Fant4stic "Flame On!" The Human Torch Thread

[Spider - Man]

I wasn't totally upset with the CGI in the first, I know there was a lot of "ringing of hands" about it leading up to the movie, but not too many complaints about after the movies were made.

I did notice that it was better more fluid in the second movie, than the first....so I'm going to assume that this will be even more so in this movie. I hope.

Yeah f they could improve the Hulk so much from 'Hulk' (ughh!) to 'Incrdible Hulk' (meh) to the Avengers (wow!) imagine the improvement they should be able to realize with the Torch since he was better than 'meh' to start with!

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

I remember people BEFORE the first movie seeing "raw footage" freaking out...but didn't hear anything afterwards. I'm hoping that we see MUCH BETTER CGI all the way around. ESPECIALLY WITH "stretchy boy"....

Reed's powers were definitely a big issue. Also with the way the turtles are looking in that terrible Ninja Turtles movie coming out I bet CGI Thing is just around the corner:

Spoiler

 

[Spider‑Man]

I remember people BEFORE the first movie seeing "raw footage" freaking out...but didn't hear anything afterwards. I'm hoping that we see MUCH BETTER CGI all the way around. ESPECIALLY WITH "stretchy boy"....

I actually have that footage somewhere...was it in the FF DVD special features. Yeah the torch just sort of floats up and away very cartoony looking. And people did freak! But not NEARLY as much as over the first shots of Chiklis in makeup! I'll never forget that day!

 

[spidergeek232]

Wow, it's so...quite in here. Thanks, Kelly!

I'm sure Torch will look epic with the CGI of today! Can't wait to see!

 

[Kelly]

I actually have that footage somewhere...was it in the FF DVD special features. Yeah the torch just sort of floats up and away very cartoony looking. And people did freak! But not NEARLY as much as over the first shots of Chiklis in makeup! I'll never forget that day!

Yes, I remember....they were keeping him undercover, and somehow someone got some set pics and released them. OMG that was crazy.

 

[Bren]

edit just saw Kelly's warning previous page

 

[bubbadoom]

It all comes down to budget - I bet Bay's Turtles has a bigger budget than this FF reboot...

 

[KDM1986]

It all comes down to budget - I bet Bay's Turtles has a bigger budget than this FF reboot...

Bays movies also have a history of making bank at the box office. Fantastic Four is trying to reboot a Medicore franchise. It's naturally gonna have a small budget. Also I thought this movie wasn't greenlit yet.

 

[Kelly]

I actually have that footage somewhere...was it in the FF DVD special features. Yeah the torch just sort of floats up and away very cartoony looking. And people did freak! But not NEARLY as much as over the first shots of Chiklis in makeup! I'll never forget that day!

Well, on the DVD it wasn't a big deal because they were showing how they did the CGI. This was footage, I believe that someone from another website was invited on the set for interviews, and he took some footage or something. There was a big stink about it.

 

[bubbadoom]

Bays movies also have a history of making bank at the box office. Fantastic Four is trying to reboot a Medicore franchise. It's naturally gonna have a small budget. Also I thought this movie wasn't greenlit yet.

And this was the problem with the FF from the start! The first film started with only an $80 million budget [which grew to $100] and FF2 started with $100 million [and grew to $120 when WETA dropped the ball on the Surfer]. In both cases they hardly had enough money to do what they did - practical Thing, limited stretching for Reed, limited Johnny flamed on, etc. - so how are they going to "fix" these problems on a similar budget.

If they don't start out with at least $150 million we are in trouble.

 

[Mr.M]

They are just going to have to get creative and resourceful. Otherwise ask Disney for an extension (which they won't get either). Nobody is clamoring for more FF movies right now, so you can't invest wrecklessly. If you blow your budget on a 100 million dollar Thing, the rest of the roster's effects will be short changed. Ideally, you want a 200 million dollar budget minimum, but that is not going to happen. I think 150 is a fair number.

 

[Zarex]

They are just going to have to get creative and resourceful. Otherwise ask Disney for an extension (which they won't get either). Nobody is clamoring for more FF movies right now, so you can't invest wrecklessly. If you blow your budget on a 100 million dollar Thing, the rest of the roster's effects will be short changed. Ideally, you want a 200 million dollar budget minimum, but that is not going to happen. I think 150 is a fair number.

