Elder Scrolls V - Part 3

[Spidey-Bat]

Yeah I've dismissed them. And it very much is clutter. It's not useful information if you don't want it all the time. In both cases, the information is there but in the new UI, the information is all there on the default page. I prefer to not have to both with excess information if it's not necessary. If I want to know how much a piece of armour weighs I'll choose to go to armour.

You make it sound like the information is just thrown all around the screen. It's organized into columns which you can sort into ascending or descending. If you don't need it, then you just don't need to look at it, it doesn't replace any information that wasn't already there. It takes up the same amount of screen space as the default menu but uses that space to provide you more useful information instead of just empty space. What do you when you want to compare weights of armors or weapons to decide which to drop? Gotta scroll to each one, remember it, and compare. How is that more efficient than just sorting the entire list by weight?

Keep making up these reasons why the default is better on the PC, they're becoming quite hilarious.

 

[Master Chief]

You're drawing comparisons that don't apply to inventory management in videogames. User interfaces should be quick and easy to use so players can do what they need to as fast as possible and continue with playing the game. The default menus are functional but they're far from ideal; This is coming from a console gamer.

 

[Wolvieboy17]

Where have I said, ever, that the default is better on the PC the this UI? I have not. I'm merely defending the notion that the default is this terrible crime against quality that Bethesda seems to have committed. Frankly I don't care which way you prefer it, whatever works for you. But like I've said, MANY times now, calling Bethesda lazy and incompetent on the basis of that menu alone is just ridiculous. It's petty, nitpicky and entitled. The moment anyone starts lording over about the money and facilities developers get in order to try and justify why they have failed their duty is the moment someone outs themselves as a f***ing idiot.

 

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

Where have I said, ever, that the default is better on the PC the this UI?

Wow, smaller fonts AND much, much, much more clutter? What an improvement!.

You didn't say it but you clearly implied it

I'm merely defending the notion that the default is this terrible crime against quality that Bethesda seems to have committed.

Thats exactly what it is. The UI in Oblivion and Fallout 3 is one of the largest complaints. This UI is even worse.

Frankly I don't care which way you prefer it

Well yea, you do. This entire adagio for strings argument came specifically from you caring, without actually being asked, mentioned or anything really. It was pretty much a knee jerk responce to the pc being really, really awsome. Really good.

But like I've said, MANY times now, calling Bethesda lazy and incompetent on the basis of that menu alone is just ridiculous.

It's also buggy as hell. Like every other Bethesda game. Unbalanced too.

he moment anyone starts lording over about the money and facilities developers get in order to try and justify why they have failed their duty is the moment someone outs themselves as a f***ing idiot.

Son, that's not nice.

 

[Wolvieboy17]

I stand by everything you quoted there. And Spock, you should know by now I don't have contempt for the PC, mainly just you. I believe that people can play or like or watch or read or think or believe whatever the hell they want to in life, it's only when they try and force that on others that I get the ****s, and you my friend are one big culprit of just that behaviour.

Of all these hundreds of over privileged devs that worked on Skyrim, I'd be interested Spock if you could show me just one mid-level employee who earns an unreasonable amount of money for the hours they put into their games. Do you even have any basis of knowledge for those things or do you just spout off?

And I stand by that last comment. If you honestly think of developers like Bethesda in that way, then you are a fool with some kind of bizarre unjustified chip on your shoulder.

 

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

I stand by everything you quoted there. And Spock, you should know by now I don't have contempt for the PC, mainly just you

I actually didn't know this. It's quite the Shakespearean revelation.

 

[Tanin]

I just got Skyrim for the PC today. As for the UI? With my disability I am very happy they allowed the controller UI on the PC.

So I get exactly what I want. The controls I can use one handed and the Graphics capability of my PC rig ^_^

 

[Spider-Who?]

I checked out the redesigned UI from the previous page. I can see why PC gamers prefer it, since it acts very much like a PC Window with list/details turned on. However, for me, I find the implementation of it to be (from a graphic design standpoint) pretty mediocre. It's painful to look at. Text is way too small. It's too much information at once, and the info is pretty redundant since all the item's info is displayed twice on each side of the screen. And it still doesn't fix the problem the PC people have with having to scroll through lists of items, so I don't get why people are pleased with it in that regard. The only thing I like about the revision is the ability to search. The default is a far cleaner, easier UI to look at, I think.

