Discussion: Racism - Part 4

[Holiday]

Except of course every post has your avatar attached to it. You make a decision to present yourself that way in the argument and then complain that people see you how you intended them to see you.

I'll say this and move on because there is no need to hijack this thread any longer, but it was said that I constantly defend Trump which is factually untrue regardless of whatever avatar I have. When DJ was still around months ago and I had a different avy, he labeled me a Trump supporter along with Amixili because I didn't share the status quo opinion on something here so this isn't anything new.

 

[jolldan]

I often hear stories about Islamophobia, which is awful never want to hear of anyone being picked on or marginalized because of their religion.

However there seems to be very little mention reported on this

 

[Teelie]

That isn't in the US though and little we could do about it. Especially with the current administration's anti-everything policy.

 

[MagnarTheGreat]

Jules Suzdaltsev also has statements about racist bullying occurring at the school.

Madison365 - Baraboo Schools Investigating Purported Nazi Salute Prom Photo

[Photographer] Gust’s website says he has a son who is a junior at Baraboo High School. It is not clear whether Gust’s son is in the photo. Gust’s website also indicates that he is a retired teacher. Gust did not immediately respond to a phone message or a message left through the contact form on his site.

Journal Sentinel - Baraboo school district condemns a photo showing a large group of students giving Nazi salute

WiscNews - UPDATE: Nazi salutes appear to be used in group photo of boys from Baraboo High School prom; police investigating

USA Today - Texas high school students hold up Nazi salute in class photo (February 2017)

 

[THORin]

Wow...that is vile. I don't know any other words to describe how disgusting that is.

 

[MagnarTheGreat]

Coincidence or not, I think they should change their school district logo while they're at it.

Coat of arms of Germany - Wikipedia

 

[Donner]

For ****s sake. This is okay now? In Germany, that crap will get you arrested.

I'm absolutely appalled.

 

[Teelie]

This is the kind of **** we deal with when people don't give a ****.

 

[samsnee]

Pretty obvious this school doesn’t care since accounts from students say they didn’t do anything when other incidents were called out.

Stan Lee, RIP, said it well back in the day

Let's lay it right on the line. Bigotry and racism are among the deadliest social ills plaguing the world today. But, unlike a team of costumed super-villains, they can’t be halted with a punch in the snoot, or a zap from a ray gun. The only way to destroy them is to expose them—to reveal them for the insidious evils they really are. The bigot is an unreasoning hater—one who hates blindly, fanatically, indiscriminately. If his hang-up is black men, he hates ALL black men. If a redhead once offended him, he hates ALL redheads. If some foreigner beat him to a job, he’s down on ALL foreigners. He hates people he’s never seen—people he’s never known—with equal intensity—with equal venom.

 

[Aximili86]

Just release their names & photos. That's the solution. Acting like this is epidemic and 95% of the society isn't going to shun & shame them over it is moronic.

Who cares if they're minors? Expose who they are, let 'em learn consequences the hard way, college applications getting knocked back, job opportunities & internships laughing them out of town, the works.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

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There's no sarcasm smiley in the above post. Strange.

 

[Marvolo]

I only have a problem with that salute when its given in sincerity and especially when its given by authority figures, government officials for example. But a bunch of kids goofing around in a school photo...seems like much ado about pretty much nothing. Even if some of them are giving that salute sincerely and fully believe the nazi ideology it's not really something that needs to be treated as an outrage. Ok, so a kid is a budding nazi. What to do? Just talk to them and try to educate them and change their mind. If they are stubborn and stick with their dumbass ideas about master races, well, to hell with the little ****s. Some teenagers are just dip****s. Maybe they'll grow out of it and some common sense will get through their thick skulls eventually.

