Discussion: Planned Parenthood

[danoyse]

ED pills are not for reproduction

What do you can happen when your sex life suddenly improves due to taking them? Women don't get pregnant by midichlorians you know.

When I took birth control, I was taking them for a medical reason (one that landed me in the emergency room and nearly needing surgery) and not because I was trying to keep from getting pregnant.

Regardless, if certain lawmakers have their way and try to ban or restrict them, that would possibly mean that if I needed them again, I would have to jump through all kinds of hoops to prove to a doctor and a pharmacist that I'm not some kind of baby-killing ****.

Why I need them (or why any woman needs them) shouldn't have to be discussed with anyone other than me and my doctor. And I sure as hell shouldn't have to be judged for it either.

 

[danoyse]

I can see where SentinelMind is coming from, but self-control and willpower as a social problem goes well beyond that. Look at fat people, alcoholics and Batman fans. If you have poor willpower it flows down to every part of you life.

If you want less sexual debauchery, tell guys to start listening to girls for relationship advice

My stance on birth control gets stronger every time I visit the Bat-forums.

 

[Trainwreck2100]

What do you can happen when your sex life suddenly improves due to taking them? Women don't get pregnant by midichlorians you know.

When I took birth control, I was taking them for a medical reason (one that landed me in the emergency room and nearly needing surgery) and not because I was trying to keep from getting pregnant.

Regardless, if certain lawmakers have their way and try to ban or restrict them, that would possibly mean that if I needed them again, I would have to jump through all kinds of hoops to prove to a doctor and a pharmacist that I'm not some kind of baby-killing ****.

Why I need them (or why any woman needs them) shouldn't have to be discussed with anyone other than me and my doctor. And I sure as hell shouldn't have to be judged for it either.

By the time old guys need said pills their SO are well beyond child birth.

 

[danoyse]

By the time old guys need said pills their SO are well beyond child birth.

Young guys can have that problem too, you know.

Speaking of which, it only lost by two votes:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...bortion-rules/2012/01/30/gIQAnw5QdQ_blog.html

Viagra regs paired with abortion rules

Sometimes a “nay” vote isn’t enough to show a lawmaker’s disdain for a bill. Sometimes only a flippant floor amendment will do.

Virginia state Sen. Janet D. Howell (D-Fairfax) doesn’t think much of a bill that would require women to have an ultrasound before undergoing an abortion.

When the proposed legislation came up for a preliminary vote in the Senate Monday, Howell offered a floor amendment that just about floored her colleagues.

“Prior to prescribing medication for erectile dysfunction, a physician shall perform a digital rectal examination and a cardiac stress test,” Howell said, reading the amendment aloud. “Informed consent for these procedures shall be given at least 24 hours before the procedures are performed.

“I just think we should have a little gender equity here,” Howell added.

The amendment failed, though not by much, in a 19-21 vote.

The abortion bill, one of many bills conservatives are pushing in the Republican-controlled Senate this General Assembly session, is expected to pass the upper chamber in a final vote Tuesday.

 

[danoyse]

Sums up my feelings on this entire matter perfectly. (oh, and watch out...the Girl Scouts are nothing but a big abortion factory too)

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...llying-women/2012/02/02/gIQA013ikQ_story.html

The big backlash against bullying women

You’d think the political process had turned into one big, sexy Go Daddy Super Bowl ad, with all the focus on breasts, bellies and even butts this week.

Let me explain how our political discourse has gone all T & A on us.

Amid the uncertainty of a meringue-strong economy, a continuing housing market crisis and persistent unemployment, the folks hired to try and fix these kinds of things in the Old Dominion spent their time legislating decisions that should be left to women and their doctors.

The Virginia Senate passed a bill Wednesday requiring women who are about to have a legal abortion to get an ultrasound first. The woman is supposed to be shown the image and will have to sign a waiver if she chooses not to take a look.

Should they also make the women listen to some lullabies? Smell some baby powder?

This legislation is nothing but bullying.

And the biggest bully on the playground this week wore pink. The Susan G. Komen Foundation, in a thinly veiled attack on abortion, withdrew its funding to Planned Parenthood for breast cancer screenings.

Yes, the folks who sell you all those hats, tote bags and special-edition teas covered in pink pulled their funding for the screenings at Planned Parenthood, which basically means breast cancer prevention for a lot of low-income people.

