Fear the Walking Dead Fear the Walking Dead General Discussion Thread - Part 1

[Docker2.0]

Some of the decisions these guys make!

 

[rashad]

What in the actual F!?!?!

Spoiler

[BLACKOUT]http://ew.com/tv/2018/04/29/fear-the-walking-dead-nick-frank-dillane-showrunners/[/BLACKOUT]

 

[Travesty]

Why didn’t he just turn off the horn?

Jesus...,

 

[squeekness]

Got rid of the last character I gave a crap about? I'm out.

 

[X-Ray]

Did that just really happened? Wow.

 

[Docker2.0]

It almost seems like an unnecessary kill. I mean, it kind of makes no sense at all. But whatever.

 

[BestGirl]

That episode was extraordinarily boring outside of the unexpected death. I don't think I'll bother to watch next week, or return to the show until Gimple's off it.

 

[Travesty]

It almost seems like an unnecessary kill. I mean, it kind of makes no sense at all. But whatever.

Yeah, there was no proper build up or anything. It just...happened.

 

[Matt]

Yeah, there was no proper build up or anything. It just...happened.

I disagree. There was tons of buildup. But you're looking at it from the wrong perspective. There was no buildup with Nick because we haven't seen the buildup to his death yet (at least not all of it...we are still watching that story via flashback). What we saw last night was the end of Nick's story, but its sort of the middle of Morgan's (who is the main character of the narrative being told in the "present"). The Clarks' story is coming to an end. That is what this season represents. And the journey to their end is being told via flashback and its intersecting with the new story of FTWD, Morgan's. Morgan is the main character of the story line in the present. And there was plenty of buildup to Nick's death from his perspective. You just have to understand what Nick's role in Morgan's story was. Morgan failed to act, to guide Nick away from killing until it was too late, and in doing so, got Nick killed. Nick's death, in Morgan's story, is a device that gets Morgan to stop being isolated.

Think about their interaction, from beginning to end, Morgan met Nick and the others. Nick tried to get him to open up. Morgan refused on the grounds that when he gets close to someone, they die. And that mentality is the reason Nick is dead. By being closed off to avoid causing death, Morgan caused Nick's death. That's the story and the buildup is there.

After meeting, Morgan quickly realized that Nick was looking for guidance and peace after having experienced some sort of trauma (we still don't know what that is as we are still in the middle of Nick's story in the past, but possibly Madison's death, though the jury is out on that). Nick, as Morgan once did, thinks he can find peace by killing the Vultures. Morgan, having been there, knows that the act of killing will bring no peace and have unintended consequences (as he warns Nick of in one of their earlier interactions). But because Morgan refuses to let people in, to shield himself from losing them, he does not guide Nick to the path to inner-peace until AFTER Nick killed the Vulture. Nick killing the Vulture led to a series of events where the little girl killed Nick. Now Morgan is left struggling with the fact that by being so closed off (which is, again, by Morgan's design a way to avoid losing people), he cost Nick his life. Had Morgan opened up to Nick and gave him the guidance he was seeking when Nick tried to talk to Morgan about the video, Nick may not have killed the Vulture and, in doing so, brought about his own death. Morgan's need to be detached cost Nick his life. Morgan is running from death of others. That is his story this season. But by running he has caused death.

Its actually one of the more coherent and well-developed themes that The Walking Dead-verse has had in awhile. We're putting increased importance on it because Nick, a main character in a different story from Morgan's, died. So it is the end of Nick's story. But its only the middle piece of Morgan's. As to Nick's story, its still ongoing in the sense that we haven't yet seen the events that led to his death (though we will). Nick's story is not being told in a linear manner. And that is making a lot of people feel like he got shafted. But its important to remember Nick's story isn't over. We haven't seen it yet. Last night was simply the viewer seeing the middle of Morgan's story, rather than the end of Nick's. Once we have the rest of the story, from Nick's perspective, I think his death will be a bit more of a fitting ending.

 

[Travesty]

Yeah, I disagree.

 

[Matt]

Yeah, I disagree.

I'm not really sure what you disagree on? You may feel its not the most effective way to tell the story, but, mechanically, it is clearly the intent of the writers. Ray Donovan did something similar, as has West World. Its becoming a common trope. You use the death of a major character as either an entry point, or a mid-way point of another's character's story and then show the dead character's story via flashback. You don't have to like the writers using this technique, but to say that it wasn't developed well when the story of what led to Nick's death clearly isn't complete is an unfair, and intellectually dishonest, criticism. Its the functional equivalent to me taking a bite out of a raw tomato and using that as a way to justify disliking spaghetti sauce.

 

[Travesty]

That it's well developed, and one of the best in TWD-verse.

 

[Matt]

That it's well developed, and one of the best in TWD-verse.

But it is, from the perspective of Morgan's story and development. We understand Morgan's motives, we understand what Nick represents (Nick is Morgan to Morgan's Eastman). We understand why Morgan is reluctant to be in the role of Eastman. That conflict is established, followed through, and given pay-off.

Point A: Morgan maintains emotional distance from everyone to avoid dealing with loss and death.

Point B: Morgan meets Nick.

