Dark Knight Rises vs Iron Man 3: Which Movie Inspired the Worse Fan Backlash?

[jonathancrane]

Maybe it's just me and only a few, but while I did not like Iron Man 3, I was always aware of the fan backlash TDKR had...I'm guessing there was a lot more in the IM3 boards then I thought?

Correct.

The Marvel boards were unbearable for weeks after the film's release.

 

[redfirebird2008]

Maybe it's just me and only a few, but while I did not like Iron Man 3, I was always aware of the fan backlash TDKR had...I'm guessing there was a lot more in the IM3 boards then I thought?

It was pretty bad. Some of the biggest Iron Man fans like Kedrell got so mad about it they threatened to give up on Marvel altogether.

 

[Anno_Domini]

Jesus, lol.

Well, I guess I change my vote to IM3. At least with TDKR, no one stopped being a Batman or DC fan.

 

[redfirebird2008]

Jesus, lol.

Well, I guess I change my vote to IM3. At least with TDKR, no one stopped being a Batman or DC fan.

He wasn't threatening to stop being an Iron Man or Marvel comics fan, just threatening to give up on the whole Marvel Studios movie universe. As Upset Spideyfan noted above, Marvel Studios did a great job pleasing the fans with the MCU until we got to the Mandarin twist. Then the fans felt like they were being slapped in the face, and it didn't help that Shane Black publicly mocked fans for being disappointed in it.

 

[Anno_Domini]

Did they really please the fans before IM3, though? Iron Man 2, The Incredible Hulk.

 

[Shikamaru]

Did Iron Man 3 really get more backlash? From what I've seen, all the backlash it got has something to do with how they did the Mandarin. Outside of that, I haven't seen a lot of backlash. TDKR got backlash on almost everything from start to finish - from the character portrayals to the overall story to the ending to the messages to the themes to the character development to the inconsistencies to the things that it contradicts from previous films, etc.

I would say TDKR got more backlash overall but the Mandarin twist specifically got more backlash than anything in TDKR.

 

[Visualiza]

Did Iron Man 3 really get more backlash? From what I've seen, all the backlash it got has something to do with how they did the Mandarin. Outside of that, I haven't seen a lot of backlash. TDKR got backlash on almost everything from start to finish - from the character portrayals to the overall story to the ending to the messages to the themes to the character development to the inconsistencies to the things that it contradicts from previous films, etc.

I would say TDKR got more backlash overall but the Mandarin twist specifically got more backlash than anything in TDKR.

Good point.

 

[Anno_Domini]

Did Iron Man 3 really get more backlash? From what I've seen, all the backlash it got has something to do with how they did the Mandarin. Outside of that, I haven't seen a lot of backlash. TDKR got backlash on almost everything from start to finish - from the character portrayals to the overall story to the ending to the messages to the themes to the character development to the inconsistencies to the things that it contradicts from previous films, etc.

I would say TDKR got more backlash overall but the Mandarin twist specifically got more backlash than anything in TDKR.

It's funny that the Mandarin twist get the most backlash out of anything compared to TDKR and yet TDKR ended up being the better film regardless t:

 

[S. Grundy]

Iron Man 3 was fun, The Dark Knight Rises was just plain dumb.

 

[spider-neil]

TDKR for me is like Looper. An incredibly entertaining movie but the second you start to think about the movie (probably as early as the return journey home) the plot holes are glearing. Some stuff off the top of my head;

How did Batman get back to Gotham after he escaped the pit?

How did Batman get back into Gotham, something that the nation outside Gotham failed to?

How did Batman fix his broken back?

Bruce lost all his money during Stock Exchange heist, surely any deals made in and around that time would be null and void?

'Robin' was able to tell Bruce was Batman because he saw the rage within him...? HA! HA HA! HA! HA!

Bane attempts to seduce Gothamites with a picture of Dent and a statement from Gordan, 1) He could be lying and 2) The guy BLEW UP YOUR STADIUM!!

Batman took the time to paint his logo on the side of a bridge but going to rescue Gordon?

There is a nuclear explosion no more than 50 miles from Gotham, wouldn't the fall out blow back into the City.

There is no way on this earth Batman should have survived the explosion and even if he did the radiation should have killed him on the swim back to the shore.

SO many plot holes but whilst I was watching the movie I was engaged and was tearing up with Alfred's speech so I was emotionally invested.
IM3 on the other hand had me seething with rage because they presented me with an interesting character and then pissed it away as a joke. I hope Black is no where near another superhero movie ever again.

 

[batfreakforever]

I don't care for backlash. I enjoy both movies. Iron-man 3 is a day 1 buy.