Though the cost effectiveness of computer effects has improved since 2007, the Fantastic Four is a very expensive team to put on film. A $20 million increase from ROTSS simply won't cut it, especially if you want to have a formidable CGI Thing, a thrilling Negative Zone, and a team that actually looks like they could save the Universe if called upon.

With the box office spectacle bar having been raised with Marvel's latest outings, and presumably Man of Steel as well, FOX can't expect to release a budget "let's keep the rights at all cost" superhero team movie and expect the general audience to simply pay the 3-D surcharge. I think even Marvel Studios would struggle to put out a profitable FF film in the current environment, though they have other associated revenue streams to defray the cost.

 

[Kelly]

Though the cost effectiveness of computer effects has improved since 2007, the Fantastic Four is a very expensive team to put on film. A $20 million increase from ROTSS simply won't cut it, especially if you want to have a formidable CGI Thing, a thrilling Negative Zone, and a team that actually looks like they could save the Universe if called upon.

With the box office spectacle bar having been raised with Marvel's latest outings, and presumably Man of Steel as well, FOX can't expect to release a budget "let's keep the rights at all cost" superhero team movie and expect the general audience to simply pay the 3-D surcharge. I think even Marvel Studios would struggle to put out a profitable FF film in the current environment, though they have other associated revenue streams to defray the cost.

I think that is the key.

Thing needs to be able to show an immense amount of strength, the London sequence showed that in the 2nd movie, but that is really the only time that I've seen it in a big way.

The London sequence was also pretty "ok" for Reed, but I really haven't seen anything spectacular.

Johnny has been the best IMO, especially with his speed, etc.

Sue, hell she has taken on The Hulk and won, the London sequence again...ok, but nothing great.

 

[Zarex]

I think that is the key.

Thing needs to be able to show an immense amount of strength, the London sequence showed that in the 2nd movie, but that is really the only time that I've seen it in a big way.

The London sequence was also pretty "ok" for Reed, but I really haven't seen anything spectacular.

Johnny has been the best IMO, especially with his speed, etc.

Sue, hell she has taken on The Hulk and won, the London sequence again...ok, but nothing great.

If a titanic armored space diety started sucking up our collected life forces, I definitely wouldn't be calling upon the Tim Story team. In the final battles for the two films they struggled despite 4 to 1 odds against a similarly powered Doom, and then sat out the battle with Cloud Galactus (though Johnny tried to help).

 

[Kelly]

if a titanic armored space diety started sucking up our collected life forces, i definitely wouldn't be calling upon the tim story team. In the final battles for the two films they struggled despite 4 to 1 odds against a similarly powered doom, and then sat out the battle with cloud galactus (though johnny tried to help).

bingo......

 

[Spider - Man]

Well, on the DVD it wasn't a big deal because they were showing how they did the CGI. This was footage, I believe that someone from another website was invited on the set for interviews, and he took some footage or something. There was a big stink about it.

This is the one I was talking about:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bJurF5vsUI

Look at about 0:45. That's the one I remember everyone complaining about.

 

[Spider - Man]

I think that is the key.

Thing needs to be able to show an immense amount of strength, the London sequence showed that in the 2nd movie, but that is really the only time that I've seen it in a big way.

The London sequence was also pretty "ok" for Reed, but I really haven't seen anything spectacular.

Johnny has been the best IMO, especially with his speed, etc.

Sue, hell she has taken on The Hulk and won, the London sequence again...ok, but nothing great.

I agree completely. We need a Thing that when he drops onto the hood of a car, the car is crushed, not him sliding around on it like TJ Hooker and when he slides off it, the hood pops back into shape!

The shot of him lifting the Eye weren't very impresive to me because it was shot wrong. You see him in close up lifting what looks like a light weight white plastic tube over his head and then you see an extreme long shot o the wheel straightening out. I would have rather a medium shot with the Thing at the bottome of the shot, small but clearly visible and identifiable and the massive Eye crushing down on him and him pressing it up overhead. Even with the foam rubber looking suit that would have been somewhat more effective at showing his strength.