You think an assault on women’s ta-ta health isn’t enough? How about we take on the Girl Scouts, too?

My colleague Robert McCartney just wrote about the war against the Girl Scouts.

Churches in Northern Virginia and other parts of the country have kicked out Girl Scout troops after a virulent smear campaign linking them to an international scouting association and every single reference either group has ever made to Planned Parenthood.

The anti-Girl Scout campaign is being pushed by stuff like this: “100 Questions for the Girl Scouts” on www.familywatch
international.org.

“Why did the Girl Scouts feature Marie Wilson, staunch abortion supporter and defender of Planned Parenthood as a keynote speaker at a national Girl Scout convention?”

Um, maybe because Wilson is the co-founder of Take Our Daughters and Sons to Work Day and because she is the author of “Closing the Leadership Gap: Why Women Can and Must Help Run the World.”

This is complete insanity. And all of it threatens things that are good — even vital — for women. Meanwhile, the work that needs to be done to help prevent unwanted pregnancies — real sex education and easy access to birth control — is being marginalized.

And the work that needs to be done to bolster good parenting — real child care, equal pay for mothers and flexible work time for all families — is being ignored.

No wonder there’s a backlash erupting. The Pink Bully is getting blasted big time online:

“Through various events at work I have supported the Susan G. Komen organization. With this decision — that support has ended,” declared AggieHullabaloo.

“What a stupid, cowardly, toadying decision by a group that claims to support women!” wrote MaryinChicago.

And get a load of hokiejane: “No more. Not a dime. My pink SGK jacket is in the bag for Goodwill as I type, and I’m ‘de-ribboning’ myself completely.”

Even author/icon Judy Blume chimed in: “Susan Komen would not give in to bullies or to fear. Too bad the foundation bearing her name did. Support @PPact. Save lives,” tweeted the author of “Are You There God? It’s Me, Margaret.”

Thousands of women rushed to support Planned Parenthood. The organization received $650,000 in 24 hours.

Women have had enough and have struck back in some pretty interesting ways. Buying Girl Scout cookies is an easy and yummy way to make a statement. (Thin Mints as political protest!) But take a look at this maneuver by Virginia state Sen. Janet D. Howell (D-Fairfax) on the odious ultrasound legislation.

Howell proposed a “his” version of the bill, with some requirements for Viagra prescriptions:

“Prior to prescribing medication for erectile dysfunction, a physician shall perform a digital rectal examination and a cardiac stress test,” Howell said, reading the amendment aloud. “Informed consent for these procedures shall be given at least 24 hours before the procedures are performed.

“I just think we should have a little gender equity here,” Howell added.

You want to hear the real kicker? The amendment fell short by just two votes. Keep messing with us, and the next time it might pass.

 

[Marx]

It's not an abortion factory. Congrats on calling out a typo.

Are you saying I'm not a decent person? What exactly do you know about me?

Probably about as much as the two women who stopped me and my mother outside of a doctor's office when I was 16 and asked my mother to tell them if I was having an abortion.

I was there for an eye doctor appointment. And it was none of their damn business why we were there.

As my mother raged to my dad about it later, "What if I was taking her there for an abortion? What the hell did they think they were going to do about it?"

That was the moment in my life that exemplifies why I am pro-choice, and how much I understand why something like this is a private matter.

Because I know that if I had gotten pregnant at 16, my parents would have done everything they could to help avoid me having an abortion. But if that did wind up being something we had to do, it would have been an absolutely agonizing decision for us.

We wouldn't have needed two women with signs calling us whatever they planned on calling us if I was going into that office to have an abortion. It was none of their damn business.

Even now, I could never have an abortion. I could never kill my own baby.

But it exists, no matter how much people try to pretend it doesn't, and if it exists, it should be kept safe, legal, and private.

But I know women who've had them. As soon as I say that, I always get "Well, why did they have them?" And to that...it's none of their damn business either. These are women they don't know, will never know, so they're not their friends to judge. I have my own judgements on their reasons, and I accept they weren't my decisions to make.

As far as the politics going into Planned Parenthood, and efforts to stop birth control: I'm just damn sick of it.

