are you going to convince the public to pour another 60 million or so on opening weekend? There's the answer you should be looking for. Not, who should be directing, it's HOW the heck are we going to improve these kind of numbers when we had an ace in the SS and already used him?

 

[Agent 194]

Rehashing about our favorite movies is a little like talking about old girlfriends. Sometimes you think you've gotten it out of your system and then it wells up from time to time.

 

[Agent 194]

HOW the heck are we going to improve these kind of numbers when we had an ace in the SS and already used him?

That's a very good point. The most on task point so far. Okay, you got me on topic with that.

 

[GL's Light]

As far as FF3 goes, I'm not sure how much more you could expect...Even IF it were to improve on FF2 like this recent sequel did, how are you going to convince the public to pour another 60 million or so on opening weekend? There's the answer you should be looking for. Not, who should be directing, it's HOW the heck are we going to improve these kind of numbers when we had an ace in the SS and already used him?

That could be the sticking point for Fox going ahead with FF 3. The Silver Surfer and Galactus were the big guns to bring in to add extra juice to FF 2, yet the domestic box office isn't shaping up too well. They're unlikely to trust the FF to carry FF 3 on their own, but what other characters do they own the rights to who could bring box office mojo to the table? I don't think the Inhumans are going to cut it; they're just not famous enough.

 

[Agent 194]

No and they'd mess that up too. Best not to bring them in.

 

[Pickle-El]

I don't know much about the FF rogue gallery.....but perhaps they messed up not making this a 2-movie epic? (Cutting down costs, and simply adding another villain to the 3rd)

I just don't see how they can do it. The Fox marketing machine can only do so much......

Maybe have Alba actually go nude this time?

 

[highguard]

.......

As far as FF3 goes, I'm not sure how much more you could expect...Even IF it were to improve on FF2 like this recent sequel did, how are you going to convince the public to pour another 60 million or so on opening weekend? There's the answer you should be looking for. Not, who should be directing, it's HOW the heck are we going to improve these kind of numbers when we had an ace in the SS and already used him?

Exactly, they dropped the ball at the start when they made certain decisions that hurt the BO.

Now they turned out a good serviceable film but the BO has burned them in this summer of Mega hits.

Now they were put up there with other movies including Spiderman at the beginning of summer.

Now they are not even going to make the first films take.

What is left.

Even if they did all the right things like respecting the source it may not be enough to pump any excitement in the next episode cause no one believes a word of Rothman's and Tim Story is now being looked at like a yes man to Fox.

That is why LS and others feel that all you can do now is bring in a big name Director and it burns me that Tim may take the fall for the BO shortfall of expectations.

And what is the budget going to be for this film and when will it come out. 2 years, 3 years from now.

 

[Antonello Blueberry]

Guy, calm down. The movie made more than 200 million worldwide and still has to open in big markets like France, Japan, Spain and Germany. It will easily make more than 250 million.
And someone should remember something I've been saying for a lot of time and was confirmed in today's Hollywood Reporter piece.
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/content_display/film/news/e3if727c623f03c782b8ad564866c828796

"(Franchises) are critically important, more so now than ever," says Hutch Parker, vice chairman of 20th Century Fox Film Group. "In a market that is getting increasingly cluttered with third-party productions -- often financed by hedge funds and other sources of financing -- franchise pictures cut through the clutter, courtesy of their unique relationship to the audience, and have a currency around the world that very few other kinds of pictures do."

That currency means much more than just boxoffice. According to a recent report from the MPA, theatrical boxoffice now accounts for only 19% of a movie's total revenue stream. In other words, for every $100 million that a movie makes at the boxoffice, it makes almost $400 million more from other media. With big franchises like "Spider-Man" and "Harry Potter," that can mean billions in revenue.

 

[Spider-Fan]

I think FF3 is going to be official soon enough. After the DVD's opening at worst.

Though the article saying the Surfer movie is already in the works was good news to me

I think FF3's time will come. I think a name dircetor may help, but it may be more wise of FOX to pursue the rights to a character like the Black Panther, who I think could bring more people in (he would be a big hit with the minority crowd, no doubt).

Not sure what FOX will do, but since FOX has no big franchises, FF is one of their bigger properties, so we should at least get FF3.

Also, it has yet to open in bigger markets, like AB pointed out.

 

[Carp Man]

Guy, calm down. The movie made more than 200 million worldwide and still has to open in big markets like France, Japan, Spain and Germany. It will easily make more than 250 million.
And someone should remember something I've been saying for a lot of time and was confirmed in today's Hollywood Reporter piece.
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/content_display/film/news/e3if727c623f03c782b8ad564866c828796

Well said. Box office is less then 20 % of the whole picture. Why I'm not worried about a 3rd, nor am I worried about Story, or the rest of the cast. When the last bean is counted, it will have made a profit, the sequel will be anounced, and all will be happy again. They only spend 130 on the movie. If they spent 300 like Spider-Man 3, then there may be cause for concern. Everyone needs to chill out, and the detractors need to go back into the shadows. So if FF 2 makes 300 million, by the time it all said and done, the figure will be 1.2 billion ? That is good enough for a sequel.