I want a CGI Thing that moves more slowly because of the massive weight, one that causes slight tremors when he runs close by. When he smashes his fist down onto a barroom table, it should instantly be splinters, maybe even a crater where it was, not just shaking it a little not even upsetting the glasses sitting on it for cryin out loud!!

 

[Kelly]

This is the one I was talking about:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bJurF5vsUI

Look at about 0:45. That's the one I remember everyone complaining about.

YES, that was the one I was talking about, that was actually stolen from the set, and released. OMG, Fox was pissed off about that....

 

[Enriquespy]

I would like if the flames could change color, like if he focused too much in a finger it would turn blue, like a wielding torch.

 

[bubbadoom]

YES, that was the one I was talking about, that was actually stolen from the set, and released. OMG, Fox was pissed off about that....

I am not sure I am getting the point about this Torch shot - it's obviously a work in progress test, and not intended for the final film.

There's all sorts of temp effects and pre-vis type stuff in this promo.

The Reed stretch test looks nice, could have used more like that in the movie.

 

[Donut]

This is the one I was talking about:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bJurF5vsUI

Blast from the past seeing this again

 

[Kelly]

I am not sure I am getting the point about this Torch shot - it's obviously a work in progress test, and not intended for the final film.

There's all sorts of temp effects and pre-vis type stuff in this promo.

The Reed stretch test looks nice, could have used more like that in the movie.

That was not a promo that was supposed to see the light of day as it was....it was taken before it was finished and leaked on the internet. I can't remember which website got it, but there was a big uproar about it.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I think that is the key.

Thing needs to be able to show an immense amount of strength, the London sequence showed that in the 2nd movie, but that is really the only time that I've seen it in a big way.

The London sequence was also pretty "ok" for Reed, but I really haven't seen anything spectacular.

Johnny has been the best IMO, especially with his speed, etc.

Sue, hell she has taken on The Hulk and won, the London sequence again...ok, but nothing great.

I agree completely. We need a Thing that when he drops onto the hood of a car, the car is crushed, not him sliding around on it like TJ Hooker and when he slides off it, the hood pops back into shape!

The shot of him lifting the Eye weren't very impresive to me because it was shot wrong. You see him in close up lifting what looks like a light weight white plastic tube over his head and then you see an extreme long shot o the wheel straightening out. I would have rather a medium shot with the Thing at the bottome of the shot, small but clearly visible and identifiable and the massive Eye crushing down on him and him pressing it up overhead. Even with the foam rubber looking suit that would have been somewhat more effective at showing his strength.

I want a CGI Thing that moves more slowly because of the massive weight, one that causes slight tremors when he runs close by. When he smashes his fist down onto a barroom table, it should instantly be splinters, maybe even a crater where it was, not just shaking it a little not even upsetting the glasses sitting on it for cryin out loud!!

I agree and I think part of the problem with portraying Ben as massively powerful was the suit. Whenever Chiklis moved (the scene in the secret bunker when they're all jogging down the corridor toward the end of the second film is one that is particularly cringeworthy) it was obvious that he was a guy in a thick rubber suit just trying not to trip over his own feet.

When you look at some of the art Jack Kirby created, you can see what made the Thing an iconic character. The power leaps off the page with the way he moves and lunges and throws his body into a punch. They need to capture that on film for it to really work.

 

[fantastic fifth]

When you look at some of the art Jack Kirby created, you can see what made the Thing an iconic character. The power leaps off the page with the way he moves and lunges and throws his body into a punch. They need to capture that on film for it to really work.

Yes, exactly!

 

[ShadowBoxer]

Reed's powers were definitely a big issue. Also with the way the turtles are looking in that terrible Ninja Turtles movie coming out I bet CGI Thing is just around the corner:

Spoiler

I still have some hope that the Ninja Turtles movie will be decent. It has been confirmed that they are NOT aliens anymore and Bay is not directing it or anything just producing it. Though I am not stoked on Megan Fox being April she isn't a good actor if you ask me. By anyway, I do hope the CGI for Reed and Johnny and Ben will be better this time around. Ben could be a mix of live action and CGI same goes with Reed.