I'm tired of "personhood" amendments that would basically call two of my friends murderers for having their tubes tied after they were done having children.

I'm tired of laws that make women have to go through ultrasounds they don't need (while the fathers are required to do nothing) so they can be treated like a dog who made a mess on the floor because they made a choice that is completely legal.

I'm tired of politicians trying to put limits on contraception. We should be able to pick up birth control pills without the pharmacist treating us like we're the ****es of Babylon for needing or wanting them.

I'm tired of watching a friend who does tireless good work for low-income families get threatened by a church group because her organization used the facilities at Planned Parenthood.

Overall, I'm tired of women's health issues getting trampled on in this country. I don't think that makes me an un-decent person at all.

Where did I ever say an abortion wasn't killing a baby?

That's exactly what it is. And I don't like it. I never have.

But the cold facts are is that it exists. Women are going to have them one way or another. And for that, the procedure should be kept safe, legal, and private.

And it's no one's damn business. I learned the importance of privacy the day those two women ran up to me and my mother ready to pounce.

It was such a galling invasion of privacy that I never forgot it. I already knew exactly what abortion was and what I thought of it (and was actually on their side), but that was the moment I understood what the right to privacy was.

That's not the only time I've seen it: there was a clinic near the school I was going to a few years later. It was a family clinic. I saw kids and parents going in and out of the place all of the time.

And of course, there they were at the door with their aborted fetus signs and their pamphlets, pestering every single person walking in and out of the door. One of them tried to stop me as I was walking to the deli for lunch. I kept walking.

I'm not against the pro-life movement. I think we need people there to encourage life and options other than this one, and make sure we do get to bring as many of these children into the world.

But I also believe that women have the right to make that choice for themselves. And I despise the idea that we have punish entire facilities and women who aren't having abortions. That's despicable.

Very, very well said.

And...they're backing down:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-120203komen-planned-parenthood,0,7837055.story

They should. Their decision was disgusting.

My stance on birth control gets stronger every time I visit the Bat-forums.

 

[Ocramed]

Some thoughts:

1) Ultrasounds should be required so that the woman can make an INFORMED decision.
2) Considering how there are deaths associated with Viagra, a man SHOULD go through a medical examination first before being authorized to take Viagra (he might not need to take pills for HIS problems).
3) I do believe in parental consent laws. After all, why should abortions be the exception, especially if a child needs parental permission to take aspirin in some places?
4) Regulate abortions: make it easier to gain court permission to investigate possible abuse of existing abortions laws. Abortions should be banned in the third tri-semester (with the exception of rape, incest and health of the would-be mother). And most of all, no Federal funding for abortions, especially in light of certain economic realities for an elective procedure.

On a final note, we all have to remember that at least 300,000 abortions are performed a year...and that's under Planned Parenthood's watch. Multiply that by the number of years since Roe v. Wade, and you have 12 million potential humans beings aborted for the sake of inconvenience (i.e. "family planning" So imagine the total number of abortions that have actually been performed...

Well, you don't need to, since there is actual data on the subject:

http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_induced_abortion.html

The sad thing is that we as a species can be bipolar about ending a life. We can get up in arms when it comes to the death penalty, euthanasia and war, but think nothing of killing a potential human being that has yet to make a mark in the world (which is why I am an advocate of the ultrasound). Then again, since the founder of the modern abortion movement, Margaret Sanger, was a Eugenicist who believe in population control, I am not surprised that pro-abortion-on-demand are advocates of the same sort of things.

Ultimately, it's up to each and every one of us to think this issue through. Yes, the anti-abortion folks can be pushy (in fact, any politicized group can be pushy), but they are pushy for a reason. To them, abortion is wrong because potential human beings are being killed every day. And don't say that there isn't a real-world consequence. There is one. 67 percent of all abortions are abortions involving African-American women since 1973, making the total number of abortions within the Black community to be 13 million potential human beings...

Funny how had the 13 million been live humans, the charge of genocide would come into play. We certainly thought so when Hutus were slaughtering Tutsis. But since the aborted are not "alive", and are Black, it's no big deal, right? Food for thought.

DSW

 

[Schlosser85]

After Google imaging some aborted fetuses, I have to say....I now support abortion only in the first trimester.

 

[TomPiltoff]

1) Ultrasounds should be required so that the woman can make an INFORMED decision.