 

[Anno_Domini]

TDKR for me is like Looper. An incredibly entertaining movie but the second you start to think about the movie (probably as early as the return journey home) the plot holes are glearing. Some stuff off the top of my head;

Looper was ****ing AMAZING.

How did Batman get back to Gotham after he escaped the pit?

Do people still wonder about this or wanted to see this? No one enjoys dramatic effect anymore, heh?

How did Batman get back into Gotham, something that the nation outside Gotham failed to?

Well, except for the Special Forces that actually did get inside Gotham, so the nation outside of Gotham didn't really fail to.

How did Batman fix his broken back?

Wasn't a broken back like Knightfall; just a protruding vertebrae and while I myself can't fully wrap my head around the idea of just popping it back in and being still in one spot until it heals, it's not as bogus as everything else "medical" we've seen in the trilogy(i.e.: Two-Face).

Bruce lost all his money during Stock Exchange heist, surely any deals made in and around that time would be null and void?

Hard to say. Whatever they did do, Bruce couldn't even figure it out when he looked over that USB drive or whatever it was on his SUPER computer. Perhaps someone couldn't have voided it, or they hid the huge transaction within other sells and trades.

'Robin' was able to tell Bruce was Batman because he saw the rage within him...? HA! HA HA! HA! HA!

Having the same experience, witnessing a parent's death(this case only his father)...is it really "out there" to even think it's possible?

Bane attempts to seduce Gothamites with a picture of Dent and a statement from Gordan, 1) He could be lying and 2) The guy BLEW UP YOUR STADIUM!!

Who's going to say anything when he has a bomb and as you said he BLEW UP YOUR STADIUM. The criminals wouldn't care if it was true or not since they're out of prison.

Batman took the time to paint his logo on the side of a bridge but going to rescue Gordon?

Why not? There was a three week gap from when he escaped the Pit to meeting Selina Kyle. Setting that logo as a sign of hope for Gotham isn't a bad thing.

There is a nuclear explosion no more than 50 miles from Gotham, wouldn't the fall out blow back into the City.

There is no way on this earth Batman should have survived the explosion and even if he did the radiation should have killed him on the swim back to the shore.

Agree that the nuclear bomb raised many questions, but it wasn't something Nolan wanted to look into besides Batman saving the day. I can look past them.

SO many plot holes but whilst I was watching the movie I was engaged and was tearing up with Alfred's speech so I was emotionally invested.
IM3 on the other hand had me seething with rage because they presented me with an interesting character and then pissed it away as a joke. I hope Black is no where near another superhero movie ever again.

Black screwed the pooch with Mandarin and made me lose faith in the guy when I LOVED Kiss Kiss, Bang Bang. His Ten Rings also contradict the first film's version of the terrorist organization(Stark watched a video of A.I.M. for 2009 when the first Extremis "mistake" happened, so the Ten Rings couldn't have been created before since it's stated Killian started the Ten Rings BECAUSE of the failed Extremis projects...contradicts the Ten Rings being a legit terrorist group that ransacked villages in the first film and who kidnapped billionaires to create missiles). Let alone, Black insisted Mandarin is some caricature and indeed made Mandarin into some caricature that Killian created.

Stark knew Dr. Wu since '99 and didn't bother to try and get the mini arc reactor removed during the events of Iron Man 2 when it was actually killing him in that film? I doubt advancements in technology were updated within the two years between each film to where Wu could have only removed it in IM3.

Instead of using all of his armors in the end, Stark didn't think about using his army of Iron Men when "Mandarin" attacked his place?

Harley tells Stark to build when it comes to dealing with his PTSD...but yet he HAD been building ever since the Chitauri attack and he still suffers from PTSD to this day and all of a sudden that stress is gone.

Rhodey is able to control the Iron Patriot armor after Killian's men even tinkered with it and trapping the President in it...but the President couldn't at least try and handle the IP armor himself to escape?

Didn't Pepper have an IM hand when she killed Killian? Wouldn't JARVIS had destroyed that as well during the "clean slate" command(she could have removed it, as I don't fully remember everything about IM3...I've only seen it once and I won't be buying it on Blu-ray)? Nevertheless, I feel that Pepper should have died earlier during her fall. Maybe if that happened, the awful ending to IM3 wouldn't have happened.

And what happens to the little girl? It SEEMED that the Vice President was helping out Killian because a little girl was being treated, but we know nothing about what happens to her. She's like the Penny Marko of Iron Man 3.

