Discussion: Torture II

[Paradoxium]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...d-to-bin-laden/2011/05/02/AFHjfCZF_story.html

So it looks like the Osama intel thread came from torture, Cheney style. Just shortly before Obama shut it down.

Are you eating crow now?

Always backed this up?

Against it, despite all that has happened?

Against it for when it is not "my party", and for it when "my party" is using it?

 

[Paradoxium]

Here are the people/media against these blacksites. The same type of blacksites that procured the intel on the courier.

Was the price worth it?

 

[Thread Manager]

This is a continuation thread, the old thread is [split]297605[/split]

 

[Handsome Rob]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...d-to-bin-laden/2011/05/02/AFHjfCZF_story.html

So it looks like the Osama intel thread came from torture, Cheney style. Just shortly before Obama shut it down.

Are you eating crow now?

Always backed this up?

Against it, despite all that has happened?

Against it for when it is not "my party", and for it when "my party" is using it?

I read about this earlier. Interesting stuff. The same people symbolically high-fiving Obama for Osama's death tended to harshly criticize Bush/Cheney for "enhanced interrogation techniques" and suggest that they even be brought up for war crimes over it.

Yet, Obama's "victory" is due in part to these enhanced interrogation techniques.

I suspect you won't hear much from these people about this. They'll most likely just ignore where the intel came from. Sometimes, reality bites. t:

EDIT: I loathe you, Thread Manager.

 

[Paradoxium]

Dammmit MMAAAARXXXX YOU MERGED MY THREAD ON THE LAST POST

 

[Kelly]

Well, I don't like torture....but when things like this come out of it.....makes it hard to say bad...bad....thing.

 

[Paradoxium]

I see it this way.

Billions to trillions, 10 years, thousands of troops dead or handicapped for life, and compromising a slew of principles such as torture.... for one man? Hiding in ****ing plain sight. In totality of it all... You get an iota of catharsis. But is the price worth it? Will it even matter in practical terms.

If you ask me? No. It was ultimately Pyrrhic.

 

[Kelly]

Well, had we planned it right....we could have done this a long time ago....HOW YOU ASK?

DON'T TELL THE OTHER GOVERNMENT WHAT YOU ARE DOING IF YOU CAN'T TRUST THEM....and just do it.

 

[danoyse]

As soon as I heard they got the intel from Gitmo detainee, I figured that's how they got it.

It's like there's no right or wrong answer. Something good came out of it, but will there be a price for it in the end? Who knows. It's just messed up all around.

 

[samsnee]

Actually...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110502/ap_on_re_us/us_bin_laden_hunt_for_bin_laden

Mohammed did not reveal the names while being subjected to the simulated drowning technique known as waterboarding, former officials said. He identified them many months later under standard interrogation, they said, leaving it once again up for debate as to whether the harsh technique was a valuable tool or an unnecessarily violent tactic.

 

[DeaDheaD]

heard the term "advanced interrogation" today

 

[TomPiltoff]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...d-to-bin-laden/2011/05/02/AFHjfCZF_story.html

So it looks like the Osama intel thread came from torture, Cheney style. Just shortly before Obama shut it down.

Or not
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/05/02/972427/-Waterboarding-did-not-reveal-Osama-bin-Laden-trail

And for the record, torture is not effective.

http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/features/2008/08/hitchens200808