Ultrasounds are not required for the woman to make an informed decision.

 

[danoyse]

Ultrasounds are not required for the woman to make an informed decision.

Nope, they're not.

Plus, if the mother is going to be forced to go through something like that, why isn't the father forced to go through anything?

 

[Schlosser85]

It's not like she doesn't know she's pregnant without being forced to watch an ultrasound. What's she being "informed" of?

It's just trying to emotionally manipulate her into not doing it. Be honest and call it what it is.

 

[danoyse]

It's not like she doesn't know she's pregnant without being forced to watch an ultrasound. What's she being "informed" of?

It's just trying to emotionally manipulate her into not doing it. Be honest and call it what it is.

That's exactly what it is, which is BS and shouldn't be required.

It should also be pointed out that at that early stage of a pregnancy, a baby that small can't even be seen on a regular external ultrasound performed on the abdomen. Which means the ultrasound would have to be performed internally. So...wow.

 

[Marx]

I also agree that forcing pregnant women to have ultrasounds before an abortion is nothing short of emotional manipulation.

 

[SentinelMind]

Just close your eyes, let the doc use the knives and tools, and get over with it.

 

[Lighthouse]

Just close your eyes, let the doc use the knives and tools, and get over with it.

 

[TomPiltoff]

Just close your eyes, let the doc use the knives and tools, and get over with it.

Well, yeah. What, are you gonna try and savor the moment? Of course you close your eyes and get it over with.

 

[Schlosser85]

Just close your eyes, let the doc use the knives and tools, and get over with it.

Huh

What is this even supposed to mean?

 

[Destructus86]

I just don't understand why this crap is an issue worth talking about. As far as i'm concerned contraceptive is a personal decision. Not one that should be made by politicians. Don't believe in contraceptive? Don't use it. Do believe? Then go for it.

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

I feel like we are back in the 1950's...Or maybe we never left.

 

[mclay18]

It IS an abortion factory, it just does other stuff people that protest don't care about.

it's not an abortion? I know, its an abortion factory.

control your own uterus....just make sure you pay consequences for your actions. that's all decent people ask.

You know that PP's abortion services are only 3% of what they do? The other 97% is counseling, contraceptives... you know, services and products that prevent pregnancy and abortions overall?

Please look at the facts. That's all you conservatives see it as, an "abortion clinic" or "baby-killer clinic" when it's not. PP provides a full range of women's reproductive health services and if they can't provide a service a woman is looking for, they can make referrals.

I'm a man, and preventing women from exercising their constitutional rights is the worse thing we can do. It's none of my business, and it's none of yours. So please take your nose out of my bedroom and everyone else's.

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

The truth is Komen ****ed itself by becoming a political organization and a lot of people will stop supporting them now because they have shown themselves to be an extreme right wing organization.

Does SentinelMind think that men should pay for their Viagra? Because Viagra is covered and none of the ultra religious folk like himself ever complains about that.

Viagra shouldn't be covered if Birth Control shouldn't be. That would be a consistant opinion and any thing less than that just shows that the anti birth control people are really only concerned with controlling women and think that men should be able to do whatever they want to.

Maybe women and many other men don't want to pay for your freakin Viagra or other male enhancement pills.

If god wanted you to get-it-up he you wouldn't have to take a little blue pill from that evil atheist science thingy.

 

[mclay18]

Viagra shouldn't be covered if Birth Control shouldn't be. That would be a consistant opinion and any thing less than that just shows that the anti birth control people are really only concerned with controlling women and think that men should be able to do whatever they want to.

Better yet, just make a generic birth control pill and have it available over the counter. It's proven birth control pills are beneficial for plenty of things other than the obvious (slowing heavy periods, et al).

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

Better yet, just make a generic birth control pill and have it available over the counter. It's proven birth control pills are beneficial for plenty of things other than the obvious (slowing heavy periods, et al).

I would be for that.

 

[Destructus86]

After talking with some people...I guess I can kind of see the problem with this. It does violate seperation of church and state. But then...when has Obama ever cared about trampling the constitution...

 

[Destructus86]

After talking with some people...I guess I can kind of see the problem with this. It does violate seperation of church and state. But then...when has Obama ever cared about trampling the constitution...