As for the bullying I agree that definitely needs to be addressed and is troubling. Expulsions, suspension or stripping of honors might be pretty effective ways of dealing with it. Someone or a lot of someones at the school arent doing their most important job which is to protect and nurture the children entrusted to them.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I only have a problem with that salute when its given in sincerity and especially when its given by authority figures, government officials for example. But a bunch of kids goofing around in a school photo...seems like much ado about pretty much nothing. Even if some of them are giving that salute sincerely and fully believe the nazi ideology it's not really something that needs to be treated as an outrage. Ok, so a kid is a budding nazi. What to do? Just talk to them and try to educate them and change their mind. If they are stubborn and stick with their dumbass ideas about master races, well, to hell with the little ****s. Some teenagers are just dip****s. Maybe they'll grow out of it and some common sense will get through their thick skulls eventually.

As for the bullying I agree that definitely needs to be addressed and is troubling. Expulsions, suspension or stripping of honors might be pretty effective ways of dealing with it. Someone or a lot of someones at the school arent doing their most important job which is to protect and nurture the children entrusted to them.

You always expose Nazis. You always shame Nazis. The idea that these things aren't a big deal is exactly how we get situations like Charlottesville. You don't let anyone normalize this kind of ****.

 

[Sithborg]

Hell, after the shooting at the synagogue 2 weeks ago.

And while I am not about ruining these kids lives, they do need to learn some consequences for this.

 

[Marvolo]

You always expose Nazis. You always shame Nazis. The idea that these things aren't a big deal is exactly how we get situations like Charlottesville. You don't let anyone normalize this kind of ****.

I'd agree if we were talking about adults. As far as the law is concerned, people in this country cant register with any political party until they are 18 so itd be questionable to legally punish kids for espousing a political ideology even when that ideology is nazism. After they are 18, fine. Even if that weren't the case and children could legally claim a political party and ideology, throwing up a nazi salute in a high school photo (things that often involve kids doing dumb things for ****s and giggles) is a far cry from goose stepping down main street and longing for a final solution.

I'd also agree if the nazi salute wasnt something I've seen done in jest numerous times throughout my life. I dont immediately assume a person is being sincere or worry about it unless theres reason to be concerned. And right now I'm more concerned about these kids potentially being shamed or targeted by a bunch of adults on social media going on a moral crusade than I am about those kids making a nazi salute in a high school photo.

Also, the one boy not doing the salute said the photographer told the kids to make the salute. Was the photographer an adult? If so, an adult photographer going around telling kids to make the nazi salute seems like the bigger issue to me.

 

[THORin]

You always expose Nazis. You always shame Nazis. The idea that these things aren't a big deal is exactly how we get situations like Charlottesville. You don't let anyone normalize this kind of ****.

Exactly. We must never ever allow these things to become normalized. It's not a joke. I don't care who thinks it's a joke. It's not. It's just not. We can't allow it to become a matter of jest.

 

[MagnarTheGreat]

Six years ago...same school...

When Austin Smothers and a few others recently decided to place Confederate flags on their pickup trucks to honor the death of a friend, they also raised a few eyebrows.

“We never meant it to be a racist thing to anybody,” said Smothers, a Baraboo High School junior. “We wanted to honor our friend, Joshua Blum, who had just died. We wanted to show we cared for him.”

Blum died Feb. 20 in a crash after the pickup he was driving overturned in Marquette County. Blum’s father, Tim, said his son didn’t wear his seat belt and that’s what killed him. However, a passenger in the truck wore a seat belt and survived.

Smothers said he and the others at Baraboo High School often drove their trucks around the city with the Confederate flag waving in the back.

Wiscnews - Use of Confederate flag as memorial questioned

 

[THORin]

Six years ago...same school...



Wiscnews - Use of Confederate flag as memorial questioned

They've got a track record of this sort of stuff. No surprise there, but maybe now somebody will look into what other stuff this school has been allowing to go unpunished.

 

[hellified]

I'd agree if we were talking about adults. As far as the law is concerned, people in this country cant register with any political party until they are 18 so itd be questionable to legally punish kids for espousing a political ideology even when that ideology is nazism. After they are 18, fine. Even if that weren't the case and children could legally claim a political party and ideology, throwing up a nazi salute in a high school photo (things that often involve kids doing dumb things for ****s and giggles) is a far cry from goose stepping down main street and longing for a final solution.