And then the film ends off with a terrible way of using Banner. Yah, let's give something to underuse the character of Bruce and let's not use that chance to actually use another one...a....stranger one....t:

The comedy ratio over everything else was dissatisfying, the lack of classic rock was disturbing and the better parts of the film being shelved off in some way or another was disappointing(the PTSD idea, that I really liked, was tossed aside, the BEAUTIFUL armors being destroyed, Kingsley's Mandarin being one big joke that The Comedian wouldn't even dare to laugh about).

Two things I'd never complain about for IM3 are Robert Downey, Jr. and Jon Favreau though

 

[Anno_Domini]

Dude...ease up on the language and name calling or you're most likely going to be banned after just one post.

 

[redfirebird2008]

Did they really please the fans before IM3, though? Iron Man 2, The Incredible Hulk.

FWIW, Kedrell defends IM2 to this day. I think he liked TIH too. I liked TIH but IM2 was a big disappointment. Overall though, they've done a really good job IMHO. Enjoyed all of their movies except IM2.

 

[Hammer!]

Iron Man 3 didn't get Mandarin right. TDKR didn't get Bruce Wayne right. So TDKR definitely gets the bigger backlash from me. And almost 80% of comic fans who were disappointed with IM3 were disappointed with Mandarin. Almost every comic fan who didn't like TDKR, like myself, hated aspects all over the film. Batman is my favorite character in all of literature and TDKR kicked me in the balls every ten minutes. Not only the worst of the Bat-trilogy by far, but the red headed step child of Nolan's entire filmography. I actually liked Iron Man 3 quite a bit. It wasn't as good as the first or Avengers, but definitely better than 2, which is what my expectation were going in.

In response to Anno, I could reach and try to find ways to fix all of your "plot holes" about Iron Man 3 like you did to TDKR, but I think we can both agree that both films had some pretty faulty logic at times, though I personally think TDKR deserves more criticism considering how cohesive and logically sound the first two were. One thing that does need to be mentioned since no one seems to have caught this but me, is "why doesn't Tony call in all the suits earlier in the film". It's because the house collapsed on the entrance to Tony's garage during the Malibu attack that the suits needed to fly in-and-out of. This is only revealed by a single line in the film where JARVIS reveals to Tony at the oil rig that all the debris has been removed from the entrance, and Tony replies by calling them in. This SCREAMS of scenes on the cutting room floor where this was more clearly expressed, and they definitely made a mistake of only including one line explaining it, but, none the less, it is there.

But seriously, every critically and commercially well-received comic book film has a vocal rappart that hate on a film (besides perhaps The Dark Knight, the first Iron Man, and the Avengers). The two most polarizing comic book films since Batman Returns have got an 87 and 78 score on Rotten Tomatoes respectively. This genre has certainly come a long way.

 

[spider-neil]

This fool is terribly misinformed. This is the problem I have with nerds. You guys think you know it all. The minute you realize you dont have the brains to understand something, it's automatically a plot hole. This is why Nolan has the fame he does instead of you dumbasses (excuse my french). I have answered all the questions in bolded letters.

You're going to last about a week if you are going to flinging insults left and right. It's fine to disagree it's not fine to go around insulting people.

 

[spider-neil]

And just so we're clear...TDKR has NO plot holes?

 

[Hammer!]

And just so we're clear...TDKR has NO plot holes?

I wouldn't call them plot holes per say, but it certainly has some of the most faulty logic I've seen in a comic book movie in years. And Nolan directed it! WTF

And that's not even mentioning how Nolan completely abandoned ship on the previous two film's motifs about Bruce, exchanged screen time from Alfred, Lucius and Gordon to Blake, Miranda Tate, and Daggett, completely underused Catwoman, went with a horrible voice for Bane, used the most clichéd use of a twist, featured sloppy film editing, the whole "I knews yous wuz da Batman" scene, the blatantly obvious bait-and-switch of Batman being blown up in the Bat-plane, the eye rolling induced nod to Robin, and Batman sipping cappuccino with Catwoman in Italy while Gotham is reeling from an atomic bomb explosion just miles off the coast.

Not only was this not the Batman I've known from the comics and shows, this wasn't even the Batman I knew from the first two films.

 

[spider-neil]

I wouldn't call them plot holes per say, but it certainly has some of the most faulty logic I've seen in a comic book movie in years. And Nolan directed it! WTF

And that's not even mentioning how Nolan completely abandoned ship on the previous two film's motifs about Bruce, exchanged screen time from Alfred, Lucius and Gordon to Blake, Miranda Tate, and Daggett, completely underused Catwoman, went with a horrible voice for Bane, used the most clichéd use of a twist, featured sloppy film editing, the whole "I knews yous wuz da Batman" scene, the blatantly obvious bait-and-switch of Batman being blown up in the Bat-plane, the eye rolling induced nod to Robin, and Batman sipping cappuccino with Catwoman in Italy while Gotham is reeling from an atomic bomb explosion just miles off the coast.