 

[Spidey-Bat]

I checked out the redesigned UI from the previous page. I can see why PC gamers prefer it, since it acts very much like a PC Window with list/details turned on. However, for me, I find the implementation of it to be (from a graphic design standpoint) pretty mediocre. It's painful to look at. Text is way too small. It's too much information at once, and the info is pretty redundant since all the item's info is displayed twice on each side of the screen. And it still doesn't fix the problem the PC people have with having to scroll through lists of items, so I don't get why people are pleased with it in that regard. The only thing I like about the revision is the ability to search. The default is a far cleaner, easier UI to look at, I think.

That's not the issue. It's having to scroll through the categories when you first open the menu. Now you can just click the category at the top. There's also less scrolling through the item list since more of them are displayed at once.

 

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

I checked out the redesigned UI from the previous page. I can see why PC gamers prefer it, since it acts very much like a PC Window with list/details turned on. However, for me, I find the implementation of it to be (from a graphic design standpoint) pretty mediocre. It's painful to look at. Text is way too small. It's too much information at once, and the info is pretty redundant since all the item's info is displayed twice on each side of the screen. And it still doesn't fix the problem the PC people have with having to scroll through lists of items, so I don't get why people are pleased with it in that regard. The only thing I like about the revision is the ability to search. The default is a far cleaner, easier UI to look at, I think.

Trying too hard.

 

[Spider-Who?]

What's trying to hard?

 

[DBryan]

Well I was gonna post a pretty detailed post in response to Spock's claim that Bethesda are lazy.

I was gonna talk about the thousands of lines of dialogue, the large number of unique NPCs, the hundreds of missions, the potential for unique playthroughs, the fact that I've spent 120 plus hours on one single character on Fallout 3 and still haven't finished all of the quests and that game, years later, still provides surprises for me. All this, and much much more.

The games have bugs because they have so much content. They release patches in a timely manner. Bethesda are not just open to the mod community but release things to actively help the mod community.

There is no legitimate argument for Bethesda being lazy.

But obviously Spock is trolling.

So there's no point.

 

[Speedball]

What's trying to hard?

Spock is trying too hard to troll.

 

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

There is no legitimate argument for Bethesda being lazy.

Generally speaking, this post comes across as me as more defending Bethesda for the sake of defending Bethesda. If there wasn't legitimate arguments for lazyness and/or incompetence , the UI would not be universally panned by critics and fans across the board. this conversation and indeed the discussion created by wolv (or wolf, or whatever) would not exist because no one would be arguing with him. It is reoccurring and obvious. Once again, like Fallout 3 and Oblivion before it, it has been users fixing what should have been fixed from the start. Bugs aren't an excuse either, this is also re-occurring and a patch implemented worsened the problem for some.

I'm not going to engage in this troll nonsense as it is now a tagline to engage in internet hate to attack the person rather than there opinions. Speedball contribution to the thread essentially amount to "I don't like you" That's great, but it doesn't have much to do with Skyrim.

 

[Spider-Who?]

…says the guy whose response to a simple and peaceful opinion (that you didn’t like) was “Trying too hard”.

 

[Speedball]

I haven't seen people complaining about the UI anywhere but on this board and a few others. All the reviews that I read praised the UI, for being simple to use and getting the job done, and not being overly complicated like it was in Oblivion.
You say these things, but do you have the evidence to back this up?

 

[Soapy]

I really don't understand how you can call Bethesda lazy.

They worked for three years on a wildly ambitious game that has so much more going on, with more content than the vast majority of other games out there by at least an order of magnitude. Their DLC tends to be much more substantial than what nearly every other developer releases. They don't engage in that preorder/retailer specific bonus DLC bull****. They put out lots of patches. They go out of their way to support the mod community.

But oh wait, Spock doesn't like their UI. I guess they're lazy.

 

[DBryan]

I'm not a huge fan of the menu system either. Particularly after you buy a home and start putting lots of things in a chest, its not easy to navigate through all that stuff.

But by and large its not a huge issue.

The perfect game does not exist.

