Skeleton Crew Episode 1 & 2 (Spoiler Thread)

[Ninjablade]

 

[Weather Witch]

Ahsoka, why do you look the way you do?

A smaller budget with $4.5M less per episode and a longer run time. Ahsoka has the lowest budget per episode of any live-action Star Wars show, but also the longest runtime (excluding Andor). Its budget at $100M is only slightly higher than Obi-Wan's $90M, but with two more episodes (95 minutes of additional run time).

Dave Filoni did a lot with (comparatively) very little.

 

[Slick]

Wim’s Dad real job.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

A smaller budget with $4.5M less per episode and a longer run time. Ahsoka has the lowest budget per episode of any live-action Star Wars show, but also the longest runtime (excluding Andor). Its budget at $100M is only slightly higher than Obi-Wan's $90M, but with two more episodes (95 minutes of additional run time).

Dave Filoni did a lot with (comparatively) very little.

Budget can lead to issues. Obi-Wan is a fine example. But Chow still shot the hell out of it. Even with the flat backgrounds and corridors. And while I don't think it should've existed in the form it did (or at all) she got a lot of out of it, if you ignore episode 2.

Ahsoka's issues when it comes to look, are a combination of poor craftsmanship and bad showrunning. The directing, cinematography, editing, and action choreography are not super beholden to the budget. I've seen cheaper movies/shows far better shot and edited. Dr. Who is one of my favs. Mando has a similar budget, and their best looking episode is one shot on the side of a hill, watching old man Boba wreck people. You can argue the makeup being horrific is a straight budget issue (I wouldn't) but just how bad it looks is down to how the show is shot and color graded. And who signed off on those contacts? Did Filoni really think people would care if Ahsoka, Hera, and Aladdin had their normal eye colors as opposed to extremely distracting fake looking shades? GOT didn't give Dany her violet eyes and looked better for it.

Bringing up the length of a show, where so little happens, is an error of the showrunner again, who happened to also write the thing. There is a good two hours at least that do not need to exist. And he was at least in part responsible for who he hired to direct and shoot it.

This is Watts first showrunner job, and he's shown a far more adept hand then Filoni has in live action. The first episode was a big one, but the second felt like it had a lot of movement, even as the vast majority took place on a set they will get a lot of use out of (the ship) and a small little port. The benefits of good writing and strong directing. Smoke and mirrors, smoke and mirrors to optimism that budget. Even super expensive beautiful Andor does that.

 

[Weather Witch]

and their best looking episode is one shot on the side of a hill, watching old man Boba wreck people. You can argue the makeup being horrific is a straight budget issue (I wouldn't) but just how bad it looks is down to how the show is shot and color graded

This is great example that shows a lot of this is incredibly subjective. The Believer is one of my least favorite Mandalorian episodes and I'm on record saying I think it looks like a fan film. Genuinely did not understand people praising it when it came out. Different folks and all that.

The directing, cinematography, editing, and action choreography are not super beholden to the budget.

It plays a role though. That additional $36M does allow for a lot more flexibility. You're not wrong that more money isn't some kind of magical fix though. Secret Invasion says hi. That show had about 3 times Ahsoka's budget per episode and looks infinitely worse.

This is Watts first showrunner job, and he's shown a far more adept hand then Filoni has in live action.

Now, that part I won't argue. Watts has a proven track record with his Spider-Man trilogy. I'm also not saying that the Ahsoka series is perfect by any means. Just think it gets a lot of undeserved flack. It's still up there as some of my favorite Star Wars of all time, but of course, that too is incredibly subjective.

Don't want to derail this thread too much though. Probably shouldn't have taken the bait, but can't help myself.
Happy you're enjoying Skeleton Crew and I'm having a great time with it too!

At Attin and that whole mystery is a very clever hook (and works well for viewers not as familiar with Star Wars).

 

[Sithborg]

I think the big problem is that Filoni started live action experience with the Volume. The Volume is a great tool, but it has limitations. And you need experience outside of the Volume to help work it best. And lets be honest here, Favreau has never been a great visual director, so THAT influence is not going to help. I think the Barrier alone is a good sign they recognize the limitations of it. Dark skies is a problem area for it. But add a sky covered in bright glowing green effects, suddenly, you can mask that deficit.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

@Sithborg and I with a special appearance by the rest of the boards:

 

[Weather Witch]

I think the big problem is that Filoni started live action experience with the Volume. The Volume is a great tool, but it has limitations. And you need experience outside of the Volume to help work it best. And lets be honest here, Favreau has never been a great visual director, so THAT influence is not going to help. I think the Barrier alone is a good sign they recognize the limitations of it. Dark skies is a problem area for it. But add a sky covered in bright glowing green effects, suddenly, you can mask that deficit.

I don't disagree that they need to move away from the volume more. Book of Boba Fett is really where those limitations showed the most. Though, Ahsoka has more scenes not filmed on the volume than people realize. Quite a chunk of Peridea wasn't on the volume. Still a lot of green/blue screen obviously.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I think the big problem is that Filoni started live action experience with the Volume. The Volume is a great tool, but it has limitations. And you need experience outside of the Volume to help work it best. And lets be honest here, Favreau has never been a great visual director, so THAT influence is not going to help. I think the Barrier alone is a good sign they recognize the limitations of it. Dark skies is a problem area for it. But add a sky covered in bright glowing green effects, suddenly, you can mask that deficit.

That's an issue for backgrounds and general spacing. That really doesn't explain much else. There are so many scenes where the characters are just standing next to each other, like they're taking behind the scenes footage. It's honestly shocking.