Point C: Nick, a troubled character, having recently experience some sort of trauma (the nature of which is not yet clear to the viewer) and is seeking vengeance for it, tries to open up to Morgan and get some sort of guidance.

Point D: Morgan refuses to become to Nick what Eastman was to him.

Point E: Nick gets his opportunity for revenge.

Point F: Morgan cautions Nick against seeking revenge, due to the unintended consequences of violence, but due to Morgan's emotional distance, Nick does not take his words to heart.

Point G: Nick kills the Vulture and gets his revenge.

Point H: Morgan, realizing the err of his ways and seeing Nick in himself returns to accept his role as Nick's Eastman.

Point I: Morgan lets down his barriers and breaks through to Nick, much as Eastman broke through to Morgan.

Point J: Morgan did so too late and Nick's violent act of revenge, as Morgan predicted, simply resulted in the circle of violence continuing and Nick being killed by someone else seeking revenge.

Point K (presumably, if this story is followed through on): Morgan realizes that inaction (specifically, his inaction) can lead to violent and unintended results, just as revenge can.

Point L: Morgan grows as a character due to this realization and begins to form meaningful bonds again (with the remaining Clarks, Al, and Dorie).

Like I said, you don't have to find the story to be an effective one. But there is no denying that, in terms of Walking Dead storylines, this one has themes that are clearer than most and has a more natural progression than most. The actions of the characters and conflict between them is consistent with what we know about the characters and develops in a linear and rational manner. Its not like Walking Dead Prime where Daryl trusts Dwight, then doesn't for no greater reason than because the plot necessitates Tara forgiving Dwight and someone else doubting him to generate artificial conflict or Jesus switching from pacifist to "I am part of a conspiracy to kill Negan" simply because Maggie needs people on her side and he is the best positioned to be on her side.

 

[Travesty]

Yeah, I disagree.

 

[Matt]

Yeah, I disagree.

Yeah, I have a preconceived notion that is clearly not backed up by any factual basis, but I've already said it so, when presented with information to the contrary, rather than admit I may have been off-base or modify my argument to be a more coherent one, ("i.e. I understand what the writers were going for but feel that this story line does not work for reasons X, Y, and Z") I will simply double down, hold my breath, and insist that I am right despite my inability to articulate anything to the contrary, because on the internet being right is important and I can't let anyone think that I spoke in haste earlier.

Fixed.

 

[Man in the Suit]

Fear the Walking Dead actor explains why he asked off the show

I had been doing it for three or four years, the show has undergone many changes in terms of different people in charge, all of this stuff, and I just felt like the beginning of this season kind of felt like the end of an era with this show. And television is hard work, and you have to shoot a lot. I also missed Europe very much. I’m not American, so after a while I get quite homesick and all of those things. I also felt like we had achieved what needed to be achieved in the first few seasons, so I thought it was time to keep moving.

Gimple!

 

[Travesty]

lol, I'm on my phone, and don't feel like doing a 8 paragraph thesis to counter your opinions, all over the lame death on FTWD.

But thanks for putting words in my mouth, cause I don't agree with you. I can see you're taking this to heart. Classy

 

[Matt]

lol, I'm on my phone, and don't feel like doing a 8 paragraph thesis to counter your opinions, all over the lame death on FTWD.

But thanks for putting words in my mouth, cause I don't agree with you. I can see you're taking this to heart. Classy

Yet you took time to post four responses and find and post a GIF in the name of defending why you aren't defending your actual position. You'd think if there were a logical defense of your position, you'd simply defend your position rather than defending your refusal to say anything. But, its becoming clear that having the last word is really important to you (after all, if you think its such a waste of time to respond, you simply wouldn't respond instead of responding with a justification for your lack of a response). So go ahead junior, you can have the last word.

 

[Travesty]

Please tell me you're a real person.

 

[Drizzle]

I've always hated [BLACKOUT]Nick[/BLACKOUT], so I enjoyed watching him die.

 

[Matt]

I've always hated [BLACKOUT]Nick[/BLACKOUT], so I enjoyed watching him die.

Yeah, I didn't mind it either. The character has gone about as far as he can go. Nick farming at the baseball field gave me all kinds of Farmer Rick deja vu. All I could think was "here we go again, The Walking Dead is once again telling the story of someone who was violent, then peaceful, then becomes violent again, then peaceful again, and so on and so forth." We've just been there so many times. I much prefer to use his death as a catalyst to explore Morgan and how inaction can have consequence equal to action.

 

[Dugath]

Please tell me the reason he wanted to kill that guy so much is because he killed Madison. I want her to be gone. I like the new direction of the show so far.

 

[Docker2.0]

I hated Nick like most of the cast on this show but his death was like out of the blue with no build up. It's like the show is just so random right now. And the new bad guy is so stereotypical bad. I mean, he doesn't seem scary at all.

 

[Travesty]

I hated Nick like most of the cast on this show but his death was like out of the blue with no build up. It's like the show is just so random right now. And the new bad guy is so stereotypical bad. I mean, he doesn't seem scary at all.

Uh oh, watch out, Matt may write up a 12 page essay on why you’re “wrong”.

 

[KevTravels]

I kinda found Nick infuriating from episode 1. Unlike Alicia, he never won me over. A shock indeed though.