I'd also agree if the nazi salute wasnt something I've seen done in jest numerous times throughout my life. I dont immediately assume a person is being sincere or worry about it unless theres reason to be concerned. And right now I'm more concerned about these kids potentially being shamed or targeted by a bunch of adults on social media going on a moral crusade than I am about those kids making a nazi salute in a high school photo.

Also, the one boy not doing the salute said the photographer told the kids to make the salute. Was the photographer an adult? If so, an adult photographer going around telling kids to make the nazi salute seems like the bigger issue to me.

we're not talking about kids...we're talking about young men. And patriotism and insults to vets etc....all the things that were said to football players who kneeled during the national anthem. Doing a nazi salute on american soil is a huge insult to the people who died fighting that enemy. An official enemy of the US.

When nonwhites (youth or otherwise) refuse to salute or stand for the flag or the pledge of allegiance based on religious or real grievances with how our society runs they are ostracized and punished but some suburban white youths mimic and copy the actions of a documented enemy of the US and its boys will be boys

 

[Donner]

When I was in high school, I had 4 boys follow me around the school making a Nazi salute until I ran into the bathroom and hid. No teacher ever told them to stop. I screamed at them that there might be Jewish kids in the school and they would be offended by the salutes and one of the boys joked that I would burn them in my basement if I knew who they were.

It wasn't funny then and it sure as **** isn't funny now. I think the photographer that told them to do the salute needs to be hauled into a police station and the kids need to take a trip to a Holocaust memorial.

The boys that followed me in school aren't evil racists today, but they live sheltered lives in an affluent city where the dominant race is white Christians who make over $100k a year. They don't have a clue.

 

[Teelie]

Six years ago...same school...

When Austin Smothers and a few others recently decided to place Confederate flags on their pickup trucks to honor the death of a friend, they also raised a few eyebrows.

“We never meant it to be a racist thing to anybody,” said Smothers, a Baraboo High School junior. “We wanted to honor our friend, Joshua Blum, who had just died. We wanted to show we cared for him.”

Blum died Feb. 20 in a crash after the pickup he was driving overturned in Marquette County. Blum’s father, Tim, said his son didn’t wear his seat belt and that’s what killed him. However, a passenger in the truck wore a seat belt and survived.

Smothers said he and the others at Baraboo High School often drove their trucks around the city with the Confederate flag waving in the back.

Wiscnews - Use of Confederate flag as memorial questioned

It's Wisconsin. Where the hell do they get "Confederate flag" at as an acceptable memorial? They are literally the Northern part of the country. They were anti-slavery on top of that.

Politics in early Wisconsin were defined by the greater national debate over slavery. A free state from its foundation, Wisconsin became a center of northern abolitionism. The debate became especially intense in 1854 after Joshua Glover, a runaway slave from Missouri, was captured in Racine. Glover was taken into custody under the Federal Fugitive Slave Law, but a mob of abolitionists stormed the prison where Glover was held and helped him escape to Canada. In a trial stemming from the incident, the Wisconsin Supreme Court ultimately declared the Fugitive Slave Law unconstitutional.[39] The Republican Party, founded on March 20, 1854, by anti-slavery expansion activists in Ripon, Wisconsin, grew to dominate state politics in the aftermath of these events.[40] During the Civil War, around 91,000 troops from Wisconsin fought for the Union.[41]

Wikipedia

 

[MagnarTheGreat]

Indigenous women coerced into sterilizations across Canada: senator | CBC News

 

[THORin]

Indigenous women coerced into sterilizations across Canada: senator | CBC News

Oh god...just when I think the news can't get much worse, it does.

 

[RockSP]

It's Wisconsin. Where the hell do they get "Confederate flag" at as an acceptable memorial? They are literally the Northern part of the country. They were anti-slavery on top of that.

Just because someone is from up north doesn't mean they aren't racist.

 

[Teelie]

Not what I meant. I meant that of all the states that might have some claim over the flag, one from the abolitionist north is the least one to do so. They can't claim "southern pride" or any kind of historical ties to it, which even then it would not hold much water.