And the action is just so, oof. No joke, the kids play fighting is shot better then any fight on Ahsoka.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

This is great example that shows a lot of this is incredibly subjective. The Believer is one of my least favorite Mandalorian episodes and I'm on record saying I think it looks like a fan film. Genuinely did not understand people praising it when it came out. Different folks and all that.

What makes it look like a fan film to you? Is it the location? Because my point is that no matter the location, you can still direct the hell out of it. You could film a lightsaber fight in a parking lot. It won't look like it's in SW, but that wouldn't mean you didn't shoot it well.

IMO the praising comes from how RR establishes characters through his camera work. With Din he shoots him like he's Blondie. With Fennec, a hitman. With Boba, he's the Predator. It leads to a dynamism in the characters and the action that you just haven't seen in other Star Wars shows, outside of certain moments in the forest fight on Acolyte.

It plays a role though. That additional $36M does allow for a lot more flexibility. You're not wrong that more money isn't some kind of magical fix though. Secret Invasion says hi. That show had about 3 times Ahsoka's budget per episode and looks infinitely worse.

Secret Invasion and Ahsoka are comparable in the looks department.

Now, that part I won't argue. Watts has a proven track record with his Spider-Man trilogy. I'm also not saying that the Ahsoka series is perfect by any means. Just think it gets a lot of undeserved flack. It's still up there as some of my favorite Star Wars of all time, but of course, that too is incredibly subjective.

Don't want to derail this thread too much though. Probably shouldn't have taken the bait, but can't help myself.
Happy you're enjoying Skeleton Crew and I'm having a great time with it too!

At Attin and that whole mystery is a very clever hook (and works well for viewers not as familiar with Star Wars).

I find Ahsoka is some of the absolute worst canon Star Wars. Which sucks for someone who was a TCW and Rebels truther from the start.

I don't disagree that they need to move away from the volume more. Book of Boba Fett is really where those limitations showed the most. Though, Ahsoka has more scenes not filmed on the volume than people realize. Quite a chunk of Peridea wasn't on the volume. Still a lot of green/blue screen obviously.

That people think all of Ahsoka is filmed on the Volume says what about Ahsoka?

 

[Weather Witch]

Mobile not allowing me to properly quote. Regarding The Believer my main gripes are (spoiler to not derail this thread too much).

Spoiler

Yes, the location is a part of it, but the lighting even more so. Incredibly slow and clunky dark troopers. The nonsense with Mando taking off the jetpack, so he can run up the hill instead. Especially painful since the episode starts with reminding us he has one. Some janky shots with the stormtroopers that almost seem sped-up in post. The CGI boulder that literally despawns with a bit of dust. Very repetitive shots with Grogu. There were just a lot of moments that took me out of it.

I will say most of the stuff with Fennec was really solid though. The main action beats with Boba also mostly hit. As a whole the episode just felt more artificial than the rest of the season to me. Which is ironic given the use of a real location.

I'll just agree to disagree on Ahsoka. Sorry to hear you didn't like it though!

 

[KaijuDude1992]

Only two episodes in and this is already the best SW Disney Plus thing to come out since Andor IMO. I am honestly surprised by how great this is so far after being so lukewarm/underwhelm by the trailers.

I'm pretty much invested in this little group of kids and the journey they are going on and man does it feel good to watch a SW show again that actually looks and feels very cinematic.

The Space Pirate stuff is really cool and interesting in the context of this universe, and I can definitely see the 80's Amblin/Spielberg influence being a unique, refreshing perspective.

Can't wait to see what they do with Jude Law's character as well.

 

[Still Wynning]

Regarding the whole Filoni and Watts of it all, Jon Watts is just a much better filmmaker than Filoni. It’s just that simple.

To elaborate, Filoni is a long form storyteller that’s primarily worked in animation and succeeded due to collaboration with other creatives to compensate for his weaknesses as a writer, but, with the move to live-action, which is a different format with less runtime, requires different directing sensibilities and contains a lot of uncontrollable variables you don’t get with animation, and role as creative chief officer, where he can have full creative control over project without anyone else’s input or constructive criticism, his weaknesses as a writer and inexperience working on live action projects have become more and more apparent. He is a lot like his mentor in that regard, and has unfortunately succumbed to a lot of the same issues that George did when working on the prequel trilogy. What we’ve seen from him so far is what we would get unfiltered and unrestrained, and it’s not great.

Watts, on the other hand, works in live action films, has several films under his belt, knows how the filmmaking process works, is great at directing people, particularly child actors, and collaborates with other writers and/or directors to let them have their input and creative voices be heard to make something the best it can be. We are, within reason, seeing how good of a filmmaker he can be without the constraints, guard rails and mandates of a cinematic universe like the MCU. Yes, Star Wars is another cinematic universe, but there is a lot more room for being able to do your own thing and bring your own voice and style without having to step on anyone else’s toes.

To put it into perspective, if Jon Watts were to go do his own thing, he would absolutely thrive, because that’s his playground. If Dave Filoni, with what we’ve seen him do, were to be put in the same position, he would absolutely flounder.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

 

[Drizzle]

Late to the party but I just caught up with the first two episodes and I'm really enjoying it. I haven't been this immediately invested in a Star Wars series since Andor. Actually, any Disney+ series since then besides X-Men '97 really. The characters and premise are a lot of fun. This is one time where I wouldn't have minded if they dropped all the episodes at once.

I also don't want to believe that Neel isn't a kid version of Max Rebo's species.

 

[Kane52630]

 

[DarthSkywalker]

It's me and @Sithborg !