Fire vs Ice...Human Torch vs Ice Man??? Please...

I don't know who would win, that is something that has been debated for as long as they have been around. Torch can become a super nova, but I don't know how cold Ice man can get.

 

Back in the day, there was no 'movie wise'...

 

No matter how cold he get's, I don't think he can take a super nova.

 

I would normally say Draw, but now that Iceman is made of solid Ice, he'll just become a puddle.

 

Underestimating Bobby,

while Johnny can go nova (*ooohhh nova!*), this does take him a second to do so.
Bobby can control any liquid and cause it to freeze, like say... the capillaries in johnny's brain? kinda hard to go nova when you are suffering a major brain anuerism.
Or Bobby could flash freeze Johnny into a block of ice. Storm can't light up if there is no oxygen for him to combust with.
Or flash freeze Torch's lungs, they shatter the next time he contracts his diaphragm to breethe, *snap crackle pop*
Johnny is hyped and touted all the time, but Bobby is hardly ever used to the full extent of his powers...

 

http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showthread.php?t=167898&page=3

iceman won by a vote in my tournament

 

I think that at optimal conditions for both fighers Iceman would take it about nine out of ten times. He's just that powerful. Nothing hurts him permanently. He doesn't really get tired. He doesn't have any limits to his powers that he's discovered. He's an adult omega class mutant for poop's sake and was a trained fighter at an age when Johnny was still screwing around with chicks and cars.

HOWEVER, for a long time now writers -- okay, fine, just Chuck Austen and Peter Milligan specifically -- have not been writing Iceman at optimal conditions. It burns me (HEHEHEHEHEHEH) to admit it but in terms of continuity Iceman has been in a bit of a subpar slump for a while now, both emotionally and physically. Other than a cool (HEHEHEHEHEHEH) scene Austen wrote about a year ago with Bobby turning into GiantMegaUltraIceman by absorbing water from a lake, he seems to have forgotten pretty much every ridiculously godlike thing he's ever learned about his powers in the 90s.

(Okay, so in "The Draco" he killed a demon mutant by sucking out the water from her body, but also in that arc he was blown up and had Havok threaten to pee on his disembodied head, so points off for that)

And what's Johnny been doing recently? Oh, not much...just turning into Galactus' herald and wielding the Power Cosmic. *shrug*

Let's face it...in terms of continuity Johnny's been at his physical and emotional best and Bobby's been at his worst. If we put them head to head right now at this moment, Johnny would kick the popsicle's ass up and down the street.

 

Johnny Storm would probably win,all he has to do is hit Bobby with a fire blast and he'd melt.

 

Tough one, but I'd go with Ice Man. I think he could put out the Flame quick while Ice can take a bit to melt, much more than snow.

 

Though I'm an X-fanboy, Johnny Storm is still one of my favorites.

 

Not entirely true. Johnny's body produces heat and fire, to such an extent that he was able to stay aflame underwater, sans oxygen, for a short period. If Bobby began to freeze any part of Johnny's body, Johnny would just increase his heat output to counter it.

 

Yeah, stay aflame, but not initially combust.

 

I feel compelled to post this for you kids who may not realize that they were publishing comics before Ultimate Spider-Man #1 came out...



Go check out a back issue bin.

Chances are you'll find good stories for cheaper than they're charging for new comics these days.

 

Torch would win.

 

Hmm . . . if neither was trying to kill the other, I'd say Torch wins, if only because Iceman can take more damage without dying, meaning Torch wouldn't have to hold back as much. He could basically melt most of Iceman's body and heat the surrounding air until all the moisture rises away, leaving Bobby without any water to reconstruct himself from. Whereas, Bobby's non-lethal attacks would all involve encasing Johnny in ice or throwing Ice at him, and his fire would melt it away no problem before it touched him.

Now, if both were trying their best to kill each other, it would come down to who got the drop on the other, since each could kill the other one instantaneously. Bobby could instantaneously freeze every molecule of water in Johnny's body (he did it to Legion in "Legion Quest"). But on the other hand, one full-force blast of Johnny's flame would vaporize Bobby completely. So I think it's about 50-50.

Of course, this is all based on the assumption that when Torch's flame hits Iceman's ice, Torch's flame wins, but I'm fairly sure that's true.

 

Feh, beat me to it. Showing that comic that is.

 

Good stuff.

I'm not to well versed X-Men wise, I know all the basics... So correct me if I'm wrong...

As long as there's moisture on the planet, peroid, Bobby can come back. I mean, he's kind of a Swamp Thing like elemental. And even if Johnny goes Nova, the entire planet isn't going anywhere.

 

I'm not entirely sure. I know he's been impaled, reduced to nothing but a head, and even blasted into little pieces, and each time he was able to reconstruct himself from the moisture in the air. (That last one was in the Age of Apocalypse, though.) But I'm not entirely sure he would survive if he was completely vaporized. I kind of think he might, since he seems to really be more like a disembodied consciousness that controls the ice that makes up his body. At least, that's what he was like in AoA -- I'm not quite sure 616 Iceman is there yet, although he's been getting closer.

At any rate, even if Iceman can survive vaporization, Torch might be able to keep him from re-forming indefinitely if he could keep the heat on him. (AoA Iceman had some sort of teleporting through moisture trick he might use to get away, but I don't think 616 Iceman's ever done it.) But I'm not that big an FF fan, so I don't know if there's a limit on how long Johnny can maintain his nova flame.

For what it's worth, I think someone like Xavier could definitely kill Iceman if he really wanted to. Completely destroy his mind, and there's nothing left to animate his body.

 

I agree with you on the Xavier bit, to some degree. I'd imagine that an equally powerful telepath could come along and pull Bobby's consciousness. I just don't see very many telepaths if any at all being able to totally destroy a practially abstract mind.

And even the 616 Bobby has done some insane things... I mean, freezing The Stranger's eye blasts? Must of reduced the cold to absolute zero or somehting... Regardless, damned impressive.

 

except that particular one would cost you around $10

 

Ahahaha. And so the old grumpy man schtick fails.

And it's cost a bit more than 10 bucks. Check this out...

http://milehighcomics.com/cgi-bin/b...ist&title=52019311922&publisher=MV&snumber=21

 

Wow, that is impressive. I haven't read that one -- what issue was it in?