Not only was this not the Batman I've known from the comics and shows, this wasn't even the Batman I knew from the first two films.

I don't really remember too much of my BB movie experience because I was very 'meh' about the whole movie but I remember my TDK movie experience pretty well and let's put it this way, I wasn't questioning anywhere near as much stuff as I was in TDKR. People can explain away the wonky logic all they like but (as an example) Blake saying he recognised Batman from an expression he saw on Bruce's face years previously is at best 'clunky'.

 

[Showtime]

And as for the name calling, Im not sure where we draw the line here. Just skimming through the forums here have seen much much worse than anything I've written in this post.

You've had two posts here, and they are both questionable. You're on a comicbook forum ripping on "fanboys" What did you expect to find here? We're all "fanboys" if we are posting here.

 

[Anno_Domini]

Iron Man 3 didn't get Mandarin right. TDKR didn't get Bruce Wayne right. So TDKR definitely gets the bigger backlash from me. And almost 80% of comic fans who were disappointed with IM3 were disappointed with Mandarin. Almost every comic fan who didn't like TDKR, like myself, hated aspects all over the film. Batman is my favorite character in all of literature and TDKR kicked me in the balls every ten minutes. Not only the worst of the Bat-trilogy by far, but the red headed step child of Nolan's entire filmography. I actually liked Iron Man 3 quite a bit. It wasn't as good as the first or Avengers, but definitely better than 2, which is what my expectation were going in.

How did TDKR not get Bruce Wayne right, though? It was a natural step from TDK. The only thing that Nolan got "wrong" with Bruce in TDKR is that he let things go past him like thinking Bane was Ra's al Ghul's heir or not knowing that Miranda Tate is really Talia al Ghul.

In response to Anno, I could reach and try to find ways to fix all of your "plot holes" about Iron Man 3 like you did to TDKR, but I think we can both agree that both films had some pretty faulty logic at times, though I personally think TDKR deserves more criticism considering how cohesive and logically sound the first two were. One thing that does need to be mentioned since no one seems to have caught this but me, is "why doesn't Tony call in all the suits earlier in the film". It's because the house collapsed on the entrance to Tony's garage during the Malibu attack that the suits needed to fly in-and-out of. This is only revealed by a single line in the film where JARVIS reveals to Tony at the oil rig that all the debris has been removed from the entrance, and Tony replies by calling them in. This SCREAMS of scenes on the cutting room floor where this was more clearly expressed, and they definitely made a mistake of only including one line explaining it, but, none the less, it is there.

After all the chaos was done, of course there would be debris covering the entrance from the garage, but right then, as soon as Maya notices the helicopters, boom...Tony could have brought his army out fast enough before that entrance could have been blocked.

And please do reply to my complaints of Iron Man 3. Because the guy I replied to sure couldn't it seems, lol.

 

[Tony Stark]

IM3 definitely got more fan backlash, but IM3 is memorable if only for the twist like it or not.

The worst part of TDKR is it's totally forgettable. Probably the biggest let down compared to expectation.

 

[Iron_Stark]

Yeah IM3's biggest backlash came from the Mandarin twist.

TDKR has much more things that people complained about.

 

[Anno_Domini]

IM3 definitely got more fan backlash, but IM3 is memorable if only for the twist like it or not.

Gotta love when fans think something is fact.

 

[Anno_Domini]

And just so we're clear...TDKR has NO plot holes?

I'm not saying there isn't some inconsistency with TDKR, because there is.

There's no real answer as to how Talia and Bane become aware of Bruce and Batman being the same(except that the idea is probably because they are aligned with the LoS, so they "must know"), and there is faulty logic with the Dent Act and one must make a complete leap of faith in how it continued for eight years(I'm fine with the idea that Ramirez fled Gotham and would never shed light on the truth because she would find herself in trouble too as an accomplice for attempted murder as she helped kidnapped Dent while Wuertz was the accomplice that helped bring Rachel to her doom), with Mr. Reese being alive and no one demands answers from him about who Batman is or that Gordon's family stayed silent about the whole ordeal with Two-Face.

I even have my questions regarding the bomb as well, as I agreed with your two complaints about that subject, but for the other things you mentioned...they definitely have to call for you to think about it, but they never feel like real plot holes. It's only the viewer that would suggest it without realizing the answers to those "plot holes".