 

[ultimatefan]

The article says the sequel is in consideration, as it is for Superman, but nothing is set in stone for either. It can be argued that Hulk and Daredevil were also profitable movies for the studios, but look how long it took to get the Hulk sequel in the works and where´s DD2 again? Hollywood investors are VERY greedy, they know the BO is only 20% of the revenue, but they want it as high as possible anyway.

 

[Carp Man]

The article says the sequel is in consideration, as it is for Superman, but nothing is set in stone for either. It can be argued that Hulk and Daredevil were also profitable movies for the studios, but look how long it took to get the Hulk sequel in the works and where´s DD2 again? Hollywood investors are VERY greedy, they know the BO is only 20% of the revenue, but they want it as high as possible anyway.

Either way I'm not worried. Now Superman I can see hesitation. FF 3 is in da bag. book it. I think many who did not go to the movie are waiting for the DVD. I think DVD sales and rentals will be big.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

This is exactly the kind of shilling I'm talking about. If the film didn't have the name Superman or had Singer's name attached it would have been ripped to shreds.

One guy on the Tomatometer got it 100% right and that was Roger Ebert, who gave it 2 stars.

"This is a glum, lackluster movie in which even the big effects sequences seem dutiful instead of exhilarating."

That pretty much summed up my feelings. To be fair he didn't review FF1 well either, he didn't review FF2 at all, and I'll admit he probably wouldn't have liked it.

However the only things good about SR are that which are ripped off from the Donner film, because basically the whole movie is plagerized from the original Donner film. You have Superman crash landing from Krypton, you have the scene on the farm, and you have Superman pining for Lois in Metropolis, the parts that Singer added are pure unadulterated CRAP.

If you like the movie fine, but you can't argue that there's nothing original about the movie. You may like or dislike the Fantastic Four films, but at least the writers/directors tried to do something fresh and new.

There's also another thing that Superman Returns can't say, and that's that it captured the heart of the characters. All of the main characters are 100% off, the most compelling character in the film is Perry White's nephew and Lois' fiance, and he was never in the comics.

The film is nothing but a half assed attempt to recreate the Donner film, and all they came up with is a frickin 2 million dollar shot of a guy getting a bullet in the eye. Even that was a total Matrix type rip off.

I know the fanboy shilling will continue, but in reality it is only a meager effort to bring the character back to the screen.

And however you feel it compares to the Fantastic Four movies it pales in comparison to the Spider-man movies or the first two X-men movies or the first Batman or Batman Begins.

And that's just a plain fact.

Its not a fact at all, i told you before, i was no Superman fanboy when i first watched SR and i loved it, i am now, but only because of the movie.

And you say FF tried to be original? So Dr. Doom wasnt a carbon copy of the Green Goblin in Spiderman 1 then?

 

[ultimatefan]

Either way I'm not worried. Now Superman I can see hesitation. FF 3 is in da bag. book it. I think many who did not go to the movie are waiting for the DVD. I think DVD sales and rentals will be big.

There isn´t any objective reason why FF3 is any more "in the bag" than the SR sequel. Yeah, it will be profitable, and so was SR, but even that in Hollywood doesn´t necessarily ensure anything. I can accept that SR was disappointing at the BO, and it´s time for FF fans to accept that FF2 is too. Consistently big weekend drops like the ones FF2 had, without having a massive record-breaking opening, scare studios, and the HR article is clear about that. The article says "considering", which means there´s no fast track development, like there was for FF2.

 

[Spider-Fan]

There isn´t any objective reason why FF3 is any more "in the bag" than the SR sequel. Yeah, it will be profitable, and so was SR, but even that in Hollywood doesn´t necessarily ensure anything. I can accept that SR was disappointing at the BO, and it´s time for FF fans to accept that FF2 is too. Consistently big weekend drops like the ones FF2 had, without having a massive record-breaking opening, scare studios, and the HR article is clear about that. The article says "considering", which means there´s no fast track development, like there was for FF2.

Thing with FF is they are cheaper to manage than Superman, so a FF sequel may be more lucrative.

 

[GreenKToo]

according to this, neither F4 3 or a superman sequel is certain yet.

http://www.superherohype.com/news/topnews.php?id=5986

 

[ultimatefan]

Thing with FF is they are cheaper to manage than Superman, so a FF sequel may be more lucrative.

It doesn´t matter cuz the BO for FF2 is also being much lower than SR. It´s barely paying the production budget in USA, like SR, and that´s a fundamental measure for the studio.

 

[ultimatefan]

according to this, neither F4 3 or a superman sequel is certain yet.

http://www.superherohype.com/news/topnews.php?id=5986

That´s what I been trying to say, I´m not saying that either sequel won´t happen, but don´t hold your breath yet. It´s not a done deal. The article clearly states that the movie´s BO performance is cause for worry.

 

[Bishop2]

according to this, neither F4 3 or a superman sequel is certain yet.

http://www.superherohype.com/news/topnews.php?id=5986

Obviously.

I still say they're not gonna do Silver Surfer. All the business logic argues against that.