 

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

…says the guy whose response to a simple and peaceful opinion (that you didn’t like) was “Trying too hard”.

It seemed pretty obvious to me that, that post wasn't motivated by objectivity in the slightest. More a hand slapping clan mentality. It's just my opinion here, but I just disregarded that post completely. As I did with your post a few weeks back regarding the child killing mod in which you were really offended which helped form my opinion on that posts crediblity.

Anyways, here is an anime person. Apparently people like anime, I don't know why. But, there it is. Someone done it.


http://kotaku.com/5869227/final-fantasy-xiiis-lightning-strikes-skyrim/gallery/1

 

[DBryan]

I really don't understand how you can call Bethesda lazy.

They worked for three years on a wildly ambitious game that has so much more going on, with more content than the vast majority of other games out there by at least an order of magnitude. Their DLC tends to be much more substantial than what nearly every other developer releases. They don't engage in that preorder/retailer specific bonus DLC bull****. They put out lots of patches. They go out of their way to support the mod community.

But oh wait, Spock doesn't like their UI. I guess they're lazy.

Exactly.

Took the words right out of my mouth.

There are dozens of games, heck, hundreds of games released every year that are mediocre, thin on content, that contain way more examples of lazy game making.

 

[Speedball]

FF =/= Anime

And you go on and on about the PC being superior, then try to shove it down our throats when we disagree. You like the PC as a gaming platform, we understand. That doesn't mean that console gamers, who might not have enough money to buy a decent gaming PC, are worth any less than PC gamers.

 

[Spider-Who?]

It seemed pretty obvious to me that, that post wasn't motivated by objectivity in the slightest. More a hand slapping clan mentality. It's just my opinion here, but I just disregarded that post completely.

Wow. I couldn't care less what the "clan mentality" is. There was total objectivity in my post. If you cared to actually READ it, you would have seen that I said I understand why PC people prefer the revised version and I even listed something that I LIKED about the new UI. I didn't insult anyone or their views. I stated what I liked and what I didn't like. If that isn't objective, I don't know what is. But I guess its not in your eyes because my post wasn't patting you on the back and saying "you're 100% right!"

As I did with your post a few weeks back regarding the child killing mod in which you were really offended which helped form my opinion on that posts crediblity.

So, because I expressed distaste with your feelings toward killing children in a video game, that makes my views uncredible? Congratulations. You're getting reported.

 

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

They worked for three years on a wildly ambitious game

with more content than the vast majority of other games

Great. How about the basic absolute fundamentals?
You know, before Da Vinci painted the Mona Lisa and he done preliminarily sketches and other basic stuff before creating his grand wonderul picture. Why?

Common sense.

That was one guy. Bethesda is a studio with hundreds of guys. That fixed UI, was most likely, one guy.

Their DLC tends to be much more substantial than what nearly every other developer releases. .

Whats content that doesn't exist yet have to do with... anything?

They don't engage in that preorder/retailer specific bonus DLC bull****.

Yea they do. They had a specific sale allowing you to get a Team Fortress 2 hat for pre-ordering.

They put out lots of patches.

So do most games. Alot of them more stable than Bethesda games at launch.

But oh wait, Spock doesn't like their UI. I guess they're lazy.

I am not some single minority entity I'm sorry, that is not that case. As soon as the game was released, practically everyone, fans and critics alike, pointed out the UI as flawed. I'm also not the only person here who takes issue with it. So don't pin this specifically on me as whining for the sake of it. That is not the reality.

In fact, if I recall correctly, I specifically stated, months in advance, that the game would be buggy and consolized. I recall saying Dragon Age would also suffer the same fate. Everyone raged. But guess what? I was right. Happens alot.

 

[DBryan]

I mean, I defended you earlier in the thread when you were talking about mods, but right now? You're OBVIOUSLY trolling. It's boring.

 

[Spidey-Bat]

I haven't seen people complaining about the UI anywhere but on this board and a few others. All the reviews that I read praised the UI, for being simple to use and getting the job done, and not being overly complicated like it was in Oblivion.
You say these things, but do you have the evidence to back this up?

If they were reviewing the console, of course that will be the case. The UI was designed for using it with a gamepad. But it is not good when you're using a mouse and keyboard.