Episode 01/08 "A Mad Tea-Party"

Discussion in 'Batwoman' started by Dr., Nov 12, 2019.

  1. Dr. From parts unknown

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    After episode 7 - “Tell Me the Truth” - Batwoman takes a two-week break (or runs repeats).

    Episode 8 - “A Mad Tea-Party” - is scheduled for December 1, 2019.

    Synopsis:

    AND THE AWARD GOES TO – Kate (Ruby Rose) and Alice (Rachel Skarsten) continue their sister/nemesis dance, while Alice and Mouse (guest star Sam Littlefield) construct their most evil plan yet. Mary (Nicole Kang) invites Kate to a special event honoring Catherine (Elizabeth Anweis) and Jacob (Dougray Scott) makes a decision that leaves Kate perplexed. Meagan Tandy and Camrus Johnson also star. Holly Dale directed the episode written by Nancy Kiu (#109).
     
    #1 Dr., Nov 12, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2019
  2. Dr. From parts unknown

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    Promo:

     
  3. Thome216 Registered

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    And the winner is... Alice!! Clearly the victor of this episode who has played everyone like a fiddle, and has won by burning just about every bridge behind her. I'm sure there will be a few more tries to reason with her, but the days of casually walking into each other hideouts is probably over.
     
  4. vantheman77 Superman Fan 4 Life

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    Masterful midseason finale that shows why Alice is Batwoman’s arch enemy.
     
  5. Slick Yup

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    This was a really great mid-season finale. Some tragic developments.
     
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  6. DarthSkywalker May the Force Be With You

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    This episode shows exactly why this is the most CW show possible and why it is a really crappy version of Batwoman imo.

    I understand the use of the CW formula and tropes. I get why this has led to characters having little in common with their source material. But this has gone to far at this point. Alice should be legit, break from reality, crazy. She was legitimately transformed by her own personal protection from the trauma she had to live through. When Beth comes through it is fleeting and something that would take years of help to ever truly bring back out. At first I thought she was just a low rent Harley knock off, but it is much worse then that. Instead they seem to be playing her like she is Kylo Ren. There is still good in her, even as she is purposely doing evil thing after evil thing, while fully aware she is doing it. When she started yelling about being in a cell for years, it reminded me of the issue with this interpretation. Beth and Alice aren’t two different people, it’s the same person. Just like ole Ben and Kylo. Alice is the excuse, for what Beth wants to do. And now Kate is all up for murdering her. The least Kate thing ever. It's going to make their eventually reconciliation the worst thing possible.

    To me, it is no wonder this show has lost basically half of it's live viewers at this point.
     
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  7. Joined:
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    The best thing about this episode is the little Crisis thing they tagged on at the end. Tom Cavanaugh's appearance was a nice reminder that this universe can do solid, well-acted villains. Just not on this show, apparently. It's weird that Alice is the main plot of the show, and yet every time she shows up, the show feels at it's most monotonous and repetitive. The best episode, and I wouldn't call it good, is the executioner episode and it's largely because it's not about her. The direction they've taken with her is flat and it doesn't feel like they really have an idea what to do with her between the big moments.

    The way they've handled her doesn't just hurt her though, it hurts Kate. The end of this episode just drives home that this character only cares when it effects her personally. Alice can kill all the people she wants, and Kate will casually walk into her lair multiple times an episode and constantly just let her escape. But this episode, she suddenly cares. Not because she killed someone, but, as the voice over makes explicit, because it broke up her family again. It makes her self-centered in a way that's irritating the watch.

    Catherine's death is one of the better acted moments of the show largely because it doesn't involve Kate, Jacob or Alice, but it doesn't really leave any impact. I don't know who this character is, and her dynamic with everyone seemed poorly defined to the point I couldn't tell for several episodes if she and Jacob were still together. I don't even know what her relationship with Kate is, which makes the comments about wanting to protect her feel weird. They shared, what, two scenes? Changing Jacob lying to Kate about Beth being dead to it being Catherine now feels especially pointless. All it really fueled was a half-hearted divorce subplot. It's just another instance of them taking dramatic material and finding a way to undercut it so it no longer lands with the weight it should have.
     
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  8. DarthSkywalker May the Force Be With You

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    I thought step sister's acting was strangely on point considering how they have had her up to this point. It was like a different show. But outside of that... yeah.

    It blows my mind how much they CW'ed this show. I mean I get it, I shouldn't expect Watchmen, The Boys, Daredevil, Punisher, Doom Patrol, Legion, or Jessica Jones. But come on. This is just Arrow 2.0. A Batman wannabe show, with a bunch of characters ripped of their personalities to make it as bland as possible. Also the show is just so ugly. Hard to see at times.
     
    #8 DarthSkywalker, Dec 2, 2019
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2019
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  9. Joined:
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    I think that's a fair comparison for the Beth stuff. Alice has never really been a separate personality, nor does it feel like she broke. She's explicitly out for revenge against people she perceives as having wronged her, and happy to kill anyone who gets in the way. It makes it harder to have her rehabilitated at all, because it really doesn't feel like there's anything more to her despite how often they tell me so. I feel like, this being the CW which loves to add more heroes with every season, they're going to do the thing from Andreyko's run where she becomes a hero in later seasons if they get far enough. And if they attempt that, on this foundation, I can't see that working. It really didn't work for me there either but at least the foundations were different enough and she wasn't just lashing out at people who she feels wronged by under a different name.
     
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  10. Dr. From parts unknown

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    Yeah, the Kate/Alice interactions have been somewhat bewildering (if not frustrating). It’s too bad these couldn’t be contrived as, as it were, stalemates. I.e., the dialogue between them could still take place - yet it would be obvious (due to the particulars of the scenario) why Kate didn’t have the upper hand and couldn’t subdue or capture Alice. But as presented, it seems Kate has had several opportunities to physically stop her sister (or at least try) and chooses not to.

    It’s somewhat comparable to the current Kara/Lena conflict on Supergirl. Lena is acting in ways that don’t merit much sympathy. Yet, the hero is determined to see the good within her. (The standard villain redemption arc.) Though, to be honest, I don’t exactly know what’s going on over at Supergirl.

    A better comparison might be Buffy vs. (evil) Angelus. Even though Angelus was responsible for several murders, Buffy still thought he could be saved. It was only when someone close was killed (Jenny) that Buffy decided no redemption was possible. And I guess Batwoman is following a similar template. :shrug:
     
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  11. Thome216 Registered

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    She's trying to save her sister, and yes she was hoping there was some of the old Beth left within her, but as stated above, sometimes it takes a personal hit to really convince someone to take off the kid gloves.

    Sadly, no, this is not the comic interpretation, but for what it is it is still good, in my opinion.
     
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  12. Frodo Registered

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    I think it was a solid episode overall. If anything, I think Alice's character should have taken out more characters than just her stepmom.

    Had she also killed the Stepmom,her Father, Sophie's BF, I think there would be a much greater emotional impact on Kate and truly magnify her choice to not deal with Alice.

    That then puts her at odds with not only her step sister, but Sophie herself, in addition to her own guilt for letting Alice take out their father.

    In addition to being alienated, carrying that type of heavy burden would make her character more interesting imo and could shape who she is as a hero going forward.

    I don't know the comics but from a storytelling standpoint, I think Alice really unleashed and wiping out half of the supporting cast could serve as an interesting turning point for not only Kate's view of her sister but force her to have to question her own judgment.

    That said, putting aside the shoulda , coulda, woulda, type stuff , I think this episode was among one of the better ones so far .
     
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  13. Thome216 Registered

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    But that is almost all of the supporting cast- Oh, I get it! ;)
     
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  14. Lencho01 Shazoogle! Shazoogle!

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    Best episode so